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Emitan · Mar 4, 2011

Afrikan said:
what is the difference between the "Go Sony!" posts...and "FUCK YOU SONY!" posts? Sure I don't like either one of those types of posts.

but I feel they are both around to just balance each other out. *shrugs*

Because as someone mentioned earlier in the thread, there's no reason for Sony to have access to this information. It should have gone to a third party to make logs of it. Sony getting this information is bullshit and a violation of people's right to privacy.

Zoe · Mar 4, 2011

Vorador said:
Btw, wasn't the YouTube subpoena already denied?

If you read the request, the scope of the subpoenas was narrowed to a degree that the judge found acceptable.

evolution · Mar 4, 2011

Bunch of drama queens up in this thread. Not surprised though

Mama Robotnik · Mar 4, 2011

Afrikan said:
what is the difference between the "Go Sony!" posts...and "FUCK YOU SONY!" posts? Sure I don't like either one of those types of posts.

but I feel they are both around to just balance each other out. *shrugs*

I don't advocate such short impulsive posts and try to avoid them myself, with probably mixed success.

But to me, there are legitimate reasons for anger towards Sony for their perverse use of the legal system, and few legitimate reasons to support what they have achieved today.

Thus I can understand the short angry posts, but not the short cheerleading ones.

EviLore · Mar 4, 2011

Trojita said:
What was wrong with mine?

Not your thread, this thread. Originally:

"A federal magistrate is granting Sony the right to acquire the internet IP addresses"

Sipowicz · Mar 4, 2011

people will come here and defend this, just as they will defend any action taken against the visitors to said pages

LiquidMetal14 · Mar 4, 2011

ViolentP said:
My favorite posts are the ones that refer to Sony like some guy that kicked over your garbage bin.

This is one of those threads where even the haters can say stuff they would not normally say outright in a normal thread. You know the ones who aren't regulars in Playstation game threads.

jim-jam bongs · Mar 4, 2011

It's just incredible to me that there are people cheering on a huge violation of the presumption of innocence, something considered a fundamental right under the US justice system, just because they liked Uncharted. Fucking incredible.

Cruzader · Mar 4, 2011

Billychu said:
I'm honestly convinced some of those people work for Sony. Not all of them, but some people have had almost no good reasons to be backing Sony and just keep yelling "Go, Sony!" in every thread.

I agree, but on the flip side of things....those who are on Geohotz side are more laughable. Sending money to Geo's PP account...LOL. Cmon, thats worse than saying "Go Sony" or some lame shit some tard says.

plainr_ · Mar 4, 2011

I wish Sony could use their resources to find two of my stolen PS3's. I could use a 3 monitor setup for GT5 right now.

Emitan · Mar 4, 2011

EviLore said:
Not your thread, this thread. Originally:

"A federal magistrate is granting Sony the right to acquire the internet IP addresses"

Jokes on them! We already ran out of IPs!

Alts · Mar 4, 2011

jim-jam bongs said:
Also, this is totally unnecessary. A third-party forensic investigator could analyse the logs from Geohot's server and create a report from the aggregate data which contained NO private information about where the file was downloaded, and it would still serve the purpose argued by Sony. Same goes for the logs from YouTube and from Twitter.

This. I understand the need for Sony to have access to certain information to determine whether a crime occurred or not (for now lets avoid the legitimacy of the "crime"), but it shouldnt be provided as raw data but rather a nice Yes or No response to "is a not insignificant amount of the traffic to the sites in question originating from Northern California".

Dr. Malik · Mar 4, 2011

ViolentP said:
My favorite posts are the ones that refer to Sony like some guy that kicked over your garbage bin.

Or the ones that pretend Sony is going to mandate every electronic and put you in jail if you hack it, if they win

LiquidMetal14 · Mar 4, 2011

Billychu said:
Jokes on them! We already ran out of IPs!

Then we use letters!

Infinite Justice · Mar 4, 2011

So they got it? Dang

chubigans · Mar 4, 2011

jim-jam bongs said:
It's just incredible to me that there are people cheering on a huge violation of the presumption of innocence, something considered a fundamental right under the US justice system,

Wait a second. How is this violating what you say?

Zoe · Mar 4, 2011

jim-jam bongs said:
How does that change anything I've posted?

It's pretty much already set for a third party--all of the information gained from the subpoenas is "For Attorney Eyes Only." Nobody at Sony proper is supposed to have access.

(Sony's lawyers are not in-house)

Neuromancer · Mar 4, 2011

God bless you Sony for going to a place Microsoft and Nintendo, in their most insane fever dreams, would never even imagine.

ViolentP · Mar 4, 2011

LiquidMetal14 said:
This is one of those threads where even the haters can say stuff they would not normally say outright in a normal thread. You know the ones who aren't regulars in Playstation game threads.

I'll be totally honest with you, it's kinda hard for me to tell on which side of the arguments the haters are!

Mama Robotnik · Mar 4, 2011

Cruzader said:
I agree, but on the flip side of things....those who are on Geohotz side are more laughable. Sending money to Geo's PP account...LOL. Cmon, thats worse than saying "Go Sony" or some lame shit some tard says.

Explain why.

I don't like a future in which Sony wins this, and donated some spare money to try and prevent it. It probably won't make a difference, but I'm proud to have put my money where my mouth is.

Cruzader, tell me why my choice was more pathetic than everything else we've seen. Go on.

And before you try and say I could have donated to a more "worthy" cause, be aware that I already do a shit ton of charity work, so it won't hold.

Trojita · Mar 4, 2011

EviLore said:
Not your thread, this thread. Originally:

"A federal magistrate is granting Sony the right to acquire the internet IP addresses"

Okay, cool. Thanks for the clarification.

fernoca · Mar 4, 2011

Yeah.
Original thread title sounded like "Sony acquires the rights to the internets".

BoboBrazil · Mar 4, 2011

Pretty obvious the judge is going to approve whatever Sony asks. If 1 ip address from twitter/youtube/blogspot is from California out of millions Sony will get anything they want. Might as well just end this unless they can get another judge on the case.

ViolentP · Mar 4, 2011

MariusElijah said:
Or the ones that pretend Sony is going to mandate every electronic and put you in jail if you hack it, if they win

It's a paella of insanity these threads.

LiquidMetal14 · Mar 4, 2011

ViolentP said:
I'll be totally honest with you, it's kinda hard for me to tell on which side of the arguments the haters are!

This is why it's one of those free for all open threads. Meant for more objective discussion and not just outright Sony sucks or Sony rules banter.

SapientWolf · Mar 4, 2011

evolution said:
Bunch of drama queens up in this thread. Not surprised though

Besides Sony?

ViolentP · Mar 4, 2011

LiquidMetal14 said:
This is why it's one of those free for all open threads. Meant for more objective discussion and not just outright Sony sucks or Sony rules banter.

x sucks/rules is an argument for people who cannot form arguments.

EDIT: Gaf failed to load for a second.......IT HAS BEGUN!

Trevelyon · Mar 4, 2011

Infinite Justice said:
So they actually got it? Dang

Not what you're referencing to, nowhere near the extent of the original request.

AniHawk · Mar 4, 2011

yeah i thought this fell under the whole innocent until proven guilty thing

Izayoi · Mar 4, 2011

Gotta love this country.

This shit is out of control.

H_Prestige · Mar 4, 2011

Sounds like the US judicial system is the real problem here. The judge had the power to say no.

Lothars · Mar 4, 2011

I don't have an issue with this because it's not like the users that just downloaded it will be sued, I think it's overacting from both sides but I also don't understand why someone would boycot sony over this.

lupinko · Mar 4, 2011

Combichristoffersen said:
Eh, Sony can have my IP address if they want to. I'm more concerned about the police finding my IP after googling Scuba Steve's band

Post (and that thread) of the day, made me chuckle here in the office. loool

Neki · Mar 4, 2011

jim-jam bongs said:
It's just incredible to me that there are people cheering on a huge violation of the presumption of innocence, something considered a fundamental right under the US justice system, just because they liked Uncharted. Fucking incredible.

should I stop the planet so you can jump off?

I'll just play the waiting game to see if Sony actually wins.

Key2001 · Mar 4, 2011

This subpoena was in agreement between Sony and Geohotz.

Plaintiff Sony Computer Entertainment America LLC (SCEA) has reached agreement with Defendant George Hotz on the scope of third party subpoenas that may be served by SCEA to seek jurisdictional discovery.

Here's what they agreed upon.

As ordered by this Court, on February 14, 2011, counsel for the parties met and conferred to resolve their dispute as to the scope of the subpoenas to be served on the third party Internet Service Providers (ISPs), including Bluehost, Twitter, Google, YouTube, Softlayer and PayPal. As a result of this meet and confer, the parties narrowed the scope of several of the subpoenas and agreed to provide for protection of confidential information obtained through some of the subpoenas through an Attorneys Eyes Only designation. SCEA also agreed not to pursue, as part of its jurisdictional discovery, several of the third party subpoenas originally included in its Motion for Expedited Discovery. Accordingly, the parties agreed that subject to this Courts entry of an order, SCEA may proceed to serve its subpoenas on Bluehost, Twitter, Google, YouTube, and Softlayer for purposes of jurisdictional discovery. The parties agreement, along with the revised language and scope of the relevant subpoenas, was memorialized in the Joint Letter submitted to this Court on February 18, 2011.

Notice that some of this is for attorney eyes only.

As a result of this meet and confer, the parties narrowed the scope of several of the subpoenas and agreed to provide for protection of confidential information obtained through some of the subpoenas through an Attorneys Eyes Only designation.

blu · Mar 4, 2011

So, I've seen the rap YouTube, I've been to Hotz site multiple times and I've downloaded a bunch of CFWs. Only thing I know I've missed is that private show Hotz had on his YouTube. Did I miss anything else from this amusement ride?

chubigans · Mar 4, 2011

Mama Robotnik said:
Explain why.

I don't like a future in which Sony wins this, and donated some spare money to try and prevent it. It probably won't make a difference, but I'm proud to have put my money where my mouth is.

Cruzader, tell me why my choice was more pathetic than everything else we've seen. Go on.

And before you try and say I could have donated to a more "worthy" cause, be aware that I already do a shit ton of charity work, so it won't hold.

Well, honestly, its because Geohot is a massive, massive tool who wouldn't have gotten sued if he didn't have such a huge ego and released it anonymously instead. Right or not, it's his damn fault he opened himself up to a lawsuit, and for him to ask for donations towards his legal defense is about as dumb as I've seen.

But hey, that's just me.

Morkins · Mar 4, 2011

Congrats to Sony.

They managed to piss off the one group with the resources to turn this case around... Making the EFF angry is the exact opposite thing that they should be trying to do in this case, because the EFF can turn this into a much bigger case than it already is....

LiquidMetal14 · Mar 4, 2011

Mama Robotnik said:
Explain why.

I don't like a future in which Sony wins this, and donated some spare money to try and prevent it. It probably won't make a difference, but I'm proud to have put my money where my mouth is.

Cruzader, tell me why my choice was more pathetic than everything else we've seen. Go on.

And before you try and say I could have donated to a more "worthy" cause, be aware that I already do a shit ton of charity work, so it won't hold.

Your contributions to charity are commendable. You're not the only one in that regard but I won't skew my discussion point with that.

The thing is I am in the impartial view of being a very legit customer who see's this as a ploy to protect their property. And frankly, it is as simple as this Geohot guy probably raving about this too much. Sony wants to burn their money on this, let them. I see nothing wrong in your donation but I sat around in the I care more about the future of this platform than that of hackers/CFW makers which potentially create piracy/security risks. It's more broad than that but it's not exactly corporate cheering like some say. Some are like that though, don't think I'm all Sony defensive here.

This particular piece of litigation needs more digestion and some clearly have at least read it. Others jumping to the FU Sony stance and clearly not reading at least the OP are sticking out like sore thumbs.

Lothars · Mar 4, 2011

chubigans said:
Well, honestly, its because Geohot is a massive, massive tool who wouldn't have gotten sued if he didn't have such a huge ego and released it anonymously instead. Right or not, it's his damn fault he opened himself up to a lawsuit, and for him to ask for donations towards his legal defense is about as dumb as I've seen.

But hey, that's just me.

Agreed, it's just as dumb for people to donate to his legal fund because of that exact reason.

hamchan · Mar 4, 2011

chubigans said:
Isn't that the same analogy as saying police are wasting their time arresting drug users, since they'll keep on sellin and usin' drugs no matter what they do? Of course, you could argue that what geohot did wasn't wrong, but to argue that they shouldn't sue hackers on the grounds that it wont stop hacking is not a good one.

This is a good analogy.

Why?

Because I was thinking of using the same analogy after watching The Wire lol.

Afrikan · Mar 4, 2011

so the new title could be

"Magistrate and GeoHotz grants Sony access to visitor personal data on Youtube/Twitter"

Mama Robotnik · Mar 4, 2011

chubigans said:
Well, honestly, its because Geohot is a massive, massive tool who wouldn't have gotten sued if he didn't have such a huge ego and released it anonymously instead. Right or not, it's his damn fault he opened himself up to a lawsuit, and for him to ask for donations towards his legal defense is about as dumb as I've seen.

But hey, that's just me.

I agree that Geohot is unlikeable. That awful rap video certainly doesn't help matters either.

I didn't donate because of the individual concerned, I donated because I'm legitimately worried about what a Sony victory means - confirmation that we don't own our consoles but are renting them - and cementing the idea that we can only use hardware in a prescribed way.

This is bigger than George Hotz, and I feel that I'm donating to the cause in spite of him, not because of him.

Foffy · Mar 4, 2011

Oh America...

Seriously, how many times do the courts get on their knees and start kissing the ankles of corporations? It's a little disgusting.

gundamkyoukai · Mar 4, 2011

Key2001 said:
This subpoena was in agreement between Sony and Geohotz.

Here's what they agreed upon.

Notice that some of this is for attorney eyes only.

This is rather funny i don't see people saying fucking Geohotz for selling us out .

Cruzader · Mar 4, 2011

Mama Robotnik said:
Explain why.

I don't like a future in which Sony wins this, and donated some spare money to try and prevent it. It probably won't make a difference, but I'm proud to have put my money where my mouth is.

Cruzader, tell me why my choice was more pathetic than everything else we've seen. Go on.

And before you try and say I could have donated to a more "worthy" cause, be aware that I already do a shit ton of charity work, so it won't hold.

Donating to an attention whore who has a bullet point on his ass and seems to not take stuff seriously...yea. Great cause.

If you feel superior than the guy yelling "Go Sony!" then more props to you but both are pretty lame "responses" from both sides.

Edit: beaten.

obonicus · Mar 4, 2011

I kinda liked the judge's triple put-down of the EFF.

MMaRsu · Mar 4, 2011

What the FUCK? Sony going off the deep end here..

Trevelyon · Mar 4, 2011

H_Prestige said:
Sounds like the US judicial system is the real problem here. The judge had the power to say no.

Well, he did, initially and then he revised the request down to something he thought would be more appropriate to the case at hand.

Not the blanket catchall internet round-up people thought it might be.

androvsky · Mar 4, 2011

So from the actual order, it looks like all Sony is getting is IP addresses, and they're only allowed to do some simple geolocating to make sure addresses from California ISPs visited those sites.

They'd have to go back to the ISPs to tie those addresses to names, and it doesn't look like they're authorized to do that.

Naturally, everyone's reacting like Sony's going to sue everyone who watched a youtube video. Oh well.

Both sides of this fight have acted sufficiently like dicks that it's impossible for me to root for anyone, but I'd at least like a little sanity in talking about what's going on. "Visitor personal data" sounds a lot more specific than simple IP addresses without permission to ask the ISPs who they belong to.

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