Support NeoGAF

[KingSnake]

TPHD is not a remake, it was never supposed to be a remake, it will never be a remake. It's a HD remaster.

A lot of crazy expectations around here, really.

 

[CronoShot]

New Zelda art is great

As for the game...well, it pretty much highlights the limitations of the Gamecube (and Wii) at the time of release. People complained about the bloom before so they toned it down, but it seemed to have been there for a reason.

 

[bloodforge]

I think it looks great. The design of some of the characters has always been a bit ugly.

 

[TheMoon]

If Nintendo was going to do a lazy port (because that's what this is), they should have done Skyward Sword.

I don't understand why people think Wind Waker was any different - it was just as lazy, but cel shaded game tend to hold up better.

I hope not many people are going to buy this thing at full price. We have to send the message that these types of cash grabs aren't ok.

Yea no... stop pulling this nonsense out of your butts.

 

[Calvero]

I really really like it. Looks dope!

 

[Mr-Joker]

...That's exactly the point of a remake, to get rid of the limitations of the original graphics. OoT and MM3D redid the character models and generally made the entire game higher poly, added in entirely new lighting, and created dramatically improved textures and completely new assets from scratch. They're still not exactly cutting edge games, but they look much more modern than an N64 game thanks to those improvements.

WWHD didn't have as much work put in, but they still overhauled the lighting system by adding in new effects like bloom and ambient occlusion and generally polished the game up to look great by modern standards.

TPHD hasn't done any of that stuff. It's just the same game in HD with a nice but underwhelming texture upgrade. Nintendo could have eliminated these problems by going back to the original concept are and recreating the main character models with more polygons like they did for OoT3D and MM3D. They could have overhauled that archaic castle scene with newly made assets and effects- look at how differently Hyrule castle town turned out in OoT3D vs the original. Here, it's pretty much no different than the original.

If they weren't willing to put the work into overhauling the visuals to a modern standard, they shouldn't have bothered. The game is honestly not the most interesting Zelda title and it really needed something special to make it exciting to play again. You may disagree, but as a huge fan who bought all the other remakes on day one I have next to no interest in this.

Twilight Princess is not a remake and I am not sure where you got the impression that it was.

Twilight Princess is a port of the original game but with the HD treatment applied to it.

If Nintendo was going to do a lazy port (because that's what this is), they should have done Skyward Sword.

Because Skywards Sword requires more works and has that big glaring issue centered around the fact that the game was built from the ground up with Motion+ control and can not be simply removed without remaking the game from the ground up.

 

[Dr.Guru of Peru]

Yea no... stop pulling this nonsense out of your butts.

then...what is it?

 

[quesalupa]

Oh my God they turned Ilia into Topanga.

 

[TheMoon]

then...what is it?

Not what you want. Simple as that.

You don't go and remake most of the textures from scratch, remodel things like that Malo Mart door frame because you're farting out a "lazy" port.

I'm not forcing anyone to love this, I just bugs the hell out of me whenever this "lazy dev" bullshit gets thrown around in general. Especially when you can see they put in work. They just didn't do anything that makes it look fancy all of a sudden. On top of that, it's not a simple visual enhancement port like most of these HD remasters. It adds gameplay tweaks and new content as well. You don't have to love it but have some base-level respect for the work done.

 

[ffdgh]

Well uhh...TP NPCs were never eye candy or anything I guess? Still not sure what what's going on with that face lol.

 

[Nerrel]

TPHD is not a remake, it was never supposed to be a remake, it will never be a remake. It's a HD remaster.

A lot of crazy expectations around here, really.

It's crazy to expect TPHD to look half as good as the three stunning remasters that immediately preceded it?

You say that it's just a "remaster" and not a remake, as if that justifies the fact that Nintendo is giving us a minimal effort. That's the problem- they're giving us a remaster when the game needed a remake.

 

[Jonneh3003]

then...what is it?

A high quality texture rework on a game that really needed it? Even at it's launch people critised the textures for this game see IGN's review. Just because a characters face looks a bit weird in part of the trailer doesn't mean it's a low quality rush job.

She looked less bizarre in the screenshot they tweeted.

Twilight Princess has always caused conflict between which the better version is: Wii or Gamecube? Wii U version has the 16:9 and motion pointing of the Wii version with the traditional controls of the Gamecube version. It's all the pros of both versions bundled into one with greatly improved textures on top of that. A rushed port would be upresing it to 1080p and calling it a day. Then we also have the new amiibo trial dungeon too. In no way is this a rushed game.

 

[Morts]

Making an ugly game HD wasn't going to make it not ugly. The art is most of the problem.

Still, there's a lot of cool stuff in Twilight Princess, including some of the series best dungeons. I'll be playing it again.

 

[Heroman]

It's crazy to expect TPHD to look half as good as the three stunning remasters that came before it?

Oot and mm were remake not remasters dude and Ww always looked better then TP.

 

[trixx]

Still have the Wii version so I'm good.
I think ill buy Pokken instead LOL

Twilight is my favourite 3d installment too =/... oh well.

 

[PumpkinSpice]

Still have the Wii version so I'm good.
I think ill buy Pokken instead LOL

I feel the same way about my GC version. The $80 CAD price tag isn't exactly helping things for the HD ver.

Have they announced any substantial changes yet? Like along the lines of the swift sail in Wind Waker HD?

 

[FunkyDealer]

Looks like a decent enough remaster to me. It's a remaster, not a remake. And it's a decade old gamecube game. And the humans in TP always looked weird.

I'm still in. Just gotta finish Majoras Mask 3D, and I'm there.

 

[Jonneh3003]

Still have the Wii version so I'm good.
I think ill buy Pokken instead LOL

Fair enough, I would say Twilight Princess HD is only for big fans of the original and those who haven't played it before. Once this comes out I'll own it on all platforms, love Twilight Princess and can't wait to see the enhancements with my own eyes.

 

[TheMoon]

Oot and mm were remake not remasters dude and Ww always looked better then TP.

inb4 Rich lectures you about exact same code being reused in the N64 upgrades and thus not being remakes

I feel the same way about my GC version. The $80 CAD price tag isn't exactly helping things for the HD ver.

Have they announced any substantial changes yet? Like along the lines of the swift sail in Wind Waker HD?

Just briefly. No full "here's what's new" rundown.

Fewer Tears of Light to collect, instant Wolf/Link transformation via touch screen button is all we know in that regard right now.

 

[LegendofLex]

It's crazy to expect TPHD to look half as good as the three stunning remasters that came before it?

I think it's a crazy comparison in the first place.

OoT and MM smoothed out the "aged N64 polygons and pre-rendered assets" stuff with nice character and environment models and added richer, more vibrant textures. The former was never an issue for TP (just the rough textures), and TPHD seems to have been improved at least in some measure in the latter department. OoT notably had downgraded lighting for some key areas and scenes.

TWWHD 's textures were mostly just redrawn in HD; the actual texture art itself didn't change much if at all. (Remember how they remarked that simply rendering the original game in HD had spectacular results?) This gave them lots of development effort to spend on tweaking the lighting engine (which is the same one they're using for Zelda U, which uses a similar shading style - not a development advantage they'd gain from TPHD). With TPHD, most of the effort improving the graphics seems to have gone into creating not just TP's old textures in HD but actually more detailed textures that make the art style convincing in HD (look at the cobblestones in Castle Town, for example).

 

[themagicalkitsune]

It's crazy to expect TPHD to look half as good as the three stunning remasters that immediately preceded it?

You say that it's just a "remaster" and not a remake, as if that justifies the fact that Nintendo is giving us a minimal effort. That's the problem- they're giving us a remaster when the game needed a remake.

Well yeah, it's unrealistic to expect TPHD to look as good as Ocarina 3D or Majora 3D since those were remakes (from scratch, I think? edit: I guess not since source code is the same) instead of (HD) remasters. Whether or not they should have gone with a remake instead of an HD upgrade is a different question.

 

[Ridley327]

I feel the same way about my GC version. The $80 CAD price tag isn't exactly helping things for the HD ver.

Have they announced any substantial changes yet? Like along the lines of the swift sail in Wind Waker HD?

Only one we know of thus far is there's an instant transformation function built into the Gamepad that you can just tap and not have to call on Midna. Gyro aiming seems to be in, as well.

 

[KingSnake]

It's crazy to expect TPHD to look half as good as the three stunning remasters that immediately preceded it?

You say that it's just a "remaster" and not a remake, as if that justifies the fact that Nintendo is giving us a minimal effort. That's the problem- they're giving us a remaster when the game needed a remake.

It's crazy to not understand the difference. Even in this post you listed two remakes and one HD remaster. Zelda WW looks tons better because its art has aged better. The art matters so much for a game, we have lots of proofs about that with Wii U games.

No much can be done for a TP HD unless it's a remake, i.e. remake the characters, geometry, remake some parts of the landscape etc.

How do you even know if it's a minimal effort or not. WW HD was supposed to be done because the Anouma played around with different Zelda versions and discovered that it's really easy to make WW in HD. Might have been even cheaper to produce than TP then.

Probably Zelda TP HD might not even existed without Zelda Wii U being delayed.

 

[FunkyDealer]

It's crazy to expect TPHD to look half as good as the three stunning remasters that immediately preceded it?

You say that it's just a "remaster" and not a remake, as if that justifies the fact that Nintendo is giving us a minimal effort. That's the problem- they're giving us a remaster when the game needed a remake.

Well, you can have a remaster or wait another decade for a remake. That's up to you.

Minimal effort would have been a VC release.

 

[digdug2k]

Oot and mm were remake not remasters dude and Ww always looked better then TP.

OOT3D doesn't look that good either TBH. But yeah, this game is not a remake. We've known that since the initial reveal. I'm not really sure why people are still getting upset about it.

 

[Revven]

I feel the same way about my GC version. The $80 CAD price tag isn't exactly helping things for the HD ver.

Have they announced any substantial changes yet? Like along the lines of the swift sail in Wind Waker HD?

They haven't officially announced anything but from screenshots we have:

1) Lanaryu Province has four less tears of light to collect
2) Ruppee count/Giant's Wallet capacity increased from 1,000 to 2,000 (ignoring the 9999 capacity increase for beating the Cave of Shadows from the amiibo).
3) Some kind of Poe lanturn has been added as a new item, we are not sure what it does yet.
4) Gyro aiming for Slingshot/Arrows/Clawshot

And there's likely to be more as if it was just those things it would be a very paltry amount, no way that's all they've done. These are things that haven't been announced officially yet by Nintendo but what we've gleaned from trailers/screenshots they've released.

 

[jmizzal]

so many whinny babies, I play games because they are fun, they already improved the pacing, and the added gamepad features are more then enough to get me hyped. The games textures are improved dont know why people are saying otherwise.

 

[dancrane212]

You guys are all focusing on the wrong face. Some things were never meant to go beyond SD.

Wonder if that has been cleaned up since November or not.

 

[Twilightzoney]

.

That comparison there shows they redid the textures but didn't bake any Ambient Occlusion to them. Since everything in there seems changed. I think their textures might look betterm but without the baked AO and no real time shading system going on everything is going to look flat.

 

[Green Mamba]

You people need to focus on the real news, which is how badass this official art of Ganondorf is:

Goddamn.

 

[blamite]

Ilia's face is bad, yes, but the game's real problem is the lack of s selfie mode like WWHD had.

 

[FunkyDealer]

That comparison there shows they redid the textures but didn't bake any Ambient Occlusion to them. Since everything in there seems changed. I think their textures might look better but without the baked AO and no real time shading system going on everything is going to look flat.

Look at her shoulders. AO is still there, it's just a bit differently applied. And not as dark.

 

[TheCongressman1]

OOT3D doesn't look that good either TBH. But yeah, this game is not a remake. We've known that since the initial reveal. I'm not really sure why people are still getting upset about it.

Because WWHD wasn't a 'remake' either, and they completely revamped the lighting even though it didn't really even need it, but it ended up looking amazing. Now, they are ignoring the game that does.

 

[Jonneh3003]

It's crazy to expect TPHD to look half as good as the three stunning remasters that immediately preceded it?

You say that it's just a "remaster" and not a remake, as if that justifies the fact that Nintendo is giving us a minimal effort. That's the problem- they're giving us a remaster when the game needed a remake.

It needed a remake? Twilight Princess is absolutely fine as it is. It didn't need design enhancements like Wind Waker's swiftsail or less tedious Tri Force quest. The only issue Twilight Princess has ever had is its textures and low and behold that's resolved with this remaster. Completely remaking Twilight Princess to look like the tech demo would be a huge waste of resources, why not just make a whole new game? Ocarina of Time 3D and Majora's Mask 3D were bigger efforts because of how much they could visually improve them. Upgrading N64 textures to 3DS ones is huge. It's pretty big for Twilight Princess HD too but we're not talking the same kind of graphical leap.

I agree Wind Waker HD looks nicer overall but I also think it was an easier game to port, the textures are pretty simplistic and translate nicely to high resolutions. When you compare TP HD to the original it's clear a lot of work went into this version.

Because WW wasn't a 'remake' either, and they completely revamped the lighting in a game that didn't even really need that. Now, they are ignoring the game that does.

I thought the strong lighting really added new life to Wind Waker's visuals. Being on these small islands surrounded by sea and having the sun gleaming down on you just felt good, it's absolutely beautiful when you're sailing along and see all the different shades of blue from the sea and sky that occur thanks to the new lighting.

 

[FunkyDealer]

The important question though: will there be more fishing-holes?

 

[KingSnake]

Because WW wasn't a 'remake' either, and they completely revamped the lighting in a game that didn't even really need that. Now, they are ignoring the game that does.

They revamped the lighting in WW because they were testing for Zelda Wii U, so that was more of a "collateral damage" than something really intended.

 

[trixx]

TPHD has a hero mode which the original does not have(?). That's probably the main selling point for me but still can't justify purchasing it.

 

[TheChits]

You people need to focus on the real news, which is how badass this official art of Ganondorf is:

Goddamn.

Yooooooo

 

[FunkyDealer]

Because WWHD wasn't a 'remake' either, and they completely revamped the lighting even though it didn't really even need it. Now, they are ignoring the game that does.

Before WWHD, Nintendo said they tried to improve the lighting on other games, but with lesser results. So it's likely they've tried to improve the lighting in TP, but it didn't work out well.

It's an old game, running on an old engine. There could be limitations. It sure won't be as easy to enhance as a PS360 title.

 

[Twilightzoney]

Look at her shoulders. AO is still there, it's just a bit differently applied. And not as dark.

I think that's the issue is that its not very apparent at all now. And everything blends in to look very flat.

 

[ShadowFox08]

Damn loooks like wiimotion support won't be making it.. They'd be showing it by now. Just once I'd like to see left handed link using wiimote, but then perhaps that would be too much effort?

Oh well gamepad with gyroscope is a nice thing to meet in the middle.

 

[TheCongressman1]

I thought the strong lighting really added new life to Wind Waker's visuals. Being on these small islands surrounded by sea and having the sun gleaming down on you just felt good, it's absolutely beautiful when you're sailing along and see all the different shades of blue from the sea and sky that occur thanks to the new lighting.

I fully agree, I think it looks amazing. I'm saying, the game would have looked fine if they just gave it a run of the mill HD treatment. They went beyond that with WWHD, and I'm disappointed that TP isn't getting that same treatment. The work they have done looks nice, but not having that new lighting is really hurting the visuals.

 

[Jonneh3003]

Damn loooks like wiimotion support won't be making it.. They'd be showing it by now. Just once I'd like to see left handed link using wiimote, but then perhaps that would be too much effort?

Oh well gamepad with gyroscope is a nice thing to meet in the middle.

Everyone always calls the Gamecube version superior for it's traditional control scheme. I loved the Wii version for the pointer. This is pretty much perfect.

 

[Seik]

I think it actually looks very good, IDK why people are stuck on Ilia's face.

You people need to focus on the real news, which is how badass this official art of Ganondorf is:

Goddamn.

Maaaan, I can't wait to see Ganondorf with all the new textures. D:

 

[Heroman]

I fully agree, I think it looks amazing. I'm saying, the game would have looked fine if they just gave it a run of the mill HD treatment. They went beyond that with WWHD, and I'm disappointed that TP isn't getting that same treatment. The work they have done looks nice, but not having that new lighting is really hurting the visuals.

It looks like they dont more for this remaster than they did for WW.

 

[Toparaman]

This remaster turning out as underwhelming as it is just makes me wish Nintendo would give us some proper footage of Zelda U already.

 

[ultratruman]

Is this going to be the worst selling Nintendo published zelda game?

 

[AdanVC]

It's crazy to expect TPHD to look half as good as the three stunning remasters that immediately preceded it?

You say that it's just a "remaster" and not a remake, as if that justifies the fact that Nintendo is giving us a minimal effort. That's the problem- they're giving us a remaster when the game needed a remake.

Wow. Really dissapointed on how TPHD looks now. It really doesn't look as good as this shots, expecially WWHD.

 

[mrmickfran]

Wish that was a real in-game conversation.

#teammelia

<_< >_>

#teammelia

You people need to focus on the real news, which is how badass this official art of Ganondorf is:

Goddamn.

Never noticed how chubby TP Ganon was.

 

[LegendofLex]

Is this going to be the worst selling Nintendo published zelda game?

No, that honor will forever go to Tri Force Heroes.