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[ClosingADoor]

Although I voted Remain, it's pretty disappointing to see the sensationalist echo-chamber here. Over 17m voted to leave - are we going to categorise them as a collection of xenophobes, racists, bigots, greedy baby-boomers and apathetic voters who now regret their decision? Or are we going to acknowledge that there is likely a high proportion of people in the country who had a good reason -- or more pointedly, have been negatively impacted and are no longer convinced of an upturn in their lives in the EU?

I do hope this is a wake up call for other countries to look at their population, see that people are being left behind and disconnected from politics and maybe even society as a whole. Mostly people in smaller towns. And that they really go do something to better those areas and take away that feeling.

Its just so disappointing that the people feeling that way took it out in the wrong vote, because the EU is not responsible for the things they are angry about for the most part.

 

[Theecliff]

me and my friends are genuinely distraught. thanks for helping fuck over my generation you thoughtless cunts.

 

[Amalthea]

Gues that vote was a Greggs pasty too hot for them.

 

[Steve.1981]

I really do think there has to be super majority clauses for referendums. I think thats the only way to say okay almost everyone wants this than just a popular vote alone. A near 50 50 split shouldn't be the way things go when it comes to mass votes.

After yesterday's result, and after the result of the Scottish independence referendum, I think I agree with this.

Both outcomes were almost half and half. It doesn't feel right to ignore the will of almost half the people who voted.

 

[Polari]

I really do think there has to be super majority clauses for referendums. I think thats the only way to say okay almost everyone wants this than just a popular vote alone. A near 50 50 split shouldn't be the way things go when it comes to mass votes.

I don't really see why. More of the country wanted out than in - 1.3 million people more. That's generally how democracy works.

The amount of people throwing a tanty on here because they didn't get their way, and asserting that Leave voters must be stupid, xenophobic or both is pretty sad. All this shit about "fucking over a generation" is pathetic. Life will go on. The UK will remain part of Europe. Get over it.

 

[Steve.1981]

Get over it.

Stay classy.

 

[Polari]

Stay classy.

You don't really have any other option.

 

[Glasshole]

I don't really see why. More of the country wanted out than in - 1.3 million people more. That's generally how democracy works.

The amount of people throwing a tanty on here because they didn't get their way, and asserting that Leave voters must be stupid, xenophobic or both is pretty sad. All this shit about "fucking over a generation" is pathetic. Life will go on. The UK will remain part of Europe. Get over it.

Considering the Remain camp pointed out the Leave campaign's lies in the public debates and now the Leave campaign is backtracking on these exact promises, yes, I'd say it's fair to assume the Leave voters are fucking daft.

Considering people at the age of 65 were most likely to vote Leave, an age group that pays the least taxes and has the viewest contact points with the EU, gives off a pretty xenophobe vibe to be honest. Their work life is not influenced by the EU - that's 18-24. The people whose "jobs are getting stolen by immigrants". Those people voted to remain.

Again, pretty fucking daft.

EDIT: Why am I arguing with someone who doesn't know math? Nice tag.

 

[SymbiantXenos]

They shouldn't have used pen

 

[ClosingADoor]

I don't really see why. More of the country wanted out than in - 1.3 million people more. That's generally how democracy works.

The amount of people throwing a tanty on here because they didn't get their way, and asserting that Leave voters must be stupid, xenophobic or both is pretty sad. All this shit about "fucking over a generation" is pathetic. Life will go on. The UK will remain part of Europe. Get over it.

It's how it works, but the arguments against it are totally valid. Many countries require more then just a simple majority for major changes like this. There is nothing wrong with that and might be better, considering protest votes and misleading campaigns and promises made to people.

 

[Steve.1981]

You don't really have any other option.

What about having a look at how these huge, life-changing decisions are being made?

What about making it a requirement that from now on one side must win by a clear majority, say 70% of the vote, for example?

Rather than just putting two fingers up to almost half the people who voted?

 

[Polari]

What about having a look at how these huge, life-changing decisions are being made?

What about making it a requirement that from now on one side must win by a clear majority, say 70% of the vote, for example?

Rather than just putting two fingers up to almost half the people who voted?

I mean that's fine. They could've easily passed the bill for this referendum requiring more than a simple majority. Would the public have accepted that though? I doubt it.

 

[Theecliff]

I don't really see why. More of the country wanted out than in - 1.3 million people more. That's generally how democracy works.

The amount of people throwing a tanty on here because they didn't get their way, and asserting that Leave voters must be stupid, xenophobic or both is pretty sad. All this shit about "fucking over a generation" is pathetic. Life will go on. The UK will remain part of Europe. Get over it.

nah. me and my friends are uni students. our education is supported heavily by the EU. and vote leave has given power to the exact people who would be willing to fuck us over. a bunch of my friends are training as doctors for an nhs that's going to collapse in on itself. slimy cunts like farage and gove who never had the best interests in the service despite it being one of the biggest bulletpoints for their leave campaign are in the clear now.

so yeah. i'm not going to whine about democracy or any of that bollocks but i don't have to be happy about this outcome. i'm pissed off. and some people i know are extremely upset.

 

[caramac]

No shortage of nominees for the darwin awards.

 

[dealer-]

We sleepwalked into an EU exit.

 

[Steve.1981]

I mean that's fine. They could've easily passed the bill for this referendum requiring more than a simple majority. Would the public have accepted that though? I doubt it.

I honestly don't know if the public would have accepted those terms. It just seems like a fairer way of making what are, like I said, huge life-changing decisions.

I think a 70% majority is a clear, "Yes. We want this" answer.

51.8% seems more like an, "Ehhh...We don't know...Maybe?".

 

[Walshicus]

The amount of people throwing a tanty on here because they didn't get their way, and asserting that Leave voters must be stupid, xenophobic or both is pretty sad. All this shit about "fucking over a generation" is pathetic. Life will go on. The UK will remain part of Europe. Get over it.

Not to be obtuse, but the demographics and gods know how many surveys show that the leave vote went to older, uneducated people with opinions that feminism, multiculturalism, sexual freedom etc. are bad things...

It's not difficult to make that connection.

 

[Polari]

nah. me and my friends are uni students. our education is supported heavily by the EU. and vote leave has given power to the exact people who would be willing to fuck us over. a bunch of my friends are training as doctors for an nhs that's going to collapse in on itself. slimy cunts like farage and gove who never had the best interests in the service despite it being one of the biggest bulletpoints for their leave campaign are in the clear now.

so yeah. i'm not going to whine about democracy or any of that bollocks but i don't have to be happy about this outcome. i'm pissed off. and some people i know are extremely upset.

I'm sure doctors will be fine. Where do you think that support for your education comes from, exactly? Taxpayers. And the UK pays significantly more into the EU budget than it gets back.

 

[News Bot]

I'm sure doctors will be fine. Where do you think that support for your education comes from, exactly? Taxpayers. And the UK pays significantly more into the EU budget than it gets back.

Germany also pays more than it gets. This isn't something unique to the UK. You're also ignoring subsidies, grants, economic development and scientific research projects getting EU cash, etc. We got back roughly £6bn a year.

 

[Joni]

Germany also pays more than it gets. This isn't something unique to the UK.

It also makes sense: The rich help the poor.

 

[Polari]

Not to be obtuse, but the demographics and gods know how many surveys show that the leave vote went to older, uneducated people with opinions that feminism, multiculturalism, sexual freedom etc. are bad things...

It's not difficult to make that connection.

Will that be disproportionately true of the Leave side? Sure.

But I find it hard to believe it's representative of Leave voters on the whole, considering they make up more than half the country.

 

[Glasshole]

I'm sure doctors will be fine. Where do you think that support for your education comes from, exactly? Taxpayers. And the UK pays significantly more into the EU budget than it gets back.

Are you really that dense? The EU sponsors a lot of scholarly research on university level, check horizon 2020 for a start.

If you really believe england, out of all places, will start pumping money into education, I don't know whether that would be silly or borderline illusionary.

 

[Arksy]

This has gone really off-topic...

I'm not surprised there are people who regret their decision, there always will be those who wished they had made a different choice...that doesn't change anything though, we just had a giant poll, and we got the result that we got.

 

[hodgy100]

You guys made the best Devil May Cry game. That is worth getting a litle patriotic for.

And the best sonic racing game *shameless plug* most of us wanted to stay in though

 

[Polari]

Germany also pays more than it gets. This isn't something unique to the UK. You're also ignoring subsidies, grants, economic development and scientific research projects getting EU cash, etc.

I'm not sure if they're factored in to that total or not. It was in reference to the poster's comment about the EU subsidising his education, where in reality Britain heavily subsidises the EU.

 

[Bumhead]

What about having a look at how these huge, life-changing decisions are being made?

What about making it a requirement that from now on one side must win by a clear majority, say 70% of the vote, for example?

Rather than just putting two fingers up to almost half the people who voted?

You wouldn't be making this suggestion if the side you wanted to win had won, would you.

 

[StayDead]

Will that be disproportionately true of the Leave side? Sure.

But I find it hard to believe it's representative of Leave voters on the whole, considering they make up more than half the country.

No they don't.

They make up 35% of the eligible voting population. 35%...

 

[Steve.1981]

considering they make up more than half the country

No they don't. They make up more than half the people who voted.

 

[News Bot]

I'm not sure if they're factored in to that total or not. It was in reference to the poster's comment about the EU subsidising his education, where in reality Britain heavily subsidises the EU.

They subsidise each other, claiming anything else is a bare-faced lie. The UK does not "lose" money, it gets paid back in various ways that we simply will never see now. Also:

Almost £1 billion of British money given to the EU is spend on international aid. That spending is counted towards the UK Government’s target of spending 0.7 per cent of Gross Domestic Product on aid.

Some of that money was going to spent anyway... We paid £6.5 billion last year into the EU, but we earned more than that due to access to the single market. Leavers are delusional if they think that'll be the same now.

 

[Maztorre]

People vote for what they feel is important, the stupid "cunt" is the person who doesn't or allows others to use small minded insult to sway them.

Might want to lose the rhetoric a touch it's people talking like you are that galvanised the leave vote because bitter arrogance is exactly the thing they were voting against when leaving the EU.

What galvanised the leave vote was a pack of lies that their leadership have already backed away from now that reality has set in. Turkeys voting for Christmas despite the constant warnings that starting coming true the morning after the vote.

Chill, more people disagree with you than agree with you on the EU debate, such is life people need to wind down and start to play the hand that's been dealt.

Scotland and Northern Ireland will be playing the hand that's been dealt, that's for sure. Businesses and research institutions operating in the EU will be doing the same. But chill, it's only people's livelihoods and the future of the UK as an entity, right?

I think we'll be ok, possibly great. Not tomorrow, but soon enough. We're a nation of salespeople, we will sell, maybe better now we aren't being told what we can sell, who to, for how much, and when.

The only thing the English will be selling without Europe is lies to what is left of its electorate. You will either end up with free movement as before but with no seat at the EU table, or you will continue to diminish in "splendid isolation". Outside of the financial services industry you have little to offer anymore, since you have repeatedly voted in parties that have dismantled your country to pile money on their friends in that sector.

 

[mrklaw]

Although I voted Remain, it's pretty disappointing to see the sensationalist echo-chamber here. Over 17m voted to leave - are we going to categorise them as a collection of xenophobes, racists, bigots, greedy baby-boomers and apathetic voters who now regret their decision? Or are we going to acknowledge that there is likely a high proportion of people in the country who had a good reason -- or more pointedly, have been negatively impacted and are no longer convinced of an upturn in their lives in the EU?

I won't. But I will generalise them as people voting for a massive change without likely understanding the complexity of the current situation, compounded by a toxic leave campaign promising the moon on a stick with no evidence and then admitting most of it was bollocks afterwards, and undoubtedly influenced by years of EU critical headlines and articles in right wing newspapers - like the bendy banana - which sows the seeds of 'people feeling like they're forced into lots of red tape by the EU.


It wasn't a decision the general population are capable of meaningfully making. A referendum should never have been held.

(Also should have required 2/3 majority to change)

 

[Polari]

They subsidise each other, claiming anything else is a bare-faced lie. The UK does not "lose" money, it gets paid back in various ways that we simply will never see now.

Can you source that? I've provided a neutral source dedicated to fact-checking which clearly states "The UK pays more into the EU budget than it gets back."

 

[Xenex]

I'm sure doctors will be fine. Where do you think that support for your education comes from, exactly? Taxpayers. And the UK pays significantly more into the EU budget than it gets back.

What about when our economy contracts and there's less taxpayers money to give out?

 

[Lego Boss]

Now I understand the "English Way". Can say they are that so clever as a Nation after this. It is sad how Democracy works these days. People think its a joke to vote. That one do not count and when you start to sum the those votes that "I didn't think I made a difference" writes the history of a Nation.

I only hope my country (Colombia) make things good the the peace treat.

I honestly think people thought it was like a Facebook post. That it would be read by Friends and then disappear tomorrow. It hasn't and now you can watch the world burn.

 

[News Bot]

Can you source that? I've provided a neutral source dedicated to fact-checking which clearly states "The UK pays more into the EU budget than it gets back."

Look into EU subsidies, grants, and funding to the UK for starters instead of taking a flat figure and applying it wholesale.

 

[Vault Dweller 111]

Why not redo it? If they redid the vote I'm sure it'd be 'stay' by a good margin. Isn't that the point? Okay you fucked up, does a whole country suffer because of it? Learn from the mistake and go back. Who stops that from happening? Is the EU not going to let them back? I'm sure it sucked for them to leave in the first place. Just vote again and act like it never happened.

*im drunk and it's 4am. When I wake up I better see several posts telling me why that's impossible and what an idiot i am.

 

[TCRS]

so that's like what, three people? stay mad remainers lmao

 

[Steve.1981]

You wouldn't be making this suggestion if the side you wanted to win had won, would you.

That's an obvious accusation and I understand why you make it.

The best way I can answer you is to say, I want an independent Scotland. We may get a second referendum on independence. I would be OK with my suggested 70% requirement being implemented for that vote.

I genuinely believe it would be a fairer way to make these decisions.

 

[Ushay]

Ah good ol' democracy. Ain't it great.

Now my kids will bear the consequences for our own stupidity. Hope things stabilize soon and it ends up being a boon.

 

[Bumhead]

That's an obvious accusation and I understand why you make it.

The best way I can answer you is to say, I want an independent Scotland. We may get a second referendum on independence. I would be OK with my suggested 70% requirement being implemented for that vote.

I genuinely believe it would be a fairer way to make these decisions.

It seems horribly arbitrary to suddenly make a majority vote not quite enough of a majority to change anything. And also something that could be open to a fair amount of abuse.

It's annoying being part of the 48% who wanted to remain in the EU. Theoretically, imagine being part of the 50-69% of people who vote for change, as part of a large majority vote, and still don't get their way because 70% is needed.

 

[GamingKaiju]

1.1 Million people of signed the petition for a 2nd EU ref.

Things might come out OK guys.

 

[darkwing]

1.1 Million people of signed the petition for a 2nd EU ref.

Things might come out OK guys.

wth it was like only 100k yesterday

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

1.1 Million people of signed the petition for a 2nd EU ref.

Things might come out OK guys.

Not if it fails again.

 

[GamingKaiju]

wth it was like only 100k yesterday

Reality has set in that leaving the EU will only break up our own union and have wode reaching impilcations for decades.

 

[Drackhorn]

1.1 Million people of signed the petition for a 2nd EU ref.

Things might come out OK guys.

So basically some people want to vote and vote again till they get their way?

 

[Stallion Dan]

After yesterday's result, and after the result of the Scottish independence referendum, I think I agree with this.

Both outcomes were almost half and half. It doesn't feel right to ignore the will of almost half the people who voted.

Yeah, should need a supermajority so can ignore the half you disagree with instead.

1.1 Million people of signed the petition for a 2nd EU ref.

Things might come out OK guys.

Remain voters want to try again, I'm shocked, shocked I tell you.

 

[darkwing]

they should have set something like a 60% threshold, 50.1% is kinda bonkers

 

[Clockwork5]

After yesterday's result, and after the result of the Scottish independence referendum, I think I agree with this.

Both outcomes were almost half and half. It doesn't feel right to ignore the will of almost half the people who voted.

No, you should ignore even more!

 

[Steve.1981]

It seems horribly arbitrary to suddenly make a majority vote not quite enough of a majority to change anything. And also something that could be open to a fair amount of abuse.

It's annoying being part of the 48% who wanted to remain in the EU. Theoretically, imagine being part of the 50-69% of people who vote for change, as part of a large majority vote, and still don't get their way because 70% is needed.

Well you've got to make the cut-off somewhere, at some percentage of the vote. I believe a bigger majority would give a more obvious answer to whatever question is being asked. Then there could be no niggling doubts over the numbers either way. And like I said, these are huge decisions we're being asked to make. It's not the same as electing a government, for example, where people can go back in a few years and attempt to put right a mistake they may feel they made.

Also, what do you mean when you say it would be open to abuse? I don't understand what you mean by that.

Edit: To the other people jumping in, take this post as my reply to you as well.

 

[Kinyou]

It seems horribly arbitrary to suddenly make a majority vote not quite enough of a majority to change anything. And also something that could be open to a fair amount of abuse.

It's annoying being part of the 48% who wanted to remain in the EU. Theoretically, imagine being part of the 50-69% of people who vote for change, as part of a large majority vote, and still don't get their way because 70% is needed.

It's not a unusual to require a supermajority when changes to the constitution are made https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supermajority

Considering the significant effect this will have on the UK a supermajority would make sense to me. Simply makes the whole affair less fickle and ensures that the majority is absolutely on your side.