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Microsoft needs more exclusives throughout the year

HeWhoWalks

Gold Member
I've personally made no claim, one way or another. My first post in this thread on this particular derail topic was to point out your error.

As far as I can see this entire thread of debate about Xbox profitability started with your claim (amid your persecution complex-fueled rant) that MS Xbox division was profitable, to which another poster (not me) posted to refute your claim.

Now you're moving the goal posts. Frankly, you don't seem interested in intelligent debate on the actual topic of this thread (i.e. MS exclusives), but instead you seem to want to engage in thread-derailing tirades whilst employing misdirection, straw-men arguments and non-sequitur, all to avoid accepting the actual facts that undermine the premise of your arguments.

Precisely why many of us have moved on. Initially, I was all for a discussion with him, but everything is "well Sony did....™", "but PlayStation fanbois...". I mean, why not face the bottom line, here? Microsoft's exclusive software is currently lacking. Nothing wrong with admitting that and leaving all the other talk elsewhere.
 
Sony has shut down a lot of studios too and I don't excuse them for that at all. Liverpool hurt (I was a fan of their output for over 20 years) and Guerrilla Cambridge and Evolution seemed senseless as they made excellent games which suffered from poor business decisions. If you search out the topics for the latter two I'm sure you'll see me complaining about it a lot. But I guess everything has to be Sony

No, it's just the case that Both SONY 'and' MS have done it. So why the focus on MS I don't know.
 
I've personally made no claim, one way or another.

Yet ask me to back up.

Looking over that, if today MS on the XBox One. MS was letting Bizarre Creations go to Activision, see Dice/Bioware go to EA see MS sell off its major In-House studio Bungie to Activision, close down Fasta, Ensemble Studios, and Indie Built, whilst also seeing so called exclusives IP like Mass Effect, Ninja Gaiden II, Lost Planet jump ship to its main rival and be on SONY machines and the one $1.5 billion bail out for faulty consoles ...
I can only imagine the endless threads, of MS is pulling out!

That all happened in the 360 era and nothing on this board about MS pulling out. So what gives with the One?, other than it's not the number one selling console in the USA anymore
 

Stanng243

Member
Yet ask me to back up.

Looking over that, if today MS on the XBox One. MS was letting Bizarre Creations go to Activision, see Dice go to EA and Bioware, see MS sell off its major In-House studio Bungie to Activision, close down Fasta, Ensemble Studios, and Indie Built, whilst also seeing so called exclusives IP like Mass Effect, Ninja Gaiden II, Lost Planet jump ship to its main rival and be on SONY machines ... I can only imagine the endless threads of MS is pulling out.

That all happened in the 360 era and nothing on this board about MS pulling out. So what gives with the One, other than its not the number one selling console in the USA anymore

And what does that have to do with Microsoft exclusives? Please stop derailing the conversation.
 
Then make a thread about Sony shutting down studios then. Coming into this thread and saying "Sony TOO" over and over is doing nothing but derailing the thread.

Sorry I don't like to see any developer shut down and most certainly not use people jobs to point score on consoles. I'm simply saying both corps do it, big difference. And to be fair to NCL and to their credit, they don't
 
Nothing wrong with admitting that and leaving all the other talk elsewhere.

There's nothing wrong and there's nothing new with it. Other than Fable they aren't many IP the 360 had from MS or its In-House studios than the XBox one does not, or that MS could have its In-House studios make.
It's always been a BIG issue for MS.
 
Sony can still release a crap ton of exclusives and Microsoft can't. Hence the purpose of this thread.

Personally, I feel like the most valuable thing Sony does is work with outside studios for exclusive games. Games like Horizon and Uncharted 4 are incredible, but they look even better when your console also has games like Nioh, Persona 5, Nier Automata, FFXII, and so on.

Obviously these are Japan-focused titles that traditionally wouldn't sell well on Xbox, but it really seems like Microsoft doesn't even try to get these titles. Rather than money-hatting exclusives they could at least spend some cash on getting already developed/released games on their platform to widen the appeal.

I'd honestly be happier if they took this approach to narrow the gap between titles rather than trying to give us brand new exclusives.
 
And what does that have to do with Microsoft exclusives? Please stop derailing the conversation.

The point is MS didn't have that 'many' more exclusives even on the 360, which people seem to look over, even the 360 didn't have IP like Yakuza, Persona, Dragon Quest Ect. Despite MS spending millions on Mistwalker and working with various other Japanese studios it all made little difference in Japan The 360 was still totally outclassed in Japan and it's not like the Mistwalker games sold 'that' well and most couldn't even give a toss about FromSoftware exclusive support on the 360 with Ninja Blade, Chrounds or Enchanted Arms all selling well below a million. You really can't blame MS for thinking Japan was and is a lost cause...

Many liked the 360 because of 3rd party games in the main or MS IP like HALO, Forza, and Gears which the XBox One has its self. Many of the issues the XBox One got in terms of lack of In-House IP or major Japanese exclusives were already there on the 360 and why I had issues with the way Robbie Bach and that total tosser Kudo Tsunoda were talking MS and the 360; With that waste of space Kinect and $500 MILLION of MS cash that should have been put towards proper games, not Kinect and mum and dad trying to dance in front of the TV.

The main difference between the One and the 360. Was that the 360 was the best selling console in the USA the 360 as the choice system to lead development on and winning out for most Digital Foundry compassions. When it came to Japanese support and In-House exclusives I thought SONY owned MS and the 360, Actually think the PS3 was the better system, but that's just me
 

Luckydog

Member
Sony can still release a crap ton of exclusives and Microsoft can't. Hence the purpose of this thread.

Not sure why that is so hard to grasp. If MS has 20 studios and shuts down 10 it kills a lot of production. If Sony has 100 studios and closes 10 its a small fraction. In the end, the production is clearly greater on the Sony side now.
 

blakep267

Member
Because Sony still manage to maintain a bunch of studios and have several great releases every year?
Eh from their actual internal studios they aren't pumping out that many more games than Microsoft. They just have the benefit of getting every major Japanese game by default. Studios like sucker punch haven't done anything in 3 years and it was also 3 years between Guerilla releases
 
The point is MS didn't have that 'many' more exclusives even on the 360, which people seem to look over, even the 360 didn't have IP like Yakuza, Persona, Dragon Quest Ect. Despite MS spending millions on Mistwalker and working with various other Japanese studios it all made little difference in Japan The 360 was still totally outclassed in Japan and it's not like the Mistwalker games sold 'that' well and most couldn't even give a toss about FromSoftware exclusive support on the 360 with Ninja Blade, Chrounds or Enchanted Arms all selling well below a million. You really can't blame MS for thinking Japan was and is a lost cause...

Many liked the 360 because of 3rd party games in the main or MS IP like HALO, Forza, and Gears which the XBox One has its self. Many of the issues the XBox One got in terms of lack of In-House IP or major Japanese exclusives were already there on the 360 and why I had issues with the way Robbie Bach and that total tosser Kudo Tsunoda were talking MS and the 360; With that waste of space Kinect and $500 MILLION of MS cash that should have been put towards proper games, not Kinect and mum and dad trying to dance in front of the TV.

The main difference between the One and the 360. Was that the 360 was the best selling console in the USA the 360 as the choice system to lead development on and winning out for most Digital Foundry compassions. When it came to Japanese support and In-House exclusives I thought SONY owned MS and the 360, Actually think the PS3 was the better system, but that's just me


Actually the Wii outsold the Xbox 360 in the US.

Also, to your point about 360-era Xbox exclusives, at the start of last gen. MS enjoyed a metric crap ton of essentially "de facto" exclusives, due the difficulty of programming for the Cell causing a lot of devs and publishers to simply forgo PS3 development.

Not only that, the 360 released a whole year ahead of the PS3 too, so pretty much every third party title releasing in that year was effectively exclusive to the Xbox.

I think a lot of that contributes to the perception that the Xbox 360 enjoyed a lot better exclusive software support than the XB1 (which is still essentially true for the most part).

MS was taking more risks during the 360-era too and funding more games, like Blue Dragon, Lost Odyssey, Mass Effect etc..

This gen, the XB1's initial poor performance combined with the latter-gen PS3 success Sony enjoyed, meant that less third parties would be willing to forgo the Playstation audience and sign exclusive games for the Xbox One; especially with significantly higher development and publishing budgets this gen.

All last gen, MS should have been fostering close exclusive development relationships with third party developers (small and large) as well as building up their internal studio roster. They actually did invest in the former with devs like Remedy and smaller devs like "The Maw" devs, but when Kinect hit it big they seemed to abandon that strategy and go all in chasing the casual gamer.

Now they're paying for it, since it's a much more expensive game to try building up third party exclusive dev relationships and first party dev studios this gen. The financial risks are much higher now with developing new IP, even with seasoned talented existing studios. Trying to do that with newly formed studios with little experience and without any tried and tested studio game engine codebase/tools, the risks might end up being much too great for MS to gamble on, especially considering their current market position. Even trying to leverage old back-catalog IP with a newly formed studio can be a huge gamble... one that has the potential to bring both financial failure as well as damage to the IP itself... just look at EA with ME:A.
 

Stanng243

Member
The point is MS didn't have that 'many' more exclusives even on the 360, which people seem to look over, even the 360 didn't have IP like Yakuza, Persona, Dragon Quest Ect. Despite MS spending millions on Mistwalker and working with various other Japanese studios it all made little difference in Japan The 360 was still totally outclassed in Japan and it's not like the Mistwalker games sold 'that' well and most couldn't even give a toss about FromSoftware exclusive support on the 360 with Ninja Blade, Chrounds or Enchanted Arms all selling well below a million. You really can't blame MS for thinking Japan was and is a lost cause...

Many liked the 360 because of 3rd party games in the main or MS IP like HALO, Forza, and Gears which the XBox One has its self. Many of the issues the XBox One got in terms of lack of In-House IP or major Japanese exclusives were already there on the 360 and why I had issues with the way Robbie Bach and that total tosser Kudo Tsunoda were talking MS and the 360; With that waste of space Kinect and $500 MILLION of MS cash that should have been put towards proper games, not Kinect and mum and dad trying to dance in front of the TV.

The main difference between the One and the 360. Was that the 360 was the best selling console in the USA the 360 as the choice system to lead development on and winning out for most Digital Foundry compassions. When it came to Japanese support and In-House exclusives I thought SONY owned MS and the 360, Actually think the PS3 was the better system, but that's just me

They had plenty of 360 exclusives. Some they let go multi-platform, some they killed. Things like Perfect Dark, Kameo, Banjo-Kazooie, Project Gotham racing, Viva Pinata, Crimson Dragon and many more. And like you said, they had plenty of Japanese exclusives they paid for early in the 360s life. If you don't think people wouldn't love sequels to some of those games, I'm not sure what to say.

Microsoft has a huge well of Ips. It's natural people want them to use some of them.
 
Eh from their actual internal studios they aren't pumping out that many more games than Microsoft. They just have the benefit of getting every major Japanese game by default. Studios like sucker punch haven't done anything in 3 years and it was also 3 years between Guerilla releases

Sony has and is publishing a significant number more exclusive titles than MS. Whether from internal studios or not is irrelevant really. If it's published by MS/Sony, it's first party.
 
Eh from their actual internal studios they aren't pumping out that many more games than Microsoft. They just have the benefit of getting every major Japanese game by default. Studios like sucker punch haven't done anything in 3 years and it was also 3 years between Guerilla releases

Good point. What really hurts XBOX is the fallout from not being in first place and publishers deciding to release on the most popular platform only.
 
Forgot to mention, someone sent this to me on Twitter today. It's 'Father of Xbox' Seamus Blackley talking about lots of things, but predominantly MS's first-party output. He basically says that because they have a very different culture to Sony & Nintendo that he thinks the Xbox division has a lot more trouble getting games green-lit. Interesting to hear his perspective. I can't do a time code as I'm on mobile, but it's about 23:30.

https://youtu.be/8xSr70tQzw0
 
Eh from their actual internal studios they aren't pumping out that many more games than Microsoft. They just have the benefit of getting every major Japanese game by default. Studios like sucker punch haven't done anything in 3 years and it was also 3 years between Guerilla releases

Good point. What really hurts XBOX is the fallout from not being in first place and publishers deciding to release on the most popular platform only.

I don't think is true though? There's a clear divide in the number of games each publish since 2015, with MS taking their foot off the accelerator while Sony did the opposite.

https://twitter.com/Triggerhappytel/status/872171075542667265
 

Papacheeks

Banned
Forgot to mention, someone sent this to me on Twitter today. It's 'Father of Xbox' Seamus Blackley talking about lots of things, but predominantly MS's first-party output. He basically says that because they have a very different culture to Sony & Nintendo that he thinks the Xbox division has a lot more trouble getting games green-lit. Interesting to hear his perspective. I can't do a time code as I'm on mobile, but it's about 23:30.

https://youtu.be/8xSr70tQzw0

What's funny is this reiterates what I said about the xbox brand in general. The division has too many big wigs looking over it to let it run they way it should which is a gaming division.

Let it the division run the way it wants to and only intervene if over a course of time thing's don't start seeing growth or quality of software doesn't improve.
 

cakely

Member
Ouch that stung..careful what you say around SonyGAF....not to mention those are straight up fax you mentioned.

If this isn't a parody account ... good lord, man.

No, it's just the case that Both SONY 'and' MS have done it. So why the focus on MS I don't know.

If you really want to insist on Sony Too™, you should make a new thread, entitled "Sony needs more exclusives throughout the year", and we can talk about it there.

Though, it looks like we might have moved on at this point. Late reply.
 

Melchiah

Member
Forgot to mention, someone sent this to me on Twitter today. It's 'Father of Xbox' Seamus Blackley talking about lots of things, but predominantly MS's first-party output. He basically says that because they have a very different culture to Sony & Nintendo that he thinks the Xbox division has a lot more trouble getting games green-lit. Interesting to hear his perspective. I can't do a time code as I'm on mobile, but it's about 23:30.

https://youtu.be/8xSr70tQzw0

Thanks for sharing. Blackley gives an interesting inside perspective on the matter, and in relation to XBX later on in the video.
 

Kickz

Member
Not only microsoft need exclusives...also game that also doesnt available on pc
MS decision to make their exclusives also available on pc(windows 10) kind of pouring oil into fire

i doubt 2018 will change anything if most of the exclusives also coming to pc

This doesn't matter, even Sony has PS Now on PC.

I think consoles and PCs are not running the same race.
 
I've just been playing RDR on my XboxOne, abit of Steep and when Halo Wars 2 drops in price, I'll pick that up. Definitely amped for Cuphead but this has not been Microsoft's year.

Now would be a good time to atleast announce something, Fable 4? or a Tales of Vesperia 2, something...
 

panda-zebra

Member
Forgot to mention, someone sent this to me on Twitter today. It's 'Father of Xbox' Seamus Blackley talking about lots of things, but predominantly MS's first-party output. He basically says that because they have a very different culture to Sony & Nintendo that he thinks the Xbox division has a lot more trouble getting games green-lit. Interesting to hear his perspective. I can't do a time code as I'm on mobile, but it's about 23:30.

https://youtu.be/8xSr70tQzw0

Interesting insight. Well worth a watch from that point onwards and there's a lot more he offers beyond just getting games green-lit. He candidly, especially given his place in xbox history, highlights the disparity in corporate ethos between MS, Sony and Nintendo when it comes to the matter of producing games software, and uses the analogy of Microsoft having learned a language with the other two being native speakers. Reminds me of something Bob Marley said in an interview (later sampled and popularised).

What's funny is this reiterates what I said about the xbox brand in general. The division has too many big wigs looking over it to let it run they way it should which is a gaming division.

Let it the division run the way it wants to and only intervene if over a course of time thing's don't start seeing growth or quality of software doesn't improve.

An interesting contrast to something I read earlier this evening that covered Media Molecule's relationship with the corporate side of Sony. You get a sense of there being real pressure from Shu to get a title in a box and on shelves, as you'd expect, that's part of what he does, yet they're allowed great freedoms in how they go about their efforts. It's impossible to imagine a team at MS being allowed such freedoms, especially given the words offered in the youtube video.
 

Shaanyboi

Banned
The completely lackluster exclusive lineup is what keeps me from an Xbox One.

I want to play Sunset Overdrive. Sea of Thieves looks cool. But that's all I can seriously think of. I don't care about Halo, or Forza, I've played enough Gears, and Fable is dead in the water. Scalebound was killed, I'm not convinced Phantom Dust was ever actually happening.

Versus how many Sony or Nintendo exclusives I bought in just the first half of this year... It's insane.
 

bitbydeath

Member
No, it's just the case that Both SONY 'and' MS have done it. So why the focus on MS I don't know.

You should focus more on PSVR in that respect as they both receive the same sort of support. Both are upheld mostly by indies and 3rd parties and each only receive a few 1st parties each year.
 

Papacheeks

Banned
Interesting insight. Well worth a watch from that point onwards and there's a lot more he offers beyond just getting games green-lit. He candidly, especially given his place in xbox history, highlights the disparity in corporate ethos between MS, Sony and Nintendo when it comes to the matter of producing games software, and uses the analogy of Microsoft having learned a language with the other two being native speakers. Reminds me of something Bob Marley said in an interview (later sampled and popularised).



An interesting contrast to something I read earlier this evening that covered Media Molecule's relationship with the corporate side of Sony. You get a sense of there being real pressure from Shu to get a title in a box and on shelves, as you'd expect, that's part of what he does, yet they're allowed great freedoms in how they go about their efforts. It's impossible to imagine a team at MS being allowed such freedoms, especially given the words offered in the youtube video.

Yea, it's sad that seamus is gone from the company. Him, J allard really had an amazing vision for that division and kind of got pushed out as slowly they saw the bigger part of the company slowly trying to turn it into something else.
 
Eh from their actual internal studios they aren't pumping out that many more games than Microsoft. They just have the benefit of getting every major Japanese game by default. Studios like sucker punch haven't done anything in 3 years and it was also 3 years between Guerilla releases

Why do Xbox fans always say this whenever a discussion like this comes up? Even excluding external projects, Sony should have 10 internally developed games out by the end of this year, whereas Microsoft should have just 2. So no, it's not even remotely close. You might want to check your facts before making claims like that.
 

HeWhoWalks

Gold Member
There's nothing wrong and there's nothing new with it. Other than Fable they aren't many IP the 360 had from MS or its In-House studios than the XBox one does not, or that MS could have its In-House studios make.
It's always been a BIG issue for MS.

You could have just said that from the beginning, rather than placing blame on "teh fanboys" or Sony. Neither of them are the reason why Microsoft's current exclusive situation is where it is.
 

RPGam3r

Member
Hey we have a new system coming out, and absolutely no games of our own to play on it, wtf happened to you MS? Just stop trying rather than halfass it.
 
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