Golden_Pigeon
Banned
I really think that stating one parental situation should be compulsory before commenting on that thread.
Don't hit anyone. Not adults. Not kids.
Just be fucking nice to each other. What's so goddamn difficult?
I really think that stating one parental situation should be compulsory before commenting on that thread.
You reasoning is ok in theory, but in practice, everything about parenting is about you being above them, you choose things for him and have the last word about what they should or should not do.
I really think that stating one parental situation should be compulsory before commenting on that thread.
He might be getting at the fact that you're popping a defenseless child in the head for merely saying something inappropriate and that's kind of bonkers.
Punishment via physical violence is separate from consequences. That's what I'm getting at. It's not a natural consequence for almost anything you have in life.
Because I should trust your own judgement on how you turned out after possibly being abused? Why won't people admit they're probably not the best judge of their own parents. Every piece of research in existence says there are negative consequences. Every psychologist around will tell you not to fucking do it. I'm sure you can find people that licked asbestos growing up and turned out just fine but you shouldn't be feeding it to your children.
Kids are people, holy fucking shit.
Cool, wanna go with anecdotes? The bullies I knew growing up were the ones whose parents beat them the most. Every kid I knew who had parents that hit them turned out violent themselves and/or emotionally stunted in some way.
You hit your son when he says something inappropriate? Jesus christ, that's insanity. Clearly your father hitting you has continued this cycle.
You also can't say disciplining him is not a problem, because you don't know. You won't know for a very long time. Hell, you might not ever know. But research says it's bad. Stop hitting your kid.
I mean, if you have a flask that you could pour those results into, or a machine that definitively and consistently shows measurements proving that this is the case, I would love to see those studies.
I don't think what that has to do with what I said. I just said that the kind of physical punishment you're referring to is already covered by child abuse laws, I'd say, so I don't see what exactly the laws about child education are for, and I'm not fond of the fuzzy borders it has.
Yeah, if you took that post to mean I was advocating for hitting kids, then I can't help you.
Nope.I really think that stating one parental situation should be compulsory before commenting on that thread.
You know parenting is difficult. Again, there is no instruction manual on how to do it. If someone claims to have the answer it just means that they don't have kids.
Manslaughter?There's studies out there that show that hitting kids does nothing to improve their behavioural outcomes.
That said, what do you do when a kid don't give a shit? If you take away their toys and ground them and they don't listen to you and go out anyway? You can't exactly restrain them, that's force just like hitting a kid is force.
This isn't me saying "force is the answer" I'm just wondering what the solution is for problem children. Drugs? Juvie? Putting them up for adoption? Lobotomy?
Holding a child's hand isn't violent or abusive, like when grabbing your kid's hand to stop them running into traffic. It's not about banning physical contact, it's about stopping fill grown adults from striking children.Well, that's exactly my problem... I'd say that anything that hurt is child abuse... and you don't need additional laws to forbid that.
Now, a gentle patting of the hand of a child, is it physical abuse? Where do you put the limit? Seems awfully fuzzy to me.
If you basically ban physical contact, I'm sure it'll have interesting consequences (try to stop a kid from running away with words, that should be fun).
Manslaughter?
Lobotomy lol, the hell.
Raise your kids the best you can.
If you think physical punishment is needed, just know that there's unintended consequences.
Also I hope everyone is talking physical punishment such as spanking or stuffs like that.
We're not talking about using kids for boxing practice, right?
Nothing an RKO cannot fix. Seriously though, is it true that at a certain age range, the only discipline that can get through to a child is physical?
So bullying in the justification of punishment?No, although some folks really think that by getting whooped as a kid meant bloodied and bruised, passing out and going into shock etc... The occasional spank whip with a belt and pinching or flicking and or twisting of the ear, that was it for alot of us.
This.No. And spoiled and physical abuse have nothing to do with each other. Here's a good article based on 20 years of research on the subject:
http://www.cmaj.ca/content/184/12/1373.short
There may not be an instruction manual, but there are tons and tons of research articles and psychologists that would tell you not to hit your kid.
If there was an instruction manual I'm pretty sure you would not use it.
Also, I'm not making any assumptions about you at all. I'm going exactly by what you've posted. You said your dad kicked your ass and now you're talking about how you hit your kid. I'm not assuming anything. You said that.
Nothing an RKO cannot fix. Seriously though, is it true that at a certain age range, the only discipline that can get through to a child is physical?
No, although some folks really think that by getting whooped as a kid meant bloodied and bruised, passing out and going into shock etc... The occasional spank whip with a belt and pinching or flicking and or twisting of the ear, that was it for alot of us.
No, and it makes me absolutely sick thinking that people believe it does.
So bullying in the justification of punishment?
So you are being intentionally obtuse, got itWell yeah my mom did take my lunch money and my hat away and pass it back and forth with my dad while I squirmed in the middle. So yeah bullying I guess
Well, kids are defenseless anyways in the privacy of their home, it's why child abuse is so common and prevalent. I don't know how a slap make that any different. Abuse is bad everybody agree on that, the issue is that we don't have the same definition about what abuse is.
I'm really curious about what you would do if you have multiples kids and the strongest start to repeatedly hit the others.
You're purposefully blurring the lines. As a parent and an adult, you have certain legally defined duties towards your child. The age of majority is different from being in total control of someone. What you're saying actually further plays into my argument, because by your definition of "complete authority", you could kill your kids for doing something wrong. But you can't. And there are reasons for that. Just the same reasons that, in my view, morally place physically hurting them at the same level as physically hurting someone else. I live in a country where that's reflected in law, and I think it's sad that that's now how it is all around the world.
There are laws that say that you need to ensure what's best for your child. That's why they don't have completely volition. You are in charge of making sure they go to school, you are in charge of making sure they eat, etc. But you cannot use any means necessary to ensure those things. You cannot put a shock collar around their necks, force a GPS tracker on them, then zap them if they are outside of school on a given day. You cannot hurt your child to achieve your duties. You're attempting to blur the lines, so let's make them clearer. The only reason why it is allowed in some countries is that it's not considered "hurting your child". That's the basis of what we're discussing. I think physically hurting your child hurts your child, and so does all research on the field.
Yeah, if you're a doctorate in child behavior, you really need to have a child before you can give anyone advice. Can you please state what this is supposed to achieve? Show that kids are so annoying sometimes that it's hard to cope without using violence? That if you haven't had a child, you don't understand how hard it is, and if you have a child, you get that they deserved to get smacked sometimes?
I was referring to the last line. Just because there are other ways to harm children outside of violence doesn't make physical punishment any better.
What? You quoted someone saying "Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't" saying "yeah, lol, I was spanked, and I'm not broken". I don't get how that's supposed to be against spanking? I just think "not being broken" is a pretty low standard to measure something by.
Yes, thats why children in Sweden and Germany are the least disciplined in the world.
My relationship with my children is strong enough that it can survive the occasional spanking.
Your aunts and uncles slapped you around? If my family would have done that, they'd have some major problems with my parents. Would you really trust your family members to hand out physical punishment to your kids? That sounds like a recipe for disaster.
LmaoI plan to power bomb my children through a table whenever they cross me
'Just be fucking nice to each other' does not teach a child discipline, that's what's so difficult.
'Just be fucking nice to each other' does not teach a child discipline, that's what's so difficult.
To teach and discipline a child means making them feel negative emotions, one way or the other. There is no way around those situations as a parent. You can inflict those emotions through a scolding, through non-violent punishment ('go to your room', 'you're grounded') or you can administer a physical punishment.
But 'just be nice' isn't going to keep children safe or raise any decent citizens.
Well, one interesting thing to look at is the fact that negative punishment isn't always bad in that it serves a biological purpose (yes, that's supported by science). Touch a hot stove, it hurts enough you might not do it again. That's hard baked into our psychology and even animals do it to their young to keep them in line. The problem is, do we need to use these methods in our society today? I think most would think not, but again, some people truly do think a certain respect of and fear for authority is a positive thing. Some actions in the real world can have extremely harsh and unrevokable consequences. You spit at the wrong person, they might put you down, etc. Some people would rather their children hate them than see them suffer at the hands of some like that. It's a really tricky situation and part of why this subject isn't so black and white.
This thread reminded me of an anime called Magical DoReMi where one episode was about a spoiled girl who never got any kind of punishment from her parent, On the whole episode you have the main characters talking about how one slap in the face was okay from time to time and that all of them have received at least one, and I could swear that they were telling this with an smile on their face
So, the girl was acting shitty during the whole episode until her parent finally hit her in the face, then she starts acting good.
Maybe I invented some details sine I only watched this episode once 13 years ago, but I remember that As a kid this episode really fucked me up, even though I understood what they tried to say, is still fucked up that the solution to parenting was an slap in the face
Sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn't.