ComputerMKII
Banned
I love that trailer, they shouldn't feel ashamed for making it.
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Tekken Tag 2 to be modified due to use of 'Allah' in Saudi Arabia stage
- Thread starter ComputerMKII
- Start date
TheBaronOfNA
Banned
)frankie_baby
Member
I can guarantee if they had written god or Jesus on the floor some Christians would have asked for it to be changed and possibly in not as nice a way as this Muslim has
Lmao, yeah right.
GhostWriter24
Member
TheBaronOfNA
Banned
Faulty logic.
Is more equivalent of a character doing a middle finger to a Christ statue in a middle of a fight.
DR2K
Banned
Allah = god.
Yes. There is nothing wrong if it was on the wall.
Listen, I, and many others, have no problem with religious references in Videogames, you want proof? Here you go:
http://uncharted.wikia.com/wiki/Djinn
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jinn
Did you hear any contraversy concerning that? No? Didn't think so. But its when Developers use these reference in ways that are considered offensive and borderline forbidden to both our culture and our religion that voices of dissatisfaction can be heard, examples such as:
1) Cannibals screaming "Allah" in Zack and Wiki (this one is pretty self explanatory)
2)Putting the name "Allah" on top of a toilet (for us muslims, toilets are filthy places and a person shouldn't even speak, let alone have such a holy name in such a place)
3) Reciting verses from the Quran in a musical form in Little Big Planet 2 (This is mostly cultural than religious, as I don't think there is evidence from islam that forbids this, could be wrong though. Regardless, a domestic artist once caused the exact same controversy in my home country for the exact same reason. Its not nit-picky, people actually care about this stuff back home.)
And on and on.
Now, I fully agree they would not have the right to state their opinion if they threatened anyone or acted violently, but in this case it was just a small tweet, why is this even a thread?
If you are talking about those who will absolutely find anything offensive, then yes of course there will be those people. Just as there those who complained about racism in RE5. I don't agree with that at all, but they don't create a significant part in the Videogame spectrum, you shouldn't worry about them.
I'd say the logic that implies a word used as decoration on a floor that is typically used for standing on is not the equivalent of someone giving the finger to a statue. Just cause crazy ass nuts want to interpret every presence of some Muslim affiliated thing as an attack on them is the problem.
TimeEffect
Member
People half way across the world who have no connection to the game other than claiming to be offended under the guise of religious belief is completely important to everybody and deserves to be taken seriously by everybody else?
They can be offended all they want, the fact that they can influence such a decision out of fear is what's wrong here. If we want to pander to what offends everybody we wouldn't be very far. The difference here is the religion and history behind it.
Tbh I think the reason they didn't realise is because it looks like a design. Probably was a wall pattern and they used it for the tiled floor.
I guess I can see why it would upset some people, especially since it is in the Saudia Arabia stage.
A lot of intolerance in this thread btw. What's there to really complain about if you're not offended.
I guess I can see why it would upset some people, especially since it is in the Saudia Arabia stage.
A lot of intolerance in this thread btw. What's there to really complain about if you're not offended.
frankie_baby
Member
The sort of Christians who are likely to be offended are more likely to be those that don't see god and Allah as the same thing
Who got slapped by this floor design again?
I would wager in the battle of insulting religions that Christians tend to actually get insulted more and in worse ways than the Muslim world ever does. Jesus in a bottle of Piss, Virgin Mary covered in dog shit etc versus a cartoon or a world scribbled on the floor
Christians just didn't realize the power that fear could give them.
GhostTrick
Banned
People are wondering why people complain about this ? I'm asking why this thing was put in the game ? I mean seriously, people doesn't want to hear about religious complaints, that's okay. But why do they put religious contents in the first place ?!
You don't see the irony at all, do you.
Once again, there is nothing wrong with pointing this out to developers and there certainly is nothing wrong in having it removed. It's clear it wasn't their intention to have something like that in the first place, so it's nice to see them respond in a quick and positive manner. I couldn't care less either way, but apparently the developers meant no offence so hey, it's gone.
It's one of the more common arts of the Islamic world, so many Muslims would have seen it in their time. I don't really blame the developers for using it since they probably came across it after a quick search for Islamic art.
How do you know they're not fans of the Tekken series? How do you know they're not living in a western country? This may come as a shock to you, but Muslims kids in the west (and Middle East) do play games too, just like any other kid growing up.
TheBaronOfNA
Banned
It is in Muslim world:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43673879&postcount=13
And there has been international incidents regarding this (beyond the usual religious nuts)
frankie_baby
Member
I guess you don't remember the church of England threatening sony with legal action for having a level in resistance with Manchester cathedral in it?
clem84
Gold Member
It already happened and NO ONE said a thing!
Im not denying this doesnt happen everywhere else to some degree, it was just a kneejerk reaction because Muslims do it far more than anyone else, and its fucking annoying. Least this time they arent threatening Jihad on the development team.
Where's the rage here?
Again, when has this happened in the video game world?
ComputerMKII
Banned
This happened not too long ago:
http://www.france24.com/en/20121004...sparks-near-riot-toulouse-france-mounir-fatmi'Misunderstanding' over Islamic art sparks near-riot
The accidental projection of a work of art based on Islamic holy texts nearly started a riot in the southwestern French city of Toulouse on Tuesday. The artist, shocked by the response of young Muslim youths in the city, has withdrawn the piece.
A Moroccan artist on Wednesday suspended one of his works from a major arts festival in southern France after his projections of Islamic calligraphy onto a bridge nearly set off a riot when local Muslim youths saw pedestrians walking on the words.
Mounir Fatmis exhibit at the month-long Printemps de Septembre art festival in Toulouse was meant to be shown at weekends, when cordons would be in place to insure the projections could not be walked on, as this is considered blasphemous by Muslims.
But late on Tuesday the video, made up of stylised calligraphy of verses from the Koran and Hadiths (sayings) of the Prophet Mohammed, was projected by mistake onto the citys busy Pont Neuf.
According to Toulouse Police, the reaction was rapid. Up to 80 young people, many called in from the citys housing estates, gathered on the bridge to stop pedestrians from treading on the verses.
One woman was slapped after she accidentally walked onto the projection, police said, although some protesters claimed she had deliberately provoked them.
Police sent in a riot squad, but a local imam and representatives of the Muslim community went to the scene and successfully appealed for calm.
The projection was switched off, and after meetings with the mayor, an apology was made to the woman who was slapped.
This was essentially one big misunderstanding, Hassan Idmiloud, vice president of the Toulouse Muslim Association, told FRANCE 24.
Idmiloud explained that tensions had been high in Toulouse since Mohamed Merah, a 23-year-old French-Algerian Islamist, went on a killing spree in March 2012 and was subsequently shot dead by police besieging his apartment.
Relations between the French state and its significant Muslim community have been strained in recent years by a string of controversies that have put the Muslim faith at odds with France's secular tradition.
Tuesdays incident also took place amid heightened tensions following publication of cartoons of the Prophet Mohammed in satirical weekly Charlie Hebdo.
Young people saw the projections and thought they were a deliberate insult, said Idmilud. We stepped in to explain that this beautiful work of art was actually an homage to Islam, that it was a genuine mistake to project it on Wednesday before a cordon was in place. I think, and hope, that the message got through."
But we shouldnt pin all this only on religion. Many of these young people of North African origin are going through an identity crisis; they face high unemployment and communication with them is not what it should be.
If anything, this incident has demonstrated that we need to increase our dialogue with these young people.
Despite the intervention of the citys Muslim leaders, Mounir Fatmi, who describes himself as a Moroccan of Muslim origin, decided to cancel the projection of his work on the Pont Neuf.
The conditions which I agreed to for my work were not met, he said in a statement. The result was that my art was not seen properly and above all, it was misunderstood. Id rather the projection was suspended.
Fatmi added that the piece, called Technologia, was in fact owned by the Arab Museum of Modern Art in Doha, Qatar.
When it was shown there for the first time, just a few kilometres from Saudi Arabia, no one was shocked, he said. That people were shocked in Toulouse is astonishing. I just dont get it.
Another of Fatmis works, projected onto the facade of the citys landmark Hotel Dieu, will continue as part of the scheduled festival.
TheBaronOfNA
Banned
Actually, no. (at least if you take in consideration the all middle ages until now)
Also, you should note that Jesus is a Prophet in the Islam.
Thanks for understanding.
TheBaronOfNA
Banned
Of course, you should note that Muslim Riots in France are not exactly a new problem or limited in scope on "I'am offended"
abstract alien
Member
Didn't a similar issue happen in Ocarina of Time?
Edit:
Edit:
From the Zelda Wikia
Windom Earle
Member
Just because people "belief" in something, it does not automatically mean the rest of the world needs to comply or even respect it. It's some blurry letters in a video game. The scrict muslims need to get over it and stop being so damn insecure. But I guess that happens if you belief in fairy tales without proof. (All religions)
GhostTrick
Banned
So, you expect people to get annoyed without saying anything ? I mean, why that thing is in the game in the first place ?
abstract alien
Member
Yep. The fire temple music had a part that resembled a chant or something in Arabic.
Edit: beaten by better info
Just the thought of controversy among Muslims seems to be enough to make developers scramble. Kind of scary, kind of sad.
Reminds me of Little Big Planet. Included a track from a devout Muslim, but the mere thought that it could be insulting to Muslims since it features passages from the Quran was enough to recall the entire game. No one complained about that, and no one is complaining about TTT2 besides one Twitter follower.
Really? Come on now.
Reminds me of Little Big Planet. Included a track from a devout Muslim, but the mere thought that it could be insulting to Muslims since it features passages from the Quran was enough to recall the entire game. No one complained about that, and no one is complaining about TTT2 besides one Twitter follower.
Really? Come on now.
hemo memo
Gold Member
Wow
TheBaronOfNA
Banned
Bad research.
Constant threat of violence will do that.
GhostTrick
Banned
Then people are doing mountains for nothing.
I mean, someone on twitter noticed this and told Harada, then he said he will fix it. Am I right ? If so, where's the problem ?
TimeEffect
Member
Missed the point. It's not for the sake of the Western kids that this change happened.
The more moderate complainers may get what they want out of this, but fail to see why their religion is the only one to get the special attention it does.
Yes, it's a minor thing here, but the motivation is bigger than that.
R_thanatos
Member
This situation...
I hope everything will stop once the tekken team will change the texture..
But seriously some people have nothing else to say or to do in this situation ?
I await for the time where kuma wont be in the game because of some animal protectionnal lobby
I hope everything will stop once the tekken team will change the texture..
But seriously some people have nothing else to say or to do in this situation ?
I await for the time where kuma wont be in the game because of some animal protectionnal lobby
Sure does paint a great picture eh?
I guess that before giving my opinion on this bit of news, I should first specify that I am a muslim.
With that out of the way, personally while I do understand how some of my fellow muslims would feel annoyed at this (note my choice of words), I don't find it to be that big of a deal at all. I probably would have never even paid attention to it unless somebody pointed it out to me as I'm pretty sure it is the case with most people. And I'm pretty sure there's a lot of people like me out there ...
It can definitely be interpreted as offensive in our cultures, but one would really need to be a conspiracy theorist to think that there was any kind of malicious intent. And even if there was, most educated - and I am stressing educated - muslims would just find it silly and move on.
Now to go back to the twitter question, it seems to me that the person asking was quite polite about it, and the tone wasn't aggressive at all. I feel as though he was trying to make sure that there was no malicious intent behind it (mocking a religion) rather than requesting it to be changed and making threats about it. That is, unless I have missed something in the OP.
I don't think he deserves all of the harsh words that can be seen on the first page in this particular instance. I won't lie that I did feel a bit uncomfortable reading through it, and I can't help but feel targeted by some of the disdain expressed towards a particular group of muslims in a manner that I can only qualify as clumsy.
With that said, I think I will excuse myself from this thread, I just wanted to share my feelings with you guys, maybe some of you will care.
With that out of the way, personally while I do understand how some of my fellow muslims would feel annoyed at this (note my choice of words), I don't find it to be that big of a deal at all. I probably would have never even paid attention to it unless somebody pointed it out to me as I'm pretty sure it is the case with most people. And I'm pretty sure there's a lot of people like me out there ...
It can definitely be interpreted as offensive in our cultures, but one would really need to be a conspiracy theorist to think that there was any kind of malicious intent. And even if there was, most educated - and I am stressing educated - muslims would just find it silly and move on.
Now to go back to the twitter question, it seems to me that the person asking was quite polite about it, and the tone wasn't aggressive at all. I feel as though he was trying to make sure that there was no malicious intent behind it (mocking a religion) rather than requesting it to be changed and making threats about it. That is, unless I have missed something in the OP.
I don't think he deserves all of the harsh words that can be seen on the first page in this particular instance. I won't lie that I did feel a bit uncomfortable reading through it, and I can't help but feel targeted by some of the disdain expressed towards a particular group of muslims in a manner that I can only qualify as clumsy.
With that said, I think I will excuse myself from this thread, I just wanted to share my feelings with you guys, maybe some of you will care.
Its really nice to play the victim but without proof this is completely baseless, I don't remember a single time where a game developer was actually "threatened" due to religious reasons.
Windom Earle
Member
I understand that it would not be fair to insinuate that every person complaining is already starting to light the torches. But too much has happened during the last few years to not get extremely annoyed by those people. Of course they have every right to complain. But it's also very sad that people are scared enough that they instantly give in to all demands.
The reason why the symbols are there is completely irrelevant. Namco artists can do whatever they want, even if it was just a fuck up. Covered by freedom of speech and art. If people think religions overrule that, they can fuck off. Welcome back to the stone age.
TheBaronOfNA
Banned
Xenophobia. (and in this case, pretty one sided)
But yeah, is minor issue that can be fixed with a update and was completely unintentional. Dunno why we should felt outrage for a minor fix.
Thank you for your opinion. Is really appreciated.
Who said they are scared? What is your proof of this?
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