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Anyone else think Starfox 64 is not nearly as good as Starfox original?

S

Sohter.Nura

Member
thechristoph said:
Love Star Fox 64 so much. I wish it had a mode where it would just throw levels at you in random order. Fuck, I wish every level-based game had that. Do it.
Click to expand...

Actually, survival mode in Star Fox 64 would be hotttttt :0
 
K

Kard8p3

Member
This topic has caused me to revisit Starfox. I pulled the SNES and Starfox out of the closet and started playing only to realize that I've never played any of the levels outside of the middle route. I still have plenty of new game to explore :D
 
B

Boney

Banned
If Starfox as it is, would have released for the N64, as it is, it probably would be the superior game. But the things that hold it back the most are at the same time what makes it so impressive.
The game looks bad, runs choppy and is controlled with a D-Pad. Those things are what holds it back to Starfox supremacy (the only 2 candidates).

64 on the other hand, looks beautiful, and controls amazing, and that's not to say that 1st person controls work and change the whole game.

You bring a really valid point on the change of focus between the original of dodging and maneuvering between 64's shoot everything with charge beams, and the original definately sounds better this way. But the SNES kills it.

And to show 64's superiority, I present proof
 
G

Gilgamesh

Member
I never played Star Fox when it was the SNES era. I tried to check it out just recently because I played so much Star Fox 64 and loved it so much, but it was impossible for me. I felt it was too archaic in comparison to 64.
 
H

Host Samurai

Member
Agrees with the OP. I enjoy the original more and dare I say I love the originals graphics. I find them to be more "stylized" than primitive IMO.
 
J

Jasoco

Banned
If Star Fox 64 had gotten the same composer, it could have been ten times better. I loved Star Fox 64 when it came out, but I loved the original too. I remember the day I got Star Fox at Toys R Us. It was a "Players Choice" by then so we got it for $15. I was blown away at how awesome it was. At this time 3D was new to me. So this was like the most awesome thing I'd ever seen. And the game was amazing. 64 may have had improvements, as well as a secret alternate boss battle at the end of the first level that included the boss ship from the original, but the original was still the best. Its simplicity makes it great. And its artwork was much cooler. I don't care if 64 gave us all the classic memes. The SNES game was just awesome.

I too heard that 64 was a reboot of the franchise. Which means that the upcoming 3DS remake is the third version of the same game. Which also means that the series only gets good when you're playing the original story. I have the GameCube Star Fox game and it didn't have any of the heart. At all. And the DS game was just confusing. And I've seen Star Fox 2 and it changed from a SHMUP to some stupid strategy game. I mean seriously. Star Fox 2 is not fun at all. AT ALL. It's not the same. There's no going from planet to planet shooting enemies down. It's all strategy. I don't want that shit. I'm GLAD it was cancelled. 64 was better than that.

I could listen to the Star Fox soundtrack all day. Shame we never got one. We got a Star Fox 64 soundtrack, but nothing for SNES games. Man.

Off topic: But does it bug anyone else in retrospect that the Nintendo's first party N64 music capabilities were horrible in comparison to the sound chips in the SNES and NES? The N64 and all its games all had this distinct MIDI sound. From Zelda to Mario to Mario Kart to Star Fox, it all had those same horrible sounding instruments.
 
B

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Jasoco said:
If Star Fox 64 had gotten the same composer, it could have been ten times better. I loved Star Fox 64 when it came out, but I loved the original too. I remember the day I got Star Fox at Toys R Us. It was a "Players Choice" by then so we got it for $15. I was blown away at how awesome it was. At this time 3D was new to me. So this was like the most awesome thing I'd ever seen. And the game was amazing. 64 may have had improvements, as well as a secret alternate boss battle at the end of the first level that included the boss ship from the original, but the original was still the best. Its simplicity makes it great. And its artwork was much cooler. I don't care if 64 gave us all the classic memes. The SNES game was just awesome.

I too heard that 64 was a reboot of the franchise. Which means that the upcoming 3DS remake is the third version of the same game. Which also means that the series only gets good when you're playing the original story. I have the GameCube Star Fox game and it didn't have any of the heart. At all. And the DS game was just confusing. And I've seen Star Fox 2 and it changed from a SHMUP to some stupid strategy game. I mean seriously. Star Fox 2 is not fun at all. AT ALL. It's not the same. There's no going from planet to planet shooting enemies down. It's all strategy. I don't want that shit. I'm GLAD it was cancelled. 64 was better than that.

I could listen to the Star Fox soundtrack all day. Shame we never got one. We got a Star Fox 64 soundtrack, but nothing for SNES games. Man.

Off topic: But does it bug anyone else in retrospect that the Nintendo's first party N64 music capabilities were horrible in comparison to the sound chips in the SNES and NES? The N64 and all its games all had this distinct MIDI sound. From Zelda to Mario to Mario Kart to Star Fox, it all had those same horrible sounding instruments.
Click to expand...

You're a poster after my own heart. Couldn't agree more.

On the subject of music... YES SF64 would have been better with the musical vibe achieved by the first game. That's half my complaint, really. The vibe of 64 was this happy-go-lucky style that just wasn't cool for someone who actively loved the SNES original.

And YES... it constantly astounds me how good the NES and SNES sound.. how utterly iconic and rich sounding each of them were in their own way.... only to have the N64 sound so dismal. Back in the heyday it sounded disappointing.. and it sounds awful now.

I still pump my NES and SNES through the sound system and marvel at the music. N64 might as well be the ringtone on my first late-90s cellphone... even in something like Zelda.

Even newer Nintendo games like Twilight Princess sound rather "MIDI bad". I guess sometimes the composition transcends it (Wind Waker) and now that we're seeing recorded orchestral scores with Galaxy, they're back up to par... But Nintendo started out with very strong musical roots... only to turn into MIDI mush for 15 years.

And yeah... StarFox 2... surprisingly not fun at all. :(


Boney said:
If Starfox as it is, would have released for the N64, as it is, it probably would be the superior game. But the things that hold it back the most are at the same time what makes it so impressive.
The game looks bad, runs choppy and is controlled with a D-Pad. Those things are what holds it back to Starfox supremacy (the only 2 candidates).
Click to expand...

I actually don't think analog benefits StarFox all that much. Much like a fighter, or a 2D shooter, something about StarFox's corridor gameplay makes me desire the tightness of digital control.
 
E

Earthstrike

Member
If you're just playing through to beat the game, then I can see someone arguing for the original, but playing for the score in 64 is what really makes it shine, and you're constantly trying to perform. You'd just be so consistently engaged in the game. Starfox there's a lot of spots where you can just "get through" the level.
 
A

Android18a

Member
I don't know if it's just PAL Gamer syndrome, but I found Starwing on SNES to be pretty unplayable. It was *slow*, jerky and too difficult to aim with. I didn't enjoy it, and I almost skipped Lylat Wars because of how much I disliked the original.

Glad I didn't though, since Lylat Wars became my favourite N64 game and the first one I'd put in if I was to plug the console in again.
 
V

Vizion28

Banned
Star Fox 1 is one of my most memorable SNES games. I was blown away by the music and graphics at the time. Heck, the music still holds up today.

I don't even remember much of Star Fox 64 other than having my first rumble experience. Rumble Pak made you feel like your ship did get hit. Of course now we take rumble for granted but it really immersed you in the experience when you first tried it.

By the way, is Star Fox a creation of Miyamoto? If it is that guy sure came up with a lot of imaginative characters for his imaginative games.
 
V

Vizion28

Banned
I thing the N64 had poor sound output was because the sound chip and the graphics chip shared the same processor. The more graphics pushed takes a hit on the sound output and vice versa.
 
V

vas_a_morir

Banned
I think now that "Do a barrel-roll" has become so popular that this has GUARANTEED Peppy's return to Star Fox team in the next game.

Come the fuck on! Give us a Star Fox game! What is wrong with Nintendo. This latest E3 shows me that they got the message about A-List franchises. If it ain't broke... don't fix it. Don't Sonic it up with lame characters. Now, I'm not saying don't try knew things... but Peppy being Peppy was not the problem with Starfox.
 
B

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Android18a said:
I don't know if it's just PAL Gamer syndrome, but I found Starwing on SNES to be pretty unplayable. It was *slow*, jerky and too difficult to aim with. I didn't enjoy it, and I almost skipped Lylat Wars because of how much I disliked the original.

Glad I didn't though, since Lylat Wars became my favourite N64 game and the first one I'd put in if I was to plug the console in again.
Click to expand...
Gotta be a PAL thing ><

Vizion28 said:
I thing the N64 had poor sound output was because the sound chip and the graphics chip shared the same processor. The more graphics pushed takes a hit on the sound output and vice versa.
Click to expand...
I believe it had NO dedicated sound chip.. which is why the processor took a hit for everything sound-related... But I am the opposite of tech-inclined, so if someone wants to amend what I said, by all means...

It's too bad, because aside from performance issues, a dedicated sound chip gave each console a distinctive sound. Every SNES game has this rich sound to it.... a pity that N64 sounded like cheap MIDI notes, even when the masters like Koji Kondo worked with it...
 
V

vas_a_morir

Banned
InfiniteNine said:
LEAVE PEPPY ALONE! He's old and senile! ;__;
Click to expand...

It's not Peppy's Fault that Fox chose to do the barrel roll incorrectly... wait, Peppy told him to press Z or R twice. I guess he's really losing it.
 
Davey Cakes

Davey Cakes

Member
I've beaten both. Each experience is excellent in its own way, but, hell, I played through StarFox 64 more times than I can count, trying every possible path. With the original StarFox, I enjoyed it, but the gameplay wasn't as smooth and enjoyable for me. It has nothing to do with the graphics, either. 64 just felt better to play.

Additionally, I friggin' LOVED the rumble pack.
 
S

Shikamaru Ninja

任天堂 の 忍者
By the way, is Star Fox a creation of Miyamoto? If it is that guy sure came up with a lot of imaginative characters for his imaginative games.
Click to expand...

The character designer was Takaya Imamura of EAD Nintendo. Imamura is also responsible for the F-Zero characters.

I think the last characters Miyamoto created were early on the NES. (Super Mario Bros, The Legend of Zelda, Donkey Kong).
 
A

andymcc

Banned
Willy105 said:
Star Fox 64 makes the SNES original look and play terrible.

I have no idea how anybody could think otherwise.
Click to expand...

i prefer most aspects of sf64 but, the original isn't without it's charms. the music on the original starfox slays 64's.
 
S

Shikamaru Ninja

任天堂 の 忍者
Star Fox 64 also had a pretty cool 4-player splitscreen battle mode for its days. My friends used to love playing that.

I can't wait to see what EAD does for the 3DS remake. Wifi-Lan multiplayer :)
 
V

vas_a_morir

Banned
andymcc said:
i prefer most aspects of sf64 but, the original isn't without it's charms. the music on the original starfox slays 64's.
Click to expand...

Absolute truth. I wish they would replace the music on the re-release, but we know that ain't happening. Although, Star Wolf's theme rocked.
 
S

Shikamaru Ninja

任天堂 の 忍者
Absolute truth. I wish they would replace the music on the re-release, but we know that ain't happening. Although, Star Wolf's theme rocked.
Click to expand...

We don't know anything really. All we know is that at this early state it the demo featured a fully re-textured and re-designed Star Fox 64 map. There will be probably be a lot of new content by the time the game sees release.
 
A

andymcc

Banned
Shikamaru Ninja said:
We don't know anything really. All we know is that at this early state it the demo featured a fully re-textured and re-designed Star Fox 64 map. There will be probably be a lot of new content by the time the game sees release.
Click to expand...

the game was confirmed for release? i thought it was just a tech demo! :lol

that's really awesome.
 
A

andymcc

Banned
vas_a_morir said:
Why won't they give us a new legit new Starfox? didn't Starfox 64 sell ridiculous? Do they hate making money? Do they hate my me?
Click to expand...

i don't really follow sales numbers, but i'd probably guess it was because of assault and command.
 
G

GitarooMan

Member
I think another think that makes me give SF64 a little edge was that the Rumble Pak was packed in. Seems like nothing now, but at the time I got a kick out it.
 
B

big_z

Member
vas_a_morir said:
I love both, but for me, 64 is much much better. It's in my top 5 favorite games of all time. The Charge shot made the game so gnarly. I love it!

And I love the voice acting.

"Alright gang, let's check in!"
"Slippy here, A-Okay!"
"Yer beginnin' to look more and more like your father."
"Blow it out your ass, Fox."
Click to expand...


now i played through starfox 64 a shit load of times back in the day... hell i think i have one of the highest scores possible yet i dont recall falco telling you to blow it out your ass. that being said correct me if im wrong because it does sound like something he would say to fox.
 
L

Littlegator

Banned
Tbqh, I think Assault is the best in the series. The classic flights were great, and the foot controls handled like a champ. I don't know how many times I've played through it or how many hours I've spent in multiplayer.
 
W

WillyFive

Member
Vizion28 said:
I thing the N64 had poor sound output was because the sound chip and the graphics chip shared the same processor. The more graphics pushed takes a hit on the sound output and vice versa.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but it didn't seem to hurt Star Fox 64.
 
Davey Cakes

Davey Cakes

Member
GitarooMan said:
I think another think that makes me give SF64 a little edge was that the Rumble Pak was packed in. Seems like nothing now, but at the time I got a kick out it.
Click to expand...
Every time you hit an obstacle the game would rumble you out of your chair.

It was amazing.
 
V

vas_a_morir

Banned
big_z said:
now i played through starfox 64 a shit load of times back in the day... hell i think i have one of the highest scores possible yet i dont recall falco telling you to blow it out your ass. that being said correct me if im wrong because it does sound like something he would say to fox.
Click to expand...

Falco was a dick. But, he looked way more assholish and smug in Star Fox than Star Fox 64. His "Bubudubudaaaabu" with that smarmy look on his face pisses me off. Falco is a total cockmaster.
 
C

captmcblack

Member
Star Fox 64 looks a billion times better, plays smoother, has the famous voice acting (hilarious lines, yes - but infinitely quotable and relatively well-delivered), controls much better, has the great force feedback, the great shoot-em-up action (delivered with an addictive combo-mechanic), has more techniques to perform in flight, has the all-range mode (which I actually LOVED - felt like Independence Day when enemy battleships would fill the screen and it was you and your little team versus an army of doom), had fun multiplayer, had more levels, had more varied environments (and new vehicles to use as well - wish you could've used the Great Fox, though)...

Even though the SNES had better, more videogame-y awesome music, it's not like the SF64 soundtrack was the worst thing of all time. The mediocrity of the soundtrack doesn't hold down the significant improvements of virtually every other facet of the game.

SF64 wins.
 
M

Mejilan

Running off of Custom Firmware
Can't say I agree with the OP.
The SNES game had a better soundtrack.
That's about it. Oh, and it cooler looking laser blasts.

The N64 remake beats out the sluggish SNES original in just about all respects, IMHO.
Sped up gameplay, fantastic controls, significantly better (and more varied) level design and boss battles, and tons of more secrets to chase down.
To say nothing of the excellent scoring/combo system.
 
B

Boney

Banned
Littlegator said:
Tbqh, I think Assault is the best in the series. The classic flights were great, and the foot controls handled like a champ. I don't know how many times I've played through it or how many hours I've spent in multiplayer.
Click to expand...
My biggest gripe with Assault it's that both the first level and the last levels were quite good, albeit, a little on the slow side.
But those were the only fucking 2 levels!!
 
M

Mudkips

Banned
StarFox 64 is better.

Darklord said:
mc7ps3.jpg
Click to expand...
11rw30g.jpg
 
K

KevinCow

Banned
I don't think I've played either game enough to really have a preference. I only really have two opinions on this matter:

- Analog controls and non-crappy framerate are great in SF64

- It's annoying how Nintendo pretends like the original doesn't exist
 
W

WillyFive

Member
KevinCow said:
I don't think I've played either game enough to really have a preference. I only really have two opinions on this matter:

- Analog controls and non-crappy framerate are great in SF64

- It's annoying how Nintendo pretends like the original doesn't exist
Click to expand...

The main theme and Corneria in SSBB were from the original.
 
N

[Nintex]

Member
Littlegator said:
Tbqh, I think Assault is the best in the series. The classic flights were great, and the foot controls handled like a champ. I don't know how many times I've played through it or how many hours I've spent in multiplayer.
Click to expand...
StarFox Assault is the biggest waste of development resources ever, the game had an orchestrated soundtrack and yet Corneria was a city of cube like objects that popped up two feet away from you and you had to use a sniper to shoot some radars or some shit. Just why did Nintendo let Namco develop that trash :(
 
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