The Devil Source system is certainly interesting, and it reminds me a little of the Skill Set system in Devil Survivor. It's really nice to see Atlus continue to get creative with the fusion/demon systems to give the players more options. I wonder if this system means you can't choose which skills to inherit like in Devil Survivor. They haven't really mentioned that part of the fusion system yet....
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Atlus announces Shin Megami Tensei: Strange Journey (DS)
- Thread starter duckroll
- Start date
crowphoenix
Banned
The Devil Source system sounds like it's going to be fun to play around with. I wonder if it's a one time only item or something more permanent.
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
Error said:
FUCKING MEGATON!
I don't see why they take that out. Even with the random skill inheritance thing, there were some demons that just flat out couldn't learn some skills. Basically an ice-based demon couldn't learn any fire-based spells. I guess the devil source thing takes care of stuff like that.duckroll said:
charlequin
Banned
jj984jj said:
Not really. The random skill assignment is really just a fundamentally bad mechanic because there really is no reason you can't get any possible combination (i.e. one that doesn't involve skills that can't transfer or transfer together), but sometimes to do it you have to sit there clicking OK-cancel-OK-cancel-OK-cancel-OK-cancel for a bajillion years. Any result that isn't bounded by skill in any way, only by the player's willingness to sit there doing something mind-numbing, should be replaced by a similar automated system. I'll be pretty disappointed if they back away from letting you pick your own fused skills in this one.
The random skill inheritance is just there to prevent you from creating overpowered demons, personas etc.. etc..
Instead if you want a really good persona/demon, you need patience... Ask Scarlet.
Notice how the super good personas in P4/3 often involve more than 3 personas fusion, and they gimp you a bit by making a really low level persona one of the ingredients for the fusion. So you end getting shit skills like zio show up in the skill sets. :lol
I wouldn't like if you have TOTAL control, to be honest. I think that would cheapen the game, since you can always include the best skills. Having the option to include one spell/skill in a fusion is great, just one skill can make a pretty big difference.
Devil Source feature sounds a lot like the Spell Cards in P2.
Instead if you want a really good persona/demon, you need patience... Ask Scarlet.
Notice how the super good personas in P4/3 often involve more than 3 personas fusion, and they gimp you a bit by making a really low level persona one of the ingredients for the fusion. So you end getting shit skills like zio show up in the skill sets. :lol
I wouldn't like if you have TOTAL control, to be honest. I think that would cheapen the game, since you can always include the best skills. Having the option to include one spell/skill in a fusion is great, just one skill can make a pretty big difference.
Devil Source feature sounds a lot like the Spell Cards in P2.
charlequin
Banned
Error said:
But it doesn't prevent you from creating overpowered demons.
You do have total control. You can make any demon that's got a tiny possibility of coming up as a fusion possibility for your starting demons, it just takes a long time. "It takes a long time" isn't a good balancing mechanism.
That's not really true. A devil arcana persona will never learn a hama spell for instance. An ice based persona like jackfrost will never learn a fire spell.
Look at Raidou 2. You had control over passive skills, and that made the game a total joke in difficulty. Now imagine having total control over skills... hm, yeah no thanks.
I disagree with this. The system rewards players that have patience. If you have total control, then that just makes it TOO easy. It'll feel cheap as hell to me.
Look at Raidou 2. You had control over passive skills, and that made the game a total joke in difficulty. Now imagine having total control over skills... hm, yeah no thanks.
Error said:
Raidou 1 didn't have inheritance control, and it was also way too easy. That's more a result of a really bad battle system than a result of the fusion mechanics.
Now look at Devil Survivor. That offered even more control at inheritance. Was its difficulty a joke? Not really. Devil Survivor's fusion system was well received and didn't result in the huge imbalance that some people predicted.
That's the point though; you already DO have total control (within the bounds of inheritable skill/demon types) if you have 'patience'. It just turns fusion into more of a soulless, mindless timesink/grind than just grinding levels to begin with. If there's a problem with the 'best' skills being overpowered on a properly fused demon, the goal should be to eliminate overpowered combinations, not just make them into huge grinds to achieve. Rebalance overpowered skills, use a point-buy system for chosen skill inheritance based on skill power, etc. There are plenty of ways to improve the system without going backwards and Atlus's designers are skilled enough that I'd like to see them keep being progressive rather than fall back on shitty, outdated mechanics that take away the player's influence outside of blind luck and mindless repetition.Error said:
Chrono Helix
Member
And also being forced to have 3 abilities and 3 passives, as opposed to 6 of whatever type you want.
Maybe they want to make this truly old school and there's no skill inheritance. Everyone owned 
My point is that is it wasn't a grindfest, unless you chose to. The game doesn't require to have an overpowered persona, it's your choice to do one. Besides the only personas that took a long while to make are those that involved more than 3 personas fusions, that's when random skill inheritance got really ugly because one of the ingredients will be a low leveled persona with shit skills.
Nocturne never gets that frustrating because it's mostly demon x demon fusions. Heck in Raidou 2 I was making demons with the skills I wanted in less than 2 minutes.
My point is that is it wasn't a grindfest, unless you chose to. The game doesn't require to have an overpowered persona, it's your choice to do one. Besides the only personas that took a long while to make are those that involved more than 3 personas fusions, that's when random skill inheritance got really ugly because one of the ingredients will be a low leveled persona with shit skills.
Nocturne never gets that frustrating because it's mostly demon x demon fusions. Heck in Raidou 2 I was making demons with the skills I wanted in less than 2 minutes.
charlequin
Banned
Coxswain said:
Exactly!
Megaten's all about strategically confronting each battle challenge, not grinding, so I shouldn't have to grind my demon fusions either!
(One reason I like this Demon Source idea a lot is that it would let Atlus take a fairly strong stance against some combinations in normal fusions, but then still give you a special, unique way of creating a few lucky demons with those combinations.)
Chrono Helix
Member
Then again it might just lead to grinding for Demon Sources to get the skills we want instead of spending time in the fusion menu.
Famitsu has updated! http://www.famitsu.com/game/coming/1226799_1407.html
Successful Demon Negotiation:
Unsuccessful Demon Negotiation:
Devil Source received:
Demon Fusion with Devil Source:
Successful Demon Negotiation:
Unsuccessful Demon Negotiation:
Devil Source received:
Demon Fusion with Devil Source:
Buggy Loop
Member
My most anticipated RPG since a long long time, everything's perfect so far
lastendconductor
Put your snobby liquids into my mouth!
Holy shit this looks so awesome. Shaping up to be the best DS game ever!
slaughterking
Member
Taking the negotiation screenshots from Famitsu, and moving through each of the 4 screens for both scenes very quickly with an image viewer, I noticed that it actually kinda animates too! The Momunofu sprite has some minor breathing animation, and the ribbons on his spear move like the wind is blowing them. Pretty cool!
UPDATEEEEEEEEEE
http://megamisj.atlusnet.jp/
http://megamisj.atlusnet.jp/
Dragona Akehi
Retired
duckroll said:
The more I click on this thread, the more pain I feel that it isn't in my hands yet.
jaundicejuice
Member
As excited as I am for Strange Journey I don't want to over-saturate myself with information about it. I'm not going to be able to play it for months and would prefer to leave as much mystery in the experience as possible. I've seen enough to know that I want the game.
charlequin
Banned
This latest video really shows off how nice the sprites really are. The first few just looked like they were animating with just a few pieces being moved around, but the pixie is really nicely animated with her wings flapping and everything. (Plus the shadows, as duck mentioned.)
The blog has the first direct feed look at the automap on the lower screen (along with all the neat icons which show places of interest):
The blog has also gotten the director to answer a few fan questions lately, the only one of any real interest is when he confirms that while you can't see your demons animate while in battles because it's first person, you will definitely see them animate when you first fuse them, and when you check them out in the yet-to-be-unveiled View Mode.
The blog has also gotten the director to answer a few fan questions lately, the only one of any real interest is when he confirms that while you can't see your demons animate while in battles because it's first person, you will definitely see them animate when you first fuse them, and when you check them out in the yet-to-be-unveiled View Mode.
duckroll said:
Yes, I know that. I was just commenting on whether a particular scan is what the screen is actually showing at the moment.
Gorgon said:
Yeah, that's what I meant. The green outline and ping circles make it look like the player is doing a 3-square-radius scan of some kind. But both the Enemy and Forma are lit up, whereas previous screens showed those as two distinct types of scans. And is that a regular enemy, meaning that random battles aren't actually random, is it a scripted encounter, or are there FOE-type enemies?
Yaweee said:
Yeah, that's possible. I didn't even think of that. I would love to see how all the applications and stuff actually work in terms of menus or touch controls. Atlus interfaces are usually pretty hot, so it's exciting just to see what they do with the SJ theme and setting in terms of menu interface and stuff.