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Deus Ex: Mankind Divided Gets Console HDR Support

The option is grayed out for me even though my TV supports HDR and I activated it on both my TV settings and PS4.
I tried to switch HDMI cables too, no luck. :(

I have Samsung, any idea what to do? ._.

Try turning on uhd colour in advnaced picture settings (I have a JS8500)
 
That was an area I tried to keep an eye on when switching between the modes and reloading the game. If anything the sky just seems super brighter than before.



The b6 is one of the highest rated and priciest 55 inch tvs you can buy (albeit the cheapest of LG's 2016 lineup it's still £2300+). Surely if it's going to be noticeable on any tv it should on this.

Dumb question -- in your console setup does it say HDR mode is successfully enabled? Are you sure its actually in HDR? Haven't read every single one of your posts in here but just wanted to make sure you set it up right. My brother didn't on his KS8000, and then when I got him to fix it he did see the difference in Forza.
 
I'm in Prague in the day so that might not help.

I just changed it from HDR Bright to HDR Vivid which seems to make the switch more noticeable but then I'm not sure if that's just the effect of contrast being jacked to 100 automatically when on HDR mode along with oled light. Would be good to know what settings people recommend for a B6 OLED in HDR mode.

Here's the menus looking dodgy in hdr mode:

SDR


HDR

Never put your TV on Vivid mode. Eww.

First off, make sure your TV is calibrated. Look up your TV's model online and see some online sample settings for sharpness, brightness, color tone, temperature, black levels, RGB range etc. Make sure you turn off overscan on your TV as well (my TV overscans on 16:9, I have to set it to ScreenFit to fix it). Also, be wary that some TV's, game mode fucks up image quality like no other. Try to see if you can turn off post processing effects your tv does to reduce input lag individually, without having to turn game mode on. Sometimes when you have game mode on, HDR is automatically deactivated. So turn game mode off.

Make sure all necessary settings are correct under your PS4's sound and screen settings. If you have an enhanced HDMI setting on your TV, turn it on. See if that works.
 
I'm convinced >90% of people just have bad settings for their HDR set. And it's not entirely their fault.
You can blame HDR10 for this, not the owners. HDR10's spec for implementation is quite loose. One movie can be mastered on HDR10 quite differently than another. The beauty of Dolby Vision is that there is a defined spec for implementation and that HDR is implemented frame-by-frame, telling the TV how to display the picture based on the TV's capabilities.

Watching the same piece of content in both HDR10 and Dolby Vision, it's very clear why DV is superior.
 

virtualS

Member
That was an area I tried to keep an eye on when switching between the modes and reloading the game. If anything the sky just seems super brighter than before.



The b6 is one of the highest rated and priciest 55 inch tvs you can buy (albeit the cheapest of LG's 2016 lineup it's still £2300+). Surely if it's going to be noticeable on any tv it should on this.

Not necessarily. OLED doesn't ramp up to even half the peak brightness of a proper full array back-lit LCD. Blacks go deeper but highlights do not dazzle nearly as well. Potentially a similar range but arguably a less impressive look.

I attended Sony Australia's launch of their new Z9D FALD display and they had it set up next to their top of the line edge lit LCD panels with HDR support all running identical HDR content. Night and day difference... literally.
 

dallow_bg

nods at old men
Eh, the max brightness of LCD and its relation to actual picture quality seems overstated. OLED and LCD are plenty bright on their own with real world source material (not just image tests) but it's those perfect blacks and zero blooming that make OLED clear winners.

This CNET review says much the same:
https://www.cnet.com/products/lg-oledb6p-series/

My first test involved sending my lineup of TVs the HDR10 version of "The Revenant," courtesy of the Samsung UBD-K8500 Blu-ray player and the AVPro Connect AC-MX88-UHD, a distribution matrix that allows me to send HDR (and all other) HDMI signals to multiple TVs simultaneously. This is the first opportunity I've had to compare HDR on OLED and LCD HDR TVs side-by-side in the lab using the same source, and it further reinforced my previous observations: that OLED is just as much a powerhouse with HDR as it is with standard dynamic range, despite its light output deficit to LED LCD.

I was also surprised to note that both Samsung LCDs, although capable of higher light output in objective tests, didn't have a visible brightness advantage in most scenes. Spot measurements with a handheld light meter confirmed my suspicions: the LCDs were actually dimmer than the OLEDs in highlights by significant margins with "The Revenant," even the light cannon JS9500.

I can't explain the difference fully, but the main point is that with HDR, LCDs' brightness advantage over OLED with test pattern measurements (detailed above in Bright Lighting) don't necessarily indicate brighter highlights
 

DeeBatch

Member
This is categorically wrong. HDR is not "wide color range." HDR is luminosity. Wide color is, well, wide color (technically the official term is Wide Color Gamut, or WCG).

Wrong HDR is also wider colour along with luminosity. what You get with 10 bit colour is more shades and rec 2020. This with the increased luminosty reproduce what are natural eyes see. The result is a picture that looks closer to what we see in real life... Rec 2020/DCIP3 is part of the HDR standard set by UHD alliance.. To be certified panels must be 10 bits over 1000 nits and carry more than 90% of DCI p3 which is WCG. Please don't spread misinformation.

UHD Alliance Premium Certified

UHD Alliance Premium Certified, or UHDAPC ("Yoo'd-a-pac") as I've decided to call it, is the UHD Alliance's way of pointing out TVs that conform to the latest in TV technologies, like HDR, WCG and so on.

They're certainly not the first to come up with a certification program, but unlike others (THX's, most notably) the UHD Alliance has shared exactly what a TV must match to be UHDAPC. It reads like a shopping list for anyone looking to buy a high-end TV in 2016 (and beyond):

Resolution: 3,840x2,160 pixels, otherwise known as 4K.

Color depth: 10-bit (important for HDR, as most other TVs are just 8-bit).

Color gamut: Wide, including the ability to show at least 90 percent of the P3 color gamut (check out Ultra HD 4K TV color, part 1 and part 2 for more on this).

High dynamic range: Specifically the ability to use SMPTE ST2084's electro-optical transfer function, which Dolby helped create (check out What is HDR? for more info).

Minimum brightness and contrast ratios: This is probably the most interesting one, as it's great for consumers and shows the different players here at work. There are two possible minimum specs. A minimum brightness of 1,000 nits, along with a black level of a maximum of 0.05 nits (20,000:1 contrast ratio), or a minimum brightness of 540 nits, along with a black level of a maximum of 0.0005 (1,080,000:1).

The first option is clearly for LCDs, and can only be obtained by some sort of dynamic backlight (ideally, local dimming). The second option is almost certainly there because LG insisted, as there's only one technology that can do that kind of contrast ratio, and LG is the only company that current sells it: OLED. Regardless, for HDR to be worthwhile it needs a big contrast ratio, so this requirement in the UHDAPC is key. It's not explained how these numbers are measured, but one step at a time.

There are also specifications for UHDAPC content and mastering, which basically match the specs for the TVs (which makes sense).

https://www.cnet.com/news/what-is-uhd-alliance-premium-certified/
 

DeeBatch

Member
on my TV its one way or the other. once I switch it to HDR in the DeusEx menus it turns on my TV's HDR mode and I'm not able to change it back unless go back and turn if off in DeusEx. the option to change any picture modes is greyed out on my TV's settings when DeusEx has control over the TV.

XBR55X850D

Not every Tv supports HDR in game mode unfortunately.
 

DeeBatch

Member
it must be the way Eidos has scaled HDR in this game. watching Narcos and other HDR content it's very apparent when its on and it looks stunning.

someone also said it's only really noticeable at night in Prague, i just started a new game+ so it's daylight in the game right now.

I have a feeling future games will truly make use of the wide colour range we see in the movies and TV shows on netflix/amazon.

For gaming right now TMK they are using Rec 709, this is why not a big change in colours. The movies and streaming content uses Rec 2020 which is a much wider colour gamut than rec 709 hence the big difference in colours.
 

DeeBatch

Member
Make sure your RGB settings are matched up. Muted colors sounds like you TV is RGB Full and your PS4 is to RGB limtied (or on auto that isn't detecting things properly).

The other thing could be that you had your TV set to some dumb ass "vivid" mode. Your eyes adapted to these insanely blasted colors, high sharpness, high contrast etc., and now what you're seeing is a far more accurate image, yet because of the disparity it now seems "muted."

For HDR content you should use limited not full as HDR is not 4:4:4 chroma but 4:2:0. 4:4:4 @ 4k is only supported @ 8 bits this is a bandwidth issue of HDMI 2.0A. 4k blurays are 4:2:0. Enabling RGB full is adding unnecessary processing as orginal content for 4k blurays movies is 4:2:0.. Some streaming of regular 4k could be 444 @ 8 bits though and games than can do the same just not UHD bluray movies. To be clear UHD is distributed via 4:2:0 do not use full RGB to view these.
 

DeeBatch

Member
Wish PC support was up and running. I've got everything set up and ready to go there but nothing takes advantage of it yet.

HDR is coming soon to PC I hear Battlefield 1 will support this. I also talked to Club3d and their DP to hdmi 2.0 adpater will support it soon too. They are still testing the Adapter for HDR but was told company Representative chip is capable.
 
Resolution: 3,840x2,160 pixels, otherwise known as 4K.

Color depth: 10-bit (important for HDR, as most other TVs are just 8-bit).

Color gamut: Wide, including the ability to show at least 90 percent of the P3 color gamut (check out Ultra HD 4K TV color, part 1 and part 2 for more on this).

High dynamic range: Specifically the ability to use SMPTE ST2084's electro-optical transfer function, which Dolby helped create (check out What is HDR? for more info).
You proved me right by quoting the UHD spec (which I am quite aware of). Notice how Color Gamut and HDR are listed quite separately? UHD Cert != HDR. UHD Cert is a standard, based on the culmination of several display technologies all bundled together.

One only need to be aware of HDR in the film world, which, again, is luminosity. And what are UHD TVs trying to display? Film or the digital representation of film.

So, yeah, maybe you should be a little more aware of what you're copying verbatim.

And mind you, I am not talking about the two HDR specs, which, again, are standards set. I am talking about what HDR is and I don't understand how anyone can dispute it as being anything other than increased luminosity.
 

DeeBatch

Member
You proved me right by quoting the UHD spec (which I am quite aware of). Notice how Color Gamut and HDR are listed quite separately?

One only need to be aware of HDR in the film world, which, again, is luminosity. And what are UHD TVs trying to display? Film or the digital representation of film.

So, yeah, maybe you should be a little more aware of what you're copying verbatim.

And mind you, I am not talking about the two HDR specs, either. I am talking about what HDR is and I don't understand how anyone can dispute it as being anything other than increased luminosity.

Do You see 90% of DCI p3 needed to be HDR certified for television makers set? How are they seperate DCI P3 is WCG. The clearly state all the requirments for certification and WCG(DCI P3) is one of them. This is not even debatable. The luminosity is one part the colour gamut are the next . They both go hand in hand . HDR specs are set and they require WCG too. Seriously you are way off on ur comprehension.

Listen to these podcast from Spectral and other experts and educate yourself on HDR. These videos over 1 hour each but you will be much wiser after watching I promise :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZWWbx6vGk8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcLWK4k62T0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIY8l2W4YV4
 
Do You see 90% of DCI p3 needed to be HDR certified for television makers set? How are they seperate DCI P3 is WCG. The clearly state all the requirments for certification and WCG(DCI P3) is one of them. This is not even debatable. The luminosity is one part the colour gamut are the next . They both go hand in hand . HDR specs are set and they require WCG too. Seriously you are way off on ur comprehension
I get what you're saying, but you're clearly not making an attempt at understanding me. I am NOT disputing UHD certification. Not one iota. As a matter of fact, I've mentioned that all the technologies that make up UHD are a bundle of different technologies. Like DCI-P3, which is specification to display a much wider color gamut.

HDR, the technology itself, is for increased luminosity. It can exist by itself or it can exist alongside WCG. Hell, black and white photos/film can support HDR! And HDR, as a technology, has long existed before the UHD specs.

For example, this Deus Ex patch doesn't include a WCG alongside its HDR features. It's still using rec.709 colors.
 

McSpidey

Member
So far my experience is that both PS4 and Xbox One output HDR10 and include REC2020 colour. Sony have some out and said they're supporting wide colour, and the results seem to indicate this is the case, MS have an odd unsubstantiated claim they don't.

Re Full vs Limited - I'm in general agreement that it's easier to calibrate for Limited however since there's another thread to debate HDR standards and labels, this one is about Deus Ex, my Deus Ex experience is that PS4 + Limited + HDR appears to have an incorrect (raised) black level, at least on LG E6 OLEDl. All other combinations work fine (SDR + full or limited, HDR + Full), so you have to run Full.
 

DeeBatch

Member
I get what you're saying, but you're clearly not making an attempt at understanding me. I am NOT disputing UHD certification. Not one iota. As a matter of fact, I've mentioned that all the technologies that make up UHD are a bundle of different technologies. Like DCI-P3, which is specification to display a much wider color gamut.

HDR, the technology itself, is for increased luminosity. It can exist by itself or it can exist alongside WCG. Hell, black and white photos/film can support HDR! And HDR, as a technology, has long existed before the UHD specs.

For example, this Deus Ex patch doesn't include a WCG alongside its HDR features. It's still using rec.709 colors.

I will say this for HDR movies and streams WCG must be present.. For gaming no such standard is in place hence rec 709.. look at OG PS4 it has 1080 HDR gaming so for gaming ya HDR is not required to use WCG and no standard is set. I will say this though they need to use WCG for gaming HDR too it will look far better. The sunsets, clouds all the IQ would benefit from WCG creating a much more realistic image.
 
I will say this for HDR movies and streams WCG must be present.. For gaming no such standard is in place hence rec 709.. look at OG PS4 it has 1080 HDR gaming so for gaming ya HDR is not required to use WCG and no standard is set. I will say this though they need to use WCG for gaming HDR too it will look far better. The sunsets, clouds all the IQ would benefit from WCG creating a much more realistic image.
We've been discussing/arguing two different things, I think. That is okay, though. I totally agree with your mentioning of standards. I don't know the answer to this, but would GPUs/consoles require more horsepower to push WCG? I would think so, but I truly don't know. HDR, as we've seen, doesn't seem to impact performance.
 

DeeBatch

Member
We've been discussing/arguing two different things, I think. That is okay, though. I totally agree with your mentioning of standards. I don't know the answer to this, but would GPUs/consoles require more horsepower to push WCG? I would think so, but I truly don't know. HDR, as we've seen, doesn't seem to impact performance.

No the don't need more performance they just need to grade it in REC 2020.
 

Lucifon

Junior Member
Never put your TV on Vivid mode. Eww.

First off, make sure your TV is calibrated. Look up your TV's model online and see some online sample settings for sharpness, brightness, color tone, temperature, black levels, RGB range etc. Make sure you turn off overscan on your TV as well (my TV overscans on 16:9, I have to set it to ScreenFit to fix it). Also, be wary that some TV's, game mode fucks up image quality like no other. Try to see if you can turn off post processing effects your tv does to reduce input lag individually, without having to turn game mode on. Sometimes when you have game mode on, HDR is automatically deactivated. So turn game mode off.

Make sure all necessary settings are correct under your PS4's sound and screen settings. If you have an enhanced HDMI setting on your TV, turn it on. See if that works.

Sorry I should have specified. That overblown contrast is on the default "hdr bright" setting too. I chose hdr vivid because it seems to look better in hdr and also read on lg tvs it displays the widest colour gamut in hdr.

Does anyone know what settings are good for 2016 lg oleds in hdr? Is limited bugged as opposed to full?
 

DeeBatch

Member
Sorry I should have specified. That overblown contrast is on the default "hdr bright" setting too. I chose hdr vivid because it seems to look better in hdr and also read on lg tvs it displays the widest colour gamut in hdr.

Does anyone know what settings are good for 2016 lg oleds in hdr? Is limited bugged as opposed to full?

If you are using a vivid setting within movie mode while watching HDR10 its ok. For dolby vision HDR this is not needed due to Dynamic Metadata.. If you are using vivid Mode(opposed to movie mode) for HDR you are not getting proper HDR metadata.
 

Lucifon

Junior Member
If you are using a vivid setting within movie mode while watching HDR10 its ok. For dolby vision HDR this is not needed due to Dynamic Metadata.. If you are using vivid Mode(opposed to movie mode) for HDR you are not getting proper HDR metadata.

LG tvs don't seem to work that way. When the tv kicks into hdr mode you have hdr bright (default), hdr vivid or hdr standard. Standard looks horrible, dull with a browny filter over everything.
 
LG tvs don't seem to work that way. When the tv kicks into hdr mode you have hdr bright (default), hdr vivid or hdr standard. Standard looks horrible, dull with a browny filter over everything.

Samsung TV's don't either, HDR is picked up whatever mode you have it in.
 
Are there any pics or videos to compare pre and post patch? Also isn't this too early to launch a PS4 Pro patch? Maybe wait for the console to release, improve more features and then release the patch.
 

Inuhanyou

Believes Dragon Quest is a franchise managed by Sony
Are there any pics or videos to compare pre and post patch? Also isn't this too early to launch a PS4 Pro patch? Maybe wait for the console to release, improve more features and then release the patch.

If they are done there is no point in not having the patch ready to go. I doubt they want to waste any more time than neccesary on it

And video and pictures would be useless, you can't show HDR through recording software that doesn't support it and monitors that dont support it
 

Vuze

Member
Can IPS monitors take advantage of HDR content?
The panel technology doesn't really matter. There are HDR certified IPS and VA TVs. But no, your IPS monitor won't automagically support HDR10 since there is a lot more to it. See the spec discussion above i.e. Max brightness, WCG, etc
 

mandiller

Member
Are there any pics or videos to compare pre and post patch? Also isn't this too early to launch a PS4 Pro patch? Maybe wait for the console to release, improve more features and then release the patch.

But....argh...what?
How would you see any difference in the screens or video unless you had a HDR screen? You can't see HDR in any way unless viewing it on a HDR screen. No point taking a new screenshot post-patch and you looking at the screenshot on your PC or phone
 
If they are done there is no point in not having the patch ready to go. I doubt they want to waste any more time than neccesary on it

And video and pictures would be useless, you can't show HDR through recording software that doesn't support it and monitors that dont support it

But....argh...what?
How would you see any difference in the screens or video unless you had a HDR screen? You can't see HDR in any way unless viewing it on a HDR screen. No point taking a new screenshot post-patch and you looking at the screenshot on your PC or phone

I know. But at least offscreen pics. I know they aren't very obvious, but just to give an idea.
 
Some infos from a reddit user with a HDR TV set:

First- when you load game, I went to 'extras' and soon as I entered that screen - a pop up message came up saying HDR capable screen detected, do you want to use it- duh. Yes - then screen sorta flashes like it's loading quickly (more colors) and another message confirming HDR enabled.

Also on my TV when I switch to the PlayStation channel and Deus Ex is on- it'll have a 'HDR' logo thing in top right near where it displays info.

I think more upcoming games will have that logo so users won't miss it.
 

Vuze

Member
Some infos from a reddit user with a HDR TV set:



I think more upcoming games will have that logo so users won't miss it.
I think he's talking about his TV ("switch to the PS channel") info overlay. The TV indicating whether or not HDR content is on display is pretty much standard.
 
I think he's talking about his TV ("switch to the PS channel") info overlay. The TV indicating whether or not HDR content is on display is pretty much standard.

Ah I see. I thought that the game icon in the library was updated with HDR logo on top of it. Well Sony should update the digital game icons to indicate that they support HDR and PS4 PRO so everyone will be aware like what they are doing with the physical cases of the upcoming games.
 

McSpidey

Member
Has anyone else noticed some purple fringing (looks sort of like a chromatic aberration) on the fine white line object edge highlighting when in HDR mode on PS4?
 

guybrushfreeman

Unconfirmed Member
It is very noticeable. Which area are you in? It's much less dramatic in day time Prague but Prague at night or one of the darker missions look dramatically better as a result of HDR. Also, what are your settings?

Do you think there's any performance cost on the PS4 with HDR on? I've been wondering this since they announced HDR for the original PS4. I imagine it's insignificant if it's there anyway. Same question for the Xbox One and One S I suppose. Could you do a video on that?
 
So let's get this straight, Deus Ex has been patched with bt2020 colour 100%?

Nothing uses BT2020 colour 100% since there are no mastering monitors that reach that gamut. HDR Blu-ray is only mastered with DCI-P3 displays, but they store it in the BT.2020 container. Apparently Xbox HDR games don't even use a wider gamut, and the same is probably true for PS4, so the only benefit we see is the increased highlights. Maybe 10-bit gradients if we're lucky.

Can IPS monitors take advantage of HDR content?

No monitor currently available can take advantage of HDR since none of them support the HDR10 or Dolby Vision standard and the electro-optical transfer function. Having a 10-bit panel or support for wider gamut doesn't magically make it understand the HDR signal, and if the current HDR games don't even touch the wcg, the benefit would be nil anyways.

IPS in particular lacks the deep blacks needed for Ultra HD Premium certification so even if the panel ticks all the other boxes like 10-bit, DCI-P3, 1000 nits, it'll fall short and only be HDR "ready". My guess is the first HDR monitors will be VA/OLED exclusively. You can already see from the upcoming models how more and more VA panels are coming out, even if they aren't HDR yet.
 

Harp

Member
You can blame HDR10 for this, not the owners. HDR10's spec for implementation is quite loose. One movie can be mastered on HDR10 quite differently than another. The beauty of Dolby Vision is that there is a defined spec for implementation and that HDR is implemented frame-by-frame, telling the TV how to display the picture based on the TV's capabilities.

Watching the same piece of content in both HDR10 and Dolby Vision, it's very clear why DV is superior.

I had the Vizio P series back in June,while I was deciding which tv to get. I also had the Sony 850c. Only thing I could test both dolby vision and hdr10 was Marco Polo on Netflix. Dong a side by side comparison there was basically no difference. Any real difference was the tvs themselves.
 

Pagusas

Elden Member
The option is grayed out for me even though my TV supports HDR and I activated it on both my TV settings and PS4.
I tried to switch HDMI cables too, no luck. :(

I have Samsung, any idea what to do? ._.

the HU7200 isnt an HDR screen from what I recall, where do you recall seeing it was?
 

Lucifon

Junior Member
Dumb question -- in your console setup does it say HDR mode is successfully enabled? Are you sure its actually in HDR? Haven't read every single one of your posts in here but just wanted to make sure you set it up right. My brother didn't on his KS8000, and then when I got him to fix it he did see the difference in Forza.

Sorry I didn't answer this, yep the TV switches into HDR mode and the Xbox has all the ticks in the settings with HDR enabled.
 
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