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[Hermii]

Nothing really surprising here. It's about what I expected for an open world game of this scale. I was only hoping against hope that it would at least have some AA, keeping everything else the same, but I figure that would be too much.

As for any performance improvements from now until release? I dunno if that's gonna happen. I can't recall any playable demo Nintendo has ever shown in the past that had improved performance by release. I figure Nintendo may feel that the frame rate drops are rare and not that significant so as to not warrant any additional effort to optimize.

The bigger question is what is Nintendo going to do with the NX verssion? Nintendo can't make that version that much superior looking since they also want to sell copies of the Wii-U version. I'd figure at most we'll probably get a resolution improvement to 1080p and that's it.

1. I am pretty sure Skyward Sword did.
2. The demo build could be months old, and its Nintendo. They are not known for shying away from putting in the effort to optimize their games.
3. Pretty much the fate of the Company Depends on the sucess of the NX, and Zelda will be their number one card to get core gamers to buy it.

 

[jroc74]

Stylized black magic aka what Nintendo always does to "cheat"

Nintendo are legend at taking what hardware they have and putting it to good use. It already looks absolutely beautiful with that art style

I'm guessing thats why they went with cel shading.

It is cel shaded, right? Does using cel shading use less performance?

 

[geordiemp]

It's running on a 0.2 TF machine. It's bursting with dark magic.

What were the zelda images and videos running on last year that were used in so many GIFs on GAF. Everybody knows those 1080p shots with down sampled AA.

I remember getting shot down for saying it was clearly not WiiU and was a PC bullshot. And people go on at ubisoft

 

[Oblivion]

Well, people are talking about the NX being doomed if not scorpio level.. That's obviously crazy cause Scorpio is not meant to be a 300$ machine..

But even if the NX is "only" XBo level, wich shouldn't be too impossible, that's still 10 WiiUs.. So it should be possible i guess.

What makes you think the NX will even get anywhere near Xbone levels?

 

[Interceptor]

What were the zelda images and videos running on last year that were used in so many GIFs on GAF. Everybody knows those 1080p shots with down sampled AA.

I remember getting shot down for saying it was clearly not WiiU and was a PC bullshot. And people go on at ubisoft

Yeah that's nonsense.

 

[Rodin]

Nothing really surprising here. It's about what I expected for an open world game of this scale. I was only hoping against hope that it would at least have some AA, keeping everything else the same, but I figure that would be too much.

As for any performance improvements from now until release? I dunno if that's gonna happen. I can't recall any playable demo Nintendo has ever shown in the past that had improved performance by release. I figure Nintendo may feel that the frame rate drops are rare and not that significant so as to not warrant any additional effort to optimize.

The bigger question is what is Nintendo going to do with the NX verssion? Nintendo can't make that version that much superior looking since they also want to sell copies of the Wii-U version. I'd figure at most we'll probably get a resolution improvement to 1080p and that's it.

It has AA (edge smoothing). The last sentence doesn't make sense, Konami didn't want to sell MGS V on PS360?

What were the zelda images and videos running on last year that were used in so many GIFs on GAF. Everybody knows those 1080p shots with down sampled AA.

I remember getting shot down for saying it was clearly not WiiU and was a PC bullshot. And people go on at ubisoft

Bullshots are a marketing tool used by pretty much everyone. What ubi does is downgrading the visuals effects, which is not the case here (lighting, shaders, grass, shadows, AO, etc look exactly the same).

What makes you think the NX will even get anywhere near Xbone levels?

What makes you think it won't?

Can't wait to play this on NX.

I'm Hopeful that version will ultimately have:

1920 x 1080p
rock solid framerate, locked @ 30fps
both AA and AF
higher resolution textures
greater draw distance
improved shadows
more particle effects.

That sounds like a lot, but really isn't. The core assets would be basically the same.

The game would look completely different with those changes. So yeah, it's a lot, but i can see it happening.

My whishlist for the NX version, in this order:

1) native 1080p (duh), rock solid performances (30 or 60fps)
2) better lod and shadows distance
3) improved pop in
4) higher res textures and shadows
5) 16x AF
6) AA (SMAA TX1)
7) better foliage

I think that'll do.

 

[AmyS]

Can't wait to play this on NX.

I'm Hopeful that version will ultimately have:

1920 x 1080p
rock solid framerate, locked @ 30fps
both AA and AF
higher resolution textures
greater draw distance
improved shadows
more particle effects.

That sounds like a lot, but really isn't. The core assets would be basically the same.

It's running on a 0.2 TF machine.

Yeah that's true, and if NX is even just around XBone level, the above shouldn't even cause it to break a sweat.

 

[SinCityAssassin]

 

[orioto]

What makes you think the NX will even get anywhere near Xbone levels?

It's basically the minium upgrade they can offer, if there is anything right about the report of them wanting to avoid too much of a gap, and third party port being possible. That's the minimum. And it's super doable for a 300 or even a 250$ machine, that's what gaf told me at least.

 

[Oblivion]

It has AA (edge smoothing).

But the DF guy in the video said no AA whatsoever.

The last sentence doesn't make sense, Konami didn't want to sell MGS V on PS360?

Completely different matter since Konami didn't have to worry about selling hardware.

What makes you think it won't?

Because it seems quite likely that Nintendo may have learned the wrong lesson from the failure of the Wii-U (i.e. that it sold extremely poorly because it was too powerful)

 

[Inuhanyou]

I'm guessing thats why they went with cel shading.

It is cel shaded, right? Does using cel shading use less performance?

Yes, cell shading was actually born as a cost saving technique as well as a visual one, because you use less polygons and less detail that would otherwise be filled in to look right.

Cell shading is all about simplified models being shaded in a way that stylizes them to the point where you don't notice inaccuracies.

Without that shading, Zelda's model would look like a below PS2 model, but because of how he is shaded, it comes to life in a different way.

The same goes for the rest of the world. They don't focus on realistic textures or having a lot of realistic physics to save on overhead.

So they can animate fewer blades of grass for example with super big blades of grass that animate in a stylized way instead of having to conform to realistic large patches. Trees are simplified with designs to hide their lack of dimension and such.

 

[WhiteRabbitEXE]

This is exactly what I expected. I imagine this will hold through launch as well, with the framerate being a bit more stable, but still not locked.

Can't wait to play this on NX.

I'm Hopeful that version will ultimately have:

1920 x 1080p
rock solid framerate, locked @ 30fps
both AA and AF
higher resolution textures
greater draw distance
improved shadows
more particle effects.

That sounds like a lot, but really isn't. The core assets would be basically the same.

And this is exactly what I've been expecting on NX. If that's the case I'll be quite happy. Though I could see texture resolutions possibly remaining the same (hopefully not, environmental textures really need a boost in places). I'm pretty damn sure they won't touch the models or general geometry, but that's fine.

 

[geordiemp]

It has AA (edge smoothing).

Bullshots are a marketing tool used by pretty much everyone. What ubi does is downgrading the visuals effects, which is not the case here (lighting, shaders, grass, shadows, AO, etc look exactly the same).

You know that GIF, it was a video not just a still for marketing PR, and no way was that last years zelda stuff running on a WiiU. It was 1440p down sampled with near perfect IQ. That was above Xb1 for sure, maybe above Ps4 as well.

If it was PC and thats what Nintendo believe will be the power level of the Nx, then now we are talking and I am interested.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

Because it seems quite likely that Nintendo may have learned the wrong lesson from the failure of the Wii-U (i.e. that it sold extremely poorly because it was too powerful)

Ah, so you're just making shit up. Cool.

 

[AmyS]

The game would look completely different with those changes. So yeah, it's a lot, but i can see it happening.

Like an HD remaster, yeah, but not a complete remake with more geometry. In most ways, less than the difference between Ocarina of Time on N64 and Ocarina of Time 3D on 3DS.

 

[SinCityAssassin]

Because it seems quite likely that Nintendo may have learned the wrong lesson from the failure of the Wii-U (i.e. that it sold extremely poorly because it was too powerful)

A lot of scenarios are likely because of the nature of their decision making (Zelda-Only E3 would be one of them) but the belief that the NX is at least around the power of a standard Xbox One is based on more recent rumors that were meant to dispel the notion that the NX's power was above either console and trailing the Neo.

 

[LordOfChaos]

No AA, harsh but I guess understandable, but no AF at all either is a bummer.


Hope they can wring more out of the Wii U before launch. If not, well, hey NX.

 

[Oblivion]

Ah, so you're just making shit up. Cool.

Actually I'm going by the most recent rumors by Emily Rogers.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

Actually I'm going by the more recent rumors by Emily Rogers.

Even if you go by those rumors, she never stated the console would simply be a rebranded Wii U or only offer slightly more power.

 

[Oblivion]

Even if you go by those rumors, she never stated the console would simply be a rebranded Wii U.

But would it be really that hard to believe? You are aware of the original Wii, yes?

 

[SinCityAssassin]

Actually I'm going by the most recent rumors by Emily Rogers.

She is the one who stated that the NX would be more comparable to Xbox One in terms of raw power.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

But would it be really that hard to believe? You are aware of the original Wii, yes?

So again, you're just making shit up.

 

[Oblivion]

She is the one who stated that the NX would be more comparable to Xbox One in terms of raw power.

Yes, initially. Then there was that thread about her saying she heard differently and that it would be weaker.

 

[bachikarn]

Nothing really surprising here. It's about what I expected for an open world game of this scale. I was only hoping against hope that it would at least have some AA, keeping everything else the same, but I figure that would be too much.

As for any performance improvements from now until release? I dunno if that's gonna happen. I can't recall any playable demo Nintendo has ever shown in the past that had improved performance by release. I figure Nintendo may feel that the frame rate drops are rare and not that significant so as to not warrant any additional effort to optimize.

The bigger question is what is Nintendo going to do with the NX verssion? Nintendo can't make that version that much superior looking since they also want to sell copies of the Wii-U version. I'd figure at most we'll probably get a resolution improvement to 1080p and that's it.

Pretty sure if Nintendo had a choice, they would sell zero Wii U copies and have everyone instead buy an NX and buy the NX version.

I'm subscribing to the idea that development moved over to the NX early on and the Wii U version is a down port.

 

[LordRaptor]

Yes, cell shading was actually born as a cost saving technique as well as a visual one, because you use less polygons and less detail that would otherwise be filled in to look right.

Cell shading is all about simplified models being shaded in a way that stylizes them to the point where you don't notice inaccuracies.

Without that shading, Zelda's model would look like a below PS2 model, but because of how he is shaded, it comes to life in a different way.

The same goes for the rest of the world. They don't focus on realistic textures or having a lot of realistic physics to save on overhead.

So they can animate fewer blades of grass for example with super big blades of grass that animate in a stylized way instead of having to conform to realistic large patches. Trees are simplified with designs to hide their lack of dimension and such.

This post has a highly impressive concentration of Wrong

 

[orioto]

Even if you go by those rumors, she never stated the console would simply be a rebranded Wii U.

And anyway everything points at NX being more powerfull. If they learned something from WiiU, it's not that it was "too powerful". It's that it was too expensive to produce, and the reason of that was the gimmick.

The only reason the NX would be a 250-300$ console with the same power of the WIiU, or barely more, would be that the gimmick part is again, really expensive to produce in itself.

Also look at that Zelda. it screams "that game is too ambitious for it's hardware". Nintendo never ever needed a more powerful hardware that much. Maybe for the first time in their history, you can say "give them all the power in the world and they'll make incredible use of it".

 

[Hermii]

Actually I'm going by the most recent rumors by Emily Rogers.

If I remember correctly she said it is around Xbox one, but a different architecture and hardware setup so apple to apple comparisons with other consoles arent possible.

 

[Bots are better than you]

Actually I'm going by the most recent rumors by Emily Rogers.

The ones from before E3, with the thread that got locked after no female Link in Zelda, and while ignoring her warnings about the numbers not being useful for a direct comparison due to the possibility of NX having another system architecture?

Taking this as a fact is not jumping to conclusions, it's "cannonballing into them" (love that image btw.). I give Emily a share of trust, but i also try to keep in mind the rest of the stuff that was said about this.

 

[Rodin]

But the DF guy in the video said no AA whatsoever.



Completely different matter since Konami didn't have to worry about selling hardware.



Because it seems quite likely that Nintendo may have learned the wrong lesson from the failure of the Wii-U (i.e. that it sold extremely poorly because it was too powerful)

- i addressed this. He was probably tricked by the terrible calibration of the TVs at E3. You'd be surprised of how much difference a stupidly high sharpness value and other TV filters can make in IQ.

- Nintendo isn't making the NX to sell Wii Us.

- That doesn't make any sense.

You know that GIF, it was a video not just a still for marketing PR, and no way was that last years zelda stuff running on a WiiU. It was 1440p down sampled with near perfect IQ. That was above Xb1 for sure, maybe above Ps4 as well.

If it was PC and thats what Nintendo believe will be the power level of the Nx, then now we are talking and I am interested.

The gifs you're referring to are probably 640x360 or something. The 1440p shots were jpgs, not gifs, and they came from the marketing stuff for Zelda they had in their E3 website.

Actually I'm going by the most recent rumors by Emily Rogers.

Except that's not even remotely what she said. She was talking about numbers and then she said that nvidia was involved in the NX hardware, which makes numbers useless. Only real world performances matter.

 

[Zombie James]

An art style that good deserves better image quality.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

Yes, initially. Then there was that thread about her saying she heard differently and that it would be weaker.

No, she said Xbone-level power might be stretching it a "tiny bit" but the NX is using a custom architecture, so it's hard to say. She also stated that although the NX won't blow away current systems power-wise from MS and Sony, it will absolutely blow away the Wii U.

And all of this could be bogus anyway.

 

[Krabboss]

The framerate looked quite bad to me in the footage they showed at E3 which kinda took the wind out of game's sails for me. Hopefully it runs at 60 on NX, but that is probably not very likely.

 

[Aostia]

Ugh. Painful. This game looks sooo good, but being hamstrung by poor performance...

I don't really wanna shell out for an NX to play this shit at a stable framerate, and I somehow doubt we'll see much in the way of improvement in the framerate before launch. I kind of feel like the game is probably in a ready to ship state, just held back for the NX launch. Based on nothing but my own cynicism, mind you.



They clearly remarked that it was still in development and that changes before launch are a possibility. There's nothing wrong with taking a preliminary look with an asterisk, especially given that this is a cross-gen game with major hype that pushes the Wii U to its apparent limits.

It runs better than the vast majority of ps360 open world games being even bigger

Poor performance?

 

[bachikarn]

What makes you think the NX will even get anywhere near Xbone levels?

Why wouldn't it? Wii U was shitty and expensive because it still used the PPC architecture. No one uses that so it was actually more expensive to get less power.

Nintendo will almost surely use a modern standard architecture which should result in much stronger hardware at a reasonable price.

Btw, we have a poster here who originally leaked the Wii specs saying the CPU is a little bit stronger than then the XBONE and the PS4. I forgot their username

 

[SinCityAssassin]

The framerate looked quite bad to me in the footage they showed at E3 which kinda took the wind out of game's sails for me. Hopefully it runs at 60 on NX, but that is probably not very likely.

That was mostly the stream than anything. The direct videos segments they put up on youtube are better.

 

[Inuhanyou]

This post has a highly impressive concentration of Wrong

I'm not sure what your disagreeing with, but by all means let me know

 

[Bots are better than you]

The framerate looked quite bad to me in the footage they showed at E3 which kinda took the wind out of game's sails for me. Hopefully it runs at 60 on NX, but that is probably not very likely.

If you're talking about the initial streaming of the trailer and the Treehouse segments, that was the stream, really bad.

The non-streamed tailer for example looked ok so far.

 

[Jawbreaker]

Disappointing, but not surprising after having watched E3 footage. Hopefully the NX will iron things out.

 

[Krabboss]

If you're talking about the initial streaming of the trailer and the Treehouse segments, that was the stream, really bad.

The non-streamed tailer for example looked ok so far.

I'm not talking about the initial reveal.

 

[Wind's Howling]

This is like PS3's The Last of Us. It was also that console's swansong but you could definitely notice the system was struggling with it.

Great for early WiiU owners but people that waited for something better will definitely get it for the NX.

 

[Astral Dog]

Because it seems quite likely that Nintendo may have learned the wrong lesson from the failure of the Wii-U (i.e. that it sold extremely poorly because it was too powerful)

What!?

 

[SinCityAssassin]

What!?

My god, life was a lie all along.

 

[TheKastorian]

So pretty good compared to Xbox 360 and PS3.

.

 

[Rodin]

I'm not sure what your disagreeing with, but by all means let me know

If Link's model is sub PS2 then TP's Link must be below N64, right? Which would make OOT's Link SNES level i guess.

Let's stop with this nonsense. Shading is impressive, and so are the hair tech, facial animations and clothes textures and physics for Wii U level of hardware.

NX version would probably just

1080p
AA
stable 30 fps.
better particle effects

Particles are already great. While they can certainly be improved on the NX, there are more important things to tweak before those.

 

[killatopak]

NX version would probably just

1080p
AA
stable 30 fps.
better particle effects

 

[SinCityAssassin]

and less pop-in.

 

[nOoblet16]

They should have atleast used some form of PPAA, using FXAA isn't too tough on old consoles.

There's this thing about all BOTW gameplay videos, everything looks a bit saturated eventhough it's suppose to be colourful.
It's like everything has a sun basked effect making the colours somewhat saturated.

 

[CrayToes]

Looking good. Can't wait to see the NX version.

 

[Oblivion]

What!?

I'm saying that from Nintendo's perspective, they may be thinking to themselves that they've had consoles in the past where they tried to compete with the competition, such as the N64 and GC and that didn't work out for them. Then they decide they're not going to bother going down that route and come out with the Wii, and now suddenly they're more successful than they've ever been in their entire history. Then they bring out the Wii-U, which goes back to the generational jumps they did before and it's a failure just like the GC and N64.

If you look at it like that, it's quite possible that's what they feel was the major problem with the Wii-U.

 

[BigTnaples]

No AA/AF at 720p, 20 fps, and LoD pop in sounds like a horror game.



Save us NX. Please.