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DirectX 12 is on the way
- Thread starter Tyrax
- Start date
Lol code to the metal. Both the ps4 and the x1 have APIs, neither are apparently extremely thin as to be able to call it coding to any metal.
The x1 and it's GPU are firmly rooted in DX11 land (the ps4 pretty much shares the same GPU family)
And yes Metro is balls but windows 8 is a better OS than 7
Edit: Beaten
Didn't think this ^ was happening, but, finally, DirectX12
It's hard to believe the first DX11 cards were released nearly 4 1/2 years ago, in fall 2009.
Didn't think this ^ was happening, but, finally, DirectX12
It's hard to believe the first DX11 cards were released nearly 4 1/2 years ago, in fall 2009.
Has there really been a game, where 'Turn On DX11' has been something to be excited about? Crysis 2?
Delusibeta
Banned
Watch this be Windows 9 exclusive.
Gamesadict
Member
I don't like W8 either, but getting back on topic...
Does anyone know about any of the new features on DX12? They only talk about closer to the metal and better tools...
And yeah, hope they make it W7 compatible, but I don't really see it happening...
Does anyone know about any of the new features on DX12? They only talk about closer to the metal and better tools...
And yeah, hope they make it W7 compatible, but I don't really see it happening...
TouchMyBox
Member
I'm down with this.
Well part of the issue has been that 360 and PS3 only really support DX9, so there's only minimal incentives for devs to add features or put serious effort in.
Netherscourge
Banned
We'll, unless they add Windows 7 support, it means nothing to me. It'll be interesting to see if AMD counters by allowing Mantle to run on all versions of Windows with their Radeon cards. Mantle sounds more powerful than DirectX these days. It just needs more developer interest.
Iced_Eagle
Member
Excited to see what they can do, and when it's releasing. Hopefully there will be some announcements of games/engines supporting it, along with hardware announcements (but I doubt that since the event will likely be focused on the software). I'm personally hoping for Star Citizen support!
Those who think it will support Win7 should be prepared to be disappointed. DX 11.1 and 11.2 isn't even available on Win7, let alone DX12. DirectX is closely integrated with the driver model of Windows itself. It's a ton of work to backport a driver model, because sometimes it can need underlying kernel/OS changes outside of just changing the driver. When they do update DirectX on the same version of Windows and add features, it's generally done through an OS service pack (such as 10.0 being upgrade to 10.1 with Vista SP1). It always has been this way so it's not like it's some surprise.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Display_Driver_Model
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DirectX
Metro Last Light off the top of my head.
Hybrid Shutdown != Win7 hibernation. Your tl;dr is wrong.
Hybrid shutdown only hibernates the kernel, but you get a clean user session every time (and of course it's smart enough to handle driver/hardware changes on boot). Plus the hibernation/resume is now multi-core in Win8 instead of single core in Win7. If you're curious here's details: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/hardware/gg463386
Those who think it will support Win7 should be prepared to be disappointed. DX 11.1 and 11.2 isn't even available on Win7, let alone DX12. DirectX is closely integrated with the driver model of Windows itself. It's a ton of work to backport a driver model, because sometimes it can need underlying kernel/OS changes outside of just changing the driver. When they do update DirectX on the same version of Windows and add features, it's generally done through an OS service pack (such as 10.0 being upgrade to 10.1 with Vista SP1). It always has been this way so it's not like it's some surprise.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Display_Driver_Model
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DirectX
Metro Last Light off the top of my head.
Hybrid Shutdown != Win7 hibernation. Your tl;dr is wrong.
Hybrid shutdown only hibernates the kernel, but you get a clean user session every time (and of course it's smart enough to handle driver/hardware changes on boot). Plus the hibernation/resume is now multi-core in Win8 instead of single core in Win7. If you're curious here's details: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/hardware/gg463386
Mr_Appleby
Member
Iced_Eagles's post a couple up explains why it won't be on Windows 7. Having to go back and rewrite low level OS functions in order for DirectX 12 to run certain routines is more trouble than it's worth. This is nothing new for DirectX, launching major new updates around a new OS that is.
Not liking an OS != being a fucking luddite!
Iced_Eagle
Member
Based on past DirectX releases, the latest generation of cards will generally support a subset of the new feature set, so not every feature will be supported. New cards after the reveal will support the full feature set as they designed the card to work for that version, and fully tested it for it.
Even though I got a 780ti a few weeks ago, I may just have to upgrade if DX12 brings big changes (and the new cards bring a good perf bump... come on Maxwell!).
Yes, Windows 7 is old. Half a decade is a long time for the tech world. To put it in context, the very first Android device, the HTC Dream, was released 8 months before Windows 7 released. Just think of how much has happened and changed in that time.
TaroYamada
Member
I also hate Windows 8.1 on my desktop (but love it on my hybrid), so I understand why some folks here are apprehensive. If it helps at all the start menu is rumored to return next year in the threshold update.
DirectX 12, yeah whatever cool.
What's REALLY exciting is this matches up what ntkrnl said. Isn't this a possible place for Microsoft to at least hint at Halo 2 Anniversary? It isn't as if games haven't been announced at GDC before, y know.
Idk, just a thought that got me excited since ntkrnl had mentioned getting news in Feb/March timeframe. Is such a thing even possible?
EDIT: also, did we already know Microsoft was going to be at GDC? Like specifically that they were going to be announcing things?
What's REALLY exciting is this matches up what ntkrnl said. Isn't this a possible place for Microsoft to at least hint at Halo 2 Anniversary? It isn't as if games haven't been announced at GDC before, y know.
Idk, just a thought that got me excited since ntkrnl had mentioned getting news in Feb/March timeframe. Is such a thing even possible?
EDIT: also, did we already know Microsoft was going to be at GDC? Like specifically that they were going to be announcing things?
Not progressing to a better OS == being a luddite.
8 isn't a bad system, really, and it's much faster than 7. Not nearly as intuitive as far as the start menu goes, but it's not near as big an inconvenience as I thought it would be. Glad I went ahead with 8.
No it does not!
On the other hand, calling people luddites because they do not like the OS you are using == childish.
SXSW starts on the 7th and Microsoft will have a pretty large presence there as well as Phil Spencer being interviewed by Geoff Keighley. I kind expect some news on Friday. Sorry for going off topic.
Has a game ever been announced there? I mean, between GDC and SXSW I would think MS would choose GDC if anything. Just curious.
At any rate, ntkrnl said march, and he's been pretty much spot on till now. So I'm keeping myself cautiously hopeful/excited.
No idea. Weirder things have happened though.
SneakyStephan
Banned
If they don't support windows 7 then no dev is going to bother making a dx12 game
And I already paid good money for my windows 7 key, why the hell would I pay another 100 euros when windows 7 works perfectly fine
If we get even deeper with the whole ntkrnl/H2A thing, we might ask "Is it possible Halo 2A or maybe just the next mainline Halo is being announced alongside DirectX 12 because it's the game they will be demonstrating some of the new tech on?" Maybe a bit of a stretch, but I do wonder.
KojiKnight
Member
This is because DX9 enabled programmable shaders... They essentially opened up limitless potential. DX10 and 11 added very little themselves, and instead more or less just brought standards to things both AMD and Nvidia were already doing (tesselation, compute shaders, etc) in more proprietary fashion. (AMD has had tesselation as a GPU feature since the original 8k series for example)
Far better under the covers but wah wah metro
maneil99
Member
Same a could have been said of 11... Lots of games used that for tessellation ect ( BF series, Crysis, Metro, ect )
SneakyStephan
Banned
There's been some nice performance increases in a few games, nice soft shadows as well
tomb raider looked pretty sweet on pc with all the eye candy on
I never said it was a nice business practice. It's pretty crappy of them (unless they really are taking advantage of some new things in Windows 8 that won't work at least well in 7, though I doubt that).
Still, 8 doesn't deserve the hate it gets, which was all I was getting at, and believe me I was one of the haters. If your main reason was because you had 7 before 8 was out and don't have/really want to spend your 100 euros, then yeah, you're totally justified.
Now if you went with 7 over 8 two months ago because you were silly and bought into the hate, then, while yeah it sucks, I don't have near as much sympathy for you.
Same thing can be said by DX10/11 from DX9?
Demigod Mac
Member
It probably won't make a difference to non-DX12 hardware.
That said, they'd be silly not to were it an option, especially considering that you can completely banish the Metro interface from your desktop with two settings changes.
8/8.1 exclusive would be death for this. I use Win8 and love it, but clearly a huge portion of the userbase, stubborn as many Windows users can be, aren't going to upgrade. Win7 support is essential. They should just roll it into a platform update and give developers reason to actually use it.
Demigod Mac
Member
I think it more likely they'll make DX12 an 8 and 9 exclusive, and if they're smart, make 9 to 8 like 7 was to Vista. Could actually move some OS sales if that were the case, combine a good OS with big performance benefits. They sure do need it; tablets and phones are chewing away at PC sales.
As a gamer that is utter cow dung. Windows 8 is the best place for game performance.
KojiKnight
Member
11.2 is already 8 exclusive, they won't back down on that for win7. All it will do is force devs to either play it safe and make their games DX11 only, or higher end ones will have multiple pathways for 11 or 12 just like many games still have DX9 or 11 mode.
Like it or hate it, Win7 is the new XP in that people aren't going to abandon it anytime soon and thus will be the target of lowest common denominator.
Yeah, lets just be real. I'm fucked, it's just how the beast goes. I have gotten real comfortable with this OS, that's all really. Windows 8 or 9, will simply be something I'm going to have to deal with it seems.
Radical Acceptance. Meh . . . whenever I do the inevitable motherboard upgrade (running 1366), I'll grab a damn copy.
It might have been a slight mistranslation, but last year one of AMD's VPs said there would not be a DirectX 12 anytime in the near future as far as they could see.
Apparently, even Microsoft said DirectX was no longer evolving as a technology, but soon changed their statement.
http://tech.slashdot.org/story/13/04/12/1847250/amd-says-there-will-be-no-directx-12-ever
http://games.slashdot.org/story/13/02/01/0245208/microsoft-phases-out-xna-and-directx
http://www.i-programmer.info/news/1...404-microsoft-phases-out-xna-and-directx.html
Apparently, even Microsoft said DirectX was no longer evolving as a technology, but soon changed their statement.
http://tech.slashdot.org/story/13/04/12/1847250/amd-says-there-will-be-no-directx-12-ever
http://games.slashdot.org/story/13/02/01/0245208/microsoft-phases-out-xna-and-directx
http://www.i-programmer.info/news/1...404-microsoft-phases-out-xna-and-directx.html
Where did you read this Coolio?
I was under the impression the APIs were generally hardware agnostic as long as the horsepower was there to run it, no?
fyi,I know nothing about computers.
-COOLIO-
The Everyman
well when dx 11 dropped it was exclusive to hd 5000 series and gtx 400 series cards.