There's no reason they can't make both unless Nintendo is paying them for the exclusivity.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Enough is enough, Capcom: It's time to marry Monster Hunter and Dragon's Dogma
- Thread starter Emperor_Uriel
- Start date
There's no reason they can't make both unless Nintendo is paying them for the exclusivity.
Muchi Muchi Pink
Member
So have you played MH on 3ds recently? Because it controls a lot better since 4 on portable.
Reasons would include them only having so many staff, and Capcom operating on a tight budget at the moment. On the plus side, I expect their next project will be an NX version, which would at least need updated assets. I'd be very surprised if we don't see a PS4 version of whatever the NX home console version gets.
You don't need to 'claw' on 3DS. I tried the camera on the second stick on a new 3DS, and to be honest I think the large creature lock-on-camera tool (which you can use on any 3DS, on both 3U and 4U) is just as useful unless you get pinned in a corner when underground. It freed up my thumb for dealing with other stuff during particularly frantic combat, I used it for 500+ hours over both games. It's especially good for keeping the camera pointed at a specific target during matches vs multiple monsters, you can swap it with a tap of your thumb.
I used a classic controller for Monster Hunter Tri on the Wii, and the controls there were just fine too, the same as 3U later on. I found the nunchuck/wiimote controls to be weird though (although I've seen a couple of gaffers say they were ok-takes all sorts!
), although anyone interested in action games on the Wii could easily buy classic controller. My limited edition of Tri even shipped with one.CaviarMeths
Member
There are monster hunting games on PS4 like Toukiden and God Eater. If you live outside of Japan though, you might have to buy them online. Don't know if any retailers would reserve shelf space for bombas like console monster hunting games.
RecRoulette
Member
Careful what you wish for, Capcom would just make Dragon's Dogma 3DS exclusive
That should be fixed soon...
E_Darkness
Member
But mobiles are still handhelds.
I mean with a shared library or NX being a hybrid.
So, basically, you want a Dragon's Dogma sequel with Monster Hunter in the name and some Rathalos and Lagiacrus thrown in?
Monster Hunter is a fantastic series. It's doing just fine stacking each new game with more and more depth, content and variety, rather than dumbing down and gutting each new game in exchange for prettier graphics like I've seen happen to so many other series.
Monster Hunter is a fantastic series. It's doing just fine stacking each new game with more and more depth, content and variety, rather than dumbing down and gutting each new game in exchange for prettier graphics like I've seen happen to so many other series.
pretty done
Member
No, I can't hold the 3DS for longer than 10 minutes without getting hand cramps. The hardware isn't made for people with large hands. Same deal with the PSP, except that thing is even less comfortable than the 3DS.
Just one of the many reasons why people in the west play on PC/console.
I used to have this problem but I just changed my finger positioning and within a few days I could play significantly longer without my hands hurting.
Admittedly, I don't have large hands, but I honestly don't think hand size really matters much in the first place.
Edit:
Or get a New 3DS. I really like the feel of it.
Wait, am I reading this OP right? You want a business (something that exists for the sole purpose of making money) to cannibalize one of it best selling franchises in favor of one that didn't sell well enough to justify even one sequel? Quality of the games aside, you're up in the night, mate.
Carpel tunnel city
The proper, cramp-free way. Hold it like this if you aren't already.
That's an older game from before they fixed the hitboxes.
E_Darkness
Member
Just because it is old doesn't stop the traumatic memories.
Emperor_Uriel
Member
Actually, it's "I like Monster Hunter's enemy variety, but I strongly prefer Dragon's Dogma's gameplay and world structure. Can we just make Monster Hunter with Dragons Dogma's gameplay and a seamless world?"
It didn't sell because it was a new IP with a very genric artstyle and a half-baked open world.
It's amazing that anyone in this industry tries anything new when even something as simple as "Why not try this spinoff idea while leaving the mainline series alone" is met with such forceful resistance.
pretty done
Member
That looks so damn uncomfortable.
I'll just re-install DD
A and play it on my Steam controller. Good enough, no cramps/discomfort!copelandmaster
Member
Personally, the Monster Hunter Ultimate 3 demo was one of the most clunky pieces of shit I have ever played. Every class felt heavy and awful. If the class had a huge fucking weapon, missing while the monster things were jumping around (like they weren't even designed for this specific game's combat) was frustratingly common. Aiming with the long range classes was like aiming a gun in Dead Rising 1. Swimming and swimming combat was infuriating to control. Not to mention, the large health pools, the tired and samey boss attack patterns, the mediocre hit feedback. It all felt horrible.
Fuck Monster Hunter Ultimate 3.
How about just putting some modified MH monsters into DD (a game with competent combat) and calling it a day.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Monster Hunter combat is amazing, but it utterly unlike most other action combat systems. It really has a rhythm to it, and when you hit the rhythm you feel incredible, but learning the rhythm and learning the tells and the frames and the timing is a hell of a curve.
I recommend anyone who wants to get into MonHun play with friends if you can find them
Also the premise of this thread is weird
MH has a heck of a learning curve and the demos tend to be a pretty bad way to get a feel for it.
If you want a Dragon's Dogma sequel with more monsters, just say so. No need to make your own variation on the "Zelda needs to be like Dark Souls" meme and embarrass yourself trying to claim Monster Hunter has anything but great gameplay.
You shouldn't be surprised people don't like the sound of your idea you're claiming is new. Haven't you seen how people responded to SMTxFE essentially being Persona with some Fire Emblem cameos?
I've been waiting for an excuse to post this gif but I might as well drop it here, why not?
As a fan of the heavy-as-fuck Greatsword, it's all about knowing where the monster will be and when you can get a good swing at them. The best Greatsword players know the monsters' behavior so well they're practically psychic.
Orniletter
Banned
I knew which Monster the video was about before I clicked the link lol.
Plesioth <3
There have been stinkers over the years, but I feel...starting with Tri...they've been generally great with 4U further improving on the foundation.
Fucking yuck at people throwing shade at MH though.
Emperor_Uriel
Member
Okay, so if I were to replace the word "clunky" with "unbelieveably obtuse," then maybe we could move past this part of the argument. Not even Dark Souls demands that players invest 20 hours just to understand the basics of combat.
I'm an immense Dark Souls fan. I'm against adding difficulty options, I'm in favor of making co-op more challenging, and I love From's dedication to adding sadistic new surprises with each entry.
I did not viciously protest against Bloodborne. Nor did I get upset when Dark Souls 3 incorporated many of Bloodorne's combat elements into it's gameplay. I trusted that From Software had that talent to deliver something different, but equally great.
Why not have the same faith in Capcom for this?
I love Dark Souls too.
But Monster Hunter has a certain identity and I wouldn't want another action spinoff to lose that identity. And it's not that obtuse. There are in-game and online weapon tutorials, there's co-op multiplayer, there are easier weapon choices like the Switch Axe, etc. Keep in mind the games' largest audience in Japan is young children.
NeonZ
Member
If Monster Hunter changed to a more standard battle style, with quick counters, cancellable attacks and such, it'd dramatically change the core gameplay itself. Obviously people who dislike it would be fine with that, but people who enjoy the game wouldn't want its gameplay to become something completely different. We aren't just talking about accessibility changes, it'd fundamentally change the game's combat since then the focus probably would change to comboing and keeping aggression as long as possible. The moment you give super speed to the melee fighters you'd also need to boost the abilities of the ranged weapons too. So, the ranged gameplay also would change.
I don't get why this kind of post seems to ignore the PS2 versions. And then there was also the Wii game. They existed and were localized without much impact. The handheld games were what exploded the series popularity in Japan, and that's the reason Capcom focuses on them. This isn't a Pokemon case where we never really got mainline Pokemon on consoles. Here, we had 3 mainline MHs on consoles before the focus changed to portables. There's no evidence that there's some big untapped market for console MH even in Japan itself and that's why Capcom focuses on handhelds, since there's no indication that extra console versions would have sales even half as good as the handheld games.
No Monster Hunter clones have exploded on consoles either, even though they'd be going after this supposedly untapped market with no competition.
It's not obtuse though, it's just different. You simply can't play MH the same as every other action game out there, including Dark Souls. And the sooner you realise that the quicker you'll enjoy the combat in MH.
Emperor_Uriel
Member
In the context of my proposal, which states that the handheld games would remain unchanged and the game would be handled by the DD/DMC crew instead of the MH devs, I'm kind of left interpreting this as "I'm worried that, if this hybrid was actually successful, it would kill the classic series in the same way that RE4 killed classic RE."
I don't think that would happen here. Japan is still very into the MH series as it is. This idea is focused primarily on appealing to the rest of the world, for whom the series's incredibly dense mechanics (combined with being tied mostly to handhelds) has made it very unpalatable.
If you didn't like it, you and everyone else who adores MH as-is can go straight to the next traditional handheld iteration.
"It's not obtuse though"
"TBH I don't think the demos or even 20 hours is enough to wrap your head around the controls let alone the entire game when it comes to MH."
By your exact parameters, it is absolutely obtuse.
SolicitorPirate
Member
Maybe I missed a post, but has OP even played Monster Hunter?
There's a reason why MH has the longevity no other hunting game has.
There's a reason why MH has the longevity no other hunting game has.
I really don't think MH is obtuse in the sense that there are a lot of individual facts and techniques you need to learn, it's just different and takes a long time to adjust to as a result. It really plays nothing like the games people try to compare it to beyond surface-level similarities.
Once MH really clicks for you, you start to see how weird some of the requests (open-world, story-based, "less clunky") for the future of the series are.
Once MH really clicks for you, you start to see how weird some of the requests (open-world, story-based, "less clunky") for the future of the series are.
At that point, why not just make a new Dragon's Dogma game?
If the monster variety in Dragon's Dogma is a problem, Capcom could probably still invent some cool new monsters. The monster variety in Monster Hunter 1 was garbage compared to where the series is now.
If you define obtuse as being different then I guess it is. If the game's controls come off as clunky, then you're honestly trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. It takes time to realise that and then figure the rules the game does play by.
Adam_Roman
Member
Marry the US with Dragon's Dogma Online first please.
The PS2 games were before the series got big with a multiplayer focus. And there indeed probably isn't some untapped market for MH on consoles in Japan. I'm just saying it at least makes sense on paper that MH's basic ideas combined with more standard controls and an online focus might do well on PlayStation and Xbox in the west, probably with the same market that's playing Destiny right now. I'm not sure the Wii even counts as that "big shot" since it sold to a totally different market.
MonHun already has a fully functioning online and local-com focus (the latter is a major factor in Japan, and completely impossible with a console). What is "standard controls"? You say this as if the game is currently controlled by some strange voodoo.
Also the Wii release was well after the series' popularity and the reason the series even ended up with Nintendo was because Sony fumbled with MH3P. Ironically it was over online functionality.
At this point, though, I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo were or were willing to pay enormous sums of money for development and exclusivity for the title ad infinitum. Capcom's current state of affairs would also lap that right up.
Sir Ilpalazzo
Member
I'm still baffled by the OP's statement that Dragon's Dogma has "immensely deep combat". Deep combat requires both a great-feeling player character and great, complex enemies to interact with - and Dragon's Dogma only nails the first of those; the enemies can't keep up with your moveset at all. (Unlike Monster Hunter, where the enemies' abilities are carefully balanced around your characters' movesets.)
It is almost like if someone made a hypothetical game where you played as DMC3 Dante and fought an enemy cast ripped directly out of Oblivion. The player character would be extremely well-made but that doesn't necessarily make "deep" combat on its own.
It is almost like if someone made a hypothetical game where you played as DMC3 Dante and fought an enemy cast ripped directly out of Oblivion. The player character would be extremely well-made but that doesn't necessarily make "deep" combat on its own.
CaviarMeths
Member
Really tho, you want Dragon's Dogma 2 that takes design cues from MH. You would have gotten far less resistance in this thread if you just said that. Your mistake was to assert your opinions on gameplay in MH as fact. It's OK to not like Monster Hunter. Honestly, most people don't and never will. But it's Capcom's most consistently successful IP for a reason.