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[King Mystery]

He can sketch too. This guy is pretty badass.

 

[Slayven]

Would he feel about as safe living in an ISIS-controlled area of Iraq? That would be the apples-to-apples comparison. I'm guessing that white Americans are also more likely to be killed by a police officer than by ISIS unless they decide to go backpacking through Syria.

Some neighborhoods there is little difference. Calling the police is an absolute last result.

 

[abadguy]

Never heard of this guy, but i like him already.

 

[Ventrue]

This guy is my hero.

 

[Crosseyes]

Chambers, 77, said that he didn’t have a gun and wasn’t “a man of violence,” but said that if he were, he would use the weapon for protection against the police. “I would want to shoot him first and ask questions later, as they say the cop ought to do,” he said.

A very danced around reality when it comes to ways that the oppressed black community can actually enact change on the institutions that abuse them. If the continued protests and support get only words and no action to change how the police function, or worse, people coming out in support of continued police procedures, it will come to that more and more often. And it will be justified.

 

[Klossen]

If those good police officers were doing their jobs properly, there wouldn't be any fear of police officers because all that bad ones would be rooted out.

But, they're not. And that's why people (particularly minorities) fear police in general.

You are blaming the group for the crimes of the few. This is wrong and if applied elsewhere, would be considered blatantly ignorant. But hey, it's ok to call cops murderers because they're an actual force of authority.

That's a rather large leap from critiquing something to desiring that something completely removed from existence.

Then, maybe, a more accurate likening would've been desirable? See how absurd it becomes comparing the police to ISIS? His comparison only works if I ignore the vast majority of decent cops, and the vast majority of deeds that are actually beneficial to society. This is ridiculous.

 

[Piston Hyundai]

He's kind of downplaying how outright fucking savage ISIS is, but I understand where he's coming from.

 

[slit]

Again, completely disregards all the GOOD work that the police force is doing, which for some reason, everyone tends to ignore. Those murderers and rapists don't go to prison willingly, trust me.

They can do the deeds like a group of frigging Mother Teresas for all I care.

If they cover up for the bad apples they are just as guilty and therefore their good deeds do not get them some special immunity.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

I can see his point.

ISIS are a foreign bogeyman 10000 miles away that have little effect on the lives of every day joes...while this guy is dealing with violence and intolerance from the cops everyday.

yep. it's pretty clear what he's saying.

and he's certainly not wrong.

If they cover up for the bad apples they are just as guilty and therefore their good deeds do not get them some special immunity.

indeed.

He's kind of downplaying how outright fucking savage ISIS is, but I understand where he's coming from.

certainly it wasn't meant to be a perfect analogy.

 

[Angelus Errare]

Again, completely disregards all the GOOD work that the police force is doing, which for some reason, everyone tends to ignore. Those murderers and rapists don't go to prison willingly, trust me.

Tell me about it, it's gotta suck for everyone to be stereotyped by the actions of a few who happen to get all the media attention. We should create a task force that enforces really messed up laws that help perpetuate those stereotypes, then tell that group to pick themselves up by their bootstraps as we systematically keep them oppressed...

 

[Quixzlizx]

Some neighborhoods there is little difference. Calling the police is an absolute last result.

Even if you're fired up, I think saying that is rather insulting. ISIS basically behaves like incompetent Nazis, in that they proudly attempt to commit genocide.

 

[Link]

Never said that. I said that if you removed the police force from the equation, chances are those people would be in even more danger than they were before.

I know, right? People might even have to start carrying firearms with them wherever they go.

 

[Klossen]

They can do the deeds like a group of frigging Mother Teresas for all I care.

If they cover up for the bad apples they are just as guilty and therefore their good deeds do not get them some special immunity.

No force of power is flawless and nobody is saying that the police is without flaws. Mistakes occur. And some people that are officers shouldn't have that job. But again, how exactly does that render the work of the majority of cops, who go to work every day, putting their lives on the line, rendered useless? This attitude only serves to worsen the problem, not solve it. What incentive would a good cop have to remain good if he's regarded as Al-Baghdadi by everyone in the neighbourhood? Might aswell just play it safe and assume everyone's out to get me.

 

[evilromero]

But is he wrong?

Hell no. His transcript hits the nail on the head. It just sucks that him presenting a very clear reality is rebuked by political rhetoric and twisting of his words. It's very depressing that we cannot intelligently discuss the fact of the matter that there is a problem with the
police in this country without some asshat just spitting party line bullshit to keep his idiotic constituency placated.

 

[Zen_Arcade]

You are blaming the group for the crimes of the few. This is wrong and if applied elsewhere, would be considered blatantly ignorant. But hey, it's ok to call cops murderers because they're an actual force of authority.

No it's not. Even if they're not murdering people, they're protecting the ones who are, which is the exact opposite of what a police force should be doing. When you are part of the group of people who are supposed to uphold the law, and instead you systematically cover up crime you yourself are committing a crime. In most other situations you would at least be considered to be an accomplice. We blame the group because no one in the group does anything to stop the people that ARE committing the crimes.

If I saw you murder someone, and I knew you murdered them, and I helped you cover it up, would I not be at some fault for helping you get away with your crime? Because that's really not far off from what the police force does.

No force of power is flawless and nobody is saying that the police is without flaws. Mistakes occur. And some people that are officers shouldn't have that job. But again, how exactly does that render the work of the majority of cops, who go to work every day, putting their lives on the line, rendered useless? This attitude only serves to worsen the problem, not solve it. What incentive would a good cop have to remain good if he's regarded as Al-Baghdadi by everyone in the neighbourhood? Might aswell just play it safe and assume everyone's out to get me.

Because the police force does nothing to correct these mistakes and flaws. Instead they cover it up and pretend like there isn't a problem. Or worse, lie and claim that the person who died or got injured deserved it.

 

[Poltergust]

You are blaming the group for the crimes of the few. This is wrong and if applied elsewhere, would be considered blatantly ignorant. But hey, it's ok to call cops murderers because they're an actual force of authority.

As mentioned earlier, any bad police officer would reflect poorly on the police as a whole. The police department must be held to the highest scrutiny. If someone who is supposed to serve and protect you does the complete opposite, then what does that say about the rest of the police force? How could they let someone like that get power and authority?

You are also ignoring all of the cases that get ignored or thrown out when police shoot civilians (who are usually unarmed). Why are the police covering things up when they should be doing everything in their power to get rid of all the bad officers?

The question I pose to you is this: based on all of this, why should the public trust the police to be accountable of themselves?

 

[GaimeGuy]

"SENATOR CHAMBERS: There's some scary people in this...I probably get more threats than everybody, at least in this room, put together. I don't carry any weapon anywhere. I don't want a weapon. I think Americans have become the most frightened people on the face of this earth. Rural people are the ones who often come out here and tell us, we've got to be able to have guns in the schools because the police are not close by. Well, the only ones in their area are their neighbors and each other. On the one hand, they want to talk about how they help each other, they get along so well, but all of them want to carry guns. I don't mean every individual, but they...it's not persuasive to me. And before they had the right to carry all these concealed weapons, they were not getting shot down in their streets, they were not getting shot between their house and their pickup truck, they were not getting shot off their tractors or their combines, yet they want to carry guns everywhere they go. And to me, it indicates a lack of a feeling of manhood and the gun is not an extension of a person. The person becomes an extension of the gun. And without the gun, he feels insecure, he's frightened, he thinks people are going to hurt him. And I would hate to live like that. But by the same token, a scared person is the last one who ought to have a weapon, and I just can't see, Senator, why people need to carry these guns into these liquor establishments. And what you've indicated is that you'd like to see it happen, but I don't think you've made a compelling justification for it."

I love this man

 

[Corronchilejano]

Would he feel about as safe living in an ISIS-controlled area of Iraq? That would be the apples-to-apples comparison. I'm guessing that white Americans are also more likely to be killed by a police officer than by ISIS unless they decide to go backpacking through Syria.

True, but you are definetly more likely to be killed by police if you're black, and in some cases, blacks are more afraid of the police than of regular criminals.

 

[Slayven]

Even if you're fired up, I think saying that is rather insulting. ISIS basically behaves like incompetent Nazis, in that they proudly attempt to commit genocide.

Still sounds like all the police cases recently hitting the news. I mean Ferguson police had 70 percent of the black population on warrents.

 

[Orbis Tabula]

No force of power is flawless and nobody is saying that the police is without flaws. Mistakes occur. And some people that are officers shouldn't have that job. But again, how exactly does that render the work of the majority of cops, who go to work every day, putting their lives on the line, rendered useless? This attitude only serves to worsen the problem, not solve it. What incentive would a good cop have to remain good if he's regarded as Al-Baghdadi by everyone in the neighbourhood? Might aswell just play it safe and assume everyone's out to get me.

I don't think slit is saying that bad cops invalidate good cops. What I think he's saying is that bad cops often get away with it because they are protected by their "good cop" brothers. All the good cops, who do good, and put their lives on the line? I think everyone is thankful for that. But the problem is, for more and more Americans, and especially minorities, the feeling is that when you have an encounter with a police officer, he's not the only one whose life is on the line. Both of your lives are. But the difference is that one person signed up for that, and the other person is in that position without choice.

 

[J10]

You are blaming the group for the crimes of the few. This is wrong and if applied elsewhere, would be considered blatantly ignorant. But hey, it's ok to call cops murderers because they're an actual force of authority.

It's not a few. It's most of them. It's the entire institution. There is clear evidence of this. The reason it's not wrong when applied to cops is precisely because they're an institution of corrupt authority.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Still sounds like all the police cases recently hitting the news. I mean Ferguson police had 70 percent of the black population on warrents.

Damn a city of 70% thugs

How does it even function

It's like Tattoine

 

[Klossen]

No it's not. Even if they're not murdering people, they're protecting the ones who are, which is the exact opposite of what a police force should be doing. When you are part of the group of people who are supposed to uphold the law, and instead you systematically cover up crime you yourself are committing a crime. In most other situations you would at least be considered to be an accomplice. We blame the group because no one in the group does anything to stop the people that ARE committing the crimes.

If I saw you murder someone, and I knew you murdered them, and I helped you cover it up, would I not be at some fault for helping you get away with your crime? Because that's really not far off from what the police force does.

Sounds more and more like this thread is heading down the conspiracy Autobahn. Where are your sources proving a system-wide covering up of major crimes? You confuse incompetence for malice.

As mentioned earlier, any bad police officer would reflect poorly on the police as a whole. The police department must be held to the highest scrutiny. If someone who is supposed to serve and protect you does the complete opposite, then what does that say about the rest of the police force? How could they let someone like that get power and authority?

You are also ignoring all of the cases that get ignored or thrown out when police shoot civilians (who are usually unarmed). Why are the police covering things up when they should be doing everything in their power to get rid of all the bad officers?

The question I pose to you is this: based on all of this, why should the public trust the police to be accountable of themselves?

You are, again, speaking of the police as one singular unit. Which quite frankly, does piss me off. I feel like I must stress over and over again that the far majority of cops are good and honest people. The mistakes of the few does not and should not paint the entire organization as guilty. This is a witch hunt.

It's not a few. It's most of them. It's the entire institution. There is clear evidence of this. The reason it's not wrong when applied to cops is precisely because they're an institution of corrupt authority.

Oh it's most of them now? Please post sources proving that most cops actually do shoot civilians and then cover it up.

 

[InsaneZero]

Then, maybe, a more accurate likening would've been desirable? See how absurd it becomes comparing the police to ISIS?

You might want to review the definition of the word "context".

You're rather eager to protect these police from mere words, but you don't seem to have the same compassion for the people that the police is supposed to serve and protect.

I can't really say claim that the people there are being harassed or killed since I don't actually know the situation there. Your claim about the police is baseless since you don't really know what that place is like either. But luckily, we have heard from a man that represents the people in that area. Maybe he knows a little bit more about police relations than we do, and maybe his words are worth considering.

 

[commedieu]

sigh.

 

[krazen]

No force of power is flawless and nobody is saying that the police is without flaws. Mistakes occur. And some people that are officers shouldn't have that job. But again, how exactly does that render the work of the majority of cops, who go to work every day, putting their lives on the line, rendered useless? This attitude only serves to worsen the problem, not solve it. What incentive would a good cop have to remain good if he's regarded as Al-Baghdadi by everyone in the neighbourhood? Might aswell just play it safe and assume everyone's out to get me.

You avoided the original posters question about how its under 'good' cops watch where all this happen. He/She's no longer a 'good' cop by then.

The problem is when bad cops do bad, everyone gives them the benefit of the doubt. The good cops might have the best intention to protect and serve, but all that goes away when he either actively helps cover ups, ignores, or automatically sides with cops under the assumption that they can't do no wrong.

The problem here is less the demonizing of cops, but the total apathy most police departments have towards civilian complaints and the HUGE benefit of the doubt they give blatantly bad cops because off the pretty stupid view that if a 'good' cop fucks up they don't want them steamrolled and that 'us vs them' mentality that sees themselves as under fire by the media as opposed to trying to look inward and root out the assholes and bad policing that gives them a bad name

 

[Ferrio]

Sounds more and more like this thread is heading down the conspiracy Autobahn. Where are your sources proving a system-wide covering up of major crimes? You confuse incompetence for malice.

It's okay guys, they're not doing it on purpose. They just suck at their job, everything is fine.

 

[Zen_Arcade]

Sounds more and more like this thread is heading down the conspiracy Autobahn. Where are your sources proving a system-wide covering up of major crimes? You confuse incompetence for malice.

I don't confuse incompetence for malice, I'm just not gullible enough to believe it's simple incompetence. If it were, the people who are incompetent would get fired like any other job. Instead they're given cushy two week payed vacations and go back out acting exactly like they did before.

And I'm not going to do your research for you. If you haven't parsed out that there are cover ups within the police force in this country then you just haven't been paying attention.

 

[Lagamorph]

Thought he was balancing a sword on his arm in that OP picture at first...

 

[Slayven]

Damn a city of 70% thugs

How does it even function

It's like Tattoine

Not like cops say fuck the law, I am the law

http://www.buzzfeed.com/adolfoflore...-admits-to-illegally-detaining-peo#.kfooaXqgp

 

[Klossen]

I don't confuse incompetence for malice, I'm just not gullible enough to believe it's simple incompetence.

And I'm not going to do your research for you. If you haven't parsed out that there are cover ups within the police force in this country then you just haven't been paying attention.

There are cover ups =/= The entire police force as a whole is covering up crimes and most cops are bad people because.

I'm out.

 

[Enzom21]

Sounds more and more like this thread is heading down the conspiracy Autobahn. Where are your sources proving a system-wide covering up of major crimes? You confuse incompetence for malice.



You are, again, speaking of the police as one singular unit. Which quite frankly, does piss me off. I feel like I must stress over and over again that the far majority of cops are good and honest people. The mistakes of the few does not and should not paint the entire organization as guilty. This is a witch hunt. I'm out.

Sounds like you're more upset about people maligning police than you are about corrupt police.

 

[Zen_Arcade]

There are cover ups =/= The entire police force as a whole is covering up crimes and most cops are bad people because.

I'm out.

Thank God, you weren't adding anything intelligent or worthwhile to the conversation anyway.

 

[Vicetrailia]

They can do the deeds like a group of frigging Mother Teresas for all I care.

If they cover up for the bad apples they are just as guilty and therefore their good deeds do not get them some special immunity.

Yes indeed. Good police, your silence will not protect you. The problem is far grander than any number of "bad apples" anyhow, I don't even know why people try to put it on that level. I guess because they just want to hand-wave it.

 

[Quixzlizx]

Still sounds like all the police cases recently hitting the news. I mean Ferguson police had 70 percent of the black population on warrents.

Your statements are very ironic. White Americans and black Americans have more similar treatment in America than black Americans in America and Shia muslims in Anbar province. Yet you are disgusted about how white Americans are apathetic towards the treatment of black Americans, while you show a similarly ignorant and self-absorbed view towards persecuted groups that you are not focused on.

True, but you are definetly more likely to be killed by police if you're black, and in some cases, blacks are more afraid of the police than of regular criminals.

Don't disagree with this at all. I was just arguing the analogy.

 

[Armaros]

Sounds more and more like this thread is heading down the conspiracy Autobahn. Where are your sources proving a system-wide covering up of major crimes? You confuse incompetence for malice.

For the minorities that get subjected to abuse by police and then see those bad cops get nothing to a slap on the wrist, it doesn't matter.

Its still corruption, and the 'good' cops shield 'bad' cops from it.

Unless you believe that the 70% of Ferguson have legitimate arrest warrants out for them, and the institution was hard at work to fix it before the report came out.

Edit: it doesn't matter if they are mistakes or malice, if nothing is done to fix the problems.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

Chambers for president!

 

[slit]

No force of power is flawless and nobody is saying that the police is without flaws. Mistakes occur. And some people that are officers shouldn't have that job. But again, how exactly does that render the work of the majority of cops, who go to work every day, putting their lives on the line, rendered useless? This attitude only serves to worsen the problem, not solve it. What incentive would a good cop have to remain good if he's regarded as Al-Baghdadi by everyone in the neighbourhood? Might aswell just play it safe and assume everyone's out to get me.

No, when THESE many mistakes occur and have no consequence it's useless because for all the good they do they still enable others to be harmed when they would not have if there was any kind of culpability.

"Cop A" puts "Rapist A" in prison. That's great!

"Cop A" knows "Cop B" murdered someone with no justification but says and does nothing. This makes him a bad cop already. He cannot remain good because he isn't and doesn't really care about justice. Only that it's applied to certain people.

 

[TacticalFox88]

Klossen, I'm going to say it outright, until you've been racially profiled, and afraid to talk to police (the one's who are SUPPOSED to protect you), because saying the wrong thing might get you killed, followed around in stores, discriminated against by police who assume your guilty, a stacked justice system that's completely broken, honestly: your apologetic stance towards systemic police brutality can go fuck itself.

If there were so many "good" cops as you say, we wouldn't have this problem: they would've been kicked out a long time ago but what happens?

They're protected. They're scared for their lives. THEY are the victim, when in a good many of times, they should be charged with murder.

And what's worse? People defending their actions always trying to find justification. "What was he wearing?" "THEY shouldn't be breaking the law!" etc etc. etc.

We've seen case after case after case of systematic racial prejudice in this country for HUNDREDS of years and even now with video evidence there are still people (read: whites) in this country who think we're crying wolf, despite the fact that we're barely holding on to the sheep we manage to herd away from the danger.

 

[Poltergust]

You are, again, speaking of the police as one singular unit. Which quite frankly, does piss me off. I feel like I must stress over and over again that the far majority of cops are good and honest people. The mistakes of the few does not and should not paint the entire organization as guilty. This is a witch hunt.

The problem is not people making "mistakes" (and these are usually not mistakes, by the way), but how nothing is being done to get rid of the people who do those "mistakes."

Heck, even in times when people were properly fired, it still wasn't enough. I've heard of a couple of cases where a police officer got fired in one department but then got rehired in another one.

 

[Poodlestrike]

My first thought was that that was a step too far, but in the context he frames it, it's not a bad comparison. ISIS has been made up to be this existential threat, but to many minorities the police are significantly more dangerous. If calling attention to that ridiculous circumstance requires inflammatory language, so be it.

 

[J10]

Oh it's most of them now? Please post sources proving that most cops actually do shoot civilians and then cover it up.

I can't post sources that most cops do shoot civilians. I can, however, cite sources that prove that cops are holding the justice system hostage by refusing to punish their own and that they disproportionately target minorities for harassment.

 

[Chumly]

I think people need to understand a little more history of Ernie as well. He knows exactly what he was doing and was purposely inflammatory. Nebraska hasn't done anything to reign in the police or address any issues. We have had a number of high profile incidents and absolutely nothing has changed. Being majority republican and with lots of rural white senators you can only imagine what they think of black north omaha. Ernie regularly makes inflammatory comments which bring attention to whatever he is talking about.

 

[Corronchilejano]

Don't disagree with this at all. I was just arguing the analogy.

Well, people in the middle east are afraid of ISIS because they come and kill you for no reasonable reason. Blacks get killed by cops for no reasonable reason.

 

[dbztrk]

No lies detected.

 

[Slayven]

Your statements are very ironic. White Americans and black Americans have more similar treatment in America than black Americans in America and Shia muslims in Anbar province. Yet you are disgusted about how white Americans are apathetic towards the treatment of black Americans, while you show a similarly ignorant and self-absorbed view towards persecuted groups that you are not focused on.



Don't disagree with this at all. I was just arguing the analogy.

 

[InsaneZero]

Chambers foor president!

If we elected everybody that we liked to the executive position, then the only people left would be responsible for legislation. Similarly, we shouldn't give everyone with a good idea a national position, since we still need some of those people locally.

I think he's fine being where he currently is.

This section, by itself, makes a really good point about gun control. Seems like he's calling out the stupidity of the mah guns mah freeeedom gunna shoot them baddies more than he's making a statement about the police being like ISIS.

Seems like they lost their heads over the comparison more than the point he was making, which is that all this MY GUNS attitude in the US ought to be changing and shifting, and the NRA's main support group is being irrational, silly, and scared up about nothing.

The people that brought this to national attention are the same people that make a living being fearmongers, so important points being ignored is to be expected.

 

[Elginer]

 

[YoungHav]

From my home I can literally jog to the World Trade Center in under 10min. A course I took was interrupted and the whole building, as well as about a dozen blocks around Times Square, had to be evacuated due to a terrorist bomb threat... yet still as a black Manhattanite I fear the NYPD more than Al Queda.

 

[Quixzlizx]

I like how you keep ignoring one half of the statement. Despite the graphs you posted, white and black Americans are STILL closer in treatment than black Americans and persecuted minorities in ISIS territory. Maybe if you actually think about that statement and get it through your skull, you can start to understand how horrific ISIS really is.