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[TheDrowningMan]

you don't need a titanic neogaf post count to see the bead of cold sweat fall from the salesperson's brow when you ask why you should buy your little ernie this thing when he's already got an xbox.

"pikmin? is that the new halo game?"



do you know a single person who wants a wii u who hasn't been able to get one? because i can direct them to one of the mounds piling up around the confused demo booths i see every day.

Nope, but that's just it. No advertising, something in part reliant on the biggest retailers in your product sector actually selling the device, which isn't happening for the most part. You couldn't move without seeing promotional materials for Wii in 2006, but that isn't the case now.

Nintendo's marketing department isn't bothering and hasn't prioritised the biggest gaming retailers in the country. Odd moves whichever way you cook it, especially for a product as prone to brand confusion as this.

I see one of three realistic possibilities:

A) There really IS very limited stock, but Nintendo's crack team of marketeers failed to realise that you still need to drum up hype / market something, especially when it may well appear to the average consumer to be a simple (but very expensive) add on for an existing console. Ergo, it has not been selling.

B) It's a deliberately soft launch. Drip feed now, get it out there and start giving it the push when you slash the price and have full functionality with TVii etc.

C) The industry is fucked. If you're not an established supermarket franchise or this year's novelty, you are in trouble in the UK.



There are other possibilities but they rely on colossal stupidity from Nintendo (ignoring and potentially alienating their retail base) or the worrying prospect of supermarkets no longer stocking consoles nationwide until established (perhaps Vita was the final straw...), which of course would be horrible for the industry in general in this country.

 

[herod]

12% of Most Wanted sales going to Vita pleases me, even if that works out to about 12 units. It's a cracking port.

it so isn't. The framerate drops to unplayable levels during any Most Wanted event, it becomes almost unplayable. I don't understand how people can think this is acceptable at all.

 

[ghst]

I see one of three realistic possibilities:

A) There really IS very limited stock, but Nintendo's crack team of marketeers failed to realise that you still need to drum up hype / market something, especially when it may well appear to the average consumer to be a simple (but very expensive) add on for an existing console. Ergo, it has not been selling.

B) It's a deliberately soft launch. Drip feed now, get it out there and start giving it the push when you slash the price and have full functionality with TVii etc.

C) The industry is fucked. If you're not an established supermarket franchise or this year's novelty, you are in trouble in the UK..

did you buy your occam's razor from club nintendo?

 

[Withnail]

I don't think that's the case at all. I think that the consoles we have are long in the tooth and the ones we want aren't out yet. When the next gen consoles hit, wallets will fall open.



Eh? Who are you talking about? There's a ton in stock at every Argos within a 10 mile radius of me.

Yep, 360 and PS3 are still very popular and I think there will be a lot of excitement surrounding their successors. In my opinion the problems of the WiiU stem from the fact that it doesn't have a compelling exclusive and very few people want to shell out £300+ to play current gen multiplatform games on an immature system.

 

[zomgbbqftw]

Reading this makes me feel like I've been flung back to the NES/SNES era, when the UK wasn't so enthusiastic about Nintendo. And we all know how awful those two platforms turned out to be.

But okay. I see your point. The UK has smarter, more trendy consumers than other places by rejecting the Wii U and Nintendo as a brand.

The UK tends to lead trends, we have the highest number of facebook accounts per capita, the highest percentage of smartphone users, we consume the highest amount of 3G/4G data per capita and the proportion of online spending of total consumer spend in the country is the highest in the world.

If the UK has rejected the Wii U, then it has done so because there are more compelling products and Nintendo have failed to capture the people that queued up at Christmas time to buy Buzz Lightyear action figures, Furbys, Tamagotchi and more recently the Wii.

 

[SmokyDave]

it so isn't. The framerate drops to unplayable levels during any Most Wanted event, it becomes almost unplayable. I don't understand how people can think this is acceptable at all.

I think your Vita might be fucked.

 

[Pie and Beans]

I see one of three realistic possibilities:

A) There really IS very limited stock, but Nintendo's crack team of marketeers failed to realise that you still need to drum up hype / market something, especially when it may well appear to the average consumer to be a simple (but very expensive) add on for an existing console. Ergo, it has not been selling.

B) It's a deliberately soft launch. Drip feed now, get it out there and start giving it the push when you slash the price and have full functionality with TVii etc.

C) The industry is fucked. If you're not an established supermarket franchise or this year's novelty, you are in trouble in the UK.

I love that D) People just don't want the WiiU isn't a realistic possibility but limited stock is. It is everywhere on the high street. If you want one, you can get one. So the answer to why its selling poorly is: people don't want one. You solve this through marketing, more aggressive pricing, or a shitload of upcoming BIG games. I expect to see a nuclear firestorm of marketing coinciding with a savage price slash next year, but on the big games front I think theyve oddly stumbled out of the console's first year bathroom stall with trousers well and truly around their ankles.

 

[Road]

Edit: from last week a missed Gamekult (FR website) article about the Wii U launch with some French sales. They don't say from where comes their datas ("our own source") > less than 45K systems sold first week-end (Week 48). 65K at the end of the following week (Week 49, I hope for Nintendo it's 45K + 65K, asked on Twitter, waiting for the answer). Article also point to some stock issues. For the same period the article say the 360 did 35K and the PS3 80K.

Same numbers as Chartz.

Obviously, they can always be just copying the real Gfk numbers.

 

[herod]

I think your Vita might be fucked.

with Sony's recent level of quality control, it wouldn't surprise me.

 

[Carl]

Wonderbook still holding firm Not seen so many adverts for it this week, but still

 

[TheDrowningMan]

did you buy your occam's razor from club nintendo?

For attempting to scrutinise the situation?

i) Marketing fail.

ii) Soft launch.

iii) Industry in a bad place.

It's not as though I've said it's like gold dust. It's not. If you want one, you can find one easily. But the fact is that it is not being stocked comprehensively by the country's biggest gaming retailers. That is an oddity. No-one can be conclusive as to the the reasons for this, no one can be certain of how the console will do in the long-run, but it is a strange situation.

 

[confuziz]

Same numbers as Chartz.

Obviously, they can always be just copying the real Gfk numbers.

Well he is from the UK, so he could make some cheap phonecalls allday =P

 

[radioheadrule83]

The UK tends to lead trends, we have the highest number of facebook accounts per capita, the highest percentage of smartphone users, we consume the highest amount of 3G/4G data per capita and the proportion of online spending of total consumer spend in the country is the highest in the world.

So we're the most self-aggrandising, anti-social, phone-hooked, lazy shoppers in the world? You make that sound like its a good thing!

you and Dave go to some lengths to try and portray a given picture don't you -- you talk to all your 'friends' in the know at game branches who can give you the skinny on sales relative to wonderbook, and Dave apparently does regular stock checks on the Argos website.. and if you don't like NFS:MW on Vita, apparently your Vita is broken

you point to the £20k Sony TV selling out at presale, but what is selling out exactly? -- I can't imagine that's a mass market product being produced on a mass market scale just yet. You're being extremely disingenuous if you don't concede that most Galaxy S3, iPad, iPod and Nexus sales are heavily subsidised.

 

[axisofweevils]

I see one of three realistic possibilities:

A) There really IS very limited stock, but Nintendo's crack team of marketeers failed to realise that you still need to drum up hype / market something, especially when it may well appear to the average consumer to be a simple (but very expensive) add on for an existing console. Ergo, it has not been selling.

B) It's a deliberately soft launch. Drip feed now, get it out there and start giving it the push when you slash the price and have full functionality with TVii etc.

C) The industry is fucked. If you're not an established supermarket franchise or this year's novelty, you are in trouble in the UK.

Personally, I think it's B. The number of Wii U commercials on TV here in the UK in the run up to launch - and now - even afterwards is astonishingly low. By comparison, I see a commercial for the CODBOD Vita bundle during almost every break in prime-time.

 

[TheDrowningMan]

I love that D) People just don't want the WiiU isn't a realistic possibility but limited stock is. It is everywhere on the high street. If you want one, you can get one. So the answer to why its selling poorly is: people don't want one. You solve this through marketing, more aggressive pricing, or a shitload of upcoming BIG games. I expect to see a nuclear firestorm of marketing coinciding with a savage price slash next year, but on the big games front I think theyve oddly stumbled out of the console's first year bathroom stall with trousers well and truly around their ankles.

That really ties into my first point. The fact is that there's really not that much stock if it's mostly in Game, Amazon and HMV. You can 'get one' on the high street very easily, but that doesn't mean there are hundreds of thousands out there.

It's been very poorly marketed, hence there's little demand. Little stock that they cannot sell because it's been abysmally marketed. But why have they failed so?

 

[SmokyDave]

...and if you don't like NFS:MW on Vita, apparently your Vita is broken...

Sigh. Yeah, that's exactly what I said.

 

[Dabanton]

As I've said before if Nintendo's plan is to have a 'soft launch' then good luck as that is dumb as shit.

It's christmas next week. Big purchases for most people have probably already been made.

 

[Road]

Well he is from the UK, so he could make some cheap phonecalls allday =P

(My conspiracy theory) I think they have subscription from all trackers and just copy everything, changing here and there.

I see people note the ridiculous differences between NPD and them sometimes, and the reason would be because NPD doesn't report weekly figures normally, so they have to actually pull out numbers out of their asses for the US sales every week.

 

[ghst]

That really ties into my first point. The fact is that there's really not that much stock if it's mostly in Game, Amazon and HMV. You can 'get one' on the high street very easily, but that doesn't mean there are hundreds of thousands out there.

It's been very poorly marketed, hence there's little demand. Little stock that they cannot sell because it's been abysmally marketed. But why have they failed so?

it's a £300 xbox with a funny little screen and no games. no one wants it, regardless of what you tell them.

if some financially cautious but stable parent asks you if it's worth the extra £140 for this new machine as a christmas present, or should they just get their kid a £160 xbox which all his friends already own, can you honestly say you'd recommend it?

and that's an already cut down demographic of kids who are still interested in home consoles and don't want some other convergence tech.

 

[cvxfreak]

The UK tends to lead trends, we have the highest number of facebook accounts per capita, the highest percentage of smartphone users, we consume the highest amount of 3G/4G data per capita and the proportion of online spending of total consumer spend in the country is the highest in the world.

If the UK has rejected the Wii U, then it has done so because there are more compelling products and Nintendo have failed to capture the people that queued up at Christmas time to buy Buzz Lightyear action figures, Furbys, Tamagotchi and more recently the Wii.

So having the highest per capita amounts to leading in trends? Maybe in some senses, but I still fail to see how that makes the UK "less daft" than other countries that may have lower per capita penetration rates than the UK, but are either far larger in volume (US, Japan) or have demonstrated a more promising consumer future (China -- 2 million iPhone 5s in one weekend).

Likening the Wii U's slow start in the UK to savviness makes about as much sense as saying the Japanese have more refined tastes for rejecting the 360. Which is completely ridiculous.

 

[Mad_Ban]

PAL Charts have become so popular recently! I remember when a thread a few months back was lucky to get 2 pages (50ppp)

 

[Pie and Beans]

That really ties into my first point. The fact is that there's really not that much stock if it's mostly in Game, Amazon and HMV. You can 'get one' on the high street very easily, but that doesn't mean there are hundreds of thousands out there.

It's been very poorly marketed, hence there's little demand. Little stock that they cannot sell because it's been abysmally marketed. But why have they failed so?

Supermarkets start the price war and maybe thats why Nintendo doesnt want them getting much stock. Thats their entire goal, they get you in to buy COD at cut price, you do the rest of your shopping, and a loyalty attachment coz they "done you a favour" keeps you coming back. I would posit that if Nintendo really are selling this shit at a loss (which I just dont believe at £300, I just don't), they wanted to keep that launch price nice and solid with no wavering and no Supermarket starting the price war that always has to result in an official price drop across the board when it becomes clear thats the selling price point.

So right now you've got a triple team of ambivalence from the market not wanting your product, the price clearly isnt right, and reluctance to market perhaps because Nintendo thinks why shit money away if the situation currently seems untenable. To me it looks like Nintendo wants to conservatively avoid that price drop for as long as possible, but when theyre hand is forced come out swinging with advertising. Will it work? I dunno, I think Nintendo's penny pinching has finally bit them in the ass. Good for consumers!

 

[Sandfox]

it's a £300 xbox with a funny little screen and no games. no one wants it, regardless of what you tell them.

if some financially cautious but stable parent asks you if it's worth the extra £140 for this new machine as a christmas present, or should they just get their kid a £160 xbox which all his friends already own, can you honestly say you'd recommend it?

While I agree with you, by that logic the Xbox would be the better option regardless of the hardware being paired against it.

 

[Dabanton]

PAL Charts have become so popular recently! I remember when a thread a few months back was lucky to get 2 pages (50ppp)

Indeed. And each week is going to become even more interesting from here on out.

 

[Mad_Ban]

Indeed. And each week is going to become even more interesting from here on out.

The threads in winter 2013 are going to be something special, I think.

 

[WeylandxYutani]

Nintendoland now at 45k cumulative sales.

 

[KillerMan91]

PAL Charts have become so popular recently! I remember when a thread a few months back was lucky to get 2 pages (50ppp)

Well there has been launch of new console and it's christmas so sales are more interesting.

 

[Frillen]

Wonderbook still holding firm

And that's a good thing.....?

 

[CrunchinJelly]

Is... is... is that a Vita game I see in the individual top 40?!

 

[KillerMan91]

And that's a good thing.....?

Why it wouldn't be ? Going by reviews it's solid product for casual audience.

 

[Tratorn]

Nintendoland now at 45k cumulative sales.

Where is this number from?

 

[PaulLFC]

So we're the most self-aggrandising, anti-social, phone-hooked, lazy shoppers in the world? You make that sound like its a good thing!

you and Dave go to some lengths to try and portray a given picture don't you -- you talk to all your 'friends' in the know at game branches who can give you the skinny on sales relative to wonderbook, and Dave apparently does regular stock checks on the Argos website.. and if you don't like NFS:MW on Vita, apparently your Vita is broken

you point to the £20k Sony TV selling out at presale, but what is selling out exactly? -- I can't imagine that's a mass market product being produced on a mass market scale just yet. You're being extremely disingenuous if you don't concede that most Galaxy S3, iPad, iPod and Nexus sales are heavily subsidised.

For the first bolded part, that's not what he said. For the second, only the Galaxy S3 will be subsidised out of those as it's the only one with a contract (unless you go for the Galaxy Ace / Nexus 7 deal that some Carphone Warehouse stores are doing).

Nintendoland now at 45k cumulative sales.

Do you have a link for that? So that means at most 45k Premiums sold so far (likely less as some may be individual Nintendoland sales)? What's the ratio of basicremium?

 

[Alcibiades]

Nintendoland now at 45k cumulative sales.

source?

 

[herod]

My impression on the Wii U situation is that Nintendoland is certainly not the Wii Sports equivalent that people appear to be attempting to paint it as, and as Iwata (I think?) said, that people will only really understand it once they get it in their hands. Other than that, old software isn't going to sell anything. Nintendoland, Zombi U and NSMB U (despite its quality, it can't convince people who are burned out on NSMB with screenshots alone) are not really enough to sell a £300 console.

Comparisons to Wii are a bit wide of the mark. It's quite clearly a tougher sell than just showing someone swinging a Wii remote and seeing a Mii swinging a tennis racket in unison on the screen. The cavalcade of clones and accessories that followed the Wii has put an end to anything that simple and effective coming out anymore.

It also appears about ~£50-£100 too expensive right now for an impulse purchase by former Wii owners (although perhaps that isn't so bad considering the software problems at launch, hopefully the open beta test finishes soon).

In every way it seems like a slow burner that will depend on word of mouth. Crazy talk of failure, Gamecube levels and cancellation are ridiculous; once they get the manufacturing costs down and the bugs ironed out they can of course follow up with casual/crowd-pleasers like Mario/Mario Kart, Wii Sports, Pokemon and games using a second gamepad. This is not in the same hopeless-looking situation that the Vita is in, Nintendo at least will have their A-tier teams working on this (as media create watchers will know, games sell systems, even Vita).

So, early days. I do think it has the "home-handheld" gaming market dominance within reach, unless Sony or Microsoft produce something with their next console that competes in this area. Apparently 51% of handheld gamers game exclusively at home while watching TV so this is not a small market. A lot of Vita owners should be looking at the Wii U as being most things they imagined the Vita would be.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Where is this number from?

From Gfk-ChartTrack. IIRC he has the reports.

If the premium:everything else ratio is still roughly the same that would make the LTD ~75K.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

While I agree with you, by that logic the Xbox would be the better option regardless of the hardware being paired against it.

... which is probably why the 360 (in UK) or PS3 will continue to outsell the Wii U in Europe in 2013.

 

[grimshawish]

Nintendoland now at 45k cumulative sales.

For other peoples reference, these numbers are from Weyland.

Nintendoland sold 26k first week, does this imply total console sales in the region of 37k if it was packed in every premium?

So thats 19k since launch week.

 

[Carl]

And that's a good thing.....?

Of course it's a good thing. Why wouldn't it be?

 

[DrWong]

Same numbers as Chartz.

Obviously, they can always be just copying the real Gfk numbers.

Yep, or Chartz took their numbers from this same article (there're a few French Chartz members in the interweb).

My impression on the Wii U situation is that Nintendoland is certainly not the Wii Sports equivalent that people appear to be attempting to paint it as, and as Iwata (I think?) said, that people will only really understand it once they get it in their hands. Other than that, old software isn't going to sell anything. Nintendoland, Zombi U and NSMB U (despite its quality, it can't convince people who are burned out on NSMB with screenshots alone) are not really enough to sell a £300 console.

Comparisons to Wii are a bit wide of the mark. It's quite clearly a tougher sell than just showing someone swinging a Wii remote and seeing a Mii swinging a tennis racket in unison on the screen. The cavalcade of clones and accessories that followed the Wii has put an end to anything that simple and effective coming out anymore.

It also appears about ~£50-£100 too expensive right now for an impulse purchase by former Wii owners (although perhaps that isn't so bad considering the software problems at launch, hopefully the open beta test finishes soon).

In every way it seems like a slow burner that will depend on word of mouth. Crazy talk of failure, Gamecube levels and cancellation are ridiculous; once they get the manufacturing costs down and the bugs ironed out they can of course follow up with casual/crowd-pleasers like Mario/Mario Kart, Wii Sports, Pokemon and games using a second gamepad. This is not in the same hopeless-looking situation that the Vita is in, Nintendo at least will have their A-tier teams working on this.

So, early days. I do think it has the "home-handheld" gaming market dominance within reach, unless Sony or Microsoft produce something with their next console that competes in this area. Apparently 51% of handheld gamers game exclusively at home while watching TV so this is not a small market. A lot of Vita owners should be looking at the Wii U as being most things they imagined the Vita would be.

Thanks, I was trying to wrote something along these lines but your post saves me this pain (due to low English writing skills).

 

[Bruno MB]

Nintendoland now at 45k cumulative sales.

Thanks.

Nintendo Land:

1st week - 26k ltd

3rd week - 45k ltd

Edit: Beaten by grimshawish.

 

[PaulLFC]

For other peoples reference, these numbers are from Weyland.



So thats 19k since launch week.

A (very) rough estimate then would be around 64k sold up to now (both Premium & basic) if that approx 70:30 premium:basic ratio holds and my maths isn't off (it probably is!).

 

[bigtroyjon]

The original narrative in the Pal thread was that Wonderbook would see it's sales consistently rise as we approached Christmas and sell well over time.

That has obviously not happened, I guess we'll see if it has any kind of staying power post new year.

 

[herod]

I don't think Nintendoland sales are that useful. It's available separately from any bundles, and there are three console bundle options, Basic, Premium+Nintendoland and Premium+Zombi U.

 

[Graphics Horse]

I don't think Nintendoland sales are that useful.

It gives them a game in the top 40.
Zombie U is 4th best selling Wii U game this week but I don't know how they're distributed.

 

[herod]

It gives them a game in the top 40.
Zombie U is 4th best selling Wii U game this week but I don't know how they're distributed.

Yeah, I mean in terms of trying to work out hardware sales, sorry.

 

[Graphics Horse]

Yeah, I mean in terms of trying to work out hardware sales, sorry.

I know. Only kidding. But it is the only official stat we can see.

 

[Tratorn]

A (very) rough estimate then would be around 64k sold up to now (both Premium & basic) if that approx 70:30 premium:basic ratio holds and my maths isn't off (it probably is!).

First week was 60% premium, 30% zombiu-bundle, 10% basic in UK.
How do you know its 70:30 now?

The zombiu-bundle shouldn't be that high anymore, but that could also increase the premium more than the basic.

 

[radioheadrule83]

For the first bolded part, that's not what he said. For the second, only the Galaxy S3 will be subsidised out of those as it's the only one with a contract (unless you go for the Galaxy Ace / Nexus 7 deal that some Carphone Warehouse stores are doing).

My bad, he said his Vita might be 'fucked'


TalkTalk offering the Galaxy Tab 7.0 or Nexus 7 free with selected Android phone contracts -
http://mobile.talktalk.co.uk/tablet-bundle

Nexus 4 (LG phone in Nexus range) -
£29 upfront, £35 a month on Three
http://www.store-3.co.uk/3-three-lg-google-nexus-4.html?ref=phonefinder

Nexus 7 -
Also offered free with subscriptions to The Times, Financial Times etc. and
Free via mobiles.co.uk - http://www.mobiles.co.uk/free-google-nexus-7.html

iPhone 5 -
£49.99 upfront, £46 a month with EE. Get it for £20 if you take a 4G plan. http://shop.ee.co.uk/apple-iphone-5-16gb-black-and-slate/pay-monthly/details/

iPad Mini -
Free with £50 deposit on a £31 contract - http://shop.orange.co.uk/mobile-broadband/tablet/
£49 upfront, £27 a month on Vodafone - http://www.vodafone.co.uk/shop/ipad-and-tablets/ipad-and-ipad-plans/index.htm?cid=rdr-1746-01
£49 upfront, £35.99 a month on EE - http://shop.ee.co.uk/ipad-mini-16gb-black-and-slate/pay-monthly/details/

iPad with Retina -
£99 upfront, £27 a month on Vodafone - http://www.vodafone.co.uk/shop/ipad...ipad-plans/index.htm?cid=rdr-1746-01#device_1
£149.99 upfront, £35.99 a month on EE - http://shop.ee.co.uk/ipad-with-retina-display-16gb-black/pay-monthly/details/


People might be buying WiFi only and SIM only more at full price for Christmas, I know one or two who've done so myself, but subsidised deals help the take-up of devices like this significantly all year round. The cost spreading flexibility available, in smartphones in particular, makes it very hard to make meaningfully direct comparisons re: popularity / interest vs products that do not have that luxury.

 

[Majmun]

Going for a soft launch and releasing it during the holiday season...
Doesn't sound logical to me.

There just isn't much demand. There are some things that you just can't spin.

 

[SmokyDave]

My bad, he said his Vita must be 'fucked'.

That's not the bit that you misrepresented, as you well know. My issue lies with the description of the framerate as 'unplayable'. Since I own the console version and have put 30 hours into the Vita version, I'm pretty sure I'd have noticed an 'unplayable' framerate. I can only conclude that the issue lies with herod's Vita.