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PS4 PRO: for best IQ (Native 4k + HDR + 60 HZ + 4:4:4) 2160p-YUV420 or 2160p-RGB?
- Thread starter PLASTICA-MAN
- Start date
Poimandres
Member
In fairness a lot of it is to do with complexities with the TV settings.
But yeah... as a Pro owner with a 4K TV it's all new ground to me, and way more complicated than it should be!
The port is not a proper Hdmi 2.0 port does not have all the protocols or the new hdr hdmi chip.. They released this Tv b4 Hdmi 2.0 specs were finalized the ports are not certified . one port (4) had Hdmi 2.0 and Hdcp 2.2(MHL port) but it's can't decode the metadata. No Way around it if you want HDMI 2.0A(HDR) you have to get one connect box..
For HDR you should use auto as it tracks the colour space correctly. Native will override the metadata and have subtle differences. Spectracal which are the leaders in software and equipment for Tv calibrations say use auto for correct colour. Calibrators might also use Custom Colour space. You want HDR as director intended use Auto.
So with PSVR connected, I am forced into HDCP 1.4. Will this create any issues for me running 4K content properly?
Direct connect without PSVR gets me HDCP 2.2, YUV420, no-HDR(2014 Sony xbr850B set). I just worry about HDCP 1.4 causing issues with other 4K stuff on my console, games, Netflix...
Direct connect without PSVR gets me HDCP 2.2, YUV420, no-HDR(2014 Sony xbr850B set). I just worry about HDCP 1.4 causing issues with other 4K stuff on my console, games, Netflix...
My receiver display bit depth in the video information.
Nice, I had not thought to check there. I am assuming your receiver is HDCP 2.2 and HDMI 2.0a compliant?
Any chance you want to post screenshots, this is really interesting.
I think it should only affect HDR. 4K should pass through fine with 1.4, but HDR not so much.
DJ Lushious
Member
michaelius
Banned
Is there specific game where it's easy to observe?
I've checked Infamous FL and Ratchet but neither have any banding with 2160p-RGB setting
But I'm using 2016 KS7000 so it's possible that 2015 models behave diffrently
Onkyo TX-NR646 http://www.uk.onkyo.com/en/products/tx-nr646-124318.html and it's hdcp 2.2 & HDR compatible.
byron_hinson
Member
Mind sending me your settings for the PS4 Pro and TV. I have the JS9000 UK but games like Infamous are far far too dark
byron_hinson
Member
If you load infamous from the start where you are first running away and look at the sunset.
As far as the PS4 Pro is concerned, 4:2:2 uses 12-bit color and HDR10 is 10-bit color.
Yes, 4:2:2 will work with HDR but then you are forcing the TV to downscale a 12-bit color range to 10-bit in order for it to work with HDR. Some TVs will handle this better than others. On ones that don't handle the conversion too well, you will see color banding that others might not see.
If you want the native color range for HDR10, you would need to go 4:2:0 (which uses 10-bit color) to get it. If your TV can handle dowscaling 12 bit color to 10 with no issues, then you won't see the color banding when using 4:2:2 like some people are.
Futurevoid
Member
What's strange is I only get the color banding in Second Son. I have to switch to YUV420 to resolve it. Whereas every other game displays without issue or banding using 4:2:2. I'm on an B6 OLED. First Light doesn't even have banding for me! Same studio!
excaliburps
Press - MP1st.com
Reading through this thread made my head hurt.
So, for 4K TVs with HDR, it's YUV? I set my PS4 Pro to "Automatic" on my LG UH7700 (HDR supported) and it shows RGB when I check the Video Output Information screen.
Should I change it to YUV? Leave it on Automatic?
Wanted to add that in Automatic, RGB is selected, but it auto goes to YUV sometimes (particularly in NBA 2K17).
So, for 4K TVs with HDR, it's YUV? I set my PS4 Pro to "Automatic" on my LG UH7700 (HDR supported) and it shows RGB when I check the Video Output Information screen.
Should I change it to YUV? Leave it on Automatic?
Wanted to add that in Automatic, RGB is selected, but it auto goes to YUV sometimes (particularly in NBA 2K17).
Futurevoid
Member
Sampled some other HDR games and I do see some banding in the skyboxes but minimal. Though nowhere near as severe as Second Son. It's gotten rid of by switching to YUV420. Looks like YUV420 for HDR games on the B6 OLED unless others have found otherwise?
It seems that using Auto switches to 4:2:2 8bit when playing HDR contents which would explain the banding since 8bit is not enough to properly display HDR. Setting it to YUV420 will make it always display 4:2:0 12bit which is more than enough for HDR. That is what happens in my setup at least.
Goodacre0081
Member
supported games automatically switch to HDR when they load up. right now the dashboard doesn't do HDR so it will always show as RGB when doing the test
i set mine to auto and it works
potatohead
Member
When you're in the PS4 OS alone it defaults to non-HDR I believe. I don't think the current PS4 UI is outputting HDR, so you will see default to RGB.
When you run a game in HDR mode it will switch to YUV to be able to output the HDR mode.
Yautja_Warrior
Member
To be fair, its more to do with all the different TV's out there and people understanding the settings, not really a fault of the PS4 Pro.
It works fine with my Sony 4k TV. I set the Pro to Automatic, which works just fine, switching from 4k RGB to YUV420 if I turn on HDR in a game, really quite simple.
So you manually switch for HDR?
Dzab
Member
I have a KS8000 and regardless if I set it to 420 or 422, there seems to be colour banding and HDR effect is not "WOW". But on the PC, 10bit 420 looks great. Very frustrating.
Surely if the same TV has a problem on one input but not another that would suggest a setting causing the banding?
byron_hinson
Member
More like the PS4 Pro being the cause outputting wrong information or incompatible stuff. I have everything through the one Input and PS4 Pro the only device with a HDR issue.
Plug hdmi in, set resolution to automatic. Enable hdr on TV.
Not particularly complicated.
Dzab
Member
I've tried so many combinations, a few others said they had the same problem. Stated it was because the Pro forces Deep Colour to be on (for HDR) which makes it 12bit etc. And there are some UHD blu ray players have a similar issue apparently but Deep Colour can be turned off on those and stopping the colour banding. Some are saying that Samsung sets have an issue with dealing with a 12bit source.
I'm willing to try other people's settings if they have limited colour banding or ideas.
Same here.
![[Asmodean]](/data/avatars/m/123/123312.jpg?1526393694){kind=avatar}
[Asmodean]
Member
This is because on PC you can specify the color depth. on PS4 there's only the ambiguous "Deep Color" setting.
There is currently some communication issues between the Pro and some TVs, is what I think. The PS4 pro thinks these TVs are basically cool to output at 12-bit even though HDR is enabled and looking for 10-bit. Then it's being converted again from 12-bit to 10 or such.
All of this color conversion BS is causing issues. We either need this communication issue resolved, or we need Sony to add settings to allow users to specify the preferred color bit depth.
I'm not sure if it's on the TV side of things or the PS4 overall.
excaliburps
Press - MP1st.com
Oh! Yeah, didn't think of that UI thing. Haha! Better to set to auto, then?
I did notice NBA 2K17 show a "HDR" message when booting it up.
Kamina
Golden Boy
Thanks for the help today.
I dont really care about HDR much, i just want 4:4:4 or 4:2:2 at least if possible.
Masterbrew
Member
I dont see the big issue with 4:2:0. At 2160p it has the chroma resolution of 1080p at 4:4:4.
Thats pretty good considering you get 10bit and HDR on top.
Thats pretty good considering you get 10bit and HDR on top.
TLZ
Banned
Interesting observation. 30 bit tells me it's using 10bit HDR and 24 bit tells me it's using 8 bit non HDR. I'm sticking with YUV420 then.
DirtyLarry
Member
Can anyone with a Vizio MC65-1 or an M series share which setting they are using?
I know I do not have HDR, but right now RGB is not even an issue for me to choose on the PS4 Pro. I changed the Advanced Picture mode on my Vizio to RGB and the option was still greyed out. Do I need to change it, power down everything, and then it will be an option?
Any help appreciated.
I know I do not have HDR, but right now RGB is not even an issue for me to choose on the PS4 Pro. I changed the Advanced Picture mode on my Vizio to RGB and the option was still greyed out. Do I need to change it, power down everything, and then it will be an option?
Any help appreciated.
TLZ
Banned
Have you tried using the HDMI cable that came with the Pro?
[Asmodean]
Member
fyi: You can basically tell when the PS4 is using higher than 8-bit color, by changing deep color from automatic to off. If the screen doesn't go black for a second, it means it's running as 8-bit currently.
From my observations; (providing your display is 'deep color' compatible ,etc)
1080p - uses deep color output
2160p YUV420 - uses deep color output
2160p RGB - uses 8-bit color
I still think RGB 8-bit provides higher quality for SDR games than YUV420 at 10-bit does. At least on my samsung ks8000 eu model (9000 in us). It may only even be 10-bit on the home screen. don't think SDR games even support 10-bit color.
I haven't tested YUV422 yet, but I suspect it does use it. I can't check from my end what the actual bit depth is though. With the whole 12-bit issue.
ps;
wouldn't all of these hdmi color bandwidth issues be solved on the Pro if they simply made it output at 30hz for 30fps games/modes for games.
hdmi 2.0 can do 2160p RGB 10-bit @ 30hz .. I mean, if the game is 30fps locked anyway. what's the point in sending a 60hz signal?
For HDR on JS9000 when in hdr mode Dynamic contrast Med-High, Colour space auto, Gamma +2 and make sure Smart Led is set to high.. Tip Make sure Mpeg noise and Digital clean view is off for all content but Cable or sat. Dynamic Contrast reacts differently in HDR mode then SDR for the record. Never use DC on SDR past low.
bitoriginal
Member
Can anyone help - I've got a Sony Bravia 4K TV from 2014 that doesn't support HDR. It does support HDMI 2.0 and HDCP 2.2 - however when I choose resolution, the 2160 RBG option is greyed out and says unsupported. Anyone got any ideas why that may be?
I appear to be stuck with the 2160 yuv420 option. I've not idea whats best but everyone seems to be saying RBG if you're not using HDR.
I appear to be stuck with the 2160 yuv420 option. I've not idea whats best but everyone seems to be saying RBG if you're not using HDR.
[Asmodean]
Member
Assuming that it's supported by the TV, and the correct hdmi cable / input is used for the TV, etc
Some people have had success by going into the settings and disabling HDCP then being able to select 4k RGB, then going back and enabling HDCP again and it stays on RGB 2160p.
Else boot the PS4 in safe mode (turn it off and when turning on again hold down the button until you hear 2 beeps). and changing HDCP to 1.4 in the safe mode menu.
bitoriginal
Member
[Asmodean];224265255 said:
Thanks for the advice. Unfortunately it's not worked for me so I'll have to assume my TV doesn't support it. Ah well, it looks good but would like to know what I'm missing out on.
TLZ
Banned
[Asmodean];224258802 said:
I think I've "fixed" my Infamous First Light dark issue on my KS9500. It is still dark but not as dark as before. I'm trying my best not to use dynamic contrast. I've increased the gamma to +3. It was on 0 before.
My other unchanged settings are (calibrated previously):
Backlight - 20
Brightness - 46
Contrast - 100
Smart LED - High
Dynamic Contrast - Off
Colour Space - Native
Added:
Gamma - 3
This is all in Game mode.
If anyone still finds that dark then try Dynamic Contrast - Low.
I think this game is dark by design.
I have a Vizio M60 and am wondering the same thing. The only option I have is 2160p YUV 420. Is 2160p RBG superior?
TLZ
Banned
In all honesty I can't tell the difference.
Also, can a kid soul post a picture of the banding they see in Infamous First Light so I can make out the differences?
What settings do you have set on your TV?
Do not use native it does not track colour correctly with HDR. Subtle difference but auto calculates colour from metadata in HDR. Gamma should be +2 not 3 for accuracy. Also as I stated b4 Dynamic contrast MED or high can be used for HDR.. Use HDR+ on your set it improves HDR without ruining metadata or what director intended. This has been tested by myself and many top calibrators on AVS forums and recommended .
In auto rgb will be selected in games where hdr isn't supported and yuv will be selected where hdr is available.
Leave it on auto, best of both worlds.
Yautja_Warrior
Member
My Pro is on Auto, games auto select HDR when you load them up and the Pro goes to YUV420 but if I turn HDR off in the game option, it goes back to RGB and my TV switches back to non HDR mode.
Auto is the best setting, unless your TV doesn't like it for some reason.
I ran the signal thru my Denon AVR-X1300W (full HDCP 2.2 and HDMI 2.0a compliant) where I can view the HDMI signal information and can confirm the following:
Auto PS4 settings:
Game does not implement HDR:
Resolution: 4K:60Hz
Color Space: RGB
Pixel Depth: 8-bit
RGB Range: Full
Game does implement HDR*
Resolution: 4K:60Hz
Color Space: BT. 2020 YCbCr (YUV 422 from PS4 Video Output Test)
Pixel Depth: --- (assumed 12-bit)
RGB Range: Limited
Forced YUV 420 Settings
Resolution: 4K:60Hz
Color Space: BT. 2020 YCbCr (forced YUV420 from PS4 Video Output Test)
Pixel Depth: 10-bit
RGB Range: Limited
A few notes:
1.) with HDR on, the display should be in RGB Range: Limited, always. In fact, it has been made idiot proof on the PS4 side, as changing RGB Range in the PS$ with HDR active does nothing: the PS4 puts out limited. Make sure your display is not forced to FULL., as its will wash out. (this only pertains to Sony sets. Samsung handles differently)
2.) If you have a Sony X800D (which a few of us do) I did not see any problems such as banding with everything set to auto on both sides. In each case, auto PS4 settings were accurately received by the display.
3.) If you are seeing visible banding with Auto settings, or know your display will not properly accept the 12-bit 422 signal use the PS4 to force YUV420.
I hope this helps clear up some of the confusion and conflicting reports we are seeing in this thread.
*EDIT: Forbes is also reporting some games stay in YUV420 for HDR enabled game content. The claim is made with Deus Ex. I don't have that game so can't check personally.
Auto PS4 settings:
Game does not implement HDR:
Resolution: 4K:60Hz
Color Space: RGB
Pixel Depth: 8-bit
RGB Range: Full
Game does implement HDR*
Resolution: 4K:60Hz
Color Space: BT. 2020 YCbCr (YUV 422 from PS4 Video Output Test)
Pixel Depth: --- (assumed 12-bit)
RGB Range: Limited
Forced YUV 420 Settings
Resolution: 4K:60Hz
Color Space: BT. 2020 YCbCr (forced YUV420 from PS4 Video Output Test)
Pixel Depth: 10-bit
RGB Range: Limited
A few notes:
1.) with HDR on, the display should be in RGB Range: Limited, always. In fact, it has been made idiot proof on the PS4 side, as changing RGB Range in the PS$ with HDR active does nothing: the PS4 puts out limited. Make sure your display is not forced to FULL., as its will wash out. (this only pertains to Sony sets. Samsung handles differently)
2.) If you have a Sony X800D (which a few of us do) I did not see any problems such as banding with everything set to auto on both sides. In each case, auto PS4 settings were accurately received by the display.
3.) If you are seeing visible banding with Auto settings, or know your display will not properly accept the 12-bit 422 signal use the PS4 to force YUV420.
I hope this helps clear up some of the confusion and conflicting reports we are seeing in this thread.
*EDIT: Forbes is also reporting some games stay in YUV420 for HDR enabled game content. The claim is made with Deus Ex. I don't have that game so can't check personally.