yeah I seen that it had changed by time I hit the submit reply button.
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PS4 Rumors , APU code named 'Liverpool' Radeon HD 7970 GPU Steamroller CPU 16GB Flash
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yeah I seen that it had changed by time I hit the submit reply button.
::clears throat:: ahem... PSWii60.
WiiPS360 sounds better in real life. I pronounce it like "weeps360". Sad. I know.
crazygambit
Member
A $500 BOM console with a $400 price tag is a loss much closer to $300 than $100 or do you think retailers sell them out of the goodness of their hearts?
Agreed, I can see games upscaled to 4k, and even then that sounds like it would be some drastic upscaling but not rendering natively at that resolution. If game A is rendering at 720p or 1080p, it will likely look better than game B that's running at 4K since the engine would be able to spend more time per pixel at the lower resolutions. We don't even know if these next gen systems will have the fillrate to sustain a 4K resolution. I can see games with more controlled camera angles (sports and racing games for example) hitting 1080p more often than other genres.
Also those 4K GT demos don't really mean nor prove anything. It's no different than other racing games that use multiple consoles to render on multiple screens at once, only now instead of the frame being split over multiple screens, they are all working on the same screen.
McHuj
Member
Pretty much. Retailers don't really get a cut of the sales of the console. They make money on the game sales. That's one of the issues with an all digital download future, if retailers don't make money on game sales, then they won't stock the consoles unless they make money on them.
Lagspike_exe
Member
Or they'll get a higher markup per console and will stock DL codes, like with PSP Go.
The idea is perfectly possible, it is along the same lines as how some are expecting retail PS3 to Vita CrossBuy games to work.
The problem will be emulation on their side, it isn't practical to have a PS3 for every consumer running the game, if they can't emulate a PS3 on next gen hardware that will be expensive to sell to consumers I doubt they will want to spend the money on the sort of servers they would need to stream PS3 games and how would they get money back from it?
Ardenyal
Member
This gen did have big increase in costs to develop with the common use of normal maps. Next gen won't have the same kind of increase in costs, higher polycounts on the ingame meshes don't take that much longer to create. People won't understand this of course, it's easier to look at the increase in dev costs last gen and then multiply that with the increase in power to come to the conclusion that gaming is doomed :d
KojiKnight
Member
This... where would the money be in it for them? I think we're more likely to see what we saw from the Vita in Japan. That is, a system where you put in CERTAIN games and then pay a conversion fee... and those games will be limited to whatever developers feel like porting over to PS4. Not only do they then not have to worry about the EXTREME cost of emulating the PS3 on their own servers (more likely they'd use custom PS3's to do the job versus trying to actually emulate PS3's on a server somewhere) but they also wouldn't have to worry about paying massive bandwidth bills.
yup nailed it. if anything some things will now get easier aka faster/simpler to make.
that reminds me, ppl should go and rewatch gttv episode about UE4
Actually retailers get little to no margin on consoles.
True, but the ticket price of a console is the cost to make, plus transportation costs, duty, tax, retailer margins and manufacturer margins. They all add up to a significant slice.
bigtroyjon
Member
Gamestop's margin on new hardware is around 7%.
jeff_rigby
Banned
From the NeoGAF Xbox thread:
It's also a whole home DVR which will need multiple tuners.
From KageMaru post on BY3D
Multiple posts by others trying to discover what the hint means:
so the 20 and 13... those have to be 2013 right?
and those 4GB. i believe it's CPU, that would be too much RAM
More hints on the hint:
Yes... 6G 8T - related... 4G 5T related
the 4/5 and 6/8 refer to something with regards to specs
Speculation:
So Two SKUs a 5 Tuners 4 Gig of RAM and 8 Tuners 6 Gig of ram
PS4 with essentially the same performance without the tuners but with a Google TV HDMI pass-thru and Feature set (Microsoft thinks Sony will do this, it's in the Leaked Xbox 720 powerpoint)? Something like NASNE to provide DVR features for Sony.
Both platforms are targeting the living room and XTV; ATSC 2.0 and hbbTV DVB as well as Cable custom solutions built on ATSC-DVB Software stacks and Tru2Way/RVU.
There have been rumors of Microsoft developing a Game Console/Set Top Box for cable companies. To support the coming XTV on Cable requires access to scrambled cable channels (Tuner) and the ability to descramble (Cable card). Cable box DVRs have multiple tuners 4-6. Over The Air ATSC 2.0 requires a tuner(s) also but no cable card.
Tru2Way cablebox DVRs support RVU which both the Xbox 360 and PS3 can use.
It's all about an easy to use one box solution for the living room that also serves handhelds. Windows 8 ecosystem with the Xbox 720 the living room server to everything in the home.
Sony was counting on the US AllVID proposal which would be a 6 tuner/cablecard device connected to the home network and RVU serving to everything in the home. It looks like cable companies deliberately stalled that proposal. Microsoft with the Xbox 720 would be working with Cable companies while Sony is having to provide ALLVID like ability in a separate device (NASNE).
Looking at the leaked Xbox 720 powerpointI will only say this.
Friend works at ******* and told me they have the nextXBOX devkits. He wouldn't tell me specifics about the cpu and gpu and such. But said this to me over chat,
"lets just say that wheny you're developing for the pc 32-bit, 4gb might be the thereotical limit but you normally and only allocate 2gigs. Well, for the new xbox, you can allocate well over 4 gigs
that's all i'm going to say"
Take it what you will.
All I can say is I can not wait to see their game.
It's also a whole home DVR which will need multiple tuners.
From KageMaru post on BY3D
Microsoft employee said:
Multiple posts by others trying to discover what the hint means:
so the 20 and 13... those have to be 2013 right?
and those 4GB. i believe it's CPU, that would be too much RAM
Microsoft employee said:
More hints on the hint:
Yes... 6G 8T - related... 4G 5T related
the 4/5 and 6/8 refer to something with regards to specs
Speculation:
So Two SKUs a 5 Tuners 4 Gig of RAM and 8 Tuners 6 Gig of ram
PS4 with essentially the same performance without the tuners but with a Google TV HDMI pass-thru and Feature set (Microsoft thinks Sony will do this, it's in the Leaked Xbox 720 powerpoint)? Something like NASNE to provide DVR features for Sony.
Both platforms are targeting the living room and XTV; ATSC 2.0 and hbbTV DVB as well as Cable custom solutions built on ATSC-DVB Software stacks and Tru2Way/RVU.
There have been rumors of Microsoft developing a Game Console/Set Top Box for cable companies. To support the coming XTV on Cable requires access to scrambled cable channels (Tuner) and the ability to descramble (Cable card). Cable box DVRs have multiple tuners 4-6. Over The Air ATSC 2.0 requires a tuner(s) also but no cable card.
Tru2Way cablebox DVRs support RVU which both the Xbox 360 and PS3 can use.
It's all about an easy to use one box solution for the living room that also serves handhelds. Windows 8 ecosystem with the Xbox 720 the living room server to everything in the home.
Sony was counting on the US AllVID proposal which would be a 6 tuner/cablecard device connected to the home network and RVU serving to everything in the home. It looks like cable companies deliberately stalled that proposal. Microsoft with the Xbox 720 would be working with Cable companies while Sony is having to provide ALLVID like ability in a separate device (NASNE).
All this tuner talk will be irrelevant in the UK market. Neither Sky nor Virgin will allow third party tuners, guaranteed. They've never done deals and I can't see them starting any time soon. They will have all the impact of the PlayTV in this market if that's their big play. PS3 already had a browser too. Nobody buys consoles for these features.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
From the NeoGAF Xbox thread:
Looking at the leaked Xbox 720 powerpoint
It's also a whole home DVR which will need multiple tuners.
From KageMaru post on BY3D
Multiple posts by others trying to discover what the hint means:
so the 20 and 13... those have to be 2013 right?
and those 4GB. i believe it's CPU, that would be too much RAM
More hints on the hint:
Yes... 6G 8T - related... 4G 5T related
the 4/5 and 6/8 refer to something with regards to specs
Speculation:
So Two SKUs a 5 Tuners 4 Gig of RAM and 8 Tuners 6 Gig of ram
PS4 with essentially the same performance without the tuners but with a Google TV HDMI pass-thru and Feature set (Microsoft thinks Sony will do this, it's in the Leaked Xbox 720 powerpoint)? Something like NASNE to provide DVR features for Sony.
Both platforms are targeting the living room and XTV; ATSC 2.0 and hbbTV DVB as well as Cable custom solutions built on ATSC-DVB Software stacks and Tru2Way/RVU.
There have been rumors of Microsoft developing a Game Console/Set Top Box for cable companies. To support the coming XTV on Cable requires access to scrambled cable channels (Tuner) and the ability to descramble (Cable card). Cable box DVRs have multiple tuners 4-6. Over The Air ATSC 2.0 requires a tuner(s) also but no cable card.
Tru2Way cablebox DVRs support RVU which both the Xbox 360 and PS3 can use.
It's all about an easy to use one box solution for the living room that also serves handhelds. Windows 8 ecosystem with the Xbox 720 the living room server to everything in the home.
Sony was counting on the US AllVID proposal which would be a 6 tuner/cablecard device connected to the home network and RVU serving to everything in the home. It looks like cable companies deliberately stalled that proposal. Microsoft with the Xbox 720 would be working with Cable companies while Sony is having to provide ALLVID like ability in a separate device (NASNE).
Like herod pointed out, all of that DVR-tech would be completely wasted in all non-NA territories. and the United States only really make up a third of the total videogame market.
It is on the other hand the one market that Microsoft is the strongest in so I guess that might explain why they think it's worth designing the X720 with that market in mind.
Regardless, that will cost a lot if they also want their hardware to be a massive generational leap over current gen (and a significant leap over the Wii U).
jeff_rigby
Banned
It looks like Microsoft will have multiple SKUs so I expect you are right and a Different model for EU. The Sony setup would then be a more EU version that also works in the US with something like NASNE or using the RVU ability in the US Tru2Way.
We didn't understand the 2011 Sony TVs having hbbTV support & Opera, it was because the BBC has been broadcasting 1080P since 2011 and that requires h.264 which is part of hbbTV DVB. You are going to be 2 years ahead of us as far as the new standards here (ATSC 2.0). We are going to support the hbbTV DVB stack (Java) as well as XHTML (ATSC 2.0) for XTV applications.
We didn't get the Play TV or Torne DVR either. Sony now has NASNE in Japan but might provide something like it for EU and the US. Cable companies scrambling everything not mandated by the FCC creates a different market here.
Jeff, that Microsoft employee sounds like someone In marketing trying to drip feed hype as a start to the new generation. There is very little substantial in what is suggested and nothing new except the beginning of the usual trash talk that both companies will engage in.
The allocation of greater than 4gb ram is discussed as being a major point for the xbox but he then discusses how close the systems will perform. He says Sony will try to beat specs, may succeed but then it won't matter because they will be close enough together in performance to be "a wash". His comments are all over the shop.
Sony reps will start bleating the same message as we get closer to the hype season.
The allocation of greater than 4gb ram is discussed as being a major point for the xbox but he then discusses how close the systems will perform. He says Sony will try to beat specs, may succeed but then it won't matter because they will be close enough together in performance to be "a wash". His comments are all over the shop.
Sony reps will start bleating the same message as we get closer to the hype season.
Wouldn't surprise me if we see two XBox3 models each with different amounts of RAM. Simply for the media functions. 4GB for the basic model with 2GB reserved for OS and various features. 6GB for the top model with 4GB reserved for OS and features.
But we aren't going to see one having a much more powerful GPU then the other, its just not going to happen.
But we aren't going to see one having a much more powerful GPU then the other, its just not going to happen.
I agree it doesn't add up IMO. How can they "allocate well over 4GB" for development in a system with 6GB total memory and extensive OS and media functions when the basic model has 4GB total and has to support the same OS and a lot of the same features? The way MS are going with the OS and media even if they had one system with 6GB I'd be surprised if they could allocate well over 4GB for developers (unless well over 4GB means 4.5GB...).
jeff_rigby
Banned
Of course, it's to be expected. Some of the text does strike a chord with what I expect. The "It's all going to be about the services" and both will have similar performance is what I expected from a "if both are built from the same AMD building blocks then optimal would be essentially the same design. Then we have the leak stating that they will be the same except for minor tweeks due to DirectX - OpenGL.
Remember the Microsoft QOS patent and QOS mentioned in the leaked Xbox 720 Powerpoint. In below see left of center Memory QoS for APP pool.Donnie said:
Did you also see how I pointed out the original person who directed me to these quotes is a major Xbox fanboy and these hints should be taken with a grain of salt? The only real reason I even quoted those posts was to see what a Microsoft employee at B3D thought of them.
Kinda funny how I make that post around a month ago and just now it's gaining traction here. =P
I agree with the point you're making, but there are devs at B3D saying that even a 2x difference in flops won't make a noticeable difference to the general public.
I assume both MS and Sony would want to shrink down the footprint size of the OS next Gen, especially if it's large as we may see with MS. I question how having two separate memory sizes would hinder this.
Also I don't think either will have much advantage in the GPU department.
Remember the Microsoft QOS patent and QOS mentioned in the leaked Xbox 720 Powerpoint. In below see left of center Memory QoS for APP pool.
How does that answer the inconsistency I brought up though? Are you suggesting the rumoured RAM amounts will be only for games and they aren't mentioning the memory reserved for OS/features?
Even if that were the case what would be the point in releasing two versions with 4GB for games on one and 6GB on another.
jeff_rigby
Banned
I always thought it a good find and didn't have anything to contribute until I researched Sony's NASNE with multiple "6T" tuners "CLICK". Both Sony and Microsoft are going after the same Living room XTV essentially the same way. Even without the hints and your cite, it's obvious that all the Xbox and Cable TV rumors as well as the Xbox 720 powerpoint support the same.
jeff_rigby
Banned
APP pool of always loaded APPS requires memory. If a consumer wants more RAM storage for APPs he has it in the more expensive SKU. If he wants the cheaper 4 gig model the QOS would support more APPS but would impact gameplay. QoS is all automatic and must be supported by Game Developers. It could also allow more than 4 gigs of memory for a running game.
MS and Sony likely don't know much more than we do from rumors. I think some people here don't realize how serious people are about NDAs in the industry. Very few people are willing to sacrifice their career to leak something to the competition or press. Not to mention the legal repercussions.
Third parties are the ones that steer the two toward common approaches. Execs from EA, Acti, Crytek etc will constantly be in the ear of both parties looking to get them toward common ground.
I'm still seeing the same problem. If the basic model has 4GB total then allowing more than 4GB of memory for a single game on the 6GB model is going to require the game to be downscaled on the 4GB model.
Also clearing apps is one thing, but the OS is still there. Or are you saying that you think this QoS idea means a developer can decide to shut down the OS and all other features and use the system 100% for its game?
I'm just trying to get a good idea of what you're expecting from XBox3.
What i will say is that this coming gen looks to be very similar in approach to the last based on the rumours we can see as "reasonable".
MS will produce a feature rich, technologically solid machine focused on delivering services in its key areas (US), but focus the majority of them behind a paywall. They will rely mainly on third party exclusives (especially outside the first 2 years) bought with the traction that these services will or wont get and spend billions in making you think you need it. Sony will produce a higher spec machine, with less features, but maintaining free support of key functionality. They will focus on first party development to "wow" the gamers into early adoption but will struggle to both focus and deliver its message to take advantage.
MS will produce a feature rich, technologically solid machine focused on delivering services in its key areas (US), but focus the majority of them behind a paywall. They will rely mainly on third party exclusives (especially outside the first 2 years) bought with the traction that these services will or wont get and spend billions in making you think you need it. Sony will produce a higher spec machine, with less features, but maintaining free support of key functionality. They will focus on first party development to "wow" the gamers into early adoption but will struggle to both focus and deliver its message to take advantage.
jeff_rigby
Banned
Your stuck in Console mode. When you initialize a program on a PC you ask how much memory is available because it's variable. You then configure your program to use available memory in one of several models based on available memory. Memory QoS just means a Game Console OS now acts more like a OS on a PC.
I'm in console mode because this is a console.. or it should be.
So you think this is going to be a case of going into settings in your game and configuring the display options like a PC? With the system removing apps and turning off functions depending on how much resources you decide the game can use?
So you think this is going to be a case of going into settings in your game and configuring the display options like a PC? With the system removing apps and turning off functions depending on how much resources you decide the game can use?
I can't see MS or anyone designing a console and have other functions take away memory from the gaming side resources.
I see it simply ending up like the Vita and how mobile phones manage memory, there will simply be a large part of memory that only the Apps can use, apps can then use those resources that are dedicate to them without affecting the games running at the same time and the system will warn you if something is trying to use more than it can by closing something else.
I see it simply ending up like the Vita and how mobile phones manage memory, there will simply be a large part of memory that only the Apps can use, apps can then use those resources that are dedicate to them without affecting the games running at the same time and the system will warn you if something is trying to use more than it can by closing something else.
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
Here's my take on it:
MS will produce a feature rich, technologically solid machine focused on delivering services in its key areas (US), but also as many parts of Europe as possible (conquering Europe while maintaining the lead in the US will be their priority next gen), while putting the majority of them behind a paywall. They will put a lot more effort in their first party releases (as evidenced by all the new studios they've opened and acquired over the past few years) and grooming a portfolio of IPs they will be able to keep and control, having been burnt by both some of their once close partners going multiplatform (Bizarre, BioWare, Team Ninja, Bungie...) and losing potentially lucrative franchises (Mass Effect). At the same time they'll keep partnering with independent developers for some of their first party releases, just like they always have. They'll also attempt to keep third parties on their side by means of superior development tools and support, while relying mostly on differentiating features (new Live, Kinect 2, SmartGlass, Fortaleza and who knows what else) as a means of securing some exclusives; in a few strategically chosen cases, moneyhats will be deployed. Sony will produce a machine which may or may not have higher specs (most likely it will be better in some areas, while worse in others, just like this gen), with as much focus put on being an all-in-one box as Microsoft, if not more. They'll try to monetize it just as much, although perhaps through different channels; multiplayer gaming will stay free of charge only if they won't have another choice to remain competitive. They will focus on first party development to "wow" the gamers into early adoption, but might have to make further cuts to their worldwide studios and concentrate on fewer franchises, while making sure that they reach their full market potential. At the same time, they'll be doing everything to strengthen the bonds with third parties through improved development support, but also through shared advertising and other deals that have secured them so much exclusive content in the second half of this generation.
I guarantee you they are not. There is a petition right now for the BBC to upgrade their paltry 1440x1080i 8mbps broadcast bandwidth to something that can actually be considered HD.
There simply isn't the spectrum for them to broadcast 1080p. We are still switching over from analogue ffs!
jeff_rigby
Banned
It will probably be as automatic as possible. Remember we are most likely talking about a user base that will not want to think about settings. What do you think Microsoft (the Windows 8 guys) think about consumers. Lots of settings or automatic with little control?
higherARC05
Banned
I may prefer Microsoft as my favorite system but you can say what you want as it does not change the friends i have who work in the industry. Ill gladly bet you anything on the validity of my source. Ill work on getting specific details when he feels less pressured about leaks.
phosphor112
Banned
The QoS patent talks about allocating enough resources for the extra apps and functions, like being able to stream your content regardless of what you're doing.
Still surely there will have to be a minimum amount of memory guaranteed for the OS and apps. I can't imagine MS allowing a game to use so much memory that you can't pause a game and use various apps (Browser, TV, Music ect) at the same time. I'd imagine they'd have to dedicate around 1GB minimum.
BTW personally I don't like the idea of making things more like PC/Smartphones. But I won't own a XBox3 so I suppose it won't affect me.
Huh? I don't believe I even commented on any of your posts, at least not in the posts you quoted here. I looked back a few pages and don't even see what you're talking about.
BTW, anything I say is not meant to be taken personally as I question and have doubt over pretty much everything next gen. Some things sound more logical and believable to me, but unless it's confirmed, I take nothing as if it's set in stone.
jeff_rigby
Banned
jeff_rigby said:
BBC Begins 1080p Broadcasting article May 23 2011
Perhaps you are confusing Virgin and Sky Satellite broadcasting with BBC Over The Air? I'm really not up on EU broadcast standards.
If I'm reading this correctly you have 8 Mhz wide TV channels and we have 6Mhz wide TV channels for Over The Air. You have been watching 1080P (h.264) XTV since 2011 (hbbTV DVB), we are yet to get real time h.264 but Non-Real-Time transmission of h.264 video was authorized a few months ago. NRT h.264 1080P and Mobile DTV are parts of ATSC 2.0 that have been authorized with more to come by first quarter 2013.3/29/11 said:
Direct TV won't allow third party tuners either but do provide RVU support which is all that is needed to support XTV (along with a Internet connection). The ALLVID FCC proposal did include Cable and Satelliteherod said:
That brings up an interesting point: DOCSIS cable modems use one or more (DOCSIS 3.0) cable channels to provide high speed Internet access. Could one or more tuners in the Xbox 720 like the higher end model with 8T and 6 gigs of memory also include a DOCSIS 3.0 cable modem? 6 Tuners was in the ALLVID FCC proposal (looks like AllVID also had Internet access as part of the 6Tuner device) and is in the Sony NASNE, 8 Tuners in the Xbox 720 seems overkill if everyone else is targeting 6 Tuners; 2 tuners for DOCSIS 3.0 and 6 Tuners for the DVR?
The above makes the Xbox 720 more expensive than a PS4 but it includes features that must be added with accessories for the PS4 which make the total PS4 ($299) + NASNE ($215) + Cablemodem ($95) more expensive than the Xbox 720(8T) by about $200. (guesses on PS4 & Xbox 720 price).
The XBOX 720(8T) would be a better long term investment. Sorta the reverse of the early Xbox 360 - PS3 buying decision where the PS3 included many features (at higher price) that we would want in a all-in-one entertainment box. It only does everything next generation would apply more to the Xbox 720 than the PS4. All this from rumors and the leaked Xbox 720 powerpoint. We don't know Sony PS4 plans other than through simi-firm leaks of performance targets that match other leaks for the CPU-GPU....there is nothing for Sony about specs and features outside the main Silicon CPU-GPU except for the Sony CTO interview.
Also, the Leaked Xbox 720 Powerpoint appears to be targeted to "Partners" as in Cable companies so it is most likely for SKUs that contain support for Cable TV. Most likely there was no need for a Powerpoint proposal for a SKU that does not contain tuners......So there may be a Game Console only version of the Xbox 720.
SteveP rumors of slow and fast RAM in the Xbox 720 may be accurate but might indicate a second SoC for Cable/DVR support with it's own memory that connects to the Main SoC through a PCIe buss. The APP pool would be applications that run on main memory and use/control the second SoC.
If this proposal goes through then the Xbox 720 described in the leaked 2010 powerpoint is not needed, Sony's Nasne is not needed.http://www.wired.com/business/2011/02/allvid-tech-alliance/ said:
Goldrusher
Member
There is really no need for tv tuners, when everything you'd want it to do, can be done through an IPTV app...
RVU makes all the built-in tuner talk irrelevant, and is a protocol any hardware manufacturer can implement. It's not a win for consoles at all. If anything, it makes them even more redundant than they are currently; the TV itself can do it.
jeff_rigby
Banned
ALLVID proposal supported by an alliance of: Google, BestBuy, TiVo, Sony, Mitsubishi and two other large companies:
The timing of the above was a few months before the Leaked Xbox 720 powerpoint and articles I have read have resistance from Cable Companies to AllVID.In this Notice of Inquiry, the Commission seeks comment on specific steps we can take to
unleash competition in the retail market for smart, set-top video devices (“smart video devices”
In particular, we wish to explore the potential for allowing any electronics manufacturer to offer smart video devices at retail that can be used with the services of any MVPD and without the need to coordinate or negotiate with MVPDs.
We believe that this could foster a competitive retail market in smart video devices to spur investment and innovation, increase consumer choice, allow unfettered innovation in MVPD delivery platforms, and encourage wider broadband use and adoption.
More specifically, we introduce the concept of an adapter that could act either as a small “set-back” device for connection to a single smart video device or as a gateway allowing all consumer electronics devices in the home to access multichannel video programming services. Unlike the existing cable-centric CableCARD technology, this adapter could make possible the development and marketing of smart video devices that attach to any MVPD service anywhere in the United States, which could greatly enhance the incentives for manufacturers to enter the retail market. As conceived, the adapter would communicate with the MVPD service, performing the tuning and security decryption functions that may be specific to a particular MVPD; the smart video device would perform navigation functions, including presentation of programming guides and search functionality.
The Commission seeks comment on this concept. We also invite any alternative proposals that would achieve the same objective of eliminating barriers to entry in the retail market for smart video devices that are compatible with all MVPD services.
The term “smart video device” refers to a product that is capable of navigating the universe of video content available to a viewer. Traditionally, these devices have been cable or satellite set-top boxes, but have expanded to include video game systems, digital video recorders, and home theater personal computers, and which, with the AllVid adapter could additionally provide access to over-the-top services like internet video.
jeff_rigby
Banned
IF the TV is a Smart TV yes but is everyone going to go out and buy a Smart 1080P TV @ $1400 or would they buy a PS3, Xbox 360 at $200 and use their current TV? This is a big opening starting in 2013 for Sony and Microsoft to get their game consoles into the living room and is a big reason why I assumed both would be getting major hardware redesigns to both make them cheaper and support multiple features that can't be supported by cheaper Set top boxes made in China.
In the US the number of PS3 and newer Xbox 360's that can support RVU/XTV is high enough now to bypass the chicken and egg issues in starting a new XTV standard. Without these numbers there would be a much slower adoption, perhaps even stalling like it has in the past (First XTV demos occurred in 2007).
Notice in the above post Google and Sony supporting Allvid and Google and Sony working together on Google TV, a $200 box that can use RVU or position it'self using HDMI pass-thru between a cable box and the TV. Notice Cable companies resisting Google TV.
I'm seeing a battle for control between Consumer electronics companies and Cable companies. The FCC is in between the two and under pressure from both sides. RVU is a compromise position that limits CE XTV functionality.
jeff_rigby
Banned
PDF from Lecture by Nvidia on Accelerating Mobile Augmented Reality
Interesting points:
Page 12 on a road map for OpenGL and OpenGLES beyond 2013 and includes hints on NextGEN Console.
Mentions efficiencies needed by portable same as mentioned by AMD for Next gen consoles. How to save power page 6. Page 9 "Programmers View of SoC 2012" should be similar to AMD next gen Consoles. LP-DDR3 mentioned inside SoC (probably ultra wide) DDR4 contains GDDR5 features like some differential inputs that would not be needed inside a SoC. DDR4 will be outside a SoC and if ultra-wide then stacked 2.5D to a Transposer (or chip carrier) connected to the SoC.
Page 17 OS adoption of WebGL and OpenCL
Interesting points:
Page 12 on a road map for OpenGL and OpenGLES beyond 2013 and includes hints on NextGEN Console.
Mentions efficiencies needed by portable same as mentioned by AMD for Next gen consoles. How to save power page 6. Page 9 "Programmers View of SoC 2012" should be similar to AMD next gen Consoles. LP-DDR3 mentioned inside SoC (probably ultra wide) DDR4 contains GDDR5 features like some differential inputs that would not be needed inside a SoC. DDR4 will be outside a SoC and if ultra-wide then stacked 2.5D to a Transposer (or chip carrier) connected to the SoC.
Page 17 OS adoption of WebGL and OpenCL
Or just a WDTV or similar mini box for $99. Consoles are just not consumer-friendly enough to compete in the TV space.
Page 12 doesn't mention consoles. That page doesn't mean a thing other than API plans in general.
Baseless extrapolation.
What does this have to do with anything? All they mention under WebGL are Opera/Firefox, and upcoming support for Chrome. OpenCL support is mentioned for MacOS. Sony is ultimately going to use their own custom APIs ala libgcm. Yes, they'll be similar to the khronos ones, but customized to exposing the specific HW, so what does it matter what is said about OpenCL/WebGL (for other platforms even)?
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