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[shoreu]

How many of those rappers and vids/vine makers live outside the western world? I think in terms of global awareness, superman is more well known. I have nothing to back this up with.

Considering it's migos, thug, Wayne, and future all of those make it out. More use him as a figure of weath but those are some of the more popular guy who use the name every once and a while.

I can't imagine Europe being too different from us in terms of likeness on the heroes.

 

[IconGrist]

I think you have a point but comparing MoS directly to the first wave of MCU films isn't completely fair either. Expectations for MoS definitely started out higher as one of the first major post-Avengers superhero movies and with Christopher Nolan's name plastered all over the marketing.

I don't think that applies to the average movie goer who isn't invested like we are. His or her last experiences with Superman came in the form of Superman Returns. And if they were like me Superman IV before that. Even as a 5 year old that movie left a sour taste in my mouth.

 

[BigBossVanzetti]

I'm a huge DC fan and a moderate Marvel fan. It's a no brainer that Gotg nailed it's characters. They sold the movie. Rocket Racoon, Star Lord, and Groot are household names now and deservedly so. Most of it's massive audience loves the characters They created.

MOS Supes can have huge payoff this movie. He can be a great version of Superman still. He wasn't in MOS though and it showed.

 

[kswiston]

I am sort of late to this thread, but throwing out $100-140M tracking for BvS is non-news. They might as well have said that BvS is still releasing in March.

Man of Steel opened to $128M including Thursday previews. That should be the floor for BvS's opening, and would signal a pretty disastrous start for DC's expanded cinematic universe.

 

[guek]

I don't think that applies to the average movie goer who isn't invested like we are. His or her last experiences with Superman came in the form of Superman Returns. And if they were like me Superman IV before that. Even as a 5 year old that movie left a sour taste in my mouth.

That should be taken into account too, sure, but so should everything else I mentioned. In the lead up to MoS, the marketing pushed Nolan's name so hard, I recall multiple people thinking he directed it himself. MoS was coming off the back of both the Nolan trilogy which was immensely popular and Avengers which shot superhero movies into the stratosphere. So it's not really fair to use Returns as the only factor when talking about expectations either. Speaking of Avengers though, that's really the reason why expectations became so warped and it's common for people to think it flopped when at worst it may have slightly underperformed. Avengers took superhero movies to new box office heights. Combine that with the fact that Iron Man 3, the first post-Avengers MCU movie, broke a billion WW, people expected that kind of momentum to continue with MoS. That's completely unfair though, which is why the otherwise strong first film performance of MoS is framed so bizarrely.

 

[IconGrist]

That should be taken into account too, sure, but so should everything else I mentioned. In the lead up to MoS, the marketing pushed Nolan's name so hard, I recall multiple people thinking he directed it himself. MoS was coming off the back of both the Nolan trilogy which was immensely popular and Avengers which shot superhero movies into the stratosphere. So it's not really fair to use Returns as the only factor when talking about expectations either. Speaking of Avengers though, that's really the reason why expectations became so warped and it's common for people to think it flopped when at worst it may have slightly underperformed. Avengers took superhero movies to new box office heights. Combine that with the fact that Iron Man 3, the first post-Avengers MCU movie, broke a billion WW, people expected that kind of momentum to continue with MoS. That's completely unfair though, which is why the otherwise strong first film performance of MoS is framed so bizarrely.

I hear what you're saying but the movie was divisive as well so that definitely kept it from hitting Avengers heights. So many people expected something like the Reeve movies. A lot of reviews hit it for not being either similar in tone or a continuation.

Not to use this as some sort of evidence but just a funny little personal experience; My mother loved Returns and paid money to see it in theaters because it was a sequel to the Reeve movies. She has yet to watch Man of Steel because it is not. She knows there is a Batman and Superman coming out but has no interest in that either.

 

[Doctor Decimate]

And at the time of release?

Only two MCU films had grossed higher than Man of Steel. Granted, I'm sure they wanted to be higher, but people talk like the film was a complete flop at times.

On the other end of the scale, people forget that Superman has been a disappointment in cinema for like 2 decades at that point. A string of Superman 3, 4 and Returns wasn't instilling a ton of confidence in people when Man of Steel dropped. Same reason Begins is one of the lowest grossing Batman film.

The real story for MoS' box office run really should be it's 2nd weekend drop. Which was on the higher end, which is worrying for the reception. But then you look at home video (old term!) sales and they were pretty damn solid. So who knows where general audience sit with their opinion on it.

Ramble, ramble, ramble I guess.

But The Avengers>Iron Man 3>MoS at time of release. Since then GoTG/TWS/AoU have out-grossed it.

Or less than half of the MCU films have grossed higher.

I mean, I'm not saying it flopped, but I don't think "more successful than Thor" says much of anything. We'll probably never know DC's expectations, but I feel pretty confident in saying that they saw it as the next step after the billion-grossing Nolan films. Now, I don't think they expected Man of Steel to do those numbers, but I do think its box office gross in that context is probably not what they wanted it to be. The fact that they took Goyer off the sequels probably says something, too.

 

[IconGrist]

I mean, I'm not saying it flopped, but I don't think "more successful than Thor" says much of anything. We'll probably never know DC's expectations, but I feel pretty confident in saying that they saw it as the next step after the billion-grossing Nolan films. Now, I don't think they expected Man of Steel to do those numbers, but I do think its box office gross in that context is probably not what they wanted it to be. The fact that they took Goyer off the sequels probably says something, too.

A lot of the backlash for MoS was the script so it was a pretty good move. In fact, a lot of decisions made post-MoS have been very smart moves. Maybe WB thought name alone would give them equal success and when MoS proved that wasn't the case they realized a real effort had to be made.

People are still worried about BvS due to MoS but WB has made a lot of moves to ensure its quality. It could still be ass but at least they really tried this time.

 

[Ahasverus]

That should be taken into account too, sure, but so should everything else I mentioned. In the lead up to MoS, the marketing pushed Nolan's name so hard, I recall multiple people thinking he directed it himself. MoS was coming off the back of both the Nolan trilogy which was immensely popular and Avengers which shot superhero movies into the stratosphere. So it's not really fair to use Returns as the only factor when talking about expectations either. Speaking of Avengers though, that's really the reason why expectations became so warped and it's common for people to think it flopped when at worst it may have slightly underperformed. Avengers took superhero movies to new box office heights. Combine that with the fact that Iron Man 3, the first post-Avengers MCU movie, broke a billion WW, people expected that kind of momentum to continue with MoS. That's completely unfair though, which is why the otherwise strong first film performance of MoS is framed so bizarrely.

I'd argue it was The Dark knight, not Avengers, the comic book Zelgeist that shot the genre to the stratosphere. Remember whan then it came out it was like the 4th higest grossing movie of all time. And hitting a billion was a really big deal back then.

 

[G-Fex]

This may come as a huge shock to you but your opinions don't represent everyone else's. Audiences became completely enamored with the characters in Guardians. You pretending otherwise while pushing your own reaction as the only one that's valid means you're either delusional or self absorbed.

I wasn't pushing my opinion as the only one. I was just saying it cause I wanted to. You need to relax and go do something else.

self absorbed, hilarious coming from guek.

 

[IconGrist]

I don't know if I know anyone who was completely enamored with Gamora but that's a topic for another day.

 

[Penguin]

I mean, I'm not saying it flopped, but I don't think "more successful than Thor" says much of anything. We'll probably never know DC's expectations, but I feel pretty confident in saying that they saw it as the next step after the billion-grossing Nolan films. Now, I don't think they expected Man of Steel to do those numbers, but I do think its box office gross in that context is probably not what they wanted it to be. The fact that they took Goyer off the sequels probably says something, too.

It sounds like Goyer was removed due to Affleck's demands, and they have so much riding on this film.

Trust me, I know MoS didn't do as well as they wanted, no matter what Zack says, Batman was added due to his ability to draw. They probably can't afford a secondary... mid-range Superman film/box office return.

 

[icespide]

It sounds like Goyer was removed due to Affleck's demands, and they have so much riding on this film.

Trust me, I know MoS didn't do as well as they wanted, no matter what Zack says, Batman was added due to his ability to draw. They probably can't afford a secondary... mid-range Superman film/box office return.

do they even have a new superman movie planned?

 

[IconGrist]

do they even have a new superman movie planned?

Batman and Superman solo movies will be sprinkled in according to WB but nothing official has been announced.

 

[gamz]

I'd argue it was The Dark knight, not Avengers, the comic book Zelgeist that shot the genre to the stratosphere. Remember whan then it came out it was like the 4th higest grossing movie of all time. And hitting a billion was a really big deal back then.

You can also say Spider-Man 2. That was huge!

 

[guek]

I'd argue it was The Dark knight, not Avengers, the comic book Zelgeist that shot the genre to the stratosphere. Remember whan then it came out it was like the 4th higest grossing movie of all time. And hitting a billion was a really big deal back then.

Both were milestones, just like Spider-Man before it, Blade, Batman '89, etc. Avengers will be passed up eventually too.

 

[brandonh83]

You can also say Spider-Man 2. That was huge!

It's also the best of those by far IMO

I had a few issues with TDK and Avengers is just fun... but Spider-man 2 is virtually flawless and has some of the best pacing thus best storytelling from any of the superhero movies. It has this less is more philosophy running throughout that more of these movies could do well to follow.

 

[Staf]

It's also the best of those by far IMO

I had a few issues with TDK and Avengers is just fun... but Spider-man 2 is virtually flawless and has some of the best pacing thus best storytelling from any of the superhero movies. It has this less is more philosophy running throughout that more of these movies could do well to follow.

Spider-man 2 is the best comic book movie in my opinion. It took what i loved the most about the Richard Donner movies, the hero balancing their dual identity's, and turned it up to 11. Flawless movie.

 

[Lord Virgin]

Spider-man 2 is the best comic book movie in my opinion. It took what i loved the most about the Richard Donner movies, the hero balancing their dual identity's, and turned it up to 11. Flawless movie.

Have to give it a rewatch, loved it as a kid and had a crush on Kirsten Dunst as MJ. Hope it holds up. Never liked the Donner movies tho.

 

[Staf]

Have to give it a rewatch, loved it as a kid and had a crush on Kirsten Dunst as MJ. Hope it holds up. Never liked the Donner movies tho.

Watched it recently again and it really holds up. Well i love the Donner movies. Probably due to growing up in the 80s and 90s reading Superman.

 

[Penguin]

Spider-man 2 is the best comic book movie in my opinion. It took what i loved the most about the Richard Donner movies, the hero balancing their dual identity's, and turned it up to 11. Flawless movie.

Yeah people always talk about the MCU way or DC's new dark way

For my money, the Donner way has produced the most gold. Superman 1/2, Spider-man 1/2 and The Flash all kind of embrace that gee golly spirit, but know how to ramp up the personal interest and action.

 

[Staf]

Yeah people always talk about the MCU way or DC's new dark way

For my money, the Donner way has produced the most gold. Superman 1/2, Spider-man 1/2 and The Flash all kind of embrace that gee golly spirit, but know how to ramp up the personal interest and action.

Still haven't watched The Flash TV series, or Supergirl for that matter, yet. They look right up my alley.

 

[RedVladimir]

Spider-man 2 is the best comic book movie in my opinion. It took what i loved the most about the Richard Donner movies, the hero balancing their dual identity's, and turned it up to 11. Flawless movie.

Spider Man 2 is my favorite Marvel movie by far. But I still think Batman Begins is the better comic book film (better than the TDK and TDKR). Then Watchmen, then Spider Man 2.

 

[anaron]

Still haven't watched The Flash TV series, or Supergirl for that matter, yet. They look right up my alley.

Do so ASAP, they're both fantastic. Supergirl in particular captures the sense of joy and optimism more than any other superhero property out there right now.

 

[generic_username]

Spider Man 2 is my favorite Marvel movie by far. But I still think Batman Begins is the better comic book film (better than the TDK and TDKR). Then Watchmen, then Spider Man 2.

Spidey 2 for me followed by Batman Begins followed by TDK followed by X2. Rest do not matter.

 

[RedVladimir]

Civil War will have a bigger opening weekend than BvS. bookmark it

Lol. Didn't AoU do less than (the well received) Avengers its opening weekend? You bet I'll bookmark this.

Batman isn't guaranteed box office gold. Batman Begins opened with $48M and ended its domestic run at $205M. Of course that was off the back of the dismal Batman and Robin and this one follows the revered Nolan trilogy but it's not like MoS was universally loved either.

I hope people aren't too disappointed if this ends up performing like just another blockbuster movie.

Not sure I understand the first part of your post if you explain the reason behind your counter-argument.

And MoS came from an equally abysmal Superman Returns. It still managed to do 128 mil on its own. You add the market power of (a new) Batman and to some extent Wonder Woman, I'm sure anything below 200 is a failure. But we'll see.

It's not going to make $300 million, reason being you looked at star wars marketing and hype we had young people and older people to see their favourite characters back on screen. Now with this some people are skeptical because of synder directing. My friends hated man of steel and is slightly excited for this. Then you have a new batman, once again some people excited and some still skeptical. Honestly, it's probably going to make roughly around 175 million to 200 million but no 300 million. If star wars can't do it yet no one can.

Wait, didn't I provide an explanation for this? Star Wars is 40 years old. Batman and Superman are double of that. Wouldn't you say these two characters cover a wider variety of young and the older audiences? Not every kid/adult is into science fantasy (and of course a preference of superhero and science fantasy is not mutually exclusive), but you can bet every kid/adult has at least a superhero they like.

So by that logic, before TFA, a kid that's 8-10 year old is most certain to want to see Batman and/or Superman, than Star Wars, a franchise whose latest film would have predated his/her birth by a year or more. Superman/Batman do not need films to stay relevant for young audiences, cartoons and merchandise do the job.

 

[icespide]

Lol. Didn't AoU do less than (the well received) Avengers its opening weekend? You bet I'll bookmark this.

still higher than any DC movie opening weekend ever

 

[Jarmel]

People seriously in this thread thinking $300 million?

I can't laugh any harder.

 

[PhoncipleBone]

Yeah people always talk about the MCU way or DC's new dark way

For my money, the Donner way has produced the most gold. Superman 1/2, Spider-man 1/2 and The Flash all kind of embrace that gee golly spirit, but know how to ramp up the personal interest and action.

Supergirl is partway there. They have the gee golly spirit, but they haven't brought the personal interest and action quite yet. I think the show will get there though. Flash got there almost instantly though.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

$300 domestic in a single weekend is not happening with this movie.

There's no way. A whole bunch of the factors that made TFA's $248 (not even $250!) possible aren't even in play, most importantly the theater counts and the number of screenings Thursday through Sunday morning.

Batman v. Superman isn't running 24 straight hours of nonstop showings.

Besides which, anyone can tell the level of anticipation, while high, isn't anywhere near the level of anticipation for Force Awakens, which was regularly making headlines. Not entertainment news headlines - actual headlines.

So we don't have the level of anticipation, we don't have the theaters, and we don't have the screenings. And that's just to reach the same level Star Wars did. People in here thinking we're set up for Batman v. Superman to beat Star Wars by over 50 million in the same timeframe?

Nah.

 

[icespide]

$300 domestic in a single weekend is not happening with this movie.

There's no way. A whole bunch of the factors that made TFA's $248 (not even $250!) possible aren't even in play, most importantly the theater counts and the number of screenings Thursday through Sunday morning.

Batman v. Superman isn't running 24 straight hours of nonstop showings.

Besides which, anyone can tell the level of anticipation, while high, isn't anywhere near the level of anticipation for Force Awakens, which was regularly making headlines. Not entertainment news headlines - actual headlines.

So we don't have the level of anticipation, we don't have the theaters, and we don't have the screenings. And that's just to reach the same level Star Wars did. People in here thinking we're set up for Batman v. Superman to beat Star Wars by over 50 million in the same timeframe?

Nah.

BvS is also about 15 minutes longer than the force awakens

 

[IconGrist]

Nobody expects $300m. It's just trying to make whatever BvS does earn sound disappointing.

$140m or less will be a disappointment. Anything above is just fine.

 

[Shaanyboi]

Still haven't watched The Flash TV series, or Supergirl for that matter, yet. They look right up my alley.

Flash is fantastic, particularly once Reverse Flash comes in.

Supergirl is a bit shaky in quality and presentation, but the actresses for Kara and Cat Grant are fantastic in their roles.

 

[Ahasverus]

I thought Supergirl was going to be shit but it's the shit. The Kara actress is like the cutest girl in television, I want to hug her so much.

 

[generic_username]

I thought Supergirl was going to be shit but it's the shit. The Kara actress is like the cutest girl in television, I want to hug her so much.

Really? I watched the first two episodes and I could not stand it. Maybe I should give it a go.

 

[shintoki]

I think if it matches or beats The Dark Knight openings. It's a success.

If it doesn't get 400mil Domestic overall, it's most definitely a disappointment.

 

[BadAss2961]

I don't know if I know anyone who was completely enamored with Gamora but that's a topic for another day.

People completely enamored by GOTG characters is about as widespread as people memeing i'm here to talk to you about the Avengers initiative.

The movie made money but let's not get carried away.

Flash is fantastic, particularly once Reverse Flash comes in.

Supergirl is a bit shaky in quality and presentation, but the actresses for Karl and Cat Grant are fantastic in their roles.

I thought Supergirl was going to be shit but it's the shit. The Kara actress is like the cutest girl in television, I want to hug her so much.

I've tried everything CW, and Supergirl. They've done pretty well at shaping the title characters and the actors who play them, but the cheese is too much for me. Definitely for youngsters. I long for the day DC gets a TV universe capable of going on HBO. Not about being mature, but increasing the production value. Air it on Saturday nights and have that shit on repeat Sunday mornings like Tin Tin back in the day. Put them all over HBO Family.

 

[generic_username]

I think if it matches or beats The Dark Knight openings. It's a success.

If it doesn't get 400mil Domestic overall, it's most definitely a disappointment.

If it gets 400 million Domestic than we are looking at maybe a billion dollars at the box office. Could happen but the movie needs to be good. Reviews like Man of Steel could get it to 700 million or so. It needs that good WoM and good reviews to give it that extra push.

 

[Ahasverus]

Really? I watched the first two episodes and I could not stand it. Maybe I should give it a go.

Tbf I didn't watch the first episodes, I catched the show on a new year marathon around the episode with a weather guy. It's the humane drama which I find very cool.

Plus it has Marian Manhunter, I mean, how awesome is that.

 

[kswiston]

$300 domestic in a single weekend is not happening with this movie.

There's no way. A whole bunch of the factors that made TFA's $248 (not even $250!) possible aren't even in play, most importantly the theater counts and the number of screenings Thursday through Sunday morning.

Batman v. Superman isn't running 24 straight hours of nonstop showings.

Besides which, anyone can tell the level of anticipation, while high, isn't anywhere near the level of anticipation for Force Awakens, which was regularly making headlines. Not entertainment news headlines - actual headlines.

So we don't have the level of anticipation, we don't have the theaters, and we don't have the screenings. And that's just to reach the same level Star Wars did. People in here thinking we're set up for Batman v. Superman to beat Star Wars by over 50 million in the same timeframe?

Nah.

It was the Thursday previews gross that pushed Star Wars above and beyond Avengers and Jurassic World. It's regular Fri-Sun portion was just slightly higher.

BvS isn't getting nearly $60M in previews, even if that Friday is a holiday.

 

[generic_username]

It was the Thursday previews gross that pushed Star Wars above and beyond Avengers and Jurassic World. It's regular Fri-Sun portion was just slightly higher.

BvS isn't getting nearly $60M in previews, even if that Friday is a holiday.

Do you think it has a chance at hitting the billion dollar club?

 

[kswiston]

Do you think it has a chance at hitting the billion dollar club?

Sure. That club isn't extremely hard to hit these days. If Batman v Superman ends up in the $400M range domestic, $600M overseas isn't going to be too hard to pull off. The Dark Knight Rises made close to $640M four years ago without 3D. Superhero films in China pull in 2-3x what they used to make 4 years ago, and both TDKR and Man of Steel did pretty well in China. $150M in China for BvS wouldn't be an unreasonable guess. Age of Ultron did $235M last year.

 

[Vault Dweller 111]

This dude actually thinks BvS will make $300 million opening weekend?


.....


I can't even....

 

[generic_username]

Sure. That club isn't extremely hard to hit these days. If Batman v Superman ends up in the $400M range domestic, $600M overseas isn't going to be too hard to pull off. The Dark Knight Rises made close to $640M four years ago without 3D. Superhero films in China pull in 2-3x what they used to make 4 years ago, and both TDKR and Man of Steel did pretty well in China. $150M in China for BvS wouldn't be an unreasonable guess. Age of Ultron did $235M last year.

Thank you. That is good to know. Also one last question - What is your prediction for its box office opening weekend world wide.It is releasing in China simultaneously so could it hit 400 million opening weekend worldwide?

 

[Future Foundation]

This dude actually thinks BvS will make $300 million opening weekend?


.....


I can't even....

It happens. Same thing with Star Wars - there are always overzealous people when it comes to this stuff.

 

[kswiston]

Thank you. That is good to know. Also one last question - What is your prediction for its box office opening weekend world wide.It is releasing in China simultaneously so could it hit 400 million opening weekend worldwide?

It depends on the domestic weekend, but that doesn't seem unreasonable. Deadpool did $265M without China and without much of an established movie fanbase. A decent Chinese 3-day gross would have put that figure in the $330M range. So BvS doesn't have to be all that much bigger than Deadpool to hit $400M with its synced release.

 

[guek]

People completely enamored by GOTG characters is about as widespread as people memeing i'm here to talk to you about the Avengers initiative.

The movie made money but let's not get carried away.

Just because you shockingly didn't like a marvel movie as much as most people doesn't mean the statement isn't true. People in general loved the fuck out of the characters in GotG, Gamora being the weak link among the crew. That this is even questionable is almost as outlandish as arguing the MCU hasn't had any lasting pop cultural significance.

 

[Magwik]

Just because you shockingly didn't like a marvel movie as much as most people doesn't mean the statement isn't true. People in general loved the fuck out of the characters in GotG, Gamora being the weak link among the crew. That this is even questionable is almost as outlandish as arguing the MCU hasn't had any lasting pop cultural significance.

That's why there's still toy and shirts of GoTG still going around, right?

 

[guek]

That's why there's still toy and shirts of GoTG still going around, right?

Um...yes? But what does longevity of merchandising have to do with anything? People loved the fuck out of Avatar too, the lack of new merchandise in the absence of a sequel doesn't change that fact.

 

[Poodlestrike]

I'd say that people definitely liked the GotG characters a lot, and they picked up a fair few new fans, but idk about "resonated," and I definitely don't know about mentioning them in the same breath as Superman, who has basically transcended comic books and even pop culture at this point.