Support NeoGAF

[gundamkyoukai]

That's ... not what I'm hearing about Sony, from what little I am hearing. Nothing super concrete there though.

I know this MS thread but what are you hearing from Sony .
Edit i see you answer i wonder if Sony using there 1st party right now more than 3rd party devs when it comes to spec stuff .

 

[KageMaru]

Difference is negligible. Coming from someone who doesn't have a 360 btw

For some reason it's difficult for some people to understand that there really isn't a most powerful system this gen, instead it's two systems with different strengths.

The beautiful thing about next gen is that even if there were a difference of 500GFLOPs, it wouldn't make much of a difference to the point where most people would even know it.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

I know this MS thread but what are you hearing from Sony .

I'm pretty sure he just said the problem with Sony is nobody seems to be hearing much lol

 

[Gorillaz]

I just think in sonys case only key people kno whats up like 1st party and EA...Especially EA

MS is just a little more open bout it.

 

[AzaK]

But Nintendo doesn't care. Microsoft and Sony can't risk to be overshadowed in terms of specs by each other.

Heh. E3 gonna be fun this year..

Hmm "fun" isn't what I'd call it. More like pain, anguish, frustration, hate, and stunned silence from everyone.

 

[AstroNut325]

Not hearing much doesn't mean it should inspire confidence nor reduce it right?

Sony doesn't have a good track record for successful system launches. Look at the PS3, PSP GO, and the Vita. That is probably what doesn't inspire confidence. At least to US developers.

 

[B.O.O.M]

Can anyone in china leak PS4 stuff already!? lol

 

[yon61]

We have to realise that Sony are in a very strained position financially so we shouldn't be too surprised about the lack of confidence with PS4.

 

[gofreak]

Not hearing much doesn't mean it should inspire confidence nor reduce it right?

Well it might reduce confidence about when a system might launch in a primary target market for games you're working on...for example. Sony's probably being, or has been, cagey about when PS4 will launch in the US, whereas Microsoft has probably been talking with certainty about launch plans for that market. Things like that could easily give the impression of one company being on top of things whilst another is still figuring things out. Asides from the difference in primary market (Sony launching first in Japan, MS in US), if there's a schedule lag of a few months it would add to that picture too.

 

[HoodWinked]

i had a feeling this would happen MS not scared to aim for the fences. MS has a history of investing billions into dead end business ventures.

xbox360 has been the one major success and they are going to be perfectly content to take a huge loss per console at launch, they probably see the weakness of sony's current financials being so spread so thin.

 

[cyberheater]

Is the lack of information about PS4 due to timelines and that potentially, it's running quite late relative to the development cycle of Xbox720?

 

[Karak]

Is the lack of information about PS4 due to timelines and that potentially, it's running quite late relative to the development cycle of Xbox720?

Despite what some people want to think. It isn't that crazy to assume one is behind the other. Whether due to internal reasons or otherwise. Though I am sure there are some ninja's about. Additionally, console makers have been surprised by the competition before, or not offered the same tech before.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

Is the lack of information about PS4 due to timelines and that potentially, it's running quite late relative to the development cycle of Xbox720?

wasn't there a rumour a bit back that indicated it could be ahead of 720?

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

Can anyone in china leak PS4 stuff already!? lol

Make's you wonder why that is the case hey? I mean the CPU/GPU are almost certainly made in the same fabs and yet nothing on PS4...but every man and his dog are talking about Durango.

Maybe it's MS approved leaks to build hype?

 

[Proelite]

wasn't there a rumour a bit back that indicated it could be ahead of 720?

According to Seeetvar26, who is legit, the silicon was ahead, but was delayed 6 months. Resulting both being at the same place.

 

[DieH@rd]

wasn't there a rumour a bit back that indicated it could be ahead of 720?

Yes it was. But we know nothing official. It may be launched in late 2013 for all we know...

 

[KageMaru]

Well it might reduce confidence about when a system might launch in a primary target market for games you're working on...for example. Sony's probably being, or has been, cagey about when PS4 will launch in the US, whereas Microsoft has probably been talking with certainty about launch plans for that market. Things like that could easily give the impression of one company being on top of things whilst another is still figuring things out. Asides from the difference in primary market (Sony launching first in Japan, MS in US), if there's a schedule lag of a few months it would add to that picture too.

Was thinking the same. Though I still think they should skip launching in Japan first and launch in the US this fall.

Is the lack of information about PS4 due to timelines and that potentially, it's running quite late relative to the development cycle of Xbox720?

The impression that I got from the last set of rumors was that Sony was slightly ahead with their development and it was MS that was behind, at least by a month.

 

[Aguirre]

Despite what some people want to think. It isn't that crazy to assume one is behind the other. Whether due to internal reasons or otherwise. Though I am sure there are some ninja's about. Additionally, console makers have been surprised by the competition before, or not offered the same tech before.

xbox will, as with the 360, release first. ps4 will follow after this new xbox

just reading the 360 wiki, ms says the 360 is good til 2015. god.

 

[Hiro_Kunimi_80]

I'm willing to bet it will last at least 8-10 years.

to get rid of launch stock qty ?

probably ..

 

[2+2=5]

oh man, is it going to be 360 PS3 Wii part 2?

Did you really expect something different? Only brainwashed nintendo fanboys(i'm accusing noone) can really think of a wiiu at the same level as ps4 and nextbox. Saying that wiiu is nextgen(power wise at least) is like admitting to live in the nintendo colored world knowing nothing about 7 years old ps360 and current pc games.

The only difference is that supporting the same resolutions of the ps4 and nextbox the wiiu could get some 2d and non-intensive 3d dd games of the ps4 and nextbox

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

According to Seeetvar26, who is legit, the silicon was ahead, but was delayed 6 months. Resulting both being at the same place.

ah yeah. So it's all nothingness at this point.

 

[phosphor112]

I was going off of the listed specs for their power supplies, not their estimated draw. And I wasn't talking about piston, because those specs hadn't been released yet.

PS3 had a 380w PSU but ran at ~200. Is this what you are saying? It'll be similar? Because Wii U PSU is rated 50 (power draw is 30).. so... you listed some numbers that were the power draw, and others PSU numbers.

Or, are you comparing it to the PS3 slim (and ultra slim) and 360 S models?

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

PS3 had a 380w PSU but ran at ~200. Is this what you are saying? It'll be similar? Because Wii U PSU is rated 50 (power draw is 30).. so... you listed some numbers that were the power draw, and others PSU numbers.

Or, are you comparing it to the PS3 slim (and ultra slim) and 360 S models?

Just fyi, Wii U is rated at 75W afaik.

 

[sleepykyo]

Thanks for clarifying. Good to know, but I hope they do go after some more permanent exclusives. Mass Effect was a huge loss for them, even with all the work they put in for the first one.

What loss? ME did wonders for the system. Same thing is going to happen with Destiny. It'll push a lot of 720s and it'll be a non issue with the sequel goes mp.

 

[cyberheater]

According to Seeetvar26, who is legit, the silicon was ahead, but was delayed 6 months. Resulting both being at the same place.

So if true and if fab yields are good then it's going to be a marketing decision when they are going to launch.

I hope they both manage to launch this year in all main geos.

 

[KageMaru]

Did you really expect something different? Only brainwashed nintendo fanboys(i'm accusing noone) can really think of a wiiu at the same level as ps4 and nextbox. Saying that wiiu is nextgen(power wise at least) is like admitting to live in the nintendo colored world knowing nothing about 7 years old ps360 and current pc games.

The only difference is that supporting the same resolutions of the ps4 and nextbox the wiiu could get some 2d and non-intensive 3d dd games of the ps4 and nextbox

Yeah I thought it was funny back when some people thought the Wii-U would be able to keep up with the PS4/720. Sad thing is there are still some people who think it will do a better job at keeping up than the Wii did this gen.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

What a beastly console.

If the specs are true, with a potential Forza 5, SW 1313, Watch Dogs, Alan Wake 2 at launch....

GODDAMN day 1 hnnnnnnnggggg

No chance to get all those blockbuster games at launch, or most of them. Watch Dogs sounds like an epic IP Ubi will have been working on for years, their AssCreed for next-gen. Why put something like that out at launch when the user base is not even a million? We'll see games like Watch Dogs in middle to late 2014, just my gut feeling. Probably the same with 1313. I could see Forza 5 at launch or launch window, though.

 

[mr_nothin]

Uuuuuuhhh... you have no idea what you're talking about.

2gigs of game-dedicate RAM is already too much. Developers have been working with very little and doing quite a lot with it. 8gigs is just a stupid luxury that's just going to add to the cost towards the consumer for very little gain.

CPU and GPU will bottleneck the console way before RAM.

Wtf!?
Resolution + AF + AA + some form of Alpha AA and VRam starts to ramp up a lot. Add in high res textures to that and you dont know wtf you're talking about. 2GB of RAM is too much lol, oh wow.

 

[AzaK]

Just look at the Wii-U with it's pathetic amount of bandwidth. There would be little point in shrinking the OS with that system since you wouldn't be able to use it all for gaming.

Not necessarily. You can still use the memory as a form of cache that's TONNES faster then the optical or HDD (In the case of the 720).

 

[Can Crusher]

According to Seeetvar26, who is legit, the silicon was ahead, but was delayed 6 months. Resulting both being at the same place.

Isn't this a fab problem though? Apparently MS is filling up all these factories to solve the yeld problems.

In a sense, Sony may be behind in terms of delivering final devkits or something like it, but in terms of design maybe they are not behind schedule.

Hell if I know though.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

So if true and if fab yields are good then it's going to be a marketing decision when they are going to launch.

I hope they both manage to launch this year in all main geos.

I still think sony will launch in japan + US in 2013, and europe in 2014. While MS launches everywhere in 2013. Sony probably feels they can afford to launch later in europe, since they have em in the bag.

 

[phosphor112]

Just fyi, Wii U is rated at 75W afaik.

Ah ok. I'm not sure what his numbers mean then, because they are all over the place.

Launch PS3 was 380, but all the 380 models had PS2 BC, and once they dropped it, it went down to 280 but power draw was still upper hundreds...

 

[Mr Swine]

Why are people expecting the AMD Jaguar CPU (if it has it) if clocked at 1.6GHZ to be something fantastic when the latest AMD CPU is barely faster than the Phenom II that came out 2009?

That is really underwhelming that the next gen Xbox is going to have such a weak cpu

 

[Zeal]

If these reports are true, and I think they are, this thing is going to be a beast. Thank god you have not went the path of WiiU, MS.

Next-gen is about to begin.

Why are people expecting the AMD Jaguar CPU (if it has it) if clocked at 1.6GHZ to be something fantastic when the latest AMD CPU is barely faster than the Phenom II that came out 2009?

That is really underwhelming that the next gen Xbox is going to have such a weak cpu

8 cores clocked at that (I expect even higher), working in conjunction with the GPU is going to be able to produce some amazing visuals. I don't know what you're talking about here.

 

[aegies]

PS3 had a 380w PSU but ran at ~200. Is this what you are saying? It'll be similar? Because Wii U PSU is rated 50 (power draw is 30).. so... you listed some numbers that were the power draw, and others PSU numbers.

Or, are you comparing it to the PS3 slim (and ultra slim) and 360 S models?

Talking about power draw for next gen, it's about the max amount of power devs can expect to be able to draw, not what the PSU is rated at. So I would expect a fairly massive power brick in the next xbox. We'll see if Sony can engineer a decent internal solution again.

 

[derFeef]

Why are people expecting the AMD Jaguar CPU (if it has it) if clocked at 1.6GHZ to be something fantastic when the latest AMD CPU is barely faster than the Phenom II that came out 2009?

That is really underwhelming that the next gen Xbox is going to have such a weak cpu

We don't know if it's jaguar.

 

[phosphor112]

If these reports are true, and I think they are, this thing is going to be a beast. Thank god you have not went the path of WiiU, MS.

Next-gen is about to begin.

Calm down Chief.

 

[Proelite]

Why are people expecting the AMD Jaguar CPU (if it has it) if clocked at 1.6GHZ to be something fantastic when the latest AMD CPU is barely faster than the Phenom II that came out 2009?

That is really underwhelming that the next gen Xbox is going to have such a weak cpu

Because they will be 8 of them, in a console environment.

 

[Eideka]

That is really underwhelming that the next gen Xbox is going to have such a weak cpu

We can hope that final specs will be better in that regard. The GPU should be good enough.

 

[falconzss]

I still sony will launch in japan + US in 2013, and europe in 2014. While MS launches everywhere in 2013. Sony probably feels they can afford to launch later in europe, since they have em in the bag.

*weeps*

 

[cyberheater]

I still think sony will launch in japan + US in 2013, and europe in 2014. While MS launches everywhere in 2013. Sony probably feels they can afford to launch later in europe, since they have em in the bag.

Sony would have to be really stupid to launch in the Eurozone in 2014 if MS manages 2013.

So, 2014 in Europe for Sony it is then...

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

Isn't this a fab problem though? Apparently MS is feeling up all these factories to solve the yeld problems.

In a sense, Sony may be behind in terms of delivering final devkits or something like it, but in terms of design maybe they are not behind schedule.

Hell if I know though.

This is a pure guess but I wonder if it is because Sony wait for actual early chips for devkits?

Looking back at the PS3 it had SLI 6800 GPUs but a 2.4 Cell and I guess the PS1 and PS2 being custom had to have the actual chips in their devkits?

 

[phosphor112]

Talking about power draw for next gen, it's about the max amount of power devs can expect to be able to draw, not what the PSU is rated at. So I would expect a fairly massive power brick in the next xbox. We'll see if Sony can engineer a decent internal solution again.

Ah ok. Then we shall be pleased. I think the PSU will be internal for PS4 again. Sony has the sleakest designs of any company. Hell, their "power bricks" for their latest laptops are tiny and efficient because they don't want a cinder block attached to their laptops.

 

[onQ123]

Why are people expecting the AMD Jaguar CPU (if it has it) if clocked at 1.6GHZ to be something fantastic when the latest AMD CPU is barely faster than the Phenom II that came out 2009?

That is really underwhelming that the next gen Xbox is going to have such a weak cpu

GPGPU!

 

[Can Crusher]

Sony doesn't have anything in the bag. Maybe Japan if Wii U under delivers there in the log run.

360 gained marketshare in Europe this gen, significantly so when compared to Xbox 1. And MS is probably be firing on all cylinders when it comes to U.S and Europe, that's why they brought Phil Harrison on board.

Sony will take MS very seriously.

This is a pure guess but I wonder if it is because Sony wait for actual early chips for devkits?

Looking back at the PS3 it had SLI 6800 GPUs but a 2.4 Cell and I guess the PS1 and PS2 being custom had to have the actual chips in their devkits?

Rumors point to a more pragmatic approach by Sony when it comes to CPU and GPU design(It isn't bad news btw), or should I say a more "off the shelve" approach. Their big focus seems to be on memory bandwith, so I'm feeling they looked at AMD's roadmap (after supercell project and Intel project were canned) and cherry picked, worked with them to suit their needs and their memory bandwith plan.

MS for example, was already working with AMD to produce custom silicon long before it, and also evaluating Power PC tech with IBM. But unlike last gen, MS wasn't ready to hear IBM say "Well....we can't do what you want after all and so we are going to have to cook up something quick". Yes, that happened last gen, and so they didn't put all their eggs in one basket.

 

[jbug617]

I want Microsoft to address Gold membership. I want something similar to PS+

 

[Maximilian E.]

Why are people expecting the AMD Jaguar CPU (if it has it) if clocked at 1.6GHZ to be something fantastic when the latest AMD CPU is barely faster than the Phenom II that came out 2009?

That is really underwhelming that the next gen Xbox is going to have such a weak cpu

What?
8 cores, 16 threads, coupled with a custom Gpu, with 8gb ram.. In a closed environment.
It will be able to pull off some spectacular results..

 

[jeff_rigby]

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1691919&postcount=17709

Saw a nice reply from gamespot's thread

"Specs also leaked on the 8th of Jan"

And the AMD NDA was Dec 17 or 1+7=8. 8870M information was NDA till Dec 18. Lots of 8s but probably coincidence.

 

[Corky]

I want Microsoft to address Gold membership. I want something similar to PS+

It's nice to want things. Unless they're actually going the route of PS+ which is a darn good service I'm staying away from Gold. Wouldn't surprise me if the "gold-lock" went further than "just" MP.

"You can't access Bloody Palace in DMC5 on a Silver Account"

 

[phosphor112]

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1691919&postcount=17709

And the AMD NDA was Dec 17 or 1+7=8. 8870M information was NDA till Dec 18. Lots of 8s but probably coincidence.

Don't make me post the Aliens picture.