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Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U DLC |OT2| Lucas comes out of Nowhere!

P

PadWarrior

Member
NO1ob3z.jpg

As a Greninja user feels good to own these
 
B

Boney

Banned
Biggest system wide change I'd like is changing projectiles priority.

God damn tired of smacking shit like Luigi's fireballs and ZSS uncharged shots and bouncing back. It's especially annoying when you're hitting Luigi's fireballs with like 12% move and being sent back, making it an effective strategy to get hit by it so you have enough time to counter Luigi's run in.

It don't make no sense

It's never happening though.

I wish it were knockback based
Or at least it was a 4-5% differential.
 
V

Varjet

Member
Boney said:
Biggest system wide change I'd like is changing projectiles priority.

God damn tired of smacking shit like Luigi's fireballs and ZSS uncharged shots and bouncing back. It's especially annoying when you're hitting Luigi's fireballs with like 12% move and being sent back, making it an effective strategy to get hit by it so you have enough time to counter Luigi's run in.

It don't make no sense

It's never happening though.

I wish it were knockback based
Or at least it was a 4-5% differential.
Click to expand...

Adding to this, Samus's fully charged Charge Shot getting canceled out by stuff like turnips and bombs is really annoying.
But if I could get one system change it would probably be the inability to grab airborne opponents.

I was just playing on For Glory and after 15 seconds my opponent decides to suicide. Look up his profile message... "I hate spammers!".
I was playing Ike. Like, what.
 
C

Cronox

Banned
NamikazeBurst said:
He is the one replay I knew I wanted to save. I don't want to go through my other ones, so no idea if any of them are good. But the first kill in this one was worth it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALJL41ixGJc
Click to expand...

Only one? I save basically anything where I outplayed someone and got a bair kill. I'll probably have to go back and clean out less notable ones I've uploaded at some point. Almost all the view counts on my videos are from me. I can't help but go back and watch them occasionally. I fucking love bair kills.
 
N

NamikazeBurst

Member
Cronox said:
Only one? I save basically anything where I outplayed someone and got a bair kill. I'll probably have to go back and clean out less notable ones I've uploaded at some point. Almost all the view counts on my videos are from me. I can't help but go back and watch them occasionally. I fucking love bair kills.
Click to expand...

I have quite a few replays saved, but I don't remember which ones are worth uploading. I am not using my Wii U right now, so maybe I will just start uploading random ones.
 
K

Karsticles

Member
Shamrock7r said:
I hope they at the very least reduce Lucas' recovery frames on pkthunder and pk2 to Ness' level. No reason why it should be longer
Click to expand...
Lucas' PK Thunder is such a stronger harassment tool. It definitely needs more recovery frames. That thing devours shields.

However, the current recovery frames are pretty absurd.
 
R

Ricky 7

Member
Apparently Ryu got buffed in the last update but it went unnoticed until recently. Something to do with moves with hitlag modifiers being safer on shield. Since a lot of Ryu's moves have hitlag modifiers some of his moves are more safer on shield now. I think this affects other characters as well with hitlag modifier moves?
 
B

Boney

Banned
Was that first stick against ZSS worth it nami

Ricky 7 said:
Apparently Ryu got buffed in the last update but it went unnoticed until recently. Something to do with moves with hitlag modifiers being safer on shield. Since a lot of Ryu's moves have hitlag modifiers some of his moves are more safer on shield now. I think this affects other characters as well with hitlag modifier moves?
Click to expand...
I read something about concerning Charizard. Not much evidence so I didn't pay too much attention
 
W

Wyndstryker

Member
I tend to replay spike kills or very early stock kills or fast kills. Once un awhile I get a good match in the process.

I shoukd have at least 10 uploads tonight
 
R

Ricky 7

Member
Boney said:
Was that first stick against ZSS worth it nami


I read something about concerning Charizard. Not much evidence so I didn't pay too much attention
Click to expand...

Not much evidence concerning Charizard or the hitlag modifier change in general? I have no idea if this hitlag modifier thing is true or not.
 
MagiusNecros

MagiusNecros

Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
Karsticles said:
Because characters that force everyone to play the game on their terms suck.
Click to expand...

While I agree since a lot of what I see endgame is a whole bunch of Sheik. Wario vectoring just worked for him.

Meanwhile playing as the heavies you can make one mistake and characters like Sheik or Yoshi just dominate you and there goes a stock.

So basically the characters I like playing as and have some amount of skill using basically have to wait for a mistake or create one and that's when the game becomes tedium.
 
C

Cronox

Banned
NamikazeBurst said:
Okay, I uploaded three more replays. Take a look if you care to.

Donkey Kong vs. Bowser
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwNZMifGCz0
(For this one, I actually thought the Bowser was good because the match beforehand he was punishing me with OoS up-B, and doing smart Bowser stuff.)
Click to expand...

Watched this one cause there wasn't a Yoshi involved. As to your comment, the Smash games can really make otherwise good players look terrible based off a series of bad decisions in the face of the other player's momentum. Many of the people I have videos of on my Smash youtube account aren't bad players, and maybe even won a match or two, but when the momentum is against you it's hard to reset it. It's the reason sometimes someone who loses every time with their main can switch to Ganondorf and beat me. The indignance of being hit by Ganondorf leads me to DI in and get hit some more, and Ganondorf only needs me to make a few bad decisions before taking a stock.

I've gotten better at resetting momentum after losing my first stock, I've clutched out a lot of matches lately where I got momentumed or SD'd on my first stock, there's an element of ego that has to be under control - like in Zero's earlier videos where he'd say (paraphrasing) "so we lost our first stock, but we can come back." Smash 4 has a lot of systems that work towards making comebacks easier, but facing the morale loss of losing the first stock to an opponent who's barely taken any hits takes a certain attitude, and is not necessarily sustainable from moment to moment. For me, anyway.

Too bad we can't communicate slightly more complex things on FG, if I could make a "You'reDoingaLotOfThingsRight" profile I would. Because a lot of players there are just a few adjustments away from being good. But in the meantime they can look like they barely know how to play the game in a replay because the things they aren't doing are getting taken advantage of.
 
MagiusNecros

MagiusNecros

Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
Cronox said:
Watched this one cause there wasn't a Yoshi involved. As to your comment, the Smash games can really make otherwise good players look terrible based off a series of bad decisions in the face of the other player's momentum. Many of the people I have videos of on my Smash youtube account aren't bad players, and maybe even won a match or two, but when the momentum is against you it's hard to reset it. It's the reason sometimes someone who loses every time with their main can switch to Ganondorf and beat me. The indignance of being hit by Ganondorf leads me to DI in and get hit some more, and Ganondorf only needs me to make a few bad decisions before taking a stock.

I've gotten better at resetting momentum after losing my first stock, I've clutched out a lot of matches lately where I got momentumed or SD'd on my first stock, there's an element of ego that has to be under control - like in Zero's earlier videos where he'd say (paraphrasing) "so we lost our first stock, but we can come back." Smash 4 has a lot of systems that work towards making comebacks easier, but facing the morale loss of losing the first stock to an opponent who's barely taken any hits takes a certain attitude, and is not necessarily sustainable from moment to moment. For me, anyway.

Too bad we can't communicate slightly more complex things on FG, if I could make a "You'reDoingaLotOfThingsRight" profile I would. Because a lot of players there are just a few adjustments away from being good. But in the meantime they can look like they barely know how to play the game in a replay because the things they aren't doing are getting taken advantage of.
Click to expand...

There is also a case of getting tired from repeated play. There are times that I look like a FG scrub because I get tired out after several matches of precise inputs involving shield grabs, pivot grabs, alignment with dair spikes, Up OoS Fortress and what have you.

Demoralization from swift defeats can also effect how you play. And then there are some people on FG who literally gave up.
 
N

NamikazeBurst

Member
Boney said:
Was that first stick against ZSS worth it nami
Click to expand...

The first stock was definitely worth it. The despair they must've felt to fight against an opponent that doesn't care if they throw almost a whole stock away just for a kill must have been high. Did you watch the Fox one?

Cronox said:
Watched this one cause there wasn't a Yoshi involved. As to your comment, the Smash games can really make otherwise good players look terrible based off a series of bad decisions in the face of the other player's momentum. Many of the people I have videos of on my Smash youtube account aren't bad players, and maybe even won a match or two, but when the momentum is against you it's hard to reset it. It's the reason sometimes someone who loses every time with their main can switch to Ganondorf and beat me. The indignance of being hit by Ganondorf leads me to DI in and get hit some more, and Ganondorf only needs me to make a few bad decisions before taking a stock.

I've gotten better at resetting momentum after losing my first stock, I've clutched out a lot of matches lately where I got momentumed or SD'd on my first stock, there's an element of ego that has to be under control - like in Zero's earlier videos where he'd say (paraphrasing) "so we lost our first stock, but we can come back." Smash 4 has a lot of systems that work towards making comebacks easier, but facing the morale loss of losing the first stock to an opponent who's barely taken any hits takes a certain attitude, and is not necessarily sustainable from moment to moment. For me, anyway.

Too bad we can't communicate slightly more complex things on FG, if I could make a "You'reDoingaLotOfThingsRight" profile I would. Because a lot of players there are just a few adjustments away from being good. But in the meantime they can look like they barely know how to play the game in a replay because the things they aren't doing are getting taken advantage of.
Click to expand...

You should enjoy a Sheik losing more than your hate for Yoshi!

I agree that replays and just a couple matches don't allow you to determine a player's skill level, but I don't think that Bowser was actually good from playing him. A lot of his moves that hit me the first match were mostly from me playing unsafe or thinking they will play like you or Karsticles. They did a lot of unsafe dair, and once I realized they would do it almost every time I was below them, I started punishing them for it.

People can also play random characters against me and win. There was a Pit that was just smashing, F tilting, and using side-B, and I for some reason wasn't able to beat him in the first match, The next match went a lot different, but sometimes I can get really frustrated and not adjust, even while being able to win. I am sure the same applies to a lot of other people. I also make a lot of bad mistakes against characters like Ganondorf, and getting randomly up smashed and trying to make up for it quickly can just make me lose the entire match. There are Ganondorfs who would constantly down-B, and I knew they would do it every time, but I still fell for it.

The tag system is hit and miss. Yesterday I had some guy fight me, and when I accidentally used down-B off the side of the stage to kill myself, he switched his tag to "Whoops" and "Lol". When I won the next game, he switched to "Nice", and the next one I switched to "GG" after winning, and he switched to "GG" and then "RESPECT". You can't really tell someone how to improve with the tag system other then telling them to add you, and then conversing through Miiverse. Increasing the character limit on the tag system would just allow the bad people to make longer insults.
 
C

Cronox

Banned
MagiusNecros said:
There is also a case of getting tired from repeated play. There are times that I look like a FG scrub because I get tired out after several matches of precise inputs involving shield grabs, pivot grabs, alignment with dair spikes, Up OoS Fortress and what have you.

Demoralization from swift defeats can also effect how you play. And then there are some people on FG who literally gave up.
Click to expand...

When I meet a character I find annoying on FG I usually only have the patience for a couple matches, afterwards my performance goes down significantly. I know if I try my hardest I could beat a great Yoshi for example, but I have to be so completely on my game to do that. I have to basically win the match off of hard reads while the other player just goes about their bread and butter, spending no more energy against me than most of the cast. It takes no energy to toss out eggs, but it takes a toll on me to shield them while anticipating Yoshi's knowledge that I must shield the eggs and avoiding or stuffing their followups. Every single egg that hits puts me in a tech-chase scenario in which Bowser often can get hit on a successful tech or at least loses ground. Between projectiles and when you have no choice but to steel your nerves to instantly react when an opponent uses an approach because there's nothing else to do, yeah it gets a little tiring.

Though I'd say I can tell the difference between a tired good player and scrubbier players. Things like how they recover, how they followup etc don't change even when tired.
 
P

PhoenixDawn

Member
So Nintendo's solution to people complaining that 2 stock 3 minutes had a high chance of going to timeout was to lower the stock to 1 rather than slightly increase the time limit.. Not that a 1 stock rapid fire tourney is bad, but it's about to be filled with suicide characters left and right.
 
T

TheDinoman

Member
I kinda understand why regular tournaments only have three minutes for each round. They're just trying to keep the pace of the events going. When the round you're in ends and you win, you have to sit around and wait for the other players' matches to finish up. They probably didn't want people sitting around and waiting all day for the tourney to continue.
 
C

Cronox

Banned
NamikazeBurst said:
You should enjoy a Sheik losing more than your hate for Yoshi!
Click to expand...

Ha that welling feeling of unfairness with Yoshi doesn't hit me much when playing Sheik. If they get me with a bouncing fish or uair for the stock that's on me. You can't play Sheik lazily, I appreciate that the Sheik is putting as much effort into the match as I am.

I agree that replays and just a couple matches don't allow you to determine a player's skill level, but I don't think that Bowser was actually good from playing him. A lot of his moves that hit me the first match were mostly from me playing unsafe or thinking they will play like you or Karsticles. They did a lot of unsafe dair, and once I realized they would do it almost every time I was below them, I started punishing them for it.

People can also play random characters against me and win. There was a Pit that was just smashing, F tilting, and using side-B, and I for some reason wasn't able to beat him in the first match, The next match went a lot different, but sometimes I can get really frustrated and not adjust, even while being able to win. I am sure the same applies to a lot of other people. I also make a lot of bad mistakes against characters like Ganondorf, and getting randomly up smashed and trying to make up for it quickly can just make me lose the entire match. There are Ganondorfs who would constantly down-B, and I knew they would do it every time, but I still fell for it.

The tag system is hit and miss. Yesterday I had some guy fight me, and when I accidentally used down-B off the side of the stage to kill myself, he switched his tag to "Whoops" and "Lol". When I won the next game, he switched to "Nice", and the next one I switched to "GG" after winning, and he switched to "GG" and then "RESPECT". You can't really tell someone how to improve with the tag system other then telling them to add you, and then conversing through Miiverse. Increasing the character limit on the tag system would just allow the bad people to make longer insults.
Click to expand...

The Ganondorf stuff is really strange to me, sometimes I think I have it figured out but then another person switches to him and I die to scrubby 'Dorf play again. What's probably happening is I overextend on my first stock cause I want to style on him for disrespecting me with his character choice, then get impatient on my second stock when I lose the first one. Ganondorf's down b is surprisingly fast on startup, I was having trouble shielding it on reaction not long ago myself.

I've thought about giving general advice like "StopRolling," or something, but I doubt it'll be useful. Everyone interprets everyone else's profiles names as being passive aggressive at best, regardless of my good intentions. Whatever.

In the meantime, too bad about this not being a new patch eh...
 
N

NamikazeBurst

Member
Cronox said:
Ha that welling feeling of unfairness with Yoshi doesn't hit me much when playing Sheik. If they get me with a bouncing fish or uair for the stock that's on me. You can't play Sheik lazily, I appreciate that the Sheik is putting as much effort into the match as I am.



The Ganondorf stuff is really strange to me, sometimes I think I have it figured out but then another person switches to him and I die to scrubby 'Dorf play again. What's probably happening is I overextend on my first stock cause I want to style on him for disrespecting me with his character choice, then get impatient on my second stock when I lose the first one. Ganondorf's down b is surprisingly fast on startup, I was having trouble shielding it on reaction not long ago myself.

I've thought about giving general advice like "StopRolling," or something, but I doubt it'll be useful. Everyone interprets everyone else's profiles names as being passive aggressive at best, regardless of my good intentions. Whatever.

In the meantime, too bad about this not being a new patch eh...
Click to expand...

We've both played Sheik, and I don't agree with Sheik needing to put as much effort. Sure, she needs effort to play well, but she still has guaranteed combos and 50/50 situations. One big tip for playing against Yoshi is to shield, especially at higher percents. The only thing that Yoshi can kill you when you shield is a down-B, and that is easily predicted. Neutral B only allows for damage and has no kill set-ups because you can always jump and air dodge out, and the same goes for his throws. Never jump right away when Yoshi forward throws. Other than that, you shouldn't be afraid to shield against Yoshi.

I saw some guy have his tag as "LessRolls" for his previous opponent. That seems like a nicer way to put it, and when I thought he was going to be a nice opponent when I saw that.
 
S

Shamrock7r

Member
Karsticles said:
Lucas' PK Thunder is such a stronger harassment tool. It definitely needs more recovery frames. That thing devours shields.

However, the current recovery frames are pretty absurd.
Click to expand...

Ness' PK Thunder is still better for harassing, because Lucas' is so slow. Once you figure out Lucas, it is pretty easily avoidable for most characters unless you are in a bad spot recovering off stage.
 
J

JulianImp

Member
Shamrock7r said:
Ness' PK Thunder is still better for harassing, because Lucas' is so slow. Once you figure out Lucas, it is pretty easily avoidable for most characters unless you are in a bad spot recovering off stage.
Click to expand...

I'd be inclined to agree. Lucas' travels more slowly and has a considerably longer recovery time, so it tends to leave him open a lot more than Ness'.
 
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