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[hardcastlemccormick]

The general quality of the gaming side of this forum is abysmal. It's really no better than Gamefaqs, N4G or Gamspots' System Wars. It's just the same cast of characters bickering with each other about the same tired shit over and over again. It's really pathetic.

The saddest thing is not the fanboys themselves, but the poor moderation of what could be a much better forum.

/rant

These posts are worthless, elitist, and have no place on this forum. If you feel the quality of discussion is as bad as GameFAQs, congrats! You've done nothing to make it better and everything to make it even worse.

The NeoGAF moderation team is a group of volunteers who decide where to spend their time.

 

[The Jackdog]

Just checking, but are you referring to games with this comparison? There's no way they're going to cancel their 1st party games/games from hired devs just because they're dominating.

This never happened with the PS1, PS2, and it's not happening with the PS4 judging by the amount of 2015 games they already announced and the amount of unannounced 1st party games that are working on new AAA IPs.

You might have a point when it comes to the speed of firmware updates.

Neither, i meant it more as sony rests on their success and doesnt continue to develop strong first party support, strong OS updates, strong marketing and incentives for customers, etc.

 

[Arthr2ShdsJcksn]

I think It's been explained quite a few times why those two cases aren't really the same.

No two cases of anything are the same. Chaos theory babble babble....

Anyway, I didn't say that because I thought Pachter was right, but I think that its possible for the XBox to become the best selling console in America for a couple of months if they play their cards right. The PS4 is clearly going to be this generation's best seller worldwide, and most likely in America as well.

Personally, the MCC has made me think about getting an XboxOne, but I'll probably hold off until a future price cut. That collection is the best deal in gaming since the Orange Box (Ok, not as good, but almost). My PS4 is getting plenty of play right now and I'm pretty happy with that.

 

[Killroyskbg]

Enlighten me then.

 

[twobear]

What about throwing money at China?

I think we ought to wait until PS4 launches in China before we start praising it as the saviour of Xbone.

In any case, if you're an Xbone owner you should want MS to invest in their platform and improve the quality of its game offerings, not just take the same value proposition that has already been rejected in the rest of the world and try and flog it in new and exciting markets.

 

[Jack cw]

Did even read y2kev qoutes? Here's the summed part "Sales parity is IRRELEVANT to the consumer. Sales differential is the RESULT of competition."

This can't be said often enough.

 

[Ricky_R]

Neither, i meant it more as sony rests on their success and doesnt continue to develop strong first party support, strong OS updates, strong marketing and incentives for customers, etc.

Aside from strong OS updates, which were not a thing back then, did Sony rest on their success for any those on the PS2?

 

[Neuromancer]

The general quality of the gaming side of this forum is abysmal. It's really no better than Gamefaqs, N4G or Gamspots' System Wars. It's just the same cast of characters bickering with each other about the same tired shit over and over again. It's really pathetic.

The saddest thing is not the fanboys themselves, but the poor moderation of what could be a much better forum.

/rant

100% agreement

You guys are really elevating the level of discourse.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

Im not trying to argue im trying to figure out where you are getting this.

I know competition doesnt equal close sales but that doesnt mean close sales arent an indicator of how competitive a market is.

Say two NFL teams are playing. the sonys and the xboxes.

The score is 37-3. Sony takes out their QB and stops trying. Why should they? They are absolutely dominating. The game is boring as hell now. Everyone is leaving the stadium because no one is putting on a good show.

Now the xboxes start to mount a comeback. Score is 37-30, sony puts all their starters in, and the game because much more interesting to watch. Now we have something. Fans of football everywhere get a good time.

Same analogy works with cable companies. Right now in the US there are like 6 major ISPs right? So, with your argument, that domination can be good, if we just let Comcast run the internet for the whole country its gonna be great right? Because a single company dominating a market is okay.

Depends on who these companies are and their respective traits as well.

 

[Halph n Halph]

How popular do you think the UEFA Champions league is in Australia or NA?

I don't know about NA ,but worldwide its fairly well received.

 

[>-Baron-Spamedi-<]

Who cares if Singstar and LBP sell well? If you're any gamer worthy of that name, you'd obviously pick MCC and SO instead of those two.

Well I've been gaming since the Vectrex and the ZX Spectrum but I wouldn't thank you for anything Halo. I played 3 and 4 and they both bored the tits off me.

I'm getting Singstar for my partner cos she wants it despite having a terrible singing voice.
LBP I'm not bothered about.
SO looks like Saturday morning kids cartoons in game form. Maybe it'll be 'really fun'.
I've converted from Xbox 360 to PS4 this gen though and nothing Microsoft has done or announced has come close to making me interested in even considering buying the Xbox One.

I just thought it was interesting that you get to decide who is a real gamer and who isn't based solely on the crap that you like.

 

[Killer]

Well, I might see X1 sell better than PS4 in November. The console has better exclusives this fall. But i really doubt it in September.

 

[Zyae]

No, it isn't. God, re-quoting Y2kev, again.

can you articulate your own responses to my posts or are you going to keep using quotes that arent relevant.

 

[Description]

You guys are really elevating the level of discourse.

Perhaps his post lacked tact. But I don't think critiscm of the quality of the forum should be taboo as many posters make it out to be.

 

[Ricky_R]

No two cases of anything are the same. Chaos theory babble babble....

Anyway, I didn't say that because I thought Pachter was right, but I think that its possible for the XBox to become the best selling console in America for a couple of months if they play their cards right. The PS4 is clearly going to be this generation's best seller worldwide, and most likely in America as well.

Personally, the MCC has made me think about getting an XboxOne, but I'll probably hold off until a future price cut. That collection is the best deal in gaming since the Orange Box (Ok, not as good, but almost). My PS4 is getting plenty of play right now and I'm pretty happy with that.

Yeah, but you weren't talking about NA.

 

[CrazedProfessional]

I think we ought to wait until PS4 launches in China before we start praising it as the saviour of Xbone.

But Sony was only able to get a deal of 200k units a year to the Chinese Market whereas Microsoft got a deal somewhere in the realm of 3-4 million? Wasn't that launch pretty successful too?

Microsoft is throwing money everywhere, even in my small fuckoff Australian town but unlike previous generations, China is a potential factor. If Microsoft gets a foothold in there (and it's possible due to the Anti-Japanese attitudes that exist) then China could be a huge disruptor to your so-called impossible catch-up odds.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

"You know, sometimes, I make a prediction, and people go, 'Why Pach, why?' And I look at them and say, 'y not?' "

Spoiler

UK sales say it's not gonna happen.

 

[The Jackdog]

Aside from strong OS updates which were not a thing back then, did Sony rest on their success for any those on the PS2?

No, but microsoft did, and now sony is cleaning their clocks.

 

[Dragon]

Im not trying to argue im trying to figure out where you are getting this.

I know competition doesnt equal close sales but that doesnt mean close sales arent an indicator of how competitive a market is.

Say two NFL teams are playing. the sonys and the xboxes.

The score is 37-3. Sony takes out their QB and stops trying. Why should they? They are absolutely dominating. The game is boring as hell now. Everyone is leaving the stadium because no one is putting on a good show.

Now the xboxes start to mount a comeback. Score is 37-30, sony puts all their starters in, and the game because much more interesting to watch. Now we have something. Fans of football everywhere get a good time.

Same analogy works with cable companies. Right now in the US there are like 6 major ISPs right? So, with your argument, that domination can be good, if we just let Comcast run the internet for the whole country its gonna be great right? Because a single company dominating a market is okay.

Your analogy makes no sense.

Here's why it's wrong: Sony will continue to make money if they continue to dominate. A football team kicking the shit out of another football team for one particular game is not an appropriate comparison for this money. Sony is motivated by profits and sales projections, not by how much they're beating Microsoft by. I don't understand why this is hard to understand.

But Sony was only able to get a deal of 200k units a year to the Chinese Market whereas Microsoft got a deal somewhere in the realm of 3-4 million? Wasn't that launch pretty successful too?

Microsoft is throwing money everywhere, even in my small fuckoff Australian town but unlike previous generations, China is a potential factor. If Microsoft gets a foothold in there (and it's possible due to the Anti-Japanese attitudes that exist) then China could be a huge disruptor to your so-called impossible catch-up odds.

If you're going to mention China in a thread about potential NPD sales, I really don't know what to tell you besides your off base. Hinging the success of the Xbox brand outside of the UK/USA is not recommended. They have never done well outside of those two regions. In fact they do piss poor everywhere else.

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

When is NPD day?

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

Neither, i meant it more as sony rests on their success and doesnt continue to develop strong first party support, strong OS updates, strong marketing and incentives for customers, etc.

This isn't like football where you simply win the game and be done with it. Business is about making as much money as possible. Having the winning platform in your hand gives the company a platform to make even more money.

How do they do this? By expanding the market, expanding the brand, taking risks and kicking more ass.

Winning the competition matters very little to most companies; what they want is growth to satiate their stockholders.

can you articulate your own responses to my posts or are you going to keep using quotes that arent relevant.

Those quotes are extremely relevant and counter your argument.

 

[Jobbs]

The general quality of the gaming side of this forum is abysmal. It's really no better than Gamefaqs, N4G or Gamspots' System Wars. It's just the same cast of characters bickering with each other about the same tired shit over and over again. It's really pathetic.

The saddest thing is not the fanboys themselves, but the poor moderation of what could be a much better forum.

/rant

if you have a problem with the moderation you should contact them directly. complaining about it here is generally unwise.

 

[Zyae]

I actually do want a single console future, but that's not the point of this discussion.

If all it takes to get back into the good graces of the market is a few little sprinkles of nebulous concepts like "innovation" and "changes," then there are no consequences, no long-term strategies necessary. The reality is, things are a bit more severe than that.

Having several tiny little battles where nobody walks away bruised? That's not competition, that's a baby slap fight. It's what Sony and Microsoft have been locked into for a good decade, and it's only resulted in each other attempting to get "up to par." Snooze.

So would PSN exist as it does now if MS never came along in the video game industry? You know the answer to that is no

 

[Michael F. Assbender]

No, but microsoft did, and now sony is cleaning their clocks.

Not anymore. The console war has shifted.

Spoiler

According to VG24/7.

 

[Dragon]

So would PSN exist as it does now if MS never came along in the video game industry? You know the answer to that is no

I'm guessing you think something called Steam doesn't exist.

 

[siah]

No but I have no problem with one console having a commanding lead, either.

As long as it is yours, right?

 

[AyaisMUsikWhore]

Perhaps his post lacked tact. But I don't think critiscm of the quality of the forum should be taboo as many posters make it out to be.

But this is a sales thread and they are talking about the quality of the forum. I thought the rule was to contact a mod with concerns? Start a new thread about it if you feel that way. Then again, I don't think freedom to express or elaborate on things some of us may look to as "fanboyish", is a bad thing either.

 

[chicagocubsfan]

This would be surprising to me. But I expect Microsoft to win the holiday because of Halo and Overdrive anyway. I think Sony will have a very strong first quarter next year though.

 

[Night Angel]

As long as it is yours, right?

Thanks, I forgot to salt my eggs.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

So would PSN exist as it does now if MS never came along in the video game industry? You know the answer to that is no

It's not that simple. You're forgetting that the early 2000's were all about internet connectivity on everything, how the dot-com boom could change things. Hell, Sony themselves were playing up social connection would play into the PS2, even if their hype never panned out. Xbox Live and the PlayStation 2's ethernet adapter launched around the same time.

Would PSN exist as it does now without Xbox Live? Yes. It would probably be more PC-inspired, though, with a lot more interaction from SOE. Online gaming was inevitable, especially with the rise of MMO's and the insane success of online multiplayer on PC in the 90's. Xbox Live was great and pioneered a direction, but it wasn't the only influence on online console gaming.

 

[N.Domixis]

This would be surprising to me. But I expect Microsoft to win the holiday because of Halo and Overdrive anyway. I think Sony will have a very strong first quarter next year though.

I just don't get it. How can any one think this is a system seller?

 

[Dragon]

This would be surprising to me. But I expect Microsoft to win the holiday because of Halo and Overdrive anyway. I think Sony will have a very strong first quarter next year though.

Sunset Overdrive could very well turn out to be a great game. I don't know where the confidence in the sales is from though.

 

[siah]

Thanks, I forgot to salt my eggs.

Don't act as if this doesn't happen.

 

[Zyae]

Those quotes are extremely relevant and counter your argument.

No they dont. No one is arguing that Xbox should be artificially propped up like the auto bail out. We are arguing that a healthy Xbox brand is good for Sony and the Industry as a whole. Please tell me why it isnt

 

[Salex_]

Your analogy makes no sense.

Here's why it's wrong: Sony will continue to make money if they continue to dominate. A football team kicking the shit out of another football team for one particular game is not an appropriate comparison for this money. Sony is motivated by profits and sales projections, not by how much they're beating Microsoft by. I don't understand why this is hard to understand.

It's surprising that so many people think the only thing they care about is selling more than consoles than their competitors. Why would they go to sleep after that? I posted this yesterday

Even if they dominate in the console market, there's still so many other factors and benefits to improving their value proposal.

PC, smartphones, and other living room products are things to worry about.

Selling more consoles = more PS+ subscribers = more $$$
Selling more consoles = more developers/games = more games sold = more $$$ from fees
etc.

 

[RedNumberFive]

This would be surprising to me. But I expect Microsoft to win the holiday because of Halo and Overdrive anyway. I think Sony will have a very strong first quarter next year though.

I have no doubt that Halo is going to sell really well, but I don't think SO is going to be quite the chart topper that is expected.

 

[Ricky_R]

No, but microsoft did, and now sony is cleaning their clocks.

I guess time will tell. I don't think we're at a point where we can say that Sony is resting on their lead yet.

 

[siah]

I have no doubt that Halo is going to sell really well, but I don't think SO is going to be quite the chart topper that is expected.

I tend to agree with you, even though I think the game will be solid.

 

[foxbeldin]

When is NPD day?

NPD Release: Thursday, October 16th @ 4 p.m. EDT (thread posted ~6:30 p.m. EDT)

 

[Xando]

But Sony was only able to get a deal of 200k units a year to the Chinese Market whereas Microsoft got a deal somewhere in the realm of 3-4 million? Wasn't that launch pretty successful too?

You should inform yourself.
The 200k number was denied by Sony.

 

[RowdyReverb]

I have no doubt that Halo is going to sell really well, but I don't think SO is going to be quite the chart topper that is expected.

I don't think SO will be a chart topper since it's a new IP competing against several old standbys, but bundling it with the first white console variant pretty much guarantees it'll move a decent amount of units.

 

[mocoworm]

I just don't get it. How can any one think this is a system seller?

I don't think that the game is a system seller on it's own, but the sweet white console that it comes with in the bundle could sway some people. I have a friend who will buy that just to get this colour console.

The game looks great though and seeing it running instore could generate some sales from people on the fence.

 

[Neuromancer]

Perhaps his post lacked tact. But I don't think critiscm of the quality of the forum should be taboo as many posters make it out to be.

I'm all in favor of highlighting specific, bad posts people have made and pointing out what's wrong with them. Saying, in effect, 'you guys are all stupid fanboys and I'm so above it all' doesn't improve things; it doesn't even say anything of substance.

 

[Zyae]

It's not that simple. You're forgetting that the early 2000's were all about internet connectivity on everything, how the dot-com boom could change things. Hell, Sony themselves were playing up social connection would play into the PS2, even if their hype never panned out. Xbox Live and the PlayStation 2's ethernet adapter launched around the same time.

Would PSN exist as it does now without Xbox Live? Yes. It would probably be more PC-inspired, though, with a lot more interaction from SOE. Online gaming was inevitable, especially with the rise of MMO's and the insane success of online multiplayer on PC in the 90's. Xbox Live was great and pioneered a direction, but it wasn't the only influence on online console gaming.

Lol sure it would. Sony would have never implemented their free games if they werent playing catch up to XBL. Never in a million years

 

[twobear]

But Sony was only able to get a deal of 200k units a year to the Chinese Market whereas Microsoft got a deal somewhere in the realm of 3-4 million? Wasn't that launch pretty successful too?

Microsoft is throwing money everywhere, even in my small fuckoff Australian town but unlike previous generations, China is a potential factor. If Microsoft gets a foothold in there (and it's possible due to the Anti-Japanese attitudes that exist) then China could be a huge disruptor to your so-called impossible catch-up odds.

Well, the admittedly extremely limited data suggests that Xbone faces the same kind of uphill struggle in China that it does everywhere else in the world.

And again, I don't see why, as an Xbone player, you could possibly be happy that MS might forgo investing to make the platform better in favour of just launching the same mediocre product in more territories. It's in your best interests for MS to invest in improving the quality of their product, not just sell it to more people.

 

[CrazedProfessional]

You should inform yourself.
The 200k number was denied by Sony.

It wasn't denied by Sony, they just said the number doesn't have any indication of commitment levels and any further hardware shipments would depend on the success of software sales.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

No they dont. No one is arguing that Xbox should be artificially propped up like the auto bail out. We are arguing that a healthy Xbox brand is good for Sony and the Industry as a whole. Please tell me why it isnt

Because brands shouldn't always be healthy. If they put out something the market doesn't like, they should stagger, take a hit, and there should be consequences for their actions. If there isn't, there's no competition.

Still, remember that this doesn't rule out the fact that competition is one of the weakest motives for company innovation and change.

Lol sure it would. Sony would have never implemented their free games if they werent playing catch up to XBL. Never in a million years

You've stopped debating and started babbling. I'd remedy that if I were you.

 

[Neuromancer]

As long as it is yours, right?

It would be preferable if it was my console of choice, sure. But I didn't cry too much last generation when the Wii had a commanding lead.

 

[Ricky_R]

Wasn't that launch pretty successful too?

It depends on your definition of success. They shipped 100,000 units in China.

 

[The Jackdog]

I guess time will tell. I don't think we're at a point where we can say that Sony is resting on their lead yet.

Oh not at all, my only argument "look what happened last time"