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Sony was nervous about Horizon's female protagonist, did lots of focus testing
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
It's about relative performance. They've been doing "badly" overall for ~2 decades. The female solo titles, relative to the male titles, don't sell well as a collective whole. Even takng out the "top tier" Batman/Spidey/etc titles.
It's not an accident that there's not a lot of source material for solo Marvel heroes- they're all on the X-Men, a group IP.
It is such a good character. Being non-sexualized makes it so refreshing for a AAA female. But yeah, they will lose some sales. Although I believe they will also gain some.
dragonbane
Member
Guerilla started development of this game years before Beyond shipped.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
The sad thing is, it is risky. I'd love for the industry to be in a place where that isn't the case, but I don't think the marketing people are inherently wrong for asking the question. What's wrong is the idea that they'd have any power to change it if Guerilla was set on going with a female lead.
Boobahzone
Member
If your main character just has to be a white person with dreadlocks, then a lady makes more sense.
machinecaliber
Member
This is totally how it should be, especially if the story called for and its what they envisioned from the start.
Plus doesn't hurt that they nailed the characterization to a tee so far as we've seen, and people complaining about the talking during the demo are nuts. That kind of stuff only improves games, Witcher 3 for instance could have used some more of that but I guess if people like world-breaking silent/awkwardness who am I to judge.
Plus doesn't hurt that they nailed the characterization to a tee so far as we've seen, and people complaining about the talking during the demo are nuts. That kind of stuff only improves games, Witcher 3 for instance could have used some more of that but I guess if people like world-breaking silent/awkwardness who am I to judge.
In a media that wants to have highly-likable, highly-adored, highly-idolized main characters, I suppose I can see why they may lose sleep over such decisions...
But I want to get to a point where such discussions aren't even a thought that crosses the minds of people. It'll just be accepted.
But I want to get to a point where such discussions aren't even a thought that crosses the minds of people. It'll just be accepted.
HawksWinStanley
Member
This. I noticed she was female but it didn't even register as "a thing" because the character was as agile and lethal as I'd expect any action RPG protag who's out hunting to be. Wiener or not.
SolidSnakex
Member
The difference is that Zornack chose games where there's only a female protagonist. You're bringing up mostly games that allows you to choose your gender. That's not what Horizon is. You have to play as Aloy if you want to play the game. There's no gender option.
Orochinagis
Member
The female prot looks like Ygritte from GoT according to my friends.
sono
Member
I thought of Nariko too..
Mauricio_Magus
Banned
I wish this didn't happen so much in this silly industry, I love female protagonists.
I get why it happens, there was a stupid guy(ninja something) in the other thread saying he won't enjoy the game as much because you have to play as a girl, like come the fuck on. I really wonder how many gamers think that way.
I get why it happens, there was a stupid guy(ninja something) in the other thread saying he won't enjoy the game as much because you have to play as a girl, like come the fuck on. I really wonder how many gamers think that way.
A lot of those games give you a choice to play as male lead. I think when Bioware released the stats, it showed a small % actually played as FemShep. I would be curious what the stats would be for males. Like what % of males played as FemShep. For me, it wasn't even an issue of diversity (I tend to play female leads when I can, because I like diversity).
But I thought the voice acting of Jennifer Hale was really incredible. And it really kills me, to know a lot of people missed out on that. But I do get that, it's subjective. Mark Meer was great too, and some could prefer him.
I remember being really let down when I saw the FemShep stats, and wondered if on a financial level, it was worth spending all that money on voice acting, and female character models across 3 games, if such a small % actually play a female character.
Oddly enough, FemShep had a lot of popularity when it came to fans being vocal. As the trilogy went on, she became talked about more and more. And they even gave her a cover on the game. So it was a shock to see low %.
Leafhopper
Banned
Most of those games, not the main characters, sucked.
dragonbane
Member
Beyond didnt bomb. It did pretty ok actually
On the other hand some people might think falling in love would "lessen" her strong character
I remember someone saying they were happy that Mad Max spoiler
Furiosa and Max didn't exchange romantic feelings
IAmRandom31
Banned
This. One of the best character designs I've seen in a long time. Wouldn't change a single thing and loved the jnternal monologue
Rats Off To Ya
Banned
I, for one, believe there's probably some truth to the idea that a female protagonist generally hurts sales. So all the more reason to create more female protagonists. The more developers we see creating games led by bald space marines, the more that trope gets normalized as the default, and the harder it gets to sell a game with a woman on the box. It's been happening as long as we've all been gaming.
So I go back to my previous suggestion. Burn it down. All female protagonists, all the time.
So I go back to my previous suggestion. Burn it down. All female protagonists, all the time.
Ghost Slayer
Member
poor this dude, he will be gifed to death in every FFVII:R thread until the game out
Big Green Anus
Member
I'm not going to lie, but there's a big part of me that this game might not do as well due to the bias against female lead characters. Luckily, seeing Mirrors Edge and Dishonored 2 does help and I'm hoping people become more acceptance to this. This game does not look cheap, so I'm REALLY hoping it succeeds 
With that being said, I really enjoy her character design. You can see flaws in her face, which makes her more human than your typical Square Enix character RPG character
With that being said, I really enjoy her character design. You can see flaws in her face, which makes her more human than your typical Square Enix character RPG character
I'm glad the reaction has been positive then,should give Sony more faith going forward with their action games.
Personally I really don't care less whether I'm using a man or a woman in a game, but more diversity is always nice. Playing game after game featuring a bald/dark haired guy with a gruff voice and permanent scowl on his face does get a bit old after a while.
Personally I really don't care less whether I'm using a man or a woman in a game, but more diversity is always nice. Playing game after game featuring a bald/dark haired guy with a gruff voice and permanent scowl on his face does get a bit old after a while.
JimmyRustler
Gold Member
Many didn't and bombed anyway. Bayonetta?
Think that is going to be a divisive aspect of the game. I personally loved it. Seems people either thought it was charming, or felt annoyed by it.
I'm not picking on you Boobahzone, but those are not dreadlocks people, those are braids.
Shmuely Bully
Member
That's not an example you should be using to make your point. Even most of the crappy superhero flicks with male leads did several times the box office of Catwoman or really any other female superhero flick.
Heck, Spawn did better numbers with less than half the budget.
Frag Waffles
Member
There are actually people out there who feel uncomfortable playing as a woman character, hence the need for focus testing. It's the most bizarre thing.
I'm glad they went through with the focus testing though. I think the character looks great and the reception has been awesome.
I'm glad they went through with the focus testing though. I think the character looks great and the reception has been awesome.
lol wth is this from?
wkureservedp2
Member
That game looks super dumb, and I don't mean that in a bad way.
I agree. The only thing I didn't like about the character was the VA
JimmyRustler
Gold Member
It's FFVII remake reaction.
Lalalandia
Member
On the other hand female Thor is outselling male Thor by 30% and Wonder Woman is ever green for DC but 'one swallow does not a spring make' etc, etc. The problem with all of our data on male vs female leads across a wide range of media is that for years male was the default for leads making for both a very small sample size and making change seem strange rather than looking at the status quo and thinking 'damn that's a lot of dudes'. As a result stand out examples like female Thor both suffer and benefit from being different.
Of course the main problem behind all of this is that not doing the same thing as everyone else is risky so to reassure those folks afraid of risk (ie every CFO ever) lots of data is needed. Shame that this is the case but hey this is the world that we inherited, if the games good I'll buy it and help to provide a solid data point that normalises it. If it's not I won't and that will probably be used as a stick to beat the next game with a female lead.
Metroid.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
Comics are already doing this but the problem I'm hearing recently is that all female protagonist in comics are starting to look the same in terms of their goals and motivations. It makes sense cuz everyone now wants to make a female character that any women can look up to but now it's almost becoming a trope in itself. That's why I'm thinking it's time for a gritty female characters to replace bald space marine.
The game bombed because people don't understand the game (Sony send guides to how review the game).
The game bombed because the protagonist is a woman.
That's how they think all the publishers? wtf?
I not think it's necessary that tells everything he does. It's a "video" game, you can show what she is thinking.
Uno Venova
Banned
Were EA execs "worried" as well?
Probably why it took so long for a sequel.
Sales will determine whether they have more faith going forward. I hope to hell this game ends up being good, and sells well. If it bombs, then it will probably scare Sony and also push the narrative that female lead games don't sell well. Even "okay" sales numbers, would still push the narrative that a male lead game could have done more. And when you have budgets this high, and it's such a risk investing so much money, it would sadly be enough to make these companies afraid to take a leap.
I mean, it's sad that it has to be a "leap" to begin with.
SolidSnakex
Member
Were EA execs "worried" as well?
Mirror's Edge released around the same time as Dead Space and skate. Both of those games immediately started to receive sequels while we had to beg for years to get a new Mirror's Edge.
greatestjediever
Member
Were EA execs "worried" as well?
No, they were only worried she looked too asian.
Pretty much all Platinum games, including those with male leads, bombed.
But lets say it is true that games with female leads are more likely to bomb, why is that the case?
I need numbers. And again, why are female lead products more likely to bomb?
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I kind of get the impression that characters like Lara Croft are seen as "inherited". They have their own history and their own fans for their franchises. But the general audience for big money, core console games is what publishers are nervous over.
It has been pointed out how many female protagonists appeared at this year's E3, which is great. Though it is still kind of funny that big companies are actually worried about the cliches they helped create themselves, with years of unironic marketing that painted gaming as the "place for bros to get their bro on". Not talking about Sony specifically here, just the marketing trends of the western game industry as a whole.
It has been pointed out how many female protagonists appeared at this year's E3, which is great. Though it is still kind of funny that big companies are actually worried about the cliches they helped create themselves, with years of unironic marketing that painted gaming as the "place for bros to get their bro on". Not talking about Sony specifically here, just the marketing trends of the western game industry as a whole.
+
This design tha bess tho
nah.
gears of war never had good design .
that looks horrible
kunonabi
Member
Lol in what world is this an ugly person?
Not ugly but in-game her head looks kind of large and she's all face which exacerbates the problem. Other than that her design is fine.