You're right about that. It's not the same as what I was envisioning for Haru (hers would be more of a haughty, arrogant take), but Futaba is a lot different than other party members have been in the series. I was glad when it was revealed there would finally be a Hermit arcana member, and she didn't disappoint (other than the fact that you can romance her, which isn't right).
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Persona 5 Maniax User Poll Results for Favorite Characters, Personas, etc. [Spoilers]
- Thread starter ChasingComets
- Start date
You're right about that. It's not the same as what I was envisioning for Haru (hers would be more of a haughty, arrogant take), but Futaba is a lot different than other party members have been in the series. I was glad when it was revealed there would finally be a Hermit arcana member, and she didn't disappoint (other than the fact that you can romance her, which isn't right).
Star Orpheus
Member
I wonder how Haru's popularity would have faired if they emphasized her sadistic nature from Mementos.
She talks about how much she loves killing shadows while their begging for mercy.
She talks about how much she loves killing shadows while their begging for mercy.
Futaba's one of my top 5 for the entire series. She's the funniest member and has the best character development imo. I found her awkwardness very relatable.
Futaba was great but would have been far better as a platonic character. Her romance felt forced and awkward.
Yusuke is so underutilized but I love him. His deadpan humor feels really fresh for the series. He's got the best party member confidant bar-none.
Haru is deceptively great. Just useless to the plot for where she comes in. It's unfortunate.
Ryuji is a fun, intentionally flawed character. I'm not sure what people wanted out of him because his stupidity or temper almost never bothered me, it's just part of his character and what made him interesting. The times where he crosses the line, it's intentional to the game's story and he's immediately called out for it. Plus, the game lets you endlessly rib him for his temper, loudness, and stupidity.
I like to look at Ryuji as Joker's Anger Translator.
Yusuke is so underutilized but I love him. His deadpan humor feels really fresh for the series. He's got the best party member confidant bar-none.
Haru is deceptively great. Just useless to the plot for where she comes in. It's unfortunate.
Ryuji is a fun, intentionally flawed character. I'm not sure what people wanted out of him because his stupidity or temper almost never bothered me, it's just part of his character and what made him interesting. The times where he crosses the line, it's intentional to the game's story and he's immediately called out for it. Plus, the game lets you endlessly rib him for his temper, loudness, and stupidity.
I like to look at Ryuji as Joker's Anger Translator.
SatelliteOfLove
Member
Futaba is an amazing bit of character work once one gets away from the "best girl" angle.
In fact, most of these hated Persona characters require that severance to show how much they shine, especially in light of the game's forest-for-the-trees blatantness about societal disfunction and misanthropy.
Yusuke is a JoJo's protagonist gotten caught up in the wrong game and ended up just a party member.
^^^
Case in point.
In fact, most of these hated Persona characters require that severance to show how much they shine, especially in light of the game's forest-for-the-trees blatantness about societal disfunction and misanthropy.
Yusuke is a JoJo's protagonist gotten caught up in the wrong game and ended up just a party member.
^^^
Case in point.
RurouniZel
Asks questions so Ezalc doesn't have to
Futaba is and always will be my Best Girl!
Makoto was worth the second play through though.
Makoto was worth the second play through though.
Novel Mike
Member
That also sounds like Ann.
The characters just are not characterized well at all. IDK what the hell happened to the writing in this game but its all over the damn place and it rarely feels like it all flows together well.
I already mentioned Ryuji's problems in my last post but like Ann has this great character arc in the first arc of the game and gets basically no development after it. Her characterization is also constantly at odds with the rest of the game. She is very sexualized both in her poses and how the plot decides to use her both in the first arc but also in other arcs as well (like the second arc revolves the guys trying to convince her to go nude for a fucking painting after she JUST finished dealing with being sexually harassed by fucking Kamoshida, WHAT THE FUCK!? Happens again in the 7th palace!) which honestly would've been fine if her character arc had been about her actually liking her own sexuality and wanting to use it and flaunting it. (A sexually positive character would be interesting in a game like this) as she actually DOES in battle (with both her poses, her 'charm' on enemies during hold up, ect) but the problem is that THAT IS NOT HER CHARACTER AT ALL. Her actual character is very much not that person, she hates the idea of being sexualized in that way and finds it creepy when the guys or anyone else just stares at her body. Her Confidant arc is also all about her modeling career (until the very end anyway) and how shes pretty much an airhead, its demeaning compared to the character we get to see grow and develop through that first arc, struggling with being sexually harassed by a teacher, the rumors suggesting shes easy, then seeking revenge after what happens to Shiho and what she ultimately decides to do (having Kamoshida live with what hes done being a far worse punishment then death) but right after that shes just pretty much what the game thinks is a 'normal' high school girl... Besides the game constantly trying to sexualize her at every fucking turn.
So her character is confidant, sexy, risque, dominate, strong, and intelligent but also submissive, an airhead, naive, shy, innocent, and likely a dozen other character traits. The problem is that all these traits are at odds with each other, its not as if she had a split personality or anything like that its all one character and it ends up never making any sense and feels like they were trying to make two or three different characters and crammed all those traits into a single one and so it never feels like we ever have a 'true' version of Ann.
It's just so poorly written it boggles my mind.
I don't really care if he has reasons or not. It's the entire theme of the game that all of the main characters have some trauma in their past, and his sure is shitty compared to most, but he made me not care. I got his confidant to rank 10 and couldn't care one bit (although he's somewhat tolerable in the later ranks, I'll admit). But throughout the main story he's an insufferable glory whore with no impulse control and no redeeming qualities at all who basically bullies a team member out of the team. Something he at least gets called out on (though with no real repercussions). And sure, he has that "moment of awesome" where he physically exerts himself and does something physically impressive, hardly a redemption.
The only moment he ever said anything agreeable (that wasn't expletives towards an antagonist) was when he admitted he had been a scumbag, though he still continued to be one. The only accomplishments he ever had as a character was fucking up so badly that he was directly/indirectly responsible for the induction of 2 (superior to him, obviously) members to the team. Mishima did more for the team.
He was such a piece of trash during the middle third of the game that I was actually surprised when he ended up not having a palace or being a memento target.
As Futaba so succinctly put it:
The Phantom Thieves deserved better.
Way to prove my point. People who hate Ryuji can't possibly describe him without resorting to these ridiculous, often disingenuous statements. Yeah he's loud and pushy, so fucking what. He's an excitable teenager who's finally been given a chance to do something with his shitty life. The point of his arc is that he lets the fame get to his head, and it comes to a head in a good way. We needed that kind of character because variance is good. And no, he doesn't spend the entire being an asshole gloryhound, don't bullshit me. He starts out as a driven and passionate, loses sight of that and then runs it back by the end.
Dude literally gets his leg broken, kicked out of the track club (his only passion in life) abandoned by literally everyone at school, humiliated in front of his mother (and top of his dad left him years), but I guess doesn't really matter other people experienced trauma too. Not. His trauma directly informs his characterization. His anger at goddamn visceral, and unlike Ann, his problems don't go away after the first arc. It doesn't matter if you don't care, his character is undeniably well set up.
Enough with these weak fabrications. He's consistently looking out for people throughout the course game. He acts rowdy, but he's kind (they goddamn beat this over your head when he literally helps old ladies cross streets)
He's an unmitigated asshole to Morgana (who fucking deserves it for all the shit he spews his way.) but a good friend to literally everyone else (and including Morgana at points)
Hey guess what; Mishima did more for the team than literally everyone but Makoto.
The Queen disagrees.
Poor Yusuke
I want to hug him and whisper we're going to make beautiful art together (no fujoshi)
Violence Jack
Member
Neko Shogun was robbed.
Glad to see my girl Kawakami placing high.
But Yusuke and Makoto over Futaba, ehhh.......
Glad to see my girl Kawakami placing high.
But Yusuke and Makoto over Futaba, ehhh.......
A. Mess.
Ryuji's trauma is "shitty" compared to the rest? The hell am I reading?
The one thing I dislike about the character is the unnecessary perviness with Ann, but man these comments feel like you're just making excuses to hate him. I mean it's fine to dislike whatever character but geez.
Ryuji's hunger for fame and recklessness are intentional and the writers knew they'd be annoying to the player, so they intentionally made him stand out with them to then make him realize these things are wrong and he grows up as a person and even apologizes for his attitude, the guy is great.
He also got literally physically abused by a teacher, had his leg messed up and got branded as a criminal troublemaker for it, destroying all possibility of him getting sympathy in school or having a future as a track runner. That's a shitty trauma? Wow.
The one thing I dislike about the character is the unnecessary perviness with Ann, but man these comments feel like you're just making excuses to hate him. I mean it's fine to dislike whatever character but geez.
Ryuji's hunger for fame and recklessness are intentional and the writers knew they'd be annoying to the player, so they intentionally made him stand out with them to then make him realize these things are wrong and he grows up as a person and even apologizes for his attitude, the guy is great.
He also got literally physically abused by a teacher, had his leg messed up and got branded as a criminal troublemaker for it, destroying all possibility of him getting sympathy in school or having a future as a track runner. That's a shitty trauma? Wow.
Preach.
demosthenes
Member
Haha, right. Definitely the same.
I could use a couple of pictures to cover literally everyone's arc in the entire game, so I'm not sure what you're getting at. In any case, I think you're vastly overblowing how bad his stupidity he is in practice. He (and Ann) screw up and get caught by Makoto, fine, but don't discount literally everything else he's done. He's the one who goes hard when it comes to dealing with Kamoshida (with Joker mostly tagging alone), and it's pretty much his character in a nutshell. He's driven as fuck. When Makoto gets kidnapped, he's the first person to act. When the group faces imminent death he ends up saving all their lives. So why do people perpetuate this garbage that he brings nothing to the group? They would all be dead if it wasn't for him.
"If he had not been one of the first party members you get there would be no way you'd want him to join the Phantom"
No shit. The point is that you have a bunch of unpolished teens moonlighting as Phantom Thieves. There's no way you'd take anyone (barring Makoto and Futaba) over more well adjusted people.
It's because you're looking at him the wrong way. Ryuji isn't going to stop being loud and aggressive. That's just fundamental to who he is.[/spoiler] He stops being conceited and genuinely cares about helping people. Being a Phantom Thief is no longer about picking up chicks or being famous, it's about saving Tokyo from a psychopath. This is the crux of his character arc, and they don't renege on this at all.
See above. An artificial personality change wouldn't have worked at all. He's still going to be stupid and temperamental (because he's a dumb teenager). But he's clearly tempered and calmed down (comparatively), by the end.
During the very end, Ryuji mulls over the fact if the Phantom Thieves are even necessary, which is something he never would have considered at the beginning.
I really hate this "the character would have been better if they did what I wanted" but this one is particularly egregious because kicking out Persona user (aka a battle asset) would be beyond idiotic. There's no reason for it, and Ryuji's muted resolve >>> overt scene where he has to crawl his way back to the team.
Do we need to? He clearly thinks about his actions and feels bad over it (even going as far as to apologize to Haru and Futaba about it). There's nothing fake about that at all.
So well set up and characterized that the vast majority of people didn't give a crap about his tragic past and couldn't sympathize with him or like him. Shows how you can try to make a character sympathetic and still have most people dislike him when he's an obnoxious piece of shit for the entire game.
I'd imagine that Queen would disagree (even though that example just looks like pity in an attempt to preserve any undeserved shred of self worth he may have), since she only got to be a part of the team thanks to one of his many many fuck ups.
Please Atlus, give me an option to wait until Ryuji gets executed before I stop Kamoshida.
Yup -- me and my fiancee already have decided we wanted to romance her early on before Makoto showed up. It would've been a tough decision if she was actually a confidant.
Tbh I don't get what Makoto love has to do with Ryuji hate.
He isn't hated because people like her. And Makoto isn't some sort of terrible character that people misguidedly like while Ryuji is some obviously superior character they don't like. It isn't a question of "justice" like that.
mrmickfran
Member
My favorite line of hers comes from if you cheat on her on Valentine's Day;
With a genuine smile on her face. I definitely would have loved to see more of that side of Haru.
The vast majority of people my ass. Ryuji is divisive, but he isn't universally hated. The popularity poll prior to this one had Ryuji fairly high up (at #3). Also way to completely buy into what the game was actually trying to critique, lmao. Your headcanon that Makoto would pity Ryuji is pretty amusing too.
Well no, but you're always going to get the same people tripping over themselves to worship Makoto (a character who is by design, meant to be likeable) compared to an overtly flawed character like Ryuji. It's disappointingly predictable.
Star Orpheus
Member
I'm curious, how is Ryuji doing in compression to Junpei? I know he isn't very popular in Japan either but was he accepted better or worse then Ryuji was?
I see what you mean. Honestly I think Haru stands on her own as is. The problems lie with her story arc not really given enough focus, her late introduction limiting her screentime, and her Confidant having a rather harsh opening lock if you're like me and screwed up social stats.
It wasnt before the game launched? So they played the game and didnt liked him, Atlus failed to make people sympathize with him.
I liked Ryuji's confidant a lot and mostly I was able to laugh at his annoying shouting/deal with it.
I do think he's the weakest among Yosuke, Junpei, and him. I also do think he gets saddled with some annoying strains in P5's story. They could've tied his "fame" stuff to a Junpei like arc, because frankly, when he goes off on Morgana, the game should have noticed that he should be more the one feeling a unimportant and under-used. Instead he's just obnoxious for a spell there and nothing is said about him.
I do think he's the weakest among Yosuke, Junpei, and him. I also do think he gets saddled with some annoying strains in P5's story. They could've tied his "fame" stuff to a Junpei like arc, because frankly, when he goes off on Morgana, the game should have noticed that he should be more the one feeling a unimportant and under-used. Instead he's just obnoxious for a spell there and nothing is said about him.
It doesn't surprise me in the slightest that Ryuji is disliked, but what is weird to me is the extents to which he's disliked. Like without having played the game and reading comments you'd assume he's the goddamn traitor or something.
What's weirder is that yes, he's very stupid and careless... Like another very beloved character in the series, you know, Kanji? They're not the exact same but it was hard for me not to think of him when seeing Ryuji screw up. IMO he's a combination of some combination of Kanji and the good parts of Yosuke, with the latter addition including some negative aspects that later in the story get subverted! He's an anti-Yosuke, and that guy was an actual piece of shit mind you.
Personally I wasn't too hot on Ryuji during my playthrough, I liked him but some aspects of him were very annoying and made him just "ok". But seeing my sister play through the game and have him as his favorite character (which confused me at first for sure) has made me pay more attention to his scenes and this guy is a fucking saint. His life is in absolute ruins, and his future at more odds than any of the other party members', but he's still extremely enthusiastic, supportive and more than anything, very grateful.
He's very much aware about the fact that he can be a nuisance, so he constantly apologizes for it during the game and is always thanking Joker for sticking with him despite all. Hell, his response to being healed is just "sorry". Also, IMO, he's the best executed "bro" character in the modern series, having a legitimate connection with the protagonist that started organically and being the most dependable out of the bunch.
It is obnoxious, but in Makoto's case is inevitable... I mean, you know, with female characters in this series there's simply never going to be a serious conversation about them.
What's weirder is that yes, he's very stupid and careless... Like another very beloved character in the series, you know, Kanji? They're not the exact same but it was hard for me not to think of him when seeing Ryuji screw up. IMO he's a combination of some combination of Kanji and the good parts of Yosuke, with the latter addition including some negative aspects that later in the story get subverted! He's an anti-Yosuke, and that guy was an actual piece of shit mind you.
Personally I wasn't too hot on Ryuji during my playthrough, I liked him but some aspects of him were very annoying and made him just "ok". But seeing my sister play through the game and have him as his favorite character (which confused me at first for sure) has made me pay more attention to his scenes and this guy is a fucking saint. His life is in absolute ruins, and his future at more odds than any of the other party members', but he's still extremely enthusiastic, supportive and more than anything, very grateful.
He's very much aware about the fact that he can be a nuisance, so he constantly apologizes for it during the game and is always thanking Joker for sticking with him despite all. Hell, his response to being healed is just "sorry". Also, IMO, he's the best executed "bro" character in the modern series, having a legitimate connection with the protagonist that started organically and being the most dependable out of the bunch.
It is obnoxious, but in Makoto's case is inevitable... I mean, you know, with female characters in this series there's simply never going to be a serious conversation about them.
mrmickfran
Member
The pure vitriol and hatred that Ryuji is getting in this thread is something else.
Bless you PK Gaming for that amazing post.
Bless you PK Gaming for that amazing post.
King Tubby
Member
Creepy stalker girl and foreign barker were robbed.
F0rneus
Tears in the rain
Garlic Shrimp seller is the GOAT.
Ultimadrago
Member
I wonder if this wishy-washy development is why she's ranked the way she is. In fact, some say that it's only Japan that finds Ann to be drab, but I hardly see her discussed online either (though I don't regular any Persona fansites, fanfiction hubs or the like). She doesn't really leave much behind.
Makoto is another story where I almost feel similar and her popularity almost feels like an inside joke I'm not getting. Whenever I see comments about Haru and Hifumi being too vanilla, I'm tempted to make that a triple scoop (with her barely edging out due to some excitable story events). I could see it being general mainstream appeal, but in the Persona 4 days I heard of Chie the most and she had a very determined, loud tomboy direction that I probably would have never guessed making the front pages before the fact. It's all a bit nebulous.
No, this one was after
Ryuji is being worse than Junpei is debatable, but he's definitely stronger than Yosuke. Yosuke was a character who was unbelievably inconsistent and the type of comic relief character that could get immensely grating at times. If the character concept behind Junpei was "that guy you knew in highschool", Yosuke is "that guy you knew in highschool but greatly exaggerated."
I think it's the story events that make me like Makoto so much, because her Confidante chain is nothing special and actually kinda boring.
She runs the bar.
Who said he's universally hated? He's the least liked Phantom Thief. Despite his tragic past, so-called arc or hot blooded teenage passion or whatever. So if the intention was to convey a background and characterization set up well enough to make him sympathetic and/or likeable, they failed. If the intention was to write the least likeable main character in the cast then yeah, they succeeded.
If most people fail to see what makes him so great and likeable then either it's not well set up or it doesn't exist.
Napalm_Frank
Member
Ryuji was robbed. On paper I should hate him but he is just too damn likeable even if he is an idiot. The english VA was also by far the best of the bunch, ton of energy.
The Jared of this game. Everyone's secret favorite character
Wish she had a S.link instead of Ohya.
mrmickfran
Member
Yup, easily the best performance in the game along with Ann, Futaba and Akechi
He's a crazy boy with good looks and plays foil with the MC. Also pancakes.
Dude is himself, and above that just a true bro. I felt way closer to him than anyone else in the cast, even if they are theoretically way cooler.
Ultimadrago
Member
I was disappointed with Akechi's lack of reaction to, "Honey, I'm home!"
One of the best responses in the game and he gives it nothing. Hope he's gone.
One of the best responses in the game and he gives it nothing. Hope he's gone.
In what respect!? Things to keep in mind:
1) The Maniax user poll had a small sample size.
2) You emphasize "least liked" as if he was goddamn crushed by his teammates, but he was only 6 points below Ann)
3) Using the fact that he placed last in order to support your conclusion that he "failed" as a character is absolutely laughable, because being least liked does not automatically mean he was a bad character. (Ani If we were to use your logic, then I suppose Joker was a paragon when it came to writing.)
Here's the results of a different poll conducted with a much larger sample:
Lightning Lord
Banned
I like Ann. While it is true that she doesn't really develop much beyond the first arc, she still has some really good moments afterward that were memorable enough for me.
I was never too bothered by the whole sex appeal aspect of her character, since Persona in general flips from seriousness to humor a lot, like the whole nude painting thing I never really dwelled on as much as others seemed to. The only part that ever perturbed me were the scenes with Ryuji creeping on her but when she ends up teasing him for it when they are at the beach it wasn't so bad.
Nightwing123
Member
Cool Ryuji did really well in that poll and that Poll has a lot more votes than this Maniax one. Great post PK Gaming.
.
Also people really love Kawakami in that poll
It was added in the English localization.
Ryuji's the kind of character you really have to pay attention in order to really appreciate. It's the little things that make him great imo.
Haha, ain't that the truth. I think it's not as bad as it was before (at least on GAF), but a lot of people still judge these girls based on their waifu potential and it's gross.
He's basically a male version of Tharja and Camilla from Fire Emblem in that a lot of his traits are designed for the purpose of appealing to baser instincts.
Ultimadrago
Member
I'd imagine since it's poking at conventional (older) American sitcoms, but now that makes me curious about what was listed for Japanese. lol