Support NeoGAF

[radioheadrule83]

Unrelated to your post, more on topic with the idea of console-ized handheld titles: have you played God of War: Ghost of Sparta for the PSP? Whatever your answer, do you feel it embodies the "console-ized handheld title" concept?

I haven't played Ghost of Sparta actually, no. I should clarify -- I think where special efforts are made, as in Ghost of Sparta, MGS Portable Ops or Vita's Uncharted -- its obvious that those teams are making a dedicated exclusive, with the target hardware in mind from the very beginning. They're not split off from another development team, Sony Bend and Naughty Dog are very independent of one another, so you know these games aren't an afterthought. There will be times when that is not the case, and times when there is *nothing* to differentiate the software from what is available elsewhere. And in those instances, is that software really going to be relevant? I doubt it.

I don't really feel like I'm alone in this mentality - you only really have to consider how quickly excitement for MGS3D has been killed by MGS HD collection (although the last few batches of screens certainly helped) - and yet, that game is getting a lot of customised tailoring to make it work on 3DS... but people don't care, because its too similar to what they can get elsewhere. Vita exclusives will do well, some will not. And I would suggest that games that are port-downs or pale imitations are not the games that will make it set the market alight. It's the tailored pick-up-and-play games, the Android/PS Suite, GPS/NEAR, and things like that to watch out for imo. If this is to do better than PSP, that's where the answer lies.

 

[yurinka]

Like every other systems Vita has its faults, but I think Sony improved a lot since PS3 and PSP launch, and fixed most of the existing issues makng a really promising device.

These are the issues from the OP I don't agree:

-Battery Life: Even I agree, it's on par with current devices when they run high end graphics games and features that are closer to Vita.
-Entry price: Yes, it would be better at $5, but I think it's good enough.
-No on board memory : I prefer PSP and Vita way because in my own opinion, I prefer to choose the storage size and to upgrade it in the future.
-No TV output : it would be a great feature, but I understand to don't include it for now to avoid compete vs PS3 sales and to reduce costs.
-You can't use the browser while playing games: It isn't an issue, I prefer this because it gives more memory available for both games and the browser. It doesn't make that effort to close another thing to user the other.
-PSOne Classic Games Won't Be Available At Launch: Just give them some time, for sure they will add it. How about the US / EU launch?
-You Can't Manage Your Vita With A Mac: If true (I doubt it), they'll manage it in the future. And it's more a problem from Apple having that small market share and incompatible OS.

BTW all of them hopefully are going to be fixed with future firmware updates or hardware revisions. But let's hope they keep the browser stuff as it is to make sure both the games and the browser have enough memory.

Spoiler

you forgot to say PZVita haz no gamez!

 

[balladofwindfishes]

I don't understand the whole "if you want power then you have to live with battery life"

...because I don't see that as looking at handheld gaming the right way. Handheld gaming, at least over the 20+ years it's existed has always placed battery life above graphics. This is what made the Game Boy sell better than the Game Gear. Nobody cared that the Game Boy looked like a calculator for graphics because it was cheap and had awesome battery life.

And yet over the last five years for some reason the game companies now thing graphics > battery life for handhelds despite the evidence that this is still not the case at all (see NetBooks and Tablets).

Sony is trying to play the handheld market like the console market, throwing tons of features at it hoping to hit one that sticks with the customer, and yet they go and sacrifice the very foundations of portable gaming; the battery life and the price.

 

[Huff]

Selective reading or something?

Remember the parts of my posts where I pointed out Wipeout, Little Big Planet and Motorstorm would make good portable titles? Or where I stated its not impossible for a fully console-esque experience to be justified: ie. Mirrors Edge? I'm sure there will be tonnes of people eager for portable CoD, even if I am not.

Okay. You asked what's the reason to own a Vita if the only thing it has will be console ports. (cuz thats all it has right?)

Well, you just answered your own question.

No, I'm being quite clear, and I don't believe I'm being hypocritical at all - you're just reading what you want to read I think and choosing not to engage the actual idea I've suggested: home console type experiences, and in particular - ports, will not be enough to sustain interest in the system as a portable device. Sony's energies should be poured into the more innovative aspects of the device imo.

What is a home console type experience? Why can the 3DS sustain on 2 console type Mario experiences but the Vita can't on Uncharted or HSG or whatever? I know the obvious answer is that because MK sells amazing and will move hardware, while Sony's games haven't proven to do that.

That's not what I'm arguing. I'm arguing that "home console experience on a handheld" is an antique saying. Handheld tech is improving. Graphics, physics, etc is moving to console like levels.

MKWii is a really fun game, and (although I haven't played it yet) MK7 is just as good if not better. What's the difference between that and UC3/UCVita? Just sales potential? And your personal preference? I can't get MK7 on anything but a 3DS, just like I can't get UC:GA on anything but a Vita

The Vita does need games/experiences you can't get anywhere else. Or why buy it? Doesn't mean that UC or Killzone or GT can't be that game.

 

[Woo-Fu]

And yet over the last five years for some reason the game companies now thing graphics > battery life for handhelds despite the evidence that this is still not the case at all (see NetBooks and Tablets).

Sony is trying to play the handheld market like the console market, throwing tons of features at it hoping to hit one that sticks with the customer, and yet they go and sacrifice the very foundations of portable gaming; the battery life and the price.

It is called "competition". Nintendo had none, so it didn't matter how good/bad their graphics were as long as the games were fun. Sony enters the picture and suddenly the graphics arms race begins. Battery life is more important in practical terms but it is flashy screenshots and videos that sell hardware in a competitive market.

You really shouldn't act like Sony is the only one sacrificing battery life and price. If you're going to bash them for it you need to bash Nintendo for the 3DS which is doing exactly the same thing.

 

[Takao]

I don't understand the whole "if you want power then you have to live with battery life"

...because I don't see that as looking at handheld gaming the right way. Handheld gaming, at least over the 20+ years it's existed has always placed battery life above graphics. This is what made the Game Boy sell better than the Game Gear. Nobody cared that the Game Boy looked like a calculator for graphics because it was cheap and had awesome battery life.

And yet over the last five years for some reason the game companies now thing graphics > battery life for handhelds despite the evidence that this is still not the case at all (see NetBooks and Tablets).

Sony is trying to play the handheld market like the console market, throwing tons of features at it hoping to hit one that sticks with the customer, and yet they go and sacrifice the very foundations of portable gaming; the battery life and the price.

Battery technology isn't moving at a quick enough pace to support the gains elsewhere in mobile tech. The 3DS has poor battery life too, and that's despite being a considerably weaker platform technically than Vita.

 

[hsukardi]

Incredibly shitty list from pramath.

>Battery Life: This is standard for a handheld game machine this generation.
>Entry Price: It's good, and will get better.
>No on board memory: Now this sucks.
>Memory Cards are a requirement for many games, games won't even start without Memory Cards: Same issue as above.
>No TV output: Who cares.
>Backwards Compatibiltiy is a mess: Hard decision, but right decision
>Only one account per system: DRM is a bitch, but account limitation is not unusual
>You can't use the browser while playing games: Launch issue
>PSOne Classic Games Won't Be Available At Launch: Launch issue
>You Can't Manage Your Vita With A Mac: Launch issue


So many of these are launch issues; post-launch prices will lower appropriately, PSOne classic games will be available, Mac support will be added bla bla bla. Many of the complaints are items that the relevant competitors can't claim to do better (TV output, battery life). This is a bitch's list.

I absolutely hate the memory card pricing, but the market has shown tolerance to this with the Xbox 360. Realistically I'm looking at a $400 spend at launch with the PSV, and that's pricey.

 

[Apath]

I haven't played Ghost of Sparta actually, no. I should clarify -- I think where special efforts are made, as in Ghost of Sparta, MGS Portable Ops or Vita's Uncharted -- its obvious that those teams are making a dedicated exclusive, with the target hardware in mind from the very beginning. They're not split off from another development team, Sony Bend and Naughty Dog are very independent of one another, so you know these games aren't an afterthought. There will be times when that is not the case, and times when there is *nothing* to differentiate the software from what is available elsewhere. And in those instances, is that software really going to be relevant? I doubt it.

I don't really feel like I'm alone in this mentality - you only really have to consider how quickly excitement for MGS3D has been killed by MGS HD collection (although the last few batches of screens certainly helped) - and yet, that game is getting a lot of customised tailoring to make it work on 3DS... but people don't care, because its too similar to what they can get elsewhere. Vita exclusives will do well, some will not. And I would suggest that games that are port-downs or pale imitations are not the games that will make it set the market alight. It's the tailored pick-up-and-play games, the Android/PS Suite, GPS/NEAR, and things like that to watch out for imo. If this is to do better than PSP, that's where the answer lies.

So your issue is less to do with console-like handheld titles and more to do with lazy down ports? If that's your issue, then I feel you won't find many disagreeing with you. My question then becomes: how this exactly applies to the Vita when we haven't really even seen many titles that accentuate this? At most we've seen banners for games like Bioshock or Assassin's Creed. In the case of Bioshock, there is an interview where a developer states that it is being made exclusively for the Vita. Should we assume it will be the same thing as Bioshock 1/2/3, just downgraded to work on the Vita? Or should we assume it will be an effort not too unlike Metal Gear Solid Peacewalker or God of War: Ghost of Sparta where we have a console-like experience that is clearly tailored to work for an on-the-go play style.

Console games being ported to the Vita isn't a bad thing. It can even be an advantage. Where it becomes a disadvantage is when they downgrade the title (reducing the experience) or the library is dis proportionally focused on such efforts. For the former, that was the biggest issue with the PSP (IMO). We had console like efforts that really needed two analogue sticks, but were instead relegated to mediocrity due to having to work with what it had.

 

[DangerousDave]

I don't understand the whole "if you want power then you have to live with battery life"

...because I don't see that as looking at handheld gaming the right way. Handheld gaming, at least over the 20+ years it's existed has always placed battery life above graphics. This is what made the Game Boy sell better than the Game Gear. Nobody cared that the Game Boy looked like a calculator for graphics because it was cheap and had awesome battery life.

But then, the low graphic quality it will be a con.

You have a lot of options if you want to have a better battery life. For example, stick with the original DSL.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

MKWii is a really fun game, and (although I haven't played it yet) MK7 is just as good if not better. What's the difference between that and UC3/UCVita? Just sales potential? And your personal preference? I can't get MK7 on anything but a 3DS, just like I can't get UC:GA on anything but a Vita

Just to chime in.

I'd argue the ability to pick up and play the game. You can have pretty much the same Mario Kart experience whether you have 5 minutes of 5 hours. Turn the game on, and go race a few time trials or do half a Grand Prix. With Uncharted I can see that only have 5 minutes wouldn't provide enough time to actually do anything in Uncharted, and certainly not get the same Uncharted experience you would get with 5 hours on a console.

When you look at the most successful games in handheld gaming, you see this pattern where the games can be broken into small chunks or player experience.

Let's assume we have 10 minutes, and let's look at popular, big selling handheld games...
Pokemon: Just hop in, grind a bit, hatch an egg, whatever.
Monster Hunter: Mess around in free hunt, do a very small quest.
Mario Kart: Do an entire Grand Prix or do 6 or 7 time trials
Dragon Quest: Grind
New Super Mario Bros: Beat 3 or 4 levels, each level is only like a minute long
Tetris: Play until your 10 minutes run out and just turn it off.
Angry Birds: Play a dozen or so levels

Uncharted: ...continue on for 10 minutes in the story? Watch one cut scene? What can you do for 10 minutes in Uncharted that is worth even turning the system on?

Can you see how the experience can be different now?

Battery technology isn't moving at a quick enough pace to support the gains elsewhere in mobile tech. The 3DS has poor battery life too, and that's despite being a considerably weaker platform technically than Vita.

Yes, the 3DS has terrible battery life.
Sony could have looked at the 3DS and saw it's major faults (low battery, bad branding and high price) and fixed the Vita's problems. Instead they did everything the 3DS did wrong except the branding part. And the 3DS has a fairly alright gimmick to fall-back onto... the Vita doesn't.

You have a lot of options if you want to have a better battery life. For example, stick with the original DSL.

Uhh... yea that's the point. How are they going to sell this to the handheld crowd that actually uses a handheld on the go?

 

[sajj316]

The only gripe I have is no onboard memory and the cost of memory cards using a proprietary format. I understand why they are doing this but it sucks nevertheless. Space has been allocated on the PSVita gamecards for save files and patches but requiring a memory card to launch a game is just dumb.

I can live with not playing PSOne games day one.

 

[Huff]

Just to chime in.

I'd argue the ability to pick up and play the game. You can have pretty much the same Mario Kart experience whether you have 5 minutes of 5 hours. Turn the game on, and go race a few time trials or do half a Grand Prix. With Uncharted I can see that only have 5 minutes wouldn't provide enough time to actually do anything in Uncharted, and certainly not get the same Uncharted experience you would get with 5 hours on a console.

I hope not. I hope you get a different experience. One you can only get on the Vita. Whether it is better or worse is a personal opinion.

When you look at the most successful games in handheld gaming, you see this pattern where the games can be broken into small chunks or player experience.

Let's assume we have 10 minutes, and let's look at popular, big selling handheld games...
Pokemon: Just hop in, grind a bit, hatch an egg, whatever.
Monster Hunter: Mess around in free hunt, do a very small quest.
Mario Kart: Do an entire Grand Prix or do 6 or 7 time trials
Dragon Quest: Grind
New Super Mario Bros: Beat 3 or 4 levels, each level is only like a minute long
Tetris: Play until your 10 minutes run out and just turn it off.
Angry Birds: Play a dozen or so levels

Uncharted: ...continue on for 10 minutes in the story? Watch one cut scene? What can you do for 10 minutes in Uncharted that is worth even turning the system on?

Can you see how the experience can be different now?

So it's just a time factor? What if UC lets you quick save where you are and you can pick it up at the same spot? Does that solve that?

So to enjoy shooting, puzzles, or platforming, it has to be in longer than 10 min segments? Well thats not true

 

[DangerousDave]

Uhh... yea that's the point. How are they going to sell this to the handheld crowd that actually uses a handheld on the go?

Well, is even more difficult to sell a console that shows the same graphics but it has better battery life. Even when all this is already overcrowded with DS, 3DS and even iPhone and similar.

There are not too many people that do 3h+ trips to go to work or school. You don't usually need more than 3-5h of battery if you are careful.

 

[gogogow]

Class 10 speed : 10 Mb/s
PSP Memory Pro Duo speed : 15 Mb/s min guaranteed

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Digital
https://www.oss-formats.org/en/memorystick/outline/pro.html

I'm pretty sure that if PSP cards were faster than class 10,it's pretty much given the Vita cards are faster than that due to the higher resolution of the games. That still doesn't excuse the price they are asking for them.

You do know what Mbps means, right?
Memory Pro Duo - 15 MEGABIT per second = 1.875 MEGABYTE per second
That is around Class 2 speed.

And no, "PSP" cards were not faster than Class 10 SD cards...

 

[balladofwindfishes]

So it's just a time factor? What if UC lets you quick save where you are and you can pick it up at the same spot? Does that solve that?

So to enjoy shooting, puzzles, or platforming, it has to be in longer than 10 min segments? Well thats not true

You really don't see how the experience is different between a game that allows you to play an entire Grand Prix in 10 minutes over a game where you kill a few bad guys or walk somewhere and then just quick save? Do you really make any meaningful progress in the game in 10 minutes?

With something like Dragon Quest, you can't move the story forward in 10 minutes, but you can grind a level or two which will save time when you can afford to sit down and play for longer.

Why is it when the reviews were rolling in for China Town Wars, one of the most lauded additions to the game was the drug dealing mini-game? I believe it was because that mini-game allowed users to progress in the game via a very accessible and easily started and finished mini-game that only takes a few minutes from start to finish, but aids in the game's progress.

Honestly, pretty much any game can be played in 10 minute chunks. Or at least those with a quicksave function.

Any game with a quick-save technically can.
But is it still the same experience to stop and go and stop and go and stop and go from point A to point B?

Well, is even more difficult to sell a console that shows the same graphics but it has better battery life.

The Game Boy is one of the best selling handhelds ever and had awful graphics that were miles behind the Game Gear.

 

[test_account]

Let's assume we have 10 minutes, and let's look at popular, big selling handheld games...
Pokemon: Just hop in, grind a bit, hatch an egg, whatever.
Monster Hunter: Mess around in free hunt, do a very small quest.
Mario Kart: Do an entire Grand Prix or do 6 or 7 time trials
Dragon Quest: Grind
New Super Mario Bros: Beat 3 or 4 levels, each level is only like a minute long
Tetris: Play until your 10 minutes run out and just turn it off.
Angry Birds: Play a dozen or so levels

Uncharted: ...continue on for 10 minutes in the story? Watch one cut scene? What can you do for 10 minutes in Uncharted that is worth even turning the system on?

Can you see how the experience can be different now?

The only games i would concider as good "10 minute session" game on that list is Angry Birds, and maybe Tetris depending on which difficulty level you start on. Advancing one level in Super Mario Bros or Monster Hunter, or advancing a bit in higher level (grinding) is no different to me than advancing 10 minute in another type of game.

 

[patsu]

I still can't believe some people are giving Sony a pass for not having internal memory or coming with some kind of free memory stick with each Vita. You can't play all Vita games if you just buy a Vita.

As far as I know, Vita will be launched with bundles. You get 4Gb + Vita in the bundles (+ case + game + blah)

Since memory is external, that means they will need to sell Vita without the cards too in case someone inherit their cards or bought them second hand elsewhere.

 

[R_thanatos]

-No on board memory : I prefer PSP and Vita way because in my own opinion, I prefer to choose the storage size and to upgrade it in the future.

I 98% agree with you but they could have a small set of internal memory ( for quick storage or cache ) and let you use whatever memory card size you wanted afterwards.
I think they really used all the user reception of the psp go . while deciding the specs of teh vita

 

[yurinka]

I don't understand the whole "if you want power then you have to live with battery life"

...because I don't see that as looking at handheld gaming the right way. Handheld gaming, at least over the 20+ years it's existed has always placed battery life above graphics. This is what made the Game Boy sell better than the Game Gear. Nobody cared that the Game Boy looked like a calculator for graphics because it was cheap and had awesome battery life.

And yet over the last five years for some reason the game companies now thing graphics > battery life for handhelds despite the evidence that this is still not the case at all (see NetBooks and Tablets).

Sony is trying to play the handheld market like the console market, throwing tons of features at it hoping to hit one that sticks with the customer, and yet they go and sacrifice the very foundations of portable gaming; the battery life and the price.

So you must hate 3DS because it has the same battery life and tries to make the same console like games like RE but with inferior graphics than Vita. And you should thankful because Nintendo reduced its price that fast.


That approach I think is good because helped PSP to sell 70+ millions while facing the best selling Nintendo device ever.

 

[DangerousDave]

Any game with a quick-save technically can.
But is it still the same experience to stop and go and stop and go and stop and go from point A to point B?

Of course. A level of New Super Mario DS. A shooting section and a platform section of Uncharted. What's the difference? Ah, yes, that in New Super Mario DS you had LIMITED saves, so you had to spend one of the limited saves or pry that the console will have enough battery to reach home in stand-by.

The Game Boy is one of the best selling handhelds ever and had awful graphics that were miles behind the Game Gear.

Because there weren't anything before. It was the first. Now there are a lot of "less graphic intensive experiences with better battery life". And also, all those experiences has tons of games, so you have to offer something new.

 

[gofreak]

Uncharted: ...continue on for 10 minutes in the story? Watch one cut scene? What can you do for 10 minutes in Uncharted that is worth even turning the system on?

Uncharted tends to flow in a chunk of gameplay + short cutscene, with several of these through a level.

Would not be surprised if Golden Abyss has designed these 'chunks' to be shorter for burst-y play.

On a side note, with 'big' games with more complex threads, I've always wondered why there isn't a universal 'catch-up' feature - whereby the user could watch a short 15-30 second catch-up of key things they last did in the game. Just to jog memory and help you pick up the threads of the game again. Kind of like those stones in OoT 3D, but looking into the past instead of the future.

 

[Huff]

You really don't see how the experience is different between a game that allows you to play an entire Grand Prix in 10 minutes over a game where you kill a few bad guys or walk somewhere and then just quick save? Do you really make any meaningful progress in the game in 10 minutes?

With something like Dragon Quest, you can't move the story forward in 10 minutes, but you can grind a level or two which will save time when you can afford to sit down and play for longer.

Why is it when the reviews were rolling in for China Town Wars, one of the most lauded additions to the game was the drug dealing mini-game? I believe it was because that mini-game allowed users to progress in the game via a very accessible and easily started and finished mini-game that only takes a few minutes from start to finish, but aids in the game's progress.


Any game with a quick-save technically can.
But is it still the same experience to stop and go and stop and go and stop and go from point A to point B?

So because some games have set points that make you change levels between 10 - 20 minutes in, it's a better portable game? I don't see any difference between that and saving after 10 minutes and picking back up in the same spot. I actually do this with Pokemon White: I play, then shut the screen, and pick it back up in the same spot later. No saving or changing levels involved.

It's just acceptable because YOU like a 10 minutes Mario experience better than you like a ten minute Uncharted experience.

 

[diffusionx]

...because I don't see that as looking at handheld gaming the right way. Handheld gaming, at least over the 20+ years it's existed has always placed battery life above graphics. This is what made the Game Boy sell better than the Game Gear. Nobody cared that the Game Boy looked like a calculator for graphics because it was cheap and had awesome battery life.

And yet over the last five years for some reason the game companies now thing graphics > battery life for handhelds despite the evidence that this is still not the case at all (see NetBooks and Tablets).

Sony is trying to play the handheld market like the console market, throwing tons of features at it hoping to hit one that sticks with the customer, and yet they go and sacrifice the very foundations of portable gaming; the battery life and the price.

Tablets have great battery life because they are smartphone hardware strapped to giant batteries.

Smartphones have shit battery life, yet people want more power with each generation. If they cared about battery life, they wouldn't have smartphones.

Game Gear, Lynx, all of them sucked because you needed a bunch of AA batteries and they were expensive and our moms hated buying them. With a modern device you just plug it in at the end of the day. Most people don't find this inconvenient.

I honestly think "better graphics" is about all the handheld systems have at this point. An underpowered PS Vita would basically be worse than a smartphone in every way but the buttons.

 

[Infinite Justice]

Uncharted tends to flow in a chunk of gameplay + short cutscene, with several of these through a level.

Would not be surprised if Golden Abyss has designed these 'chunks' to be shorter for burst-y play.

On a side note, with 'big' games with more complex threads, I've always wondered why there isn't a universal 'catch-up' feature - whereby the user could watch a short 15-30 second catch-up of key things they last did in the game. Just to jog memory and help you pick up the threads of the game again. Kind of like those stones in OoT 3D, but looking into the past instead of the future.

You sure this hasn't been patented yet?, if not go do it now lol

 

[Shai-Tan]

if it's true that you can't even use a browser while a game is running it shows Sony has completely missed the boat on apps. only doing games properly on a device like that is unacceptable today. a lot of kids dont get the ipod touch only because they want to play games or listen to music. they want to seamlessly shift between apps whether it's a game, an app, a browser. this is a moment where I realize there really is no hope for sony on the software end. they're just incompetent, full stop.

 

[Kyoufu]

if it's true that you can't even use a browser while a game is running it shows Sony has completely missed the boat on apps. only doing games properly on a device like that is unacceptable today. a lot of kids dont get the ipod touch only because they want to play games or listen to music. they want to seamlessly shift between apps whether it's a game, an app, a browser. this is a moment where I realize there really is no hope for sony on the software end. they're just incompetent, full stop.

It's only a launch issue. The OS is nowhere near "complete".

 

[test_account]

I 98% agree with you but they could have a small set of internal memory ( for quick storage or cache ) and let you use whatever memory card size you wanted afterwards.
I think they really used all the user reception of the psp go . while deciding the specs of teh vita

It does have internal memory, the OS is stored there. I think that this internal memory is also used for chaching =)

 

[Shai-Tan]

It's only a launch issue. The OS is nowhere near "complete".

where have they said that this would be fixed soon after launch? this is a company that has never fixed the significant flaws in its ps3 os because of poor planning that left no resources for those features.

 

[Satchel]

Never realized there were THAT many issues to be honest.

Fuck. Sony really know how to shatter potential don't they?

 

[patsu]

where have they said that this would be fixed soon after launch? this is a company that has never fixed the significant flaws in its ps3 os because of poor planning that left no resources for those features.

The developers confirmed to Andriasang that it will be fixed later.

Also, it is possible to run the web browser in parallel with Vita games TODAY. I tried it last week in their SF Vita event. Fired up 6 apps, including the web browser. You can swipe back and forth between them. But you need to press "Continue" to resume the game. However the game will only resume from the last save point.

In the latter patch, it's supposed to resume from where you left off. My guess is the they are still working on the image snapshot feature.

Never realized there were THAT many issues to be honest.

Fuck. Sony really know how to shatter potential don't they?

Yes and no. The OP has inaccuracies.

 

[DangerousDave]

I honestly think "better graphics" is about all the handheld systems have at this point. An underpowered PS Vita would basically be worse than a smartphone in every way but the buttons.

Also, you can upgrade the battery life in any new revision. You can enhance the internal memory in new revision. But the only thing that you cannot enhance in a new revision is the power and the graphics. So, he graphics that you get now are the graphics that you'll get during the next 6 or 7 years.

 

[Shai-Tan]

The developers confirmed to Andriasang that it will be fixed later.

Where does it say that? All I could find is "The wording of Sony's correction suggests that this is an issue that will be fixed via an update following the system's release.".

That isn't a confirmation.

 

[sajj316]

The developers confirmed to Andriasang that it will be fixed later.




Yes and no. The OP has inaccuracies.

That and it's a list of the OP's issues with PSVita. I feel that the price is right. TV out is not important to me. One account per system - I don't plan on sharing with my wife. Browser while playing games - I have my iPhone until it's fixed.

 

[Takao]

Where does it say that? All I could find is "The wording of Sony's correction suggests that this is an issue that will be fixed via an update following the system's release.".

That isn't a confirmation.

Vita has enough RAM to be able to simultaneously do that.

 

[gofreak]

where have they said that this would be fixed soon after launch? this is a company that has never fixed the significant flaws in its ps3 os because of poor planning that left no resources for those features.

Hmmm. Compare PS3 OS day one and PS3 OS now - there's a big difference. They never fixed that headline issue of cross-game chat, but do remember that initially, the PS3 didn't even have an in-game XMB. Didn't even have trophies. And that's just for starters.

And like you say, they did that with an apparently retroactive attitude toward adding such features.

Vita seems to be designed with these things in mind from the start. It seems like it's a fairly general multi-tasker - the exceptions are the web browser and the video app. It appears you can run up to 6 other apps in tandem with a game - facebook, music player, near, party, twitter etc. along with 'built-in' functions like the universal screenshot taker. More than that, it does these things FAST. Have you seen how quickly you can hop in and out of a game? It seems the OS really is running 'hot' in the background all the time. There's no pause, no loading.

The video app may never be available with a game running (it may require too much GPU depending on the vids you're watching), but I expect the web browser will be made multitask-able in time.

I'll dare to say this - if everything else works as suggested, even without the multi-tasking web browser, it will be the best game system OS to date IMO.

The developers confirmed to Andriasang that it will be fixed later.

Also, it is possible to run the web browser in parallel with Vita games TODAY. I tried it last week in their SF Vita event. Fired up 6 apps, including the web browser. You can swipe back and forth between them. But you need to press "Continue" to resume the game. However the game will only resume from the last save point.

That is news to me, and good news IMO.

Basically falls back to more traditional suspension of a game but without generalised state suspension (i.e. suspending and resuming from your last save point). Was it OK speed wise?

 

[Aizu_Itsuko]

Seems like a list of non-problems.

The only real issues we know the system has are memory card prices and battery life, which is good for the specs but I still find a handheld needs at least twice as much.

 

[Infinite Justice]

I'll dare to say this - if everything else works as suggested, even without the multi-tasking web browser, it will be the best game system OS to date IMO.

Lighting the charlequin signal


Seriously though it seems they are much more prepared this time around and honestly given the amount of shit they got/still get for PS3 it would have been crazy if they ended up at the same place again.

 

[patsu]

Where does it say that? All I could find is "The wording of Sony's correction suggests that this is an issue that will be fixed via an update following the system's release.".

That isn't a confirmation.

The original WatchImpress article is here:
http://translate.google.com/transla...ess.co.jp/docs/series/rt/20111202_494915.html

It's says "Vita initial offering, web browser and game will get exclusive access. etc. etc. etc."

Like I said, when I tried to fire up the web browser, the OS didn't complain like in PS3 XMB. And I can swipe between the web browser process and the game process freely. But I need to click on "Continue" to resume the game from its last save point. I launched 6 apps in total, and they are all there in the process list.

I suspect the web browser process will also get suspended when it's swiped out. Don't expect them to run at the same time. i.e., Don't expect the web browser to resume downloading in the background if you swipe back to a game.

 

[Shai-Tan]

Class 10 speed : 10 Mb/s
PSP Memory Pro Duo speed : 15 Mb/s min guaranteed

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Digital
https://www.oss-formats.org/en/memorystick/outline/pro.html

I'm pretty sure that if PSP cards were faster than class 10,it's pretty much given the Vita cards are faster than that due to the higher resolution of the games. That still doesn't excuse the price they are asking for them.

Class 10 cards aren't actually 10MB/s. With an adapter plugged into a PSP my cheap Patriot class 10 micro sdhc gets 18 MB/s read, 15 MB/s write (megabytes, not megabits or mb). The 8gb Sony I had did 16MB/s read/write. Not that it says anything about the memory in the Vita but their Pro Duo memory wasn't anything special.

 

[patsu]

Can someone else start a similar thread but with a proper OP ? I'll just post there since pramath doesn't want to update his OP.

 

[Shai-Tan]

I suspect the web browser process will also get suspended when it's swiped out. Don't expect them to run at the same time. i.e., Don't expect the web browser to resume downloading in the background if you swipe back to a game.

I don't think anyone expects true multitasking but it's a big mistake to not have a semi multitasking like the old ios model which makes everything in the background suspended. Even today when I load back into Safari on ipad2 the thing has to reload/redraw everything so it's not like all the apps on ipad are even designed for full multitasking even though it has it to some extent. It's actually quite annoying about using the ipad for gamefaqs to have it forget where I was in a faq when I switch back to the browser as it reloads the page like it hasn't even been visited.

 

[patsu]

That [multitasking] may be what Sony meant. The WatchImpress interviewer said "Games and web browser can run at the same time" but was corrected by Sony to say "[At] Vita initial launch, [they] will get exclusive access".

We'll know more soon.

EDIT: To put things in perspective, The Vita UI is actually more responsive than all the Android phones/tablets I have tried so far (Samsung, Sony, HTC, etc.). It is pretty close to iOS but iOS still has more refined tracking if you change direction during the tracking/swiping quickly.

If Sony port PS Suite to this thing properly, it should basically run any general app well on a 5" OLED screen.

The games I tried all run pretty well except for the LBP demo. The LBP level I toyed with seems to use a lot of physics calculations. So I had to drag a physics bubble through an obstacle course relatively slowly.

 

[Risk Breaker]

With Uncharted I can see that only have 5 minutes wouldn't provide enough time to actually do anything in Uncharted.

Yep, and that's what games like Wipeout, Lumines, Ridge Racer, Katamari, Modnation Racers, Motorstorm, UMvsC3, Hot Shots Golf, Little Deviants, Rayman Origins, Virtua Tennis, presumably Dragon's Crown, etc... offer.

Uncharted, Resistance and Gravity Daze are almost the only titles that most probably won't be playable in short bursts. Sony is very focused on offering a varied and portable friendly experience with the Vita, I think.

 

[TheJollyCorner]

>Backwards Compatibiltiy is a mess: Another big issue. The PS Vita uses a new proprietary cartridge format for its games, and so features no UMD slot. This means that it is not backwards compatible with any physical PSP games you might already own, not unless you take part in a UMD Conversion program, which requires you to pay for games you already own,and which doesn't even cover all games. Contrast this with the 3DS, which allows you to play all DS, DSi and DSiWare games right out of the box.
Digital copies of your games can and will be carried forward to your Vita, however, assuming you register the same PSN account to the device that you used to buy the games with on your PSP.

This is my central issue.

I don't have a lot of PSP games, but I just got the FFIV Collection about a month ago. My launch PSP died and I figured instead of repairing it (if that's even possible), I'd just wait to get a VITA, transfer the saves from the memory stick, etc.

Nope.
I knew VITA wouldn't have the UMD drive, but how about some kind of proof of purchase (or just sending them the damn UMD disc) and you can download the thing for no charge?

Goddamnit. :{

 

[Shai-Tan]

Uncharted, Resistance and Gravity Daze are almost the only titles that most probably won't be playable in short bursts. Sony is very focused on offering a varied and portable friendly experience with the Vita, I think.

With suspend I don't see that they aren't pick up and play in short burst. I'm playing that psp Trails in the Sky game a the moment only 5-15 minutes at a time yet it is a long RPG. I'm playing Saints Row 3 at the moment and the lack of a true pc like save state is holding me back a bit and I end up just rampaging around before quitting because I know I won't have enough time to get to a mission then spend 20 minutes doing it. Suspend means you can just pick up where you were instantly, which is what a full save state can also do as well just with some down time for loading.

 

[Brandon F]

He no idea about the memory card snafu. Pretty abysmal given the current market trends, was hoping for a true dd portable gaming machine.

Pass until prices drop.

 

[LiquidSolid]

This is my central issue.

I don't have a lot of PSP games, but I just got the FFIV Collection about a month ago. My launch PSP died and I figured instead of repairing it (if that's even possible), I'd just wait to get a VITA, transfer the saves from the memory stick, etc.

Nope.
I knew VITA wouldn't have the UMD drive, but how about some kind of proof of purchase (or just sending them the damn UMD disc) and you can download the thing for no charge?

Goddamnit. :{

Buying one version of a game doesn't entitle you to another. The fact that you bought it despite knowing that it wouldn't run on the Vita was a silly mistake on your part.

I stopped buying retail PSP games when the PSP Go was announced. At that point it was obvious Sony had realised how crap UMDs were and were starting to pull their support from them. In that time, I've managed to build up a pretty good downloadable PSP library too (though it did make me miss out on KH BBS but eh, fuck Square Enix for not releasing a PSN version).

 

[Huff]

Buying one version of a game doesn't entitle you to another. The fact that you bought it despite knowing that it wouldn't run on the Vita was a silly mistake on your part.

I stopped buying retail PSP games when the PSP Go was announced. At that point it was obvious Sony had realised how crap UMDs were and were starting to pull their support from them. In that time, I've managed to build up a pretty good downloadable PSP library too (though it did make me miss out on KH BBS but eh, fuck Square Enix for not releasing a PSN version).

Doesn't mean we couldn't hope for a better solution. A mail in system would have been clunky (and probably not worth it to Sony) but it would also have been nice for the psp owner.

 

[Luckyman]

I prefer Nintendo and the 3DS to Sony and the Vita, I have made this clear, and I do not make any bones about this fact.

Prefering 3DS to anything.. lolz.

 

[IndieJones]

Prefering 3DS to anything.. lolz.

What a thoughtful post. A real thinker.