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[imjust1n]

Why do people have to be broke to consider a $300 next gen console with a two year contract?



Expect plenty of indie devs to have very nice things to say about the next xbox also. It's just we're only hearing from the ones that are favoring Sony's approach and not excited by Microsoft's.

Because his smart phone cost him 200 and his 7 inch tablet cost him 200. New things cost lots of money that's just how it works the ps4 is going to 500plus if anyone is thinking they're going to get a 300-400 outright next generation system should think again. It's a higher end pc with win 8 that's going to play high end games....

And for the indie stuff I'm sure Microsoft will have a better indie stuff than Nintendo I'm sure but I keep hearing Microsoft not being to nice to their indie developers

 

[imjust1n]

Love the 99$ 360 idea though, too bad I already have one.

My family doesn't. I'm sure they'd like to but 250 right now is to steep so that's good they're gonna do that.

 

[imjust1n]

Because if you're not broke you'd just pay the $500 up front and not get ripped off by a subscription plan. Also, if we're talking about casual gamers, that's a lot of money for someone that doesn't care much for games. $200 has historically been the sweet spot for casual gamers.

Lol, understand that money at some points won't matter look at apple 500 for a oversized ipod touch... People went crazy. If the system shows potential money really won't be a problem.

 

[GavinGT]

Lol, understand that money at some points won't matter look at apple 500 for a oversized ipod touch... People went crazy. If the system shows potential money really won't be a problem.

I think a lot of these non-enthusiasts paying $5-600 for the newest iPhone or Galaxy SIII are doing so largely as a fashion statement of sorts. I don't honestly think these people are paying for improved tech (not primarily). They just want to be the cool guy/girl with the flashy, new phone. It's not like the average 16-year old girl really cares about 720p or improved video decoding. She's using it to text her friends, play simple games, and take shitty pictures. I don't think consoles carry the same appeal because you don't carry them around with you.

 

[Quinton McLeod]

Apple have the Coolness Factor.
There are few companies as Uncool as Microsoft, as proven by the complete flop of their tablet, phone and search attempts.

People won't throw money at them like they do Apple, this has already been conclusively proven.

I'm sorry, but I have to agree with this.
Microsoft's brand simply doesn't have that trendy persona like Apple or even Google has.

 

[oldergamer]

A 500 dollar console will and always is focused purely on hardcore gamers. Any one in here thinking that at 500 you can attract any casual players is simply not thinking realistically.

I think this means the following is possible.

A. It's not underpowered and has more under the hood then we are lead to believe
B. They will announce a slew of hardcore games
C. They will focus on advertising features that only appeal to hardcore gamers
D. 99$ Xbox 360 is for casual gamers and it will continue to get support for another 3 + years

I still think based on how much MS invested in R&D and based on the prices, they aren't going with a AMD designed, off the shelf system. There's has to be more custom parts in there that adds to the costs.

 

[bigol]

A 500 dollar console will and always is focused purely on hardcore gamers. Any one in here thinking that at 500 you can attract any casual players is simply not thinking realistically.

I think this means the following is possible.

A. It's not underpowered and has more under the hood then we are lead to believe
B. They will announce a slew of hardcore games
C. They will focus on advertising features that only appeal to hardcore gamers
D. 99$ Xbox 360 is for casual gamers and it will continue to get support for another 3 + years

I still think based on how much MS invested in R&D and based on the prices, they aren't going with a AMD designed, off the shelf system. There's has to be more custom parts in there that adds to the costs.

it is bundled with Kinect 2.0 thus the price

 

[CLEEK]

A 500 dollar console will and always is focused purely on hardcore gamers. Any one in here thinking that at 500 you can attract any casual players is simply not thinking realistically.

I think this means the following is possible.

A. It's not underpowered and has more under the hood then we are lead to believe
B. They will announce a slew of hardcore games
C. They will focus on advertising features that only appeal to hardcore gamers
D. 99$ Xbox 360 is for casual gamers and it will continue to get support for another 3 + years

I still think based on how much MS invested in R&D and based on the prices, they aren't going with a AMD designed, off the shelf system. There's has to be more custom parts in there that adds to the costs.

A 500 dollar games console, sure. But the next Xbox will be a 500 dollar entertainment console, that also plays games. MS want it to be attractive to core gamers, casual gamers, non gamers alike.

 

[Dead Man]

$500 is the least offensive rumour I have heard so far. Nine years of inflation doesn't cover the full $100 increase, but it is not super unreasonable to me. Of course, PS3 was $1000 at launch here :/

It's all the other stuff that I really hate.

 

[oldergamer]

A 500 dollar games console, sure. But the next Xbox will be a 500 dollar entertainment console, that also plays games. MS want it to be attractive to core gamers, casual gamers, non gamers alike.

it doesn't matter. price is the deciding factor when approaching casuals (both gamer and non gamer). it doesn't matter what it does to be a "entertainment" device. To attract non gamers/casual buyers it has to be at a price range that makes sense first and foremost.

If its 500 then they clearly are not focused on casuals to start.

 

[GavinGT]

$500 is the least offensive rumour I have heard so far. Nine years of inflation doesn't cover the full $100 increase, but it is not super unreasonable to me. Of course, PS3 was $1000 at launch here :/

It's all the other stuff that I really hate.

PS3 and 360 were also heavily subsidized at launch. They can't keep heavily subsidizing if that strategy doesn't prove profitable, so paying an amount closer to the actual build cost seems reasonable to me.

 

[Shadders]

A 500 dollar games console, sure. But the next Xbox will be a 500 dollar entertainment console, that also plays games. MS want it to be attractive to core gamers, casual gamers, non gamers alike.

You're right, of course, but what entertainment services can it offer over what's currently on the market? I'm sure it will have a lovely Netflix app, but will that app be markedly better than what's on 360? I'm not sure what entertainment jazz they could put in there that would justify the expense over just getting a 360..

 

[coldfoot]

I worked at target when the ps3 came out. I had just regular people buy the ps3 because of the blu ray player for 600..... People will buy..... Ifff you show them it's worth 600. At the time there was no blu rays and blu rays made your brand new HD TV play new movies flawlessly in beautiful colors. If Microsoft shows that this thing is going to deliver everything for 299$ with a 14$ monthly sub for 2 years you bet my mom would buy it and get rid of cable and be dancing with the kinetic with dance central lol

That monthly payment will not give you ANYTHING that cable gives you, so why would she cancel cable. People, you are not paying for CONTENT with Live.

 

[BloodMoney]

$500 seems way too high, even if Kinect 2 is included. $300 with the subscription model is pretty nuts too.

$500 with kinect included... i don't even want kinect 2 bundled. And while i am sure the $300 version will not come with the next Kinect, it will also probably have gimp'd specs (hd, input/output, etc) and require a subscription.

 

[Phreaker]

I also don't think a $300 console with a two-year contract will appeal to anyone but broke hardcore gamers.

Why? I've already paid for Live for 10 years now. If I can get the console for $300 for keeping Live for another two years that's a win for me.

 

[Osiris]

Why? I've already paid for Live for 10 years now. If I can get the console for $300 for keeping Live for another two years that's a win for me.

It's not just paying for "two years of Live" though, most people do that with the cheap one year option, it's paying at the monthly subscription rate of $15 a month which is what is required for these subsidized offers.

You may have paid for Live for 10 years, but there's no way on earth you've been paying $180 a year to do so.

 

[ascii42]

It's not just paying for "two years of Live" though, most people do that with the cheap one year option, it's paying at the monthly subscription rate of $15 a month which is what is required for these subsidized offers.

You may have paid for Live for 10 years, but there's no way on earth you've been paying $180 a year to do so.

That definitely puts it in perspective. Yeah...no.

 

[twinturbo2]

It should be, but power spent processing Kinect data is power not spent processing the rest of the game.

Kinect was originally supposed to have a processing chip built in until it ended up too expensive and they had to ditch that idea. I assume it's quite thirsty too, and Kinect 2.0 is probably even thirstier.

::scratches chin::

So, this is to ensure that Kinect 2: Electric Boogaloo is everything that the original promised, and then some. Hm, we could see some great things to come out of this, more than just Dance Central stuff.

 

[enzo_gt]

You're right, of course, but what entertainment services can it offer over what's currently on the market? I'm sure it will have a lovely Netflix app, but will that app be markedly better than what's on 360? I'm not sure what entertainment jazz they could put in there that would justify the expense over just getting a 360..

Not just Netflix. For the few informed individuals in the broader market, even smart TVs do that. It's not a Netflix machine, it's an everything machine. If it does cable, you can hand your cable box back back to your provider for a subsidized Durango. It does Blu-Ray. It does on-demand content from the Internet. It does YouTube. It does social media. It's a DVR. It has a Minority Report interface. And on top of that it lets you do all these things simultaneously.

Microsoft is pushing for a device that consolidates every piece of technology you use. And it can connect with every other piece of technology you use, whether its in the W8/MS account ecosystem or not via SmartGlass. That's ambitious in it's own right, and obviously folks will flock to what is newer because of added functionality and longer support since 360 sales aren't going to be this high forever.

The real question is if MS can sell the interconnectivity to the consumer, and persuade them to replace the individual devices they have that already do what they need to do with something like this. That's not an easy task. I don't doubt people will bite, especially with the subsidized $99 or $299 version, but I think they need to convey their vision right and make sure this shiny new thing for their living room is desirable beyond just being a shiny new thing. That's what will make good sales great.

 

[Phreaker]

It's not just paying for "two years of Live" though, most people do that with the cheap one year option, it's paying at the monthly subscription rate of $15 a month which is what is required for these subsidized offers.

You may have paid for Live for 10 years, but there's no way on earth you've been paying $180 a year to do so.

Oh! Yeah, fuck that. I pay $35 a year tops. Thanks for the explanation.

 

[LittleJohnny]

It's not just paying for "two years of Live" though, most people do that with the cheap one year option, it's paying at the monthly subscription rate of $15 a month which is what is required for these subsidized offers.

You may have paid for Live for 10 years, but there's no way on earth you've been paying $180 a year to do so.

That definitely puts it in perspective. Yeah...no.

Here's a little more perspective.

$300 plus 180 x 2yrs = $660
$500 plus 60 x 2yrs = $620

A mere $40 buck difference without having to shell out $500 bucks at the store. A little more than $40 if you're frugal about Xbox Live payments but still, not that big of a deal.

Bonus perspective:

You walk in with $500, you leave with the new Xbox and no games.

You walk in with $500, you leave with the new Xbox, 3 games and money to spare. I'll take that for a nickel a day

 

[megashock5]

Here's a little more perspective.

$300 plus 180 x 2yrs = $660
$500 plus 60 x 2yrs = $620

A mere $40 buck difference without having to shell out $500 bucks at the store. A little more than $40 if you're frugal about Xbox Live payments but still, not that big of a deal.

Bonus perspective:

You walk in with $500, you leave with the new Xbox and no games.

You walk in with $500, you leave with the new Xbox, 3 games and money to spare.

But, does the $15/month subscription include Live? I honestly don't know, I assumed it didn't.

 

[MaulerX]

If they offer a $300 2 year XBL subsidized option, doesn't that mean that the $500 option does not require a subscription? Meaning, always-online not required? Or will everyone be required to have at least a free silver membership?

 

[MaulerX]

But, does the $15/month subscription include Live? I honestly don't know, I assumed it didn't.

The subscription gives you XBL gold.

 

[ascii42]

Here's a little more perspective.

$300 plus 180 x 2yrs = $660
$500 plus 60 x 2yrs = $620

A mere $40 buck difference without having to shell out $500 bucks at the store. A little more than $40 if you're frugal about Xbox Live payments but still, not that big of a deal.

Bonus perspective:

You walk in with $500, you leave with the new Xbox and no games.

You walk in with $500, you leave with the new Xbox, 3 games and money to spare. I'll take that for a nickel a day

I'd rather save $40 that I don't have to spend. Or I could just not pay for gold at all. I've gone back and forth between Gold and Silver a couple times with the 360.

 

[netBuff]

Here's a little more perspective.

$300 plus 180 x 2yrs = $660
$500 plus 60 x 2yrs = $620

A mere $40 buck difference without having to shell out $500 bucks at the store. A little more than $40 if you're frugal about Xbox Live payments but still, not that big of a deal.

Bonus perspective:

You walk in with $500, you leave with the new Xbox and no games.

You walk in with $500, you leave with the new Xbox, 3 games and money to spare. I'll take that for a nickel a day

Your calculation is flawed: I can get a 12 month XBL subscription for $48 dollars without even investing any effort searching.

And you'd rather pay more money overall and, at the same time, be inflexible should you lose interest in Gold, would rather save money or just don't need it for some time?

 

[infinityBCRT]

Your calculation is flawed: I can get a 12 month XBL subscription for $48 dollars without even investing any effort searching.

Official MSRP is $60 and I bet you most people who have a subscription are paying $60. Not everyone is savvy as you.

 

[G17]

Thurrott will be on Windows Weekly with Leo Laporte shortly (in about 10 minutes?).. he is bound to address the Xbox stuff:

http://live.twit.tv/

 

[megashock5]

The subscription gives you XBL gold.

Interesting. I didn't realize that, it definitely has an impact on the overall price.

 

[Zeth]

Thurott's live podcast on Twit.tv is starting in a few minutes. Hoping they acknowledge some of this week's xbox news/rumors.

 

[G17]

Thurrott will be on Windows Weekly with Leo Laporte shortly (in about 10 minutes?).. he is bound to address the Xbox stuff:

http://live.twit.tv/

Thurrott and Laporte are finally on stream now. Click the link for the stream.

 

[Tomcat]

Thurrott will be on Windows Weekly with Leo Laporte shortly (in about 10 minutes?).. he is bound to address the Xbox stuff:

http://live.twit.tv/

he did that on what the tech podcast

 

[borghe]

to those saying the subscription xbox (or ANY TV subscription) isn't a bad deal..

you have to look at the TV subscription model and other similar industries (newspaper, magazine, etc).

The US added 10M households last year. ALL TV SERVICES COMBINED in the US added 400K subscribers. So in all of the new households added, 4% subscribed to a new TV service. Now when you extrapolate that number (assuming more than 4% signed up for cable), that means the cable industry LOST subs... They are just barely getting the subs from new households slower than they are losing them.

In one year, you will probably see the first flat year, or possibly even loss in net TV subs. This is the same thing the newspaper and magazine industry saw, BOTH of whom had record high subscription numbers as recently as the past 10 years. But when those numbers started going down, it wasn't a gradual decline. It was a cliff.

So, when you say "that subscription model isn't too bad" remember that by a year out many many many people are going to be saying "uggh.. I need to cut my cable" and they'll still have a year left on their contract.

Granted, it's a great market for MS to get into, and one that sony will have to combat.. Because there are plenty of stupid people who aren't going to look that far in the future. They have cable now. They've had cable in their house for 30 years, they'll have cable in their house forever. It makes sense to them.

But to the gamers in this thread... when you say it's not a bad deal... ask yourself what the chances are that you will still want a pay tv service in two years from now... and is that $200 off the price of the xbox worth being locked into that.

Fortunately for MS, this tactic will absolutely shift some units. Especially if the PS4 is priced in parity with the full-priced durango.

 

[AgentP]

Here's a little more perspective.

$300 plus 180 x 2yrs = $660
$500 plus 60 x 2yrs = $620

A mere $40 buck difference without having to shell out $500 bucks at the store.

Now factor in early cancellation fees if you want to resell the console (if allowed) or cancel the sub. Paying more and MS holding your balls is not a good deal.

 

[borghe]

Now factor in early cancellation fees if you want to resell the console (if allowed) or cancel the sub. Paying more and MS holding your balls is not a good deal.

You will be able to sell the console. The cable company is the one who will subsidize the unit.. You will simply be locked into a contract with them. You are correct about the ETF WHEN (not if) you decide to cut the cable.

For perspective... you can technically sell your mobile phone while in contract with your mobile provider. of course you are still locked into your contract and now don't have a phone. Same thing with the nextbox.. only it won't be serving your TV picture.

 

[enzo_gt]

Thurrott will be on Windows Weekly with Leo Laporte shortly (in about 10 minutes?).. he is bound to address the Xbox stuff:

http://live.twit.tv/

*tune in*
*they're making fun of Windows 8*

720 prices confirmed.

 

[enzo_gt]

Sorry for double post but he's talking about the 720 now. He said no one from the media ever contacted him to know more.

EDIT:
He said he doesn't really know what always online means, doesn't know if it's for DRM specifically.

MS insider sent him a lot of info recently who gave him info and said this source gave him info that some of it confirms what he knows, some of it directly contradicts what he knows, and some of it he doesn't know anything about. He said he held back on divulging this info because of how questionable his source was but the guy went to other blogs and they published it anyways (the stuff that happened yesterday).

- Heard about new Forza
- Ryse
- Family oriented Kinect-only game
- Gold Family memberships will only cost the same as a single Gold membership
- MS moving to currency for payments instead of MS points.
- No date for launch for launch (Thurrott heard before first week of November)
- Not cutting price of 360 (Thurott heard about cheaper model; likely refers to Mini)

 

[jbug617]

He also said something about people posting these rumors like they are real

 

[Beer Monkey]

He said he doesn't really know what always online means

And when he realized that, he should have just not posted anything about "always online".

 

[Rösti]

I happened to look at the MSFT stock while listening to Windows Weekly, and saw this (at 12:48 p.m. PT):

-4.92% is quite a deal, does anyone know what triggered this?

 

[Tyrax]

I happened to look at the MSFT stock while listening to Windows Weekly, and saw this (at 12:48 p.m. PT):

-4.92% is quite a deal, does anyone know what triggered this?

They also rose over 5% in the two days prior. Most likely some hedge funds playing games with the stock market

 

[enzo_gt]

He also said something about people posting these rumors like they are real

Mostly just a critique on journalism posting and phrasing stuff as fact in their headlines and articles. Nothing new.

 

[Miles Quaritch]

Sorry for double post but he's talking about the 720 now. He said no one from the media ever contacted him to know more.

EDIT:
He said he doesn't really know what always online means, doesn't know if it's for DRM specifically.

MS insider sent him a lot of info recently who gave him info and said this source gave him info that some of it confirms what he knows, some of it directly contradicts what he knows, and some of it he doesn't know anything about. He said he held back on divulging this info because of how questionable his source was but the guy went to other blogs and they published it anyways (the stuff that happened yesterday).

- Heard about new Forza
- Ryse
- Family oriented Kinect-only game
- Gold Family memberships will only cost the same as a single Gold membership
- MS moving to currency for payments instead of MS points.
- No date for launch for launch (Thurrott heard before first week of November)
- Not cutting price of 360 (Thurott heard about cheaper model; likely refers to Mini)

Multiple subs for the price of one? Most interesting.

Hating that they thinking of moving away from MSP. Terrible decision.

 

[RSTEIN]

I happened to look at the MSFT stock while listening to Windows Weekly, and saw this (at 12:48 p.m. PT):

-4.92% is quite a deal, does anyone know what triggered this?

Check out HPQ and INTC.

PC shipment numbers came in this morning. Basically the worst ever seen.

 

[gaming_noob]

- Gold Family memberships will only cost the same as a single Gold membership

No wonder they scrapped the current Family membership plan. I'm OK if I could split the $60 cost with 3 other friends. Still having to pay for online but at $15 a year I won't complain.

 

[infinityBCRT]

Multiple subs for the price of one? Most interesting.

HA! I called that when Family Gold Subscriptions went away.

 

[Rösti]

Check out HPQ and INTC.

PC shipment numbers came in this morning. Basically the worst ever seen.

Ah, I see. Well, I wasn't expecting any greater numbers anyway. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[Dark Octave]

Oh please. Between your iphone, fancy shoes, ipad, HDTV and PC, $500 for a (hopefully) one time purchase of the next Xbox ain't shit. Quit acting stupid, people. It's also the price you pay for needing it year one or two.

Now all the other "issues" and added on fees such as Live and who knows what else, I can see having a problem with.

$500 for what we expect this thing will be capable of is fair no matter what your personal financial situation is.

 

[tfur]

I happened to look at the MSFT stock while listening to Windows Weekly, and saw this (at 12:48 p.m. PT):

-4.92% is quite a deal, does anyone know what triggered this?

Probably reports and the downgrade.
Microsoft Corporation (MSFT) Downgraded By Goldman Sachs
http://www.valuewalk.com/2013/04/microsoft-corporation-msft-downgraded-by-goldman-sachs/

It will be interesting to see what happens later this month after earnings reports.

 

[mckmas8808]

Multiple subs for the price of one? Most interesting.

Hating that they thinking of moving away from MSP. Terrible decision.

Proves Sony has it right on this one.