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[Shmunter]

so with the games being cross gen do you buy one copy of the game and it works on both PS4 and Ps5 or do you have to buy separate versions. obvs back combat on ps5 will play ps4 version but will buying ps5 version allow you to play a ps4 version?

On digital games are marked with poth ps4 and PS5 logos if both sku’s are under the one purchase. With a PS5 disc, I’m not so sure it will work on PS4.

 

[Three]

On digital games are marked with poth ps4 and PS5 logos if both sku’s are under the one purchase. With a PS5 disc, I’m not so sure it will work on PS4.

Good point. I haven't tried any discs.

 

[kyliethicc]

so with the games being cross gen do you buy one copy of the game and it works on both PS4 and Ps5 or do you have to buy separate versions. obvs back combat on ps5 will play ps4 version but will buying ps5 version allow you to play a ps4 version?

PS5 discs cannot be played on PS4.

You buy the PS4 disc, then can upgrade to PS5 version digitally, or just sell your PS4 copy and then buy the PS5 disc.

Or just buy digital. If you do an upgrade, you still keep the PS4 digital version too.

PS4 and PS5 versions remain separate and labeled as PS4 / PS5 games on the UI. Both can played, downloaded, etc.

 

[Shelookdlvl18]

You don't accept my opinions and observations are made in good faith, you outright claim that I'm console warring/spreading fud, and dismiss my years of experience in development as being irrelevant in terms of giving me insight into development practices and what that means for the end product.

What sort of response do you expect from me?
Being rude and proudly proclaiming that your views are uninformed ones doesn't encourage me to read your posts or treat you as worth responding to.

FYI I mentioned Xbox for 2 reasons only: Primarily to point out the difference in deployment strategy (Smart Delivery) and how the existence of current gen hardware at two stepping levels (Series S and Series X) muddies the waters a bit in terms of what commentators might mean when talking about multi-platform delivery being "held back". Bottom line being that Sony and MS are going about things in quite different ways, and so when comparing the two you shouldn't conflate their respective strengths and weaknesses. Both have their pros and cons.

Not particularly. Using your supposed experience, you hardly presented anything you stated as opinion. But even taking you at your word in regards to experience, and giving you the benefit of the doubt. The claims you've made appear vastly onesided. This thread isn't about Xbox, yet you readily found not one, but two reasons to explain in detail as to how their process goes... While coyly mentioning that you have no experience with the Series X/S.

I could give your experience all the weight possible to support your claims, but when they run completely counter to pretty much what every dev says regarding the topic. It still falls short.

At the end of the day, your experience as a developer will only carry you so far. At some point, if your going to engage so actively in a discussion, you need to be able to cognitively put forth a reasonable argument as to justify the claims you make, and the examples you use. At this point you've failed to do that. Then when recieving pushback, instead of using your experience to help you provide a more informed and nuanced response... You instead choose to use your experience as some sort of badge of authority.

I've already given you examples of this, and you have yet to provide any sort of response. I have no reason to believe you to be any variety of console warrior except for the posts you provide. In a thread about Sony's cross-gen decisions, and their messaging previously. You apparently found it perfectly reasonable to stumble all off into the weeds regarding Xbox and how incredibly frustrating developing for their platform is across it's consoles and pc, despite having not personally done so apparently. When other people tried to steer you back on track, and focus on the PS4/5. All of the sudden, it was completely different logic used, with the examples you gave regarding GoW and HZD being among the worst I've seen here.

If you believe anything I say, then believe me when I say that I don't mean it personally. However, when you handcuff your statements and opinions to your career experience the way you have, there's realistically no way to avoid that. Which results in anyone questioning your opinion being seen as a personal insult. I can argue with a Doctor all day long about politics and he's most likely to not take offense. However, the second I question his suggestion that in order to prevent lung cancer I should take up smoking... He's liable to take it as an insult. He's got years of experience. Who am I to question him?

 

[Papacheeks]

With Ratchet out showing what a game designed around the specifics of the console like using all the cores of Zen, and the insane I/O tells me people again like Digital Foundry, Colin Moriarty's words will not age super well. It's a classic case of Knee jerk.

Same will be said when we see the first U5 based game designed around PS5. It sucks that GT7, Horizon and GOW are cross gen. Especially GOW. But we also have not seen what the rest of their studios are working on and I at least know of 3 projects that are basically PS5 only currently in development.

One of which changed to PS5 only recently. I hope we get a state of play later this month or July. Even if we dont we have some amazing games coming that really show off what Next gen can do.

 

[Clear]

Not particularly. Using your supposed experience, you hardly presented anything you stated as opinion.

Its implicit. Duh.

Or do you expect every post to be accompanied by footnotes and hyperlinks wikipedia-style?

 

[Shelookdlvl18]

Its implicit. Duh.

Or do you expect every post to be accompanied by footnotes and hyperlinks wikipedia-style?

Well if that's the best response you can muster, I suppose we're done here.

Carry on.

 

[BlackTron]

Nintendo never say exclusive because for them it's a given. Switch got so many cross gen ports though that I don't know what your point is. They left Wii U in the dust but were there complaints that the majority of games are just Wii U ports and don't utilise switch? Not really. There should have been.

Because you have allowed the point to zip entirely over your head I'm pretty sure that if I tried to answer you it would continue to do so, but oh well:

"Nintendo never say exclusive because for them it's a given" -even if this was true, it seems off base to bring this up when Sony says Playstation Exclusive on their own IP that should be a given too, not only their contracted deals. Why isn't it a given there? But I don't want to start picking apart Nintendo's behavior in real life because:

My point was to portray Nintendo doing EXACTLY what Sony just did to stimulate an alternate perspective on it.

The first word of my post was "imagine" and then you try to point out factual inaccuracies. What Nintendo actually did in real life is irrelevant (they did not do what Sony did, obviously, so my example is hypothetical). In the real world, Wii U didn't have an install base over 100 million, so few would feel betrayed. However it doesn't matter whether their last system IRL was Wii U or Game Boy because I just wrote a story as an example lol. Again this is why the very first word of the post was IMAGINE.

In short, my example portrayed Nintendo as taking the EXACT same steps as Sony to provoke looking at things from multiple perspectives. In that context, trying to pick apart what they really did, or would, or wouldn't do in real life is a total waste of time.

 

[Sinthor]

Wow, ok, that surprised the heck out of me. I was being a snob and demanding that I play R&C at the high quality mode, but especially after seeing the performance and comparison, I'm switching to Performance RT mode. Just can't tell the difference graphic wise, the RT is awesome and 60FPS! And this is still early in the generation, folks! I don't know that we'll end up seeing the same kind of performance at full 4k with these consoles...but you know they'll be able to get better or add more of the quality eye candy stuff at higher FPS. Insomniac is INSANE being able to pull all of this off.

In a way it makes me even more sad that games like Horizon and GoW 2 will be cross gen and probably not reach this high of a mark but you know what? We will see. Maybe we'll be surprised. And in the end, PS5 only games will be coming and be the norm fairly soon regardless. This game really makes me think we're going to see AMAZING things, even more than the Demon's Souls remake made me think so. Actually, this game does look the best of anything I've seen yet and to do it at 1440p and 60fps is just awesome. Feeling stoked!

 

[Rentahamster]

No, we are GPU limited because the hardware is using a rasterizer which is 2D and all rendering is done in this 2D space. It won't be different until we switch to full 3D world space rendering calculations.


No. The GPU is much faster than the CPUs. If we started offloading the majority of computations to the CPU, the game would bottleneck even the high end CPUs. For example, I would naturally use the CPU for physics calculations but if I can move my code to the GPU to do those same physics calculations, it would be computed several orders of magnitude faster. That's called GPGPU or general-purpose GPU.

It's always best to offload the most expensive calculations to the GPU since it's way more efficient than the CPU and it's RAM.

I'm not sure if I adequately conveyed my point last time. I was responding to your idea that being constrained by the CPU or other next gen features like a fast SSD are the exception rather than the rule. I'm not sure how much a choice there is if the minimum spec can't handle a dev's more grandiose ideas.

This leads me to believe that there is nothing new to innovate with the same game's design. R&C did a great idea with the SSD but every game doesn't need that. The only thing I would agree on about being held back by previous generations would be physics (i.e. GT7) and high CPU use games.

It's a catch 22. There's nothing new to innovate if you can't innovate due to hardware limitations. As a consumer, I don't want marginally iterative game design. I want something more like R&C that presents a generational leap in capability and design. Shouldn't that be what generations are about?

Take this developer interview, for example:



The CPU limitations are the concrete wall that limits frame rate. These are the high CPU games that are being held back. Games with a more ambitious and complex design are going to have a lot more CPU calculations going on under the hood. It seems like these types of games are oftentimes those same "high CPU use" games, and if we constrain them with last gen hardware, we have to settle for last gen experiences.