EdibleKnife
Member
I've already mentioned before but it's completely possible he bought a weapon without his wife's knowledge.
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Disabled Father Killed by Police in Charlotte, NC (Protests Follow)
- Thread starter EdibleKnife
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I've already mentioned before but it's completely possible he bought a weapon without his wife's knowledge.
He has a gun. K.
He might have been smoking. K.
He might have had prior incidents. K.
however
it never should have even gotten to this point. He wasn't the suspect. He didn't start in the conflict. I mean put yourself in his shoes (I know its hard for some of you), You are sitting in your car minding your buisness. And then suddenly this dude (who is undercover,no? so he doesn't even seem like a cop probably), pulls a gun on you out the blue. You are scared shittless. Generally the first option is flight or fight...he chose fight against this unknown guy....and by then shit went bad and he is now dead. The alternative is to let this guy have his way and potentially still die and also have your wife killed too, no? I don't know if I'd risk that...just saying.
but again regardless of all that shit. Unless tjhe above 3 are good enough reasons to die, the cops are still very much at fault here and to try to handwave that away as "an unfortrunate mistake" is sad...more so considering a similar event legit happened days before....and another a week before....and another a month before. This isn't some new shocking event guy.
He might have been smoking. K.
He might have had prior incidents. K.
however
it never should have even gotten to this point. He wasn't the suspect. He didn't start in the conflict. I mean put yourself in his shoes (I know its hard for some of you), You are sitting in your car minding your buisness. And then suddenly this dude (who is undercover,no? so he doesn't even seem like a cop probably), pulls a gun on you out the blue. You are scared shittless. Generally the first option is flight or fight...he chose fight against this unknown guy....and by then shit went bad and he is now dead. The alternative is to let this guy have his way and potentially still die and also have your wife killed too, no? I don't know if I'd risk that...just saying.
but again regardless of all that shit. Unless tjhe above 3 are good enough reasons to die, the cops are still very much at fault here and to try to handwave that away as "an unfortrunate mistake" is sad...more so considering a similar event legit happened days before....and another a week before....and another a month before. This isn't some new shocking event guy.
jordan0386
Member
Very racist for them to assume he had an illegal gun.
On your first point there's a huge difference between being in the hand or in a holster.
Of course they are. It isn't legal to be carrying one around in hand. That's considered brandishing. I don't get why people have such a hard time understanding the legal and threat level difference between carrying one in a holster or hand.
Forerunner
Member
I was a cop in the military for six years. I have enough real world experience and training to know what I'm talking about. If he would have tried anything he would have been dead before he got any accurate shots off, but he's fucking dead anyways.
He wasn't complying, but he wasn't showing an intent to use the weapon at all.
So the guy gets out of the car. He has something in his hand. He walks backwards casually, looking pretty damn blazed imo. Before anything can happen someone drops what? 4 shots? in the direction of this dude. I don't get it?
Here's what I don't get about police.
You are trained for this kind of thing. I mean you go to the academy and shit and you are trained to handle people who could or could not be hostile and you're telling me within a second you have to take the 4 shots and kill this dude? I mean from what I've been told by people who did tours in the military over in Iraq they have better restraint than this shit. What the fuck man?
I don't think anyone wants anyone to just risk getting shot. I don't think that's what anyone's asking for. What everyone with a fucking conscience wants is for these professionals to have some god damned restraint and try and saves lives. It's fucking serve and protect. That includes everyone, not just who you pick and choose. It includes the guy or girl you're having a problem with too. I don't get how that's so fucking hard for people to understand. I don't get it. It pisses me off.
I don't blame anyone in the black community for being so pissed they feel like they're running out of options. At some point everyone as a member of the human race needs to wake the fuck up and realize that it's not an equal world out there. It's never been an equal world. Regain your humanity and want a change.
Here's what I don't get about police.
You are trained for this kind of thing. I mean you go to the academy and shit and you are trained to handle people who could or could not be hostile and you're telling me within a second you have to take the 4 shots and kill this dude? I mean from what I've been told by people who did tours in the military over in Iraq they have better restraint than this shit. What the fuck man?
I don't think anyone wants anyone to just risk getting shot. I don't think that's what anyone's asking for. What everyone with a fucking conscience wants is for these professionals to have some god damned restraint and try and saves lives. It's fucking serve and protect. That includes everyone, not just who you pick and choose. It includes the guy or girl you're having a problem with too. I don't get how that's so fucking hard for people to understand. I don't get it. It pisses me off.
I don't blame anyone in the black community for being so pissed they feel like they're running out of options. At some point everyone as a member of the human race needs to wake the fuck up and realize that it's not an equal world out there. It's never been an equal world. Regain your humanity and want a change.
Ploid 3.0
Member
Of all the posts on gaf I have ever read. This right here is the thing that left me in shock. Kind of makes me think back on when guild members found out I was black in FFXI. They were shocked and in disbelief because I was nice, but I doubt they would go as far as saying "why would I want black friends?"
This person seem to think black people are not regular people, or maybe only act one way. What would be wrong with having a black friend, it's like saying I wouldn't want a friend name Tom. What is the problem with Toms?
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If I get pulled over by a cop, I will keep begging them to please don't kill me. I will lick the floor if they tell me to, I just hope they aren't just in a bad mood, handle me rough causing me to maybe move a certain way, making them think instead of trying to relieve pain, break my fall, or receive a blow with my hand instead of my face, that I am resisting arrest. I won't even ask what I'm being arrested for. I'd rather live. Even then I don't think that would be enough, imagine if I sneeze :\
Or she lied knowing that it would feed into the anti cop mentality and people would believe it with no evidence?
DoubleTake
Member
Are you serious? Anyone already pointing their gun at a target will surely shoot and hit that target before someone that has their hands at their sides has a chance to raise and aim. These are trained...officers we're talking about, not civilians.
Well, I'm not in a position to argue with you then. If what I heard on the news is true though, the police might still classify these situations as justified shootings. Personally, I still get it. I think that anyone who doesn't drop a weapon when instructed is communicating an intent to use it. But if it's true that the police can easily disable someone, the instant they move to use their weapon, it would obviously be better to wait for that moment.
EdibleKnife
Member
He didn't even raise his hands or anything he got out walked back and they shot him for no reason. I mean the cops were hiding behind cars surrounding him and not one of them could have tasered him or something non lethal. The dash cam is pretty clear cut that he wasn't even a threat, so senseless.
Forerunner
Member
I can understand that train of thought. The officers knew he had a weapon and wasn’t complying, so that probably put them on edge. However, these officers should be trained for these types of situations and from the video they fucked up.
Captin Quacker
Member
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
The gun certainly gives the police reason to be very cautious. But I still fail to see whey there were nearly a dozen cops going after this guy in the first place. People feel the need to strut their authority at every turn.
I don't think anything will come from this. That the cops asked repeatedly for him to drop whatever he had is probably enough for there to be no punishment from this. It doesn't look like he was raising his hands to aim at the cops, and was backing away.
I don't think anything will come from this. That the cops asked repeatedly for him to drop whatever he had is probably enough for there to be no punishment from this. It doesn't look like he was raising his hands to aim at the cops, and was backing away.
Me too. I'm guessing they never clearly identify themselves as cops at the beginning of the encounter?
Officers are terrible shots in general. In New York, with it's above average training they only hit 30% of the time when the suspect isn't shooting back. It drops to 18% when returning fire. While they don't train to react to those stats, there's a larger problem in that most people don't go down right away unless hit in the nervous system and can easily fire back before dying. That aspect is definitely trained into them. I'm honestly surprised the cops waited as long as they did before firing. They gave him many warnings to drop it.
http://nation.time.com/2013/09/16/ready-fire-aim-the-science-behind-police-shooting-bystanders/
Perhaps they don't want to understand the difference
A Human Becoming
More than a Member
I think the dash cam footage proves Keith was not threatening any of the cops. None of them were in immediate danger. It looks like they shot him solely because he would not drop the gun he did or did not have.
BlazinSkatinAxel
Member
Dude was shot 6 secs after getting out after they told him to get out. I have to listen to the wife's video but I don't recall hearing any commands in that 6 secs.
Crazy.
This isn't up for debate anymore. He had a gun in his hand. You can clearly see a gun in his hand in the body cam video if you pause it around 18 seconds.
first thing I thought about is the sound to start the body cam footage... for all we know the guy who got killed could've been saying something.
they are required by law to have an unedited version right? I know that should not be asked, but somethings things don't surprised me.
Gotdatmoney
Member
Trash human being.
From the looks of it, it just seems to be the audio in the first half of the body cam footage. I wish it were there though, as it certainly doesn't help the situation by having it missing and leading to more speculation. Otherwise, it looks like the video was only edited in terms of cutting it down to the specific incident of the shooting. I can't see anything added or edited though that puts the cops in a better light.
I'm not sure that would be related to any edits though. From the press conference earlier, tactical units and the like (such as these warrant officers) do not wear cams and they were the first on the scene. The only one fully loaded up with camera and audio seems to be the officer who arrived after the situation had already escalated.
So speaking specifically in regards to video edits, I don't think that would be something that had been cut out, as the uniformed officers didn't arrive until after the fact and wouldn't have it on camera to begin with.
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
How would he be able to drop it if it means he would have to move his hands? Wouldn't that be MORE threatening?
Wouldn't the shooting be MORE justified if he had to move to drop it? Movements make people jumpier, no? Imagine he just make any sorts of movements to indicate he would drop his gun ...
:x
This argument doesn't make sense to me. Can't win, being black, eh.
One of the most blatantly racist posts I have seen on GAF. It's really weird that he was posting in poligaf just today talking shit about Trump. Guess you never know about people, but there are some issues that will push them over the edge. For them it was saying bad things about cops.
A Human Becoming
More than a Member
I can't see it. It's a very brief shot on a low res camera.
FreedomFighter
Member
Someone just felt like shooting someone and that's what they did.
jordan0386
Member
Most are viewed as heroes and most cops look like him.
To bash cops, would be slander on his way of life/thinking.
Yep, exactly what I said isn't it.
Did they not find a gun? If I am mistaken then I am sorry. I saw that there was a gun.
Not at all, but if he had a gun and she told them then it may have been able to be handled differently.
I have no idea why she said that there was none.
Again, forgive me but I am under the impression that there was a gun.
he's fucking dead.
In the heat of the moment, that seems to be quite a stretch. If someone is pointing a gun at a family member I imagine your first thought isn't how to frame their death to increase anti-police sentiment. I would imagine most people want to figure out how to deescalate the situation instead.
If she knew about the gun, despite what she said on camera, the most I would be willing to go with is that she was trying to lower the intensity of the situation and get the officers to back off some. In the end though, I can very well imagine she simply didn't know, especially being a small ankle holster weapon that is easy to hide. It could even be something he kept hidden more in his vehicle and unseen at home. For all we know, he could have purchased it that day and she wasn't aware yet.
Jmanunknown
Member
Of course its not looking good for the guy he's dead. The only thing in question is whether or not the officer was justified in taking away his life from him.
I agree with you.
That is why I do not understand other options.
Saying that he had a gun and warning the cops I think could have ended things differently.
Maybe not, maybe I just want to think that there was a chance but like you say I can see no reason why she would say that there was none
And you may be right, while I think that warning about the gun could have softened it she could have thought the opposite.
Forerunner
Member
Yup, nothing is going to happen to these cops. The guy was black and had a gun and drugs. They have all the justification they need even though they fucked up. The whole situation doesnt make sense. If they knew the guy had a gun why the fuck would they be that close trying to break his window opened? They fucked up on so many levels, yet theyll get away with it.
Chmpocalypse
Blizzard
You're probably right about. I know as a White person, I was always taught that cops are heroes, cops can be trusted, cops can do no wrong. It is embedded in most of us. They won't question any possibility is may not be absolute, even if it means admitting racism over it. Fucking sad.
FreedomFighter
Member
Unbelievable comments up in here now that video is released.
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