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[Wrestlemania]

The higher the vote for 'remain' in Scotland the more ammo it gives Sturgeon to demand another referendum.

Of course this only matters if the weight of English votes result in a 'leave' vote, so yes it could be all academic, but many nationalists in Scotland will take the half chance at another referendum rather than no chance right now.

So basically regardless of the way any SNP supporter votes, people can spin it as some anti-nationalist argument rather than people just voting for whether or not they want to stay in the EU.

"You're only voting 'no' to show Scotland wants to remain in and force a referendum! Bastards!"

"You're only voting 'yes' so the UK leaves and triggers another referendum! Wankers!"

Great!

 

[Audioboxer]

So basically regardless of the way any SNP supporter votes, people can spin it as some anti-nationalist argument rather than people just voting for whether or not they want to stay in the EU. Great!

Strap yourself in, us Scots are probably going to be an easy target yet again during this EU referendum from all sorts of angles.

 

[Mac@NeoGAF]

So basically regardless of the way any SNP supporter votes, people can spin it as some anti-nationalist argument rather than people just voting for whether or not they want to stay in the EU.

"You're only voting 'no' to show Scotland wants to remain in and force a referendum! Bastards!"

"You're only voting 'yes' so the UK leaves and triggers another referendum! Wankers!"

Great!

Welcome to the pandoras box of nationalism, well and truly thrown open by the SNP.

 

[Beefy]

So basically regardless of the way any SNP supporter votes, people can spin it as some anti-nationalist argument rather than people just voting for whether or not they want to stay in the EU.

"You're only voting 'no' to show Scotland wants to remain in and force a referendum! Bastards!"

"You're only voting 'yes' so the UK leaves and triggers another referendum! Wankers!"

Great!

Blame Sturgeon for that. Every chance she gets she goes on about having another rederendum.

 

[liquidtmd]

Blame Sturgeon for that. Every chance she gets she goes on about having another rederendum.

Yup. She's loving this in the sense that however the EU vote goes, she'll twist it into trying to push another referendum through.

 

[Audioboxer]

Blame Sturgeon for that. Every chance she gets she goes on about having another rederendum.

People keep fucking asking! The SNPs stance on independence is clear so why do bystanders get surprised when the media ask Sturgeon at nearly every public showing "Omg when is the next referendum going to be?".

Honestly watch nearly every interview she is in. The journalist or spokes person always asks some question about what will cause another referendum.

You literally have to be warping an agenda to pin it on her when like it or not it's due to her being ASKED about a referendum. Even if you are doing that what point are you proving? The SNP want independence no one sane doesn't already know this.

So really blame the media for constantly asking if it frustrates you why she answers so many questions about another referendum.

 

[Beefy]

People keep fucking asking! The SNPs stance on independence is clear so why do bystanders get surprised when the media ask Sturgeon at nearly every public experience "Omg when is the next referendum going to be?".

She says it even when not asked. I don't mind if Scotland goes indy and alot of my family are scottish ( I am half). But Sturgeon pushes for it for another ref far too much. Can you not see it would get annoying for some people? Specially the Scots that don't want it.

It's pretty obvious the media would use it as a thing to bash Scotland over. I'm not saying she is fully at fault, I am saying she gives the media a easy story.

 

[Audioboxer]

She says it even when not asked. I don't mind if Scotland goes indy and alot of my family are scottish ( I am half). But Sturgeon pushes for it for another ref far too much. Can you not see it would get annoying for some people? Specially the Scots that don't want it.

She has categorically said countless times its up to the Scottish people. Every time a journalist tries to say you're doing it for your own good she always delivers that line. That has to be the simplest and politest way to put it. What don't Scottish people get about the fact we would have to vote for a referendum opportunity?

Honestly if people get annoyed grow a thicker skin. The SNP are pro independence and if asked about a referendum will talk about it.

 

[Mac@NeoGAF]

People keep fucking asking! .

She's the leader of a nationalist separatist party who's avowed aim is to break up the UK.

What should interviewers ask her...'how will you explain to your supporters that you no longer seek independence?'

 

[liquidtmd]

She says it even when not asked. I don't mind if Scotland goes indy and alot of my family are scottish ( I am half). But Sturgeon pushes for it for another ref far too much. Can you not see it would get annoying for some people? Specially the Scots that don't want it.

Exactly.

All before the Scots Referendum both sides were "This is once in a Generation vote"

* Day after the Vote is to Remain, regardless of closeness

Out Camp: "Well we need to look at maybe another one"

However I Vote in the EU Ref, I'll have to good grace to accept the Result and work hard to make the best of it. I won't be running around asking for a rematch because I believe in the Democratic process here.

 

[Joni]

How does GAF perceive Boris Johnson's actual opinion piece regarding his view?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...-the-change-we-want-vote-to-leave-the-EU.html

I can take or leave the man, but I actually found his comments to explain his view more insightful than the soundbites from the piece thrown about in the media.

Could have done without the heavy handed Churchill name-drops but I found it overall more even handed than most representations from either the prominent 'In' and 'Out' camps so far.

If the powers that be of either camp want to persuade the common man, they need to start relaying their position in this kind of manner IMO. I understand the stakes, but the mudslinging and both sides screaming 'If you're not with us you're against us' needs to stop.

The European Union should at that point just use the Door-in-the-face technique against him. If you can only negotiate with threats, then you are not negotiating.

 

[Beefy]

She has categorically said countless times its up to the Scottish people. That has to be the simplest and politest way to put it. What don't Scottish people get about the fact we would have to vote for a referendum opportunity.

Honestly if people get annoyed grow a thicker skin. The SNP are pro independence and if asked about a referendum will talk about it.

Would you get annoyed if the SNP didn't get in and Scottish Labour kept saying there will never be a referendum? I bet a lot of people would be, even if you aren't

 

[Audioboxer]

She's the leader of a nationalist separatist party who's avowed aim is to break up the UK.

What should interviewers ask her...'how will you explain to your supporters that you no longer seek independence?'

Interviewers should and can ask, my point is cry babies who shriek "independence talk!" after the question is asked are unbelievable. What's the alternative the usual politician answer of no comment or change the subject?

 

[Audioboxer]

Would you get annoyed if the SNP didn't get in and Scottish Labour kept saying there will never be a referendum? I bet a lot of people would be, even if you aren't

They can say what they want? I think the diplomatic approach of if the Scottish people want and vote for it it's up to them.

Rather than saying we don't care what the Scottish people want, or what they poll for.

 

[Mac@NeoGAF]

Interviewers should and can ask, my point is cry babies who shriek "independence talk!" after the question is asked are unbelievable. What's the alternative the usual politician answer of no comment or change the subject?

Why doesn't she say the result of the referendum in 2014 was clear and that we won't seek another referendum for at least a generation.

You know, what they were telling everyone before the vote.

If she made that clear, I bet the question wouldn't get asked in interviews...but she won't say that.

 

[liquidtmd]

The European Union should at that point just use the Door-in-the-face technique against him. If you can only negotiate with threats, then you are not negotiating.

At which point he makes are you referring to?

 

[amanset]

Can't agree with that, it was a vote for the people living in Scotland.

Try telling people that would have had their citizenship changed due to "yes" vote that. I've met several, including my Mother, that were very angry about it.

 

[Audioboxer]

Why doesn't she say the result of the referendum in 2014 was clear and that we won't seek another referendum for at least a generation.

You know, what they were telling everyone before the vote.

Because if the people change their minds and want something what is a comment from 2014 relevant for?

You're acting like this is an absolute and the people of Scotland can't be allowed to change their minds. Especially if something major like the EU vote comes up.

 

[OriginalThinking]

Wait has this thread turned into a debate about Scottish independence?

I'm pretty sure I'm going to vote to stay in. I haven't seen any concrete evidence to suggest we'll be better out and (perhaps wrongly) the fact that Jeremy Gove wants out makes me feel confident I'm making the right choice. Has Jeremy Hunt declared how he's voting yet?

 

[Mac@NeoGAF]

Because if the people change their minds

But there is no evidence they have, yet the rumblings and preparations for another referendum continue behind the scenes.

Everything the SNP do, every decision they make post 2014 is to ensure another referendum as soon as possible.

 

[8bit]

Try telling people that would have had their citizenship changed due to "yes" vote that. I've met several, including my Mother, that were very angry about it.

You mean someone like a British citizen living outside of Scotland?

It me.

But there is no evidence they have, yet the rumblings and preparations for another referendum continue behind the scenes.

Everything the SNP do, every decision they make post 2014 is to ensure another referendum as soon as possible.

Proof please.

 

[amanset]

Eh, how else could they realistically have done it? Is there a Register of Scottish Citizens somewhere? I think all the Scottish Government has is a list of people living in Scotland and census data of what nationality people consider themselves to be.

http://www.scotreferendum.com/quest...nts-proposals-and-who-will-qualify-for-these/

British citizens born in Scotland but living outside of Scotland on day one of independence Scottish Citizenship?
- Yes, automatically a Scottish citizen

By whatever way that was going to work. I'm guessing for a start birth certificates would be involved. But then again, this wouldn't be the first thing that was completely not thought through by the "Yes" campaign.

 

[OriginalThinking]

But there is no evidence they have, yet the rumblings and preparations for another referendum continue behind the scenes.

Everything the SNP do, every decision they make post 2014 is to ensure another referendum as soon as possible.

They may very well change their minds if we choose to leave Europe. She has very clearly stated that if the Scottish people make it clear they want another referendum then they should be allowed to have it. I think that's both fair and reasonable. If it turns out they don't, there won't be another referendum. She won't force a referendum on the Scottish people if a clear majority don't want it. It would do no good for her, her party, or her party's cause.

 

[Audioboxer]

But there is no evidence they have, yet the rumblings and preparations for another referendum continue behind the scenes.

Everything the SNP do, every decision they make post 2014 is to ensure another referendum as soon as possible.

Yeah we'll see from this referendum on the EU what happens. Especially considering Scotland as a whole is fairly pro-EU and we do not have figure heads like Boris Johnson and IDS coming out as pro-Exit.

 

[QuicheFontaine]

Try telling people that would have had their citizenship changed due to "yes" vote that. I've met several, including my Mother, that were very angry about it.

?

If she's a Scot that was ineligible to vote due to living in England then her citizenship wouldn't have changed.

British before, British after.

Everyone whose citizenship would have changed (i.e. everyone living in Scotland) had a vote.

http://www.scotreferendum.com/quest...nts-proposals-and-who-will-qualify-for-these/

By whatever way that was going to work. I'm guessing for a start birth certificates would be involved. But then again, this wouldn't be the first thing that was completely not thought through by the "Yes" campaign.

I think you're misreading that. Your mother would qualify for Scottish citizenship automatically. Her citizenship wouldn't automatically have changed to Scottish.

 

[OriginalThinking]

Arghhhhh Hunt wants to stay in. I'm confused now. I suppose a broken clock is right twice a day....

 

[Beefy]

What ever happens it will be nice to see what happens to the Tories after the vote.

 

[jelly]

The annoying thing about Sturgeon with the independence talk is she says with certainty the Scottish people have already decided yes to having another referendum. No they haven't. She speaks for Scottish people like they agree with her, will of the people, again no. SNP want independence, fair enough but stop acting like you're doing it because most in Scotland want it.

 

[liquidtmd]

What ever happens it will be nice to see what happens to the Tories after the vote.

Regardless of outcome, honestly - tearing themselves apart is likely. Its already started.

That said, I envisage them clinging to power in the next election in the face of Labour still not knowing what the hell they currently are and capatilising on it.

 

[OriginalThinking]

The annoying thing about Sturgeon with the independence talk is she says with certainty the Scottish people have already decided yes to having another referendum. No they haven't. She speaks for Scottish people like they agree with her, will of the people, again no. SNP want independence, fair enough but stop acting like you're doing it because most in Scotland want it.

Can you provide proof of this? I honestly haven't seen her say this. And I mean first hand, not the opinion of a columnist.

 

[QuicheFontaine]

Regardless of outcome, honestly - tearing themselves apart is likely. Its already started.

That said, I envisage them clinging to power in the next election in the face of Labour still not knowing what the hell they currently are and capatilising on it.

According to the spreadsheet on Guido Fawkes, more Tory MPs have so far declared for OUT (143) than IN (134). That can't be good for party cohesion...

 

[Jezbollah]

PM's Commons Statement at 3:30pm today outlining exactly the terms of the agreement.

I'll make my mind up soon after I think.

 

[liquidtmd]

Can you provide proof of this? I honestly haven't seen her say this. And I mean first hand, not the opinion of a columnist.

I can't speak for the poster you're quoting but I find this

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...y-trigger-second-independence-referendum.html

The First Minister said there would be an "inescapable" shift in public opinion towards independence if the UK voted to leave and Scotland faced being dragged out of the EU against its will.

pretty damn presumptious on her part. She has nothing to back this up. I imagine even if the overall vote result was to pull Out of the EU and statistically across Scotland more than 50% voted as such, she'd still play this card.

Why 'inescapable'? Its talking in absolutes and we all know who only deal in those.

 

[SlickShoes]

There is no point engaging with people that can't accept that the SNP are far and away the party that Scottish people want representing them, regardless of whether we can independence or not the Scottish people voted for the SNP to represent them.

A few people here seem to be taking the view that everything the SNP do is horrible and so are their supporters.

This is just another way for folk to attack the SNP.

Many people including myself voted YES and accepted the result, to suggest that only no voters done this is ridiculous, people on both sides act like babies and couldn't accept the result either way.

One guy in this thread seems to hate the SNP and it's supporters with such vigor he is still attacking them despite everyone else moving on and even has many of the key facts wrong like his mothers britishness.

 

[jelly]

Can you provide proof of this? I honestly haven't seen her say this. And I mean first hand, not the opinion of a columnist.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...y-trigger-second-independence-referendum.html

'Asked on the BBC’s Andrew Marr programme if a vote to leave the EU would definitely trigger another independence referendum, Ms Sturgeon replied: "Almost certainly. I think that would be the demand of people in Scotland.'

 

[kmag]

Can you provide proof of this? I honestly haven't seen her say this. And I mean first hand, not the opinion of a columnist.

She hasn't. She's always been pretty careful to preface it with conditional logic if X happens then it's possible that Y happens.

The closest she's ever came to outright saying it is during her conference speech in October

““I believe with all my heart that Scotland should be an independent country.
And I, of course, respect the decision that our country made last year. So let me be clear: to propose another referendum in the next parliament, without strong evidence that a significant number of those who voted no have changed their minds, would be wrong and we won’t do that. It would not be respecting the decision that people have made...If you try to take Scotland out of the EU against our democratic wishes you will be breaching the terms of last year’s vote...In those circumstances you may well find that demand for a second independence referendum is unstoppable."

But lets be clear if Scotland votes to stay in the EU and is dragged out by English voters, then given the overwhelming support the SNP have they'll announce a 2nd referendum if they think they can win it (which I think they would in those circumstances), on the basis of their populist support.

 

[Daemul]

The only good thing about this referendum is seeing the Tories tear themselves apart, depending on the result we could see a change in Tory leadership soon after, but seeing the Tories have a meltdown isn't worth the risk of leaving the EU. My worry for the UK's future in the event of an exit greatly outweighs my hate for the Tories, so I'm voting in.

 

[kmag]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...y-trigger-second-independence-referendum.html

'Asked on the BBC’s Andrew Marr programme if a vote to leave the EU would definitely trigger another independence referendum, Ms Sturgeon replied: "Almost certainly. I think that would be the demand of people in Scotland.'

The entire quote

"Almost certainly, I think that would be the demand of people in Scotland.
I hope this scenario doesn't arise. I hope the UK as a whole votes to stay in the EU for a whole variety of different reasons. But if you cast your mind back to the Scottish referendum, the No campaign then said if Scotland voted Yes then our membership of the EU would be at risk. That was rubbish then, but that was a key argument.
If, a couple of years later, we find ourselves, having voted to stay in the EU, being taken out against our will, I think there will be many people - including people who voted No in 2014 - who would say the only way to guarantee our EU membership is to be independent. That, I think, is inescapable."

 

[Nick Laslett]

The more I think about it the stronger my conviction to vote leave. Yesterday I didn't even think I would vote!

Nothing for me trumps the sovereignty issue. The British people have a democratic right to choose how they are governed, by whom and what laws they live under.

What was originally a free trade organisation in the EEC (European Economic Community) has changed beyond all recognition into the all powerful European Union.

I don't ever remember actually voting to have the European Court have primacy over the UK Courts. When was this presented to the UK electorate? There does not seem to be a fair democratic process where I can vote on what laws the EU passes and how they effect me. This seems very wrong. For all the faults of the U.K. Government in Westminster, I do feel we operate in a democracy and my vote matters.

The whole situation makes me think of the great Thomas Paine and his writing in "Common Sense" on the merits of US independence from Great Britain. That book was the spark that lit the fuse on the War for Independence.

So none of the "In" arguments seem very persuasive to me when held up against the sovereignty question. Life might be worse out side of the EU, but at least we would have self determination.

I felt the same way about the Scottish referendum, if the Scots want to govern themselves as a separate nation from the rest of the U.K, free from the parliament in Westminster, then that is their democratic right, if the majority chooses to do so.

 

[Nicktendo86]

The Tories promised they'd do a referendum if they got voted in. It's one of the few pledges they've stuck by.

The BBC have done an election tracker and found that, less than a year into the Parliament, they have delivered or have started to deliver about a third of their manifesto.

And I will be voting out.

 

[CyclopsRock]

The European Union should at that point just use the Door-in-the-face technique against him. If you can only negotiate with threats, then you are not negotiating.

Aren't threats the basis of all negotiation, though? If you're negotiating with your boss about a pay rise the implicit threat is that you'll leave (or start looking for work elsewhere) if you don't get a sufficiently good deal. If a union is negotiating with Jeremy Hunt, there's the threat of striking. If you're a German terrorist in the Nakamoto building with a bunch of hostages negotiating with police on the ground, you might threaten to kill a person an hour til your demands are met. Remove the threat from any of these scenarios and you remove the ability to negotiate. Not only are threats an acceptable presence in negotiation, they're active requirements.

 

[Iokis]

In.

Brit living in Austria, Italian girlfriend, enjoy the perks of being an EU citizen and therefore freely admit that I'm biased.

Quite apart from that we'd lose all influence and relevance outside the EU. You really think the US/China would look favourably on the UK without a seat at the EU table?

No EU customer protection.

The need to have to organise bilateral trade agreements (that are EU compliant) with no say over said legislation. Afaik Switzerland and Norway have done this but they're rich, low population countries. It can't work for the UK.

There is no "Brussels meddling". Only 13% of UK laws even mention the EU, never mind being directly affected in some way. As for the EHCR it's 1. Good so why would you want rid of it and 2. A Council of Europe thing, not the EU. So even if you had an irrational problem with it, you're still stuck with it.

Plus leaving the EU is the wish of the many Tories and big business. You think they have the people's interests at heart? Hell, I left the UK in the first place cos of the ruin the Tories brought to my hometown.

Scotland would probably leave the UK too (love you guys, do it right this time).

EDIT: Couple changes based on info from another poster.

 

[OriginalThinking]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/new...y-trigger-second-independence-referendum.html

'Asked on the BBC’s Andrew Marr programme if a vote to leave the EU would definitely trigger another independence referendum, Ms Sturgeon replied: "Almost certainly. I think that would be the demand of people in Scotland.'

I've watched that interview and she said "almost certainly" but with the caveat again that only if the Scottish people make it clear that they would want one - this would be due to an exit from the EU changing public opinion significantly. She's not going to force a referendum on Scotland if as a collective public opinion in Scotland is against it. What she says in that interview is that she thinks it's almost certain that the population of Scotland would demand another referendum in the event of an exit and that she would respond to that demand. Again, I'm not seeing anything particularly unfair about that approach.

There won't be another referendum until the forces of Scottish independence think that general public opinion would shift to vote "yes" and that's only going to occur one of two ways, a gradual change in opinion (the generational wait for another referendum) or a really significant event that leads Scotland to question whether it is better off within the United Kingdom (such as an EU exit, or perhaps a war). She is under no obligation to wait a generation if the majority of Scots make it clear that they are no longer happy to be part of the UK government. The problem as I see it, is that there is no going back, so I can understand why the constant potential of a referendum based on fluctuating public opinion is a scary thought. That is how a democracy should work however and why despite the referendum being over, pro unionists should take every opportunity to praise and push the benefits of unionism as the debate in Scotland is still ongoing and far from settled regardless of the referendum result.

 

[liquidtmd]

Aren't threats the basis of all negotiation, though? If you're negotiating with your boss about a pay rise the implicit threat is that you'll leave (or start looking for work elsewhere) if you don't get a sufficiently good deal. If a union is negotiating with Jeremy Hunt, there's the threat of striking. If you're a German terrorist in the Nakamoto building with a bunch of hostages negotiating with police on the ground, you might threaten to kill a person an hour til your demands are met. Remove the threat from any of these scenarios and you remove the ability to negotiate. Not only are threats an acceptable presence in negotiation, they're active requirements.

* Wants to see Johnson and Johnson of the EU commission give us helicopters us the ass and cut our power

 

[Audioboxer]

I've watched that interview and she said "almost certainly" but with the caveat again that only if the Scottish people make it clear that they would want one - this would be due to an exit from the EU changing public opinion significantly. She's not going to force a referendum on Scotland if as a collective public opinion in Scotland is against it. What she says in that interview is that she thinks it's almost certain that the population of Scotland would demand another referendum in the event of an exit and that she would respond to that demand. Again, I'm not seeing anything particularly unfair about that approach.

There won't be another referendum until the forces of Scottish independence think that general public opinion would shift to vote "yes" and that's only going to occur one of two ways, a gradual change in opinion (the generational wait for another referendum) or a really significant event that leads Scotland to question whether it is better off within the United Kingdom (such as an EU exit, or perhaps a war). She is under no obligation to wait a generation if the majority of Scots make it clear that they are no longer happy to be part of the UK government. The problem as I see it, is that there is no going back, so I can understand why the constant potential of a referendum based on fluctuating public opinion is a scary thought. That is how a democracy should work however and why despite the referendum being over, pro unionists should take every opportunity to praise and push the benefits of unionism as the debate in Scotland is still ongoing and far from settled regardless of the referendum result.

It doesn't matter if she words it fairly reserved for a pro-independence person (if Scottish people vote for it, it's up to them, etc). The pitchforks are simply out any time the word independence is uttered by anyone in the SNP. It's becoming like a trigger warning for some people.

We know they are pro-independence. They can at least be cut some slack for making it clear it is up to the Scottish people, and these warped views that as Scots we are being oppressed into voting Yes can get tae fuck. To put it in Scottish.

If that were the case the SNP would not have won by a landslide in the general elections. That required NO voters to vote SNP. So paranoid English people, and paranoid Scots, can rest easy up here most people are switched on politically and aren't mere puppets.

 

[QuicheFontaine]

It doesn't matter if she words it fairly reserved for a pro-independence person (if Scottish people vote for it, it's up to them, etc). The pitchforks are simply out any time the word independence is uttered by anyone in the SNP. It's becoming like a trigger warning for some people.

We know they are pro-independence. They can at least be cut some slack for making it clear it is up to the Scottish people, and these warped views that as Scots we are being oppressed into voting Yes can get tae fuck. To put it in Scottish.

If that were the case the SNP would not have won by a landslide in the general elections. That required NO voters to vote SNP. So paranoid English people, and paranoid Scots, can rest easy up here most people are switched on politically and aren't mere puppets.

Nope.

Votes for SNP in 2015 GE - 1,454,436

Yes votes in Indyref - 1,617,989

 

[Nick Laslett]

In.

Plus leaving the EU is the wish of the Tories and big business.
.

Did the Tory Prime Minister and 70% of the Tory cabinet not just start a pro Europe campaign for the UK to stay in Europe?

Apparently there is also a letter signed by business leaders of 50 of the FTSE 100 supporting the stay campaign.

These two points seem to contradict your above quoted statement.

 

[Beefy]

It doesn't matter if she words it fairly reserved for a pro-independence person (if Scottish people vote for it, it's up to them, etc). The pitchforks are simply out any time the word independence is uttered by anyone in the SNP. It's becoming like a trigger warning for some people.

We know they are pro-independence. They can at least be cut some slack for making it clear it is up to the Scottish people, and these warped views that as Scots we are being oppressed into voting Yes can get tae fuck. To put it in Scottish.

If that were the case the SNP would not have won by a landslide in the general elections. That required NO voters to vote SNP. So paranoid English people, and paranoid Scots, can rest easy up here most people are switched on politically and aren't mere puppets.

You have your opinion others have theirs. You view what the SNP say as a good thing and some people don't. Most of the time it isn't about being paranoid. Yes the media twists it but that is what the media does.


Now back to talking about the EU vote...

 

[Audioboxer]

Nope.

Votes for SNP in 2015 GE - 1,454,436

Yes votes in Indyref - 1,617,989

Draw conclusions from the crazy swings

the SNP won all seven seats in Glasgow with the country's biggest swing - 39.3% from Labour - in Glasgow North East;

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-scotland-32635871

Pretty certain a lot of the Labour to SNP converts voted NO in the referendum.

You have your opinion others have theirs. You view what the SNP say as a good thing and some people don't. Most of the time it isn't about being paranoid. Yes the media twists it but that is what the media does.


Now back to talking about the EU vote...

I certainly view it as better than what some appear to think is being said "You should all vote for independence, anyone who supports SNP has to be pro-independence" or some other nonsense. I can't really see how a pro-independence party can put it anymore reasonably than "it's up to the Scottish people". That is the sitting on the fence statement, not telling someone to go one way or the other.

 

[CyclopsRock]

Draw conclusions from the crazy swings



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-scotland-32635871

Pretty certain a lot of the Labour to SNP converts voted NO in the referendum.

You don't really have any data to back up that assertion and there are alternative explanations (which also have no data).