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Final Fantasy XV tech demo presentation by Tabata (Demo gameplay details added)

benzy

Member
Nearly all of this trailer is target render (and CGI obviously): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3xKbPooKAo

After seeing the new build it doesn't even look like they were aiming that high character model-wise with that render, considering what they've managed to accomplish recently. The new game models blows the renders away.

old gameplay model
iWoKDFC9NoD6p.jpg


render
ibuS4zBKeZV15K.jpg

xv_e3_2013-342.jpg


gameplay tech model
i64U2zYwko0v0.jpg
 

Ishida

Banned
After seeing the new build it doesn't even look like they were aiming that high character model-wise with that render, considering what they've managed to accomplish recently. The new game models blows the renders away.

old gameplay model
iWoKDFC9NoD6p.jpg


render
ibuS4zBKeZV15K.jpg

xv_e3_2013-342.jpg


gameplay tech model
i64U2zYwko0v0.jpg

Definitely, the new in-game model is FAR better than anything we've seen from the game before.

In fact, the "target render" model and the "real-time" model from 2013 don't look that different to me, in fact they look almost the same.
 

ZenTzen

Member
Again, please don't take as gospel. These are the some of the notes.

- Attack, defend, switch weapon mechanic, magic and teleportation. Two face buttons, three shoulder buttons. Access to one spell, Fire.

- No real point of comparison with the battle system. No jump button in demo. No idea if available in final. Press attack to hit, and hold to string attacks. Defence operates the same. Hold defence to take defensive stance and evade enemies. Can also hold defence and move using the analog. Potential for timed defences in more cluttered battles maybe. Movement entirely in player's control.

- Switching mechanic can be implemented before an attack or in the midst of an attack. Start heavy and strong, go light and fast etc.

- Teleportation works by holding the trigger to target, then releasing which implements the ability. Able to string teleportation and attacks together, with switching mechanic also. Can target enemies or certain points/objects for teleportation. Teleportation available outside of battle. Can't just teleport anywhere.

- Magic similar to teleportation. Hold to charge, target, cast. You can switch targets like teleportation.

- Battle system is based on movement and offence. You move and attack, move and defend. Constantly alternate between attacking, defending, switching mechanic, mixed with teleportation and magic for added flair. Attacks become more varied by switching mechanic. Example: Press Attack, Hold Attack, Switch, Press Attack, Switch, Press Attack, Teleport, Hold Attack, Switch, Teleport etc. Feels cinematic/flashy and plays well. Good potential here for combinations in big battles with more spells/abilities and teleportation.

- Missing meters for abilities and magic as well as UI. Not final. Must be in the final game in some form as no limitations in demo, constantly teleporting and abusing magic.

- Not indicative of the final product. A lot of work yet to be done. More customisation for magic and abilities, and they're still tinkering with the controls for the best overall feeling.

- Combat has a certain weight to it, but it's not slow at all. Feels good, responsive, quick. Game goes into battle mode when threat is detected. Seamless transition.

- Only controlled Noctis, but final game will allow control of characters other than Noctis. No demonstration of this.

Control scheme on the above demo:

R2 = Teleport
L2 = Fire
L1 = Weapon Switch Mechanic
Circle = Attack
X = Defend
L3 = Movement
R3 = Camera

This should give you a decent idea of how the demo in the notes was played.

Some points of difference from above and what they've shown here in the stream demo:

1. No magic targeting indicator anymore from the looks of it. Has this been replaced by automatic lock-on, or is it not present because they're changing how it looks or something? I don't know.
2. There is some form of UI in what they showed now, which wasn't there before. I believe this is not command based due to how the battle system is. One row for each member likely which tells you current actions. You could probably access item or summons off this by pressing back or forward. Again, I don't know this for fact.
3. Further note on the magic. In the demo in the notes, you press L2 to cast. No other button. I imagine in the final game, this will be like Kingdom Hearts instead so you have access to other magic. It wouldn't make much sense otherwise. Again, pure speculation.

The following is all speculation of what I thought it could possibly be like based of the hands-on:

Control Scheme for Battle Mode:

L2 = Magic (+ either Triangle, Circle, Square, or X)
L1 = Weapon Switch Mechanic
R2 = Teleport (or different unique ability for other characters)
R1 = Switch Playable Character
Triangle = Limit Break / Special Attack
Square = Request Ally Assist
Circle = Attack / Enter (for Item or Summon Menu)
X = Defend / Cancel (for Item or Summon Menu)
L3 = Movement
R3 = Camera
D-Pad:
Up = Cover
Left = Access Item Menu (off UI)
Right = Access Summon Menu (off UI)
Down = Taunt...

The above control scheme is what I kind of imagined. Noctis uses teleport, switching mechanic, magic and attack to chain attacks.

Other characters would have their own unique ability or play style. For example, for Prompto, shooting is auto-lock on target. You press R2 quickly to change target, or keep it pressed to take manual aim. He could possibly use the switching mechanic also but change to different types of guns. You would still press Circle once for a quick shot, or keep it pressed for continuous shots and then use the switching mechanic to change up your attacks.

Maybe Ignis or Gladiolus receive some other type of ability for R2.

If you access the Item or Summon menu, you have to cancel out of the Item/Summon menu before you can start attacking again, since you're using the same button for enter.

For customisation, I'm hoping for some form of AI settings. You should be able to set them to offensive or defensive, and also give them some form of priority on magic attacks in battle situations. This way, you can balance your party with more defensive and offensive members. In addition to this, you should have some separate customisation for their magic and abilities, so if you take control of them manually, you'll have access to what you set.

This is the battle system I've kind of envisioned in mind for a while now, but chances are I'm completely wrong. It's a lot of speculation based on a barebones experience.

One other thing I hoped for was that we'd be able to activate battle mode manually. If battle mode is activated via threat maybe, then it doesn't need to activate automatically if it's just peaceful animals or beasts. This gives some balance in not every monster being a threat. Some may only become one because you start a fight. You can then explore some places a bit more peacefully and just look, like Jurassic Park. However, if you're a dick, you could press L1 or something to activate the battle menu and start killing the peaceful animals also. The way to control this would be that the battle menu can only be activated when you're in the presence of animals/beasts that can be attacked or are fight compatible. I would really like something like this.

ok if its like that then its looking much better than i thought it would, heres hoping at jump festa or when they decide to show off the battle system, we get to see all this stuff

still hoping for a jump as well
 

Noobcraft

Member
It looks awesome. I've only ever played FF1,3, and 13 but I'm interested in giving this one a shot. Is it PS4 exclusive or multiplat?
 

duckroll

Member
Having a weapon change button is great news. It would really suck if the weapon switching we saw was just automated graphical stuff for a string of attacks. Glad they didn't ditch that system. Hopefully they add the weapon indication back to the UI too. I really liked that touch in the E3 footage from last year.
 
Having a weapon change button is great news. It would really suck if the weapon switching we saw was just automated graphical stuff for a string of attacks. Glad they didn't ditch that system. Hopefully they add the weapon indication back to the UI too. I really liked that touch in the E3 footage from last year.


i thought we've always had weapon switching.

1371030621-weapons-cycling.gif
 
Those notes are superb thanks for sharing V! Sort of puts my mind at ease and yes I know not to take it as gospel, but it's looking pretty good if that's the case.
 

Verendus

Banned
Having a weapon change button is great news. It would really suck if the weapon switching we saw was just automated graphical stuff for a string of attacks. Glad they didn't ditch that system. Hopefully they add the weapon indication back to the UI too. I really liked that touch in the E3 footage from last year.
It looks like they didn't. In this stream, it seems like they're switching manually. The slight pause and change makes me think that as it feels familiar.

I hope they add a quick teleport for R2. It takes you to the next nearest enemy, and this would make it easier to chain some attacks.

I'm still disappointed it's not a direct copy of KH to be honest, but the new system wasn't bad. It was pretty good, and I can see ways of playing the game lazily when you're overpowered. Which is what suits me best. But others can still be active and do their combinations or whatever.

My only concern is that they're still tinkering around with this system. We're a year away now, and I'm no developer, but I would imagine things should be around finalised by now. The basic idea should, at least, be in place.
 
Having a weapon change button is great news. It would really suck if the weapon switching we saw was just automated graphical stuff for a string of attacks. Glad they didn't ditch that system. Hopefully they add the weapon indication back to the UI too. I really liked that touch in the E3 footage from last year.

A6tYkiA.jpg


Agreed duck it adds a nice a touch and actually knowing which weapon you're getting.
 

HeelPower

Member
My only concern is that they're still tinkering around with this system. We're a year away now, and I'm no developer, but I would imagine things should be around finalised by now.

Hopefully there won't be anymore BIG changes like from E32013->TGS2014.

Only small refinements and balancing.
 
It looks like they didn't. In this stream, it seems like they're switching manually. The slight pause and change makes me think that as it feels familiar.

I hope they add a quick teleport for R2. It takes you to the next nearest enemy, and this would make it easier to chain some attacks.

I'm still disappointed it's not a direct copy of KH to be honest, but the new system wasn't bad. It was pretty good, and I can see ways of playing the game lazily when you're overpowered. Which is what suits me best. But others can still be active and do their combinations or whatever.

My only concern is that they're still tinkering around with this system. We're a year away now, and I'm no developer, but I would imagine things should be around finalised by now. The basic idea should, at least, be in place.

Yeah KH combat system would've been awesome I was expecting an evolution from that but this looks great also, seems like they got rid of jumping or maybe it's too early to tell with certainty.
 

injurai

Banned
Although those graphics are in-engine, I'm not sure we will see that reached on the consoles. Probably in in-engine cutscenes, but different LoD models will surely be used for the standard gameplay.
 

TheTux

Member
My only concern is that they're still tinkering around with this system. We're a year away now, and I'm no developer, but I would imagine things should be around finalised by now. The basic idea should, at least, be in place.

Hopefully there won't be anymore BIG changes like from E32013->TGS2014.

Only small refinements and balancing.

Honestly I believe they are working on the combat system a lot. The FFXIII's demo was completely different from the final product.

I can also guess that they have solid ideas if they are going to release a demo though.

By the way was it clearly confirmed that the demo was coming out the same day of Type-0 or maybe a bit later?
 

duckroll

Member
My only concern is that they're still tinkering around with this system. We're a year away now, and I'm no developer, but I would imagine things should be around finalised by now. The basic idea should, at least, be in place.

Totally agreed. That's also my concern about the game from everything we've seen. If they keep changing the core battle mechanics around, it really does seem they're having issues finding a balance in the design where it actually plays well and is "fun" so to speak. Hopefully they get it worked out because I doubt they have much more time at this point.
 

injurai

Banned
Totally agreed. That's also my concern about the game from everything we've seen. If they keep changing the core battle mechanics around, it really does seem they're having issues finding a balance in the design where it actually plays well and is "fun" so to speak. Hopefully they get it worked out because I doubt they have much more time at this point.

this talk is bringing back my diablo 3 ptsd
 
Totally agreed. That's also my concern about the game from everything we've seen. If they keep changing the core battle mechanics around, it really does seem they're having issues finding a balance in the design where it actually plays well and is "fun" so to speak. Hopefully they get it worked out because I doubt they have much more time at this point.
maybe they're trying to decide between two fun mechanics?!

Positivity!
 
Totally agreed. That's also my concern about the game from everything we've seen. If they keep changing the core battle mechanics around, it really does seem they're having issues finding a balance in the design where it actually plays well and is "fun" so to speak. Hopefully they get it worked out because I doubt they have much more time at this point.

My only concern is that they're still tinkering around with this system. We're a year away now, and I'm no developer, but I would imagine things should be around finalised by now. The basic idea should, at least, be in place.

I mean if the game is almost finalised and they just tweaking the combat shouldn't that be a positive and encouraging sign? Maybe the demo is for feedback and such doesn't seem like a bad idea or maybe I'm missing something guys?
 

TnK

Member
There goes hoping the system will be like KH then, lol. Then again, if it was like KH, it could be "harder to play" for the broader audience (would it really be harder though?). If they have an option to make it automated or not would be perfect.

Guess a hands on impressions would be best to know how the game plays.
 
Totally agreed. That's also my concern about the game from everything we've seen. If they keep changing the core battle mechanics around, it really does seem they're having issues finding a balance in the design where it actually plays well and is "fun" so to speak. Hopefully they get it worked out because I doubt they have much more time at this point.

They had 9 years to get a basic working battle system, at least down to the basics.

I fear we get another KH2 battle system....*barfs*

I mean if the game is almost finalised and their just tweaking the combat shouldn't that be a positive and encouraging sign? Maybe the demo is for feedback and such doesn't seem like a bad idea or maybe I'm missing something guys?

Were did you get that idea that the game is almost finished?

Most of the playable stuff we saw takes place is the same place and the trailer just showed a bunch of random locations....
 

Verendus

Banned
Honestly I believe they are working on the combat system a lot. The FFXIII's demo was completely different from the final product.
This isn't the best thing to hear. But then I'm kind of impressed if they managed to change a battle system that quickly, since I remember the demo being only 8 or 9 months before the actual game. Maybe a year is plenty of time then for changing and finalising things.
 

injurai

Banned
maybe they're trying to decide between two fun mechanics?!

Positivity!

honestly I feel it's is less that, and more them trying to program the A.I. to operate under the same system that is given to the player. That is much more challenging than what Square has done in the past. They are probably trying to refine it and get it working, than trying to discover a fun mechanic to implement.
 

Kssio_Aug

Member
Totally agreed. That's also my concern about the game from everything we've seen. If they keep changing the core battle mechanics around, it really does seem they're having issues finding a balance in the design where it actually plays well and is "fun" so to speak. Hopefully they get it worked out because I doubt they have much more time at this point.

I guess now they found the mechanics they wanted. But why are you worried about that? I mean, when was the last time they changed it? I thought it was quite a long ago.

I understand that their 1st intention was a Kingdom Hearts gameplay style, then they changed it to a mix between what seems like FF Type-0 and Kingdom Hearts. But do we know when they made those changes?
 

Kagari

Crystal Bearer
There goes hoping the system will be like KH then, lol. Then again, if it was like KH, it would be "harder to play" for the broader audience (would it really be harder though?). If they have an option to make it automated or not would be perfect.

Guess a hands on impressions would be best to know how the game plays.

I don't agree with this at all actually. KH's systems have never really been difficult to understand.
 

Atone13

Member
Thanks Verendus, just popped in and saw your breakdown. I'm even more intrigued now then before, but like I said I'm a Final Fantasy mark, so I was interested already.
 

Myths

Member
I don't know why would they remove the rotary weapon indicator from the UI (the same for the 4 barred gauge last seen in the 2013 trailer) for good. It would most likely be integral to what the player can and can't do depending on what's being held/wielded. Since it's a technical demo, they're sure to have the power of toggling the visibility of any and all elements on or off (UI included).

Either it's been toggled, decisively swapped out for an action log of sorts, or very early in the game where he's stuck with one weapon. Or they just decided not to switch between weapons, whichever the case may be.
 

Ran rp

Member
After seeing the new build it doesn't even look like they were aiming that high character model-wise with that render, considering what they've managed to accomplish recently. The new game models blows the renders away.


render

xv_e3_2013-342.jpg

Holy shit lmao.
 

TnK

Member
They had 9 years to get a basic working battle system, at least down to the basics.

I fear we get another KH2 battle system....*barfs*
KH2FM's battle system is really good though, especially when played on Critical. I mean it is no DMC or Bayonetta, but it gets the job done.
I don't agree with this at all actually. KH's systems have never really been difficult to understand.
Whoops, I actually meant to write could instead of would, which is why I asked that question after the statement.

Then again, there goes my only guess to thinking whether or not the system is made the way it is to make it easier for others. I honestly can't think of any other reason for it to be more automated.
 

Lady Bird

Matsuno's Goebbels
We should also wonder what made them change the UI. There's a bigger focus on what the party is doing now, versus how many actions Noctis had available before, in addition to the vague info we have about party combos and stuff like that.

What it seems to me, is that Tabata is trying to fit in (or expand an already existing) form of party control system, in an attempt to make FFXV offer a party-driven experience much like the FF games of the past did it, instead of going the KH route where the player only cares about the controlled character while the AI is left "doing something random at the background".
 
We should also wonder what made them change the UI. There's a bigger focus on what the party is doing now, versus how many actions Noctis had available before, in addition to the vague info we have about party combos and stuff like that.

What it seems to me, is that Tabata is trying to fit in (or expand an already existing) form of party control system, in an attempt to make FFXV offer a party-driven experience much like the FF games of the past did it, instead of going the KH route where the player only cares about the controlled character while the AI is left "doing something random at the background".

UI isn't final though but I see where you're coming from.
 

HeelPower

Member
If I want really deliberate, precise and challenging mechanics BloodBorne is for that (and its coming way sooner too :p)

But I still hope a really unique system comes out of FFXV and it looks like it will.

I am happy the game is trying to find its own identity instead of straight up copying KH.
 

Stark

Banned
This isn't the best thing to hear. But then I'm kind of impressed if they managed to change a battle system that quickly, since I remember the demo being only 8 or 9 months before the actual game. Maybe a year is plenty of time then for changing and finalising things.

Think he meant expanded upon, the demo's BS was extremely basic. Then came in the whole paradigm shift, summons, etc.
 
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