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[Nirolak]

Game Developer magazine has put out the highlights of their salary survey as part of a free web issue.

The full report is at this link, containing over twice as much info as is here. It's interesting, and I suggest checking it out: http://gamedeveloper.texterity.com/gamedeveloper/fall2011cg#pg25

 

[BoilersFan23]

When I look at those numbers, while the salaries may seem high, most game developers (it seems) are in CA where cost of living is pretty high. It would make sense for Bethesda too because cost of living there is high. For TX, some areas of IL, etc. making those salaries would be really great (where cost of living isn't as high).

 

[walking fiend]

So that's why Bethesda games are so buggy, poor QA testers don't get enough for their jobs

 

[Nirolak]

I just noticed this chart so I added it to the OP: http://www.abload.de/img/averagesalarynbbl9.png

When I look at those numbers, while the salaries may seem high, most game developers (it seems) are in CA where cost of living is pretty high. It would make sense for Bethesda too because cost of living there is high. For TX, some areas of IL, etc. making those salaries would be really great (where cost of living isn't as high).

They actually do also have a regional salary chart at the link.

 

[Coxy]

even more of a sausage fest than I was expecting

the average salary by education level is a real shocker

 

[Nemo]

Have programming salaries been improved? I remembered it being 80k for regular game programmers doing more than 5 years

So that's why Bethesda games are so buggy, poor QA testers don't get enough for their jobs

I'm pretty sure they're just told not to give a shit about certain aspects.

 

[AlphaTwo00]

About that layoff number, it'll be interesting to see what 2011 will look like.

 

[Zoramon089]

Sausage fest

 

[Nirolak]

Have programming salaries been improved? I remembered it being 80k for regular game programmers doing more than 5 years

I'm pretty sure they're just told not to give a shit about certain aspects.

They've raised quite a bit over the past five years, but they're down a tiny bit overall this year.

The survey mentions though that this seems to be from an influx of new people than from the actual salaries going down, since the 6+ year category is quite high these days compared to what it used to be.

 

[The Dutch Slayer]

Thanks for the info, very interesting.
The difference between the USA and EU maybe high but the cost of living in the USA and CA are much much higher and in the EU you have far more "free" benefits than in the USA or CA.

 

[Nirolak]

Thanks for the info, very interesting.
The difference between the USA and EU maybe high but the cost of living in the USA and CA are much much higher and in the EU you have far more "free" benefits than in the USA or CA.

Well, 40-50% of the European salaries also seem to be coming from Eastern Europe, which is going to pull the average waaaay down.

 

[NIN90]

Pretty high salaries across all regions if you ask me.

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

Sausage fest

Yeah, that stood out to me.

More females are needed in the industry!

 

[Wazzim]

Pretty high salaries across all regions if you ask me.

I don't think the EU one is all that high, especially with the enormous income tax.

 

[DrEvil]

Producer salaries seem about right...

 

[-PXG-]

Sausage fest

I don't know, that wasn't too surprising. In fact, I was expecting even more disparity.

 

[The Dutch Slayer]

Well, 40-50% of the European salaries also seem to be coming from Eastern Europe, which is going to pull the average waaaay down.

ah that is interesting, and I understand.
Still I do not think that US salaries are to high, if you have to pay for everything in your life and you have a family.

Interested to see what a "media" salary would be, I imagine it to be dependent on the outlet off course but I think its far far less so that is also a reason a lot of "media" jump ship to development.

 

[wutwutwut]

The QA tester salaries are pretty low.

From my own experience, I'd expect average programmer salaries to be higher too, at least in the US. Either that or I've been offered jobs with way above average salaries (>2x).

 

[Datschge]

Bummer that the layoffs stat is limited to a year. I'd like to know if everyone got laid off at some point in the career or if there's some amount of stable posts (including positions etc.). Might be a minuscule amount limited to high positions in production/business anyway though...

 

[Nirolak]

ah that is interesting, and I understand.
Still I do not think that US salaries are to high, if you have to pay for everything in your life and you have a family.

Interested to see what a "media" salary would be, I imagine it to be dependent on the outlet off course but I think its far far less so that is also a reason a lot of "media" jump ship to development.

The median household income (combined income of everyone 18 and older that lives in the same residence) in the United States is $49,445 a year for comparison.

 

[Wilsongt]

even more of a sausage fest than I was expecting

the average salary by education level is a real shocker

Exactly what I was gonna say

"So, essentially, the industry is a big sausage fest."

 

[The Dutch Slayer]

The median household income (combined income of everyone 18 and older that lives in the same residence) in the United States is $49,445 a year for comparison.

Well that is higher than I expected :O.

 

[Mr. Mister]

The median household income (combined income of everyone 18 and older that lives in the same residence) in the United States is $49,445 a year for comparison.

That is a much higher median household income than I expected.

 

[charlequin]

I'm actually pretty surprised that these numbers are as high as they are. Historically programmers in the game industry were paid quite a bit lower than people in productivity or web development; based on these figures that gap is almost gone.

Also, lolling mightily at the 35% homeowner rate on California devs. Fuckin' Cali real estate prices.

Also also, the pay vs. education charts make a compelling case that college is a waste of time if you want to be a game developer: people with a HS degree had an average of $93k vs. $80k for college graduates, presumably because people without college degrees got started earlier and therefore developed experience faster.

The QA tester salaries are pretty low.

I'm shocked they're not lower. QA is a bargain-basement position, I didn't think there was even that much room for advancement.

 

[BY2K]

I'm a QA and I don't even make half of what's written in there. (Probably because I'm not working directly for the developer.)

 

[HTuran]

Gender balance is a bit shocking (1 female for every 9 males), but the table comparing education level to income is reassuring.

 

[charlequin]

Pretty high salaries across all regions if you ask me.

Skilled programmers are a rare commodity in a seller's market right now; there are (at least in the major hubs) far more development positions available than there are skilled workers to fill them. Programmer salaries don't tend to be that out of whack with other highly skilled professionals, although programmers do generally have the advantage of being able to avoid higher education.

That is a much higher median household income than I expected.

Well that is higher than I expected :O.

It's really not all that high. The US would be in some deep shit if it were much lower than that. A median two-worker household is two people working full time for $12/hr. 50% of families make less than that.

 

[FStop7]

Looks like an MBA is what you need to make money in video games.

 

[Thagomizer]

A median two-worker household is two people working full time for $12/hr. 50% of families make less than that.

That is fucking scary.

 

[Darklord]

Still wouldn't become a game developer. The amount of shit they have to put up with sounds dreadful. 100 hour weeks, arsehole lead developers, being sack or shut down or have your game canceled even if it does well, even if it's almost finished. No thanks.

 

[Kalnos]

Still wouldn't become a game developer. The amount of shit they have to put up with sounds dreadful. 100 hour weeks, arsehole lead developers, being sack or shut down or have your game canceled even if it does well, even if it's almost finished. No thanks.

It all depends on the company.

 

[Gadfly]

The developer's salaries, in particular for those with > 6 years of experience are lower than I expected.

Edit: on the other hand, this is average for everybody with over 6 years of experience. So maybe not.

 

[speculawyer]

Still wouldn't become a game developer. The amount of shit they have to put up with sounds dreadful. 100 hour weeks, arsehole lead developers, being sack or shut down or have your game canceled even if it does well, even if it's almost finished. No thanks.

I see game development as being very similar to government contracting. Except for the 100 hour weeks (on average), government contractors make about the same and deal with the same time of deal (layoffs, program cancellations, etc.).

The point? As bad as a lot of people want to make the gaming industry sound, it's very similar to other career fields in how they are handled.

 

[Nirolak]

The developer's salaries, in particular for those with > 6 years of experience are lower than I expected.

Edit: on the other hand, this is average for everybody with over 6 years of experience. So maybe not.

It's also worth noting that the "average additional income" category often goes up dramatically as you get higher in a project, especially if the project sells well.

 

[Mik2121]

Still wouldn't become a game developer. The amount of shit they have to put up with sounds dreadful. 100 hour weeks, arsehole lead developers, being sack or shut down or have your game canceled even if it does well, even if it's almost finished. No thanks.

I work 40 hours a week... (45 if you count the 1 hour lunch break)

Not all companies are horrible, and if your game gets shut down, you still get paid and you can still get a job (because a game getting shut down usually has more to do with administration than the actual programmers, artists, etc..).

Also, the amount of 'shit' you have to put kinda gets balanced back with all the neat stuff you get (if you like gaming, anyway). Free titles, chances to go to events for free, etc...

 

[Zeppelin]

Well, 40-50% of the European salaries also seem to be coming from Eastern Europe, which is going to pull the average waaaay down.

All the European countries listed on the first slide that make up for 60% of the replies are western, so at most 40% is from Eastern Europe and that's assuming they didn't ask anyone in Scandinavia.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure salaries aren't even close to the American ones here in Sweden, or in any part of Europe. From what I've heard the pay is pretty damn bad. On the other hand I doubt you'll have to put up with the same kind of bullshit with sick overtime etc. over here. But really, societies are so different it's hard to compare them.

 

[AAK]

Wow, fascinating.

I always wondered how much actors that do the mocap, VO, and stuff get paid as well.

For example, how much did JYB or Reuben Langdon get paid to do Dante and Nero for DMC4 where they were the ones that did their own stunts?

 

[Vano]

Thanks for the link, really cool.

I would have liked to see the average salary by region in Canada to compare it to US but well. It seems that working in US West (Washington) is really nice, looking at the salaries and % who own homes, also the company that are located there (bungie, valve, arena net, etc)

 

[BoilersFan23]

Have programming salaries been improved? I remembered it being 80k for regular game programmers doing more than 5 years

I'm pretty sure they're just told not to give a shit about certain aspects.

A friend of mine (who never tested games for a developer before) told me that he applied to be a tester for Bethesda for $15 an hour. That was a bit ago.

 

[GillianSeed79]

I've always been tempted to apply for a QA position, but I imagine those QA salaries are for like QA leads right? The people down in the trenches can't be making $40K+ a year? Or are they?

Also, aren't QA jobs pretty much contract only? I'd actually be really interested in applying for a QA position, but the one thing that scares me, especially in this kind of economy, is having to find new contract work every time a project is finished.

 

[KePoW]

Looks like an MBA is what you need to make money in video games.

Not just in video games. That goes for any type of company.

And that's the way it should be.

 

[spwolf]

All the European countries listed on the first slide that make up for 60% of the replies are western, so at most 40% is from Eastern Europe and that's assuming they didn't ask anyone in Scandinavia.

Anyway, I'm pretty sure salaries aren't even close to the American ones here in Sweden, or in any part of Europe. From what I've heard the pay is pretty damn bad. On the other hand I doubt you'll have to put up with the same kind of bullshit with sick overtime etc. over here. But really, societies are so different it's hard to compare them.

you do get paid/free health insurance, free kindergardens, free schools/universities, pension plan in Europe, included by default. But also, everything is so damn expensive here...

 

[SketchTheArtist]

Still wouldn't become a game developer. The amount of shit they have to put up with sounds dreadful. 100 hour weeks, arsehole lead developers, being sack or shut down or have your game canceled even if it does well, even if it's almost finished. No thanks.

It's not that hard if you're working with a good team on a great game you believe in.

Message boards assholes who bad-mouth your work with nothing to back however.....

 

[Shadow Red]

Those numbers are very inaccurate.

 

[Jokab]

Those numbers are very inaccurate.

I... okay? Do you have anything to back that up with or is it just anecdotal?

 

[Forsete]

you do get paid/free health insurance, free kindergardens, free schools/universities, pension plan in Europe, included by default. But also, everything is so damn expensive here...

Nothing is free, we pay via our taxes.

 

[Zeppelin]

you do get paid/free health insurance, free kindergardens, free schools/universities, pension plan in Europe, included by default. But also, everything is so damn expensive here...

Yeah, exactly (well, you pay for it through tax). But I still think salaries are too low here, especially for programmers. I know of people who has got a M. Sc. that get paid way less than they would have been if they had chosen a regular engineering job.

 

[Jackson]

I always wondered how much actors that do the mocap, VO, and stuff get paid as well.

For top tier VO talent the pay is around $1,000/hr. Sessions are usually around 3-4 hours. Obviously for low tier talent it's far less.

Still wouldn't become a game developer. The amount of shit they have to put up with sounds dreadful. 100 hour weeks, arsehole lead developers, being sack or shut down or have your game canceled even if it does well, even if it's almost finished. No thanks.

Most game companies don't work 100 hours a week or get shutdown. Those are edge cases that make the news because they are sensationalistic by nature.

Also also, the pay vs. education charts make a compelling case that college is a waste of time if you want to be a game developer: people with a HS degree had an average of $93k vs. $80k for college graduates, presumably because people without college degrees got started earlier and therefore developed experience faster.

With almost all art, tech or entertainment based industries education is a far less important factor toward being hired. Instead it's your portfolio or previous related experience. Basically, no one cares where you graduated from if your art looks awful or you can't show your programming.

Those numbers are very inaccurate.

Depends where you work. This survey unfortunately doesn't break down salaries by tiers like -- indie dev, publisher owned or AAA dev which all have drastically different pay scales.

 

[charlequin]

Those numbers are very inaccurate.

I look forward to the publication of your broad-sample report on industry salaries, then.

 

[Dark Octave]

Yeah, that stood out to me.

More females are needed in the industry!

Not only females but "other than white" males and females are needed as well.

This is after all a 30 something brown haired white male led industry.