Support NeoGAF

[Cuddler]

I just want this again

I would be ok whit this too but please Codemasters go back to the psx days! I want my TOCA and Colin McRae back!

 

[brotkasten]

Little headtracking action.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeagGcTrpbM

Yeah, but lets be honest, nobody used the interior view. And do you have any idea how much time, money and performance those highly detailed interiors cost? You could get at least two more filters on the screen by dropping interiors. I'm glad they did that.

 

[likedamaster]

All this time waiting for GRID 2 and we get no cockpit view? This is not happening to me right now.

I am dreaming, and will wake up to find out CM did indeed include cockpit view.

 

[jett]

Awesome, I loved GRID.

I really can't believe that they took the cockpit view out. Their reasoning is even stranger.

what




what







WHAT







WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT!?

 

[Neuromancer]

Yeah, but lets be honest, nobody used the interior view. And do you have any idea how much time, money and performance those highly detailed interiors cost? You could get at least two more filters on the screen by dropping interiors. I'm glad they did that.

I used it. Almost exclusively.

WE ARE THE 5% #occupycodemasters

 

[jlevel13]

Also dropping in to say w/o a cockpit view, I won't buy.

I'm sad to see another codemasters racing game moving backwards. Obviously somebody in management over there is looking for ways to cut costs more than ways to make better games. That 95% stat is complete bullshit.

In any case, developers should be working on making BETTER cockpit views, so more people use them (for more immersive racing).

 

[The_Darkest_Red]

I used it. Almost exclusively.

WE ARE THE 5% #occupycodemasters

Apparently GAF really is the 5%. My goodness.

 

[1-D_FTW]

Title change:

Grid 2 Debut Trailer - Gathering of the 5 Percent Club

 

[KageMaru]

Say goodbye to driver's eye
However, we mustn't allow the spectacle to gloss over the first big omission from the game: There's no helmet cam (Insert dramatic chipmunk here in your mind). Now, chances are you don't care. It's said that 95% of GRID players use bonnet or chase cam. But we care. The reason for its absence is simple – the exquisitely detailed interior shots used too much processing power to justify including them when nobody was using them, and the team would rather use that power elsewhere on the things that people are looking at. Fair enough, but we're still sad to see it go. So are the developers - they said so.

from: http://www.gamesradar.com/grid-2-we...ing-it-racing-games-will-never-be-same-again/

Welp, seems F1 2012 is the one i'm buying from CM this year.

The bolded line makes no sense. It's not like the interiors are rendered at that level when people use the outside views, at least they shouldn't be. If anything, I would imagine it should just be a LOD swap and have a very simplified cockpit for the times you can see through one of the windows.

No cockpit = no buy for me. A shame considering I thought the cockpit view in the first Grid was very cool.

 

[Totobeni]

Now I wonder if Turn 10 and PD will remove cockpit view from their games too..ya know since Codemaster's research said no on use it, no one will waste resources for the 5%.

 

[Jamesways]

Now I wonder if Turn 10 and PD will remove cockpit view from their games too..ya know since Codemaster's research said no on use it, no one will waste resources for the 5%.

Well, Che DID say in the fm2 days that true sim racers only need the views they provided and they shouldn't waste all those resources on a view that no one ever wants or uses.

I'm glad Dan and the rest of Turn 10 didn't listen to him.

Apparently racing fans don't want to waste time with silly things like assists in their games either.

 

[Andrmt]

Oh well, i'll wait for GRID 3. Hopefully the next gen will be good enough for the 5%

 

[Jamesways]

Also, besides the omission of the cockpit view I really don't see how anything they've said so far should come as a surprise. This game doesn't look like it's aiming for a broader market than the first GRID to me. There is nothing analogous to Gymkhana being added to DiRT.

The one handling model and removal of the option of assists says they're going for an even broader audience to me.

But I do agree with you on the focus on racing part. I really enjoyed that in Grid and that Shift games too.

 

[DodgyGeezerFella]

Cannot wait !

Edit - Joke already done, bah.

 

[RaceManIak]

Can't wait to see if the Alt-Tab will works with the EGO2 engine !

 

[Mascot]

Fuck, there's a whole load of overreaction going on in this thread. Who are we to argue with the developers of their own game?

You can mock up a cockpit in ten minutes flat by fixing cardboard to your screen, and if you use grey duct tape you can add a roll cage without breaking sweat. Codemasters know this. It's the rest of us who are stupid.

 

[Megasoum]

Can't wait to see if the Alt-Tab will works with the EGO2 engine !

Seriously! The stupid alt-tab bug has been on every single EGO engine game on PC so far. It was never fixed...so stupid.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

The logo...

Instragram?! I don't believe you. Either you're joking about the tint in the game or Codemasters have gone mad.

 

[Skyzard]

haha, nice missed that on first watch.

it's a joke right?

 

[brotkasten]

The fact that some people aren't even sure if this is a joke or not shows pretty well what they seem to think about Codemasters these days.

 

[ACESandEIGHTS]

I love the cockpit.

Heartbreaker if true about the cockpit view. I've seriously enjoyed the immersion of, and usually prefer the feel of, cockpit view since RalliSport Challenge, and Dirt+Forza+F1 have made great strides in immersion.

I'm totally oblivious sometimes--is the no-cockpit thing a joke?

 

[brotkasten]

I love the cockpit.

Heartbreaker if true about the cockpit view. I've seriously enjoyed the immersion of, and usually prefer the feel of, cockpit view since RalliSport Challenge, and Dirt+Forza+F1 have made great strides in immersion.

I'm totally oblivious sometimes--is the no-cockpit thing a joke?

In-car view is out, after Codemasters' research discovered that 95 per cent of players use chase or bonnet cameras to play.

.

 

[DD]

The bolded line makes no sense. It's not like the interiors are rendered at that level when people use the outside views, at least they shouldn't be. If anything, I would imagine it should just be a LOD swap and have a very simplified cockpit for the times you can see through one of the windows.

No cockpit = no buy for me. A shame considering I thought the cockpit view in the first Grid was very cool.

But it impacts in the RAM usage.

As I said, I can tolerate the lack of internal camera IF they put some effort to deliver 30+ different locations and some serious (not 2~3 races, two laps) championships. But since Codemasters went to my favorite studio to just some randon studio that makes dude bro games with 6 tracks each (except for F1), I'll keep some distance and wait til the reviews to pop up.

 

[MormaPope]

Man, the only competent driving simulators are F1 racers on PC or Forza 4/Gran Turismo 5.

 

[evolution]

Is it 60fps on consoles this time, or am I just gonna have to get it on pc?

 

[Mascot]

Is it 60fps on consoles this time, or am I just gonna have to get it on pc?

I doubt it. Not with the Ego engine, even a tweaked version.
It's more important to look good in screenshots, apparently.

 

[1-D_FTW]

Man, the only competent driving simulators are F1 racers on PC or Forza 4/Gran Turismo 5.

What?! The PC sim racing genre is overflowing with amazing titles. If you've got a fetish for something, there's a high quality title serving that audience.

Rally is the one exception. But Richard Burns Rally has an entire cottage industry of mods around it. So even though it's old, it's still the Rally racer out there (on any platform).

 

[Goldrusher]

Man, the only competent driving simulators are F1 racers on PC or Forza 4/Gran Turismo 5.

http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=437476

But again, nobody wants GRID to be a sim.
All it needs to have is realistic physics and controls. Cars with weight and proper steering. Though DiRT3 was pretty good, much better than the original DiRT and GRID.

However, even with decent handling, there's still the problematic visuals with the excessive use of camera filters.
Why not restrict that to replays? You know, when you're supposed to be looking at camera footage? Just leave them out of the actual gameplay. It's a race driver game, not a camera man game.

 

[helvetica bold]

Is the trailer realtime running on a PC? It looks a lot like Frostbite 2 even tho i know
Codemasters has their own engine.

I really hope they release this on next gen systems next year. If they say its coming to consoles in the summer I cant see why they cant why they wouldnt re-release it for the holidays on newer systems. Codemasters is know for pushing DX11 so why not show off on a new system.

If not i might just break down and buy a gaming PC.

 

[clutch.as.it.gets.]

Awesome, I loved GRID.



what




what







WHAT







WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT!?

Don´t worry. I´m pretty sure they will offer some "cockpit packs". Aren`t they nice?

 

[Snkfanatic]

I used it. Almost exclusively.

WE ARE THE 5% #occupycodemasters

I do as well, although I do notice most of my friends are always wondering why I do. So there probably is a lot of truth to their claim that most don't use it.

 

[cyberheater]

Yes. I'm in the no buy due to no cockpit view. I play all of my racing games like that.

 

[enzo_gt]

Well if it plays anything like the previous GRID, no thanks.

 

[Arucardo]

No cockpit view? the fuuuuuuck?

That's honestly going to make me think twice about whether to get this or not...

EDIT: Also, no cockpit view is totally going to add to this "Total Race Day Immersion". Can't wait for them to take the cockpit out of Dirt and F1.

 

[Branson]

No cockpit view? Ew. I can't drive from any other view, especially since ID be using a wheel. No buy for me.

It's one of the reasons I didn't try showdown either. I don't like roof, 3rd person cam.

 

[Arucardo]

No cockpit view? Ew. I can't drive from any other view, especially since ID be using a wheel. No buy for me.

It's one of the reasons I didn't try showdown either. I don't like roof, 3rd person cam.

Oh yeah, they already did that for Dirt, though it's not as bad for Showdown since the extra awareness of 3rd person is useful in most of the game modes.

 

[XANDER CAGE]

N... no cockpit view?

But that was the best part of GRID! The sense of speed was insane.

 

[Dilly]

The bolded line makes no sense. It's not like the interiors are rendered at that level when people use the outside views, at least they shouldn't be. If anything, I would imagine it should just be a LOD swap and have a very simplified cockpit for the times you can see through one of the windows.

No cockpit = no buy for me. A shame considering I thought the cockpit view in the first Grid was very cool.

Exactly.

Man, the only competent driving simulators are F1 racers on PC or Forza 4/Gran Turismo 5.

No. No. This is as wrong as it gets.

 

[Branson]

Man, the only competent driving simulators are F1 racers on PC or Forza 4/Gran Turismo 5.

Or iracing, or rfactor2, or gtr, or pcars, or netkar pro, or....

 

[deim0s]

Seriously! The stupid alt-tab bug has been on every single EGO engine game on PC so far. It was never fixed...so stupid.

They've already done research after CM: Dirt, they learned that only 5% uses alt-tab while gaming.

 

[Neuromancer]

From their forum:

We've heard a lot of your thoughts and opinions regarding the lack of cockpit view in GRID 2. To better explain our decision Executive Producer Clive Moody has this to say.

"First of all, it's important to say that every design decision we make is done with a lot of careful consideration and not taken lightly. We're acutely aware of the love there is for GRID in our community and we want to deliver the best possible experience for everyone.

There seems to be some confusion about where we get our data from to help us make these decisions. While we do use research and focus groups, the most important data source for us is the enormous amount of telemetry data we can obtain from our servers that tells us exactly how and what our players are doing across all our games. So it's not a case of just a sample of people we've spoken to in research, it's a fact that only 5% of Codemasters Racing game players ever used the in-car view.

We certainly don't want to alienate any of our fans we want to deliver truly exciting features that 100% of our players will enjoy. Videogame development is always about trade-offs and in this case, taking the hard decision to lose the in-car views for 5% of our players (and remember we still have bonnet cam and bumper cam, which many people with racing wheels use), is something we felt was more beneficial to everyone. They are expensive to run due to the requirement for high-resolution interior textures which are seen close-up and require a considerable amount of in-game memory (to store) and processing (to render).

What this means in practice is that the benefit to our vehicle models, environment models and the hundreds of other things in the environment sapping memory, is huge. By making this educated call, we can use the extra available memory to make the on-track racing a truly mind-blowingly immersive experience.

For example, we can author and run higher resolution vehicle models with more detailed geometry. We can feature higher resolution external vehicle textures and work further detail into our environment textures. We can dedicate more processing power to our improved physics systems, integral to the GRID 2 experience, and push other systems to the next level, such as particles and real-time lighting. And there are many more benefits.

One final point to make is that we’re at the tail-end of the current console generation. We’re now incredibly familiar with the current hardware and have reached the point that we’re getting EVERYTHING possible from it. We’re dedicated to pushing GRID 2 to the next level, making it the definitive racing game on this generation of hardware. Dropping a lesser-used feature such as interior cam frees up the memory and processing power to push the more prominent systems to the next level is a tough decision but it's one we felt had to be made, for the benefit of the majority of players.

If you’re still not convinced, all I ask is that you wait and see what we've got to show you. We've only scratched the surface of what we've got to show you on GRID 2 - there's lots more to coming in the months to follow and I genuinely think that you'll really enjoy it. Come and see for yourself at Eurogamer Expo.

Executive Producer Clive Moody

http://community.codemasters.com/t5/GRID-2-General-Discussion/With-regards-to-cockpit-view-a-statement-from-Executive-Producer/m-p/17778/message-uid/17778#U17778

 

[The_Darkest_Red]

I find it kind of hard to blame them if the statements about how much it helps in terms of memory allocation are true. If the game will be better because of it and at least 95% of the fans won't care then I think the decision makes sense.

Still, I feel bad for you guys who really love the cockpit view, especially if that's enough to keep you from enjoying the game at all.

 

[Dilly]

Don't care about the reasons or what's left to show, won't buy. I wonder what they really are going to do with that extra processing power then.

 

[gunther]

NO COCKPIT!!!!!

FUCK!

 

[Wonko_C]

From their forum:

http://community.codemasters.com/t5/GRID-2-General-Discussion/With-regards-to-cockpit-view-a-statement-from-Executive-Producer/m-p/17778/message-uid/17778#U17778

It's the Mass Effect 3 "can't holster weapon" thing all over again. The current generation has overstayed its welcome and compromises have to be made to improve the instagram filter.

 

[Neuromancer]

Don't care about the reasons or what's left to show, won't buy. I wonder what they really are going to do with that extra processing power then.

Trash blows across the track in the wind, sparks scatter from the L trains above, and a soaring jet etches its contrails across the sky

.

 

[Totobeni]

I find it kind of hard to blame them if the statements about how much it helps in terms of memory allocation are true. If the game will be better because of it and at least 95% of the fans won't care then I think the decision makes sense.

Still, I feel bad for you guys who really love the cockpit view, especially if that's enough to keep you from enjoying the game at all.

I only play real racing games with cockpit view(and racing wheel if available)nowadays,so they just completely lost my money and respect with this decision.

 

[Goldrusher]

What this means in practice is that the benefit to our vehicle models, environment models and the hundreds of other things in the environment sapping memory, is huge. By making this educated call, we can use the extra available memory to make the on-track racing a truly mind-blowingly immersive experience.

For example, we can author and run higher resolution vehicle models with more detailed geometry. We can feature higher resolution external vehicle textures and work further detail into our environment textures. We can dedicate more processing power to our improved physics systems, integral to the GRID 2 experience, and push other systems to the next level, such as particles and real-time lighting. And there are many more benefits.

How about you ignore all that, ditch the filters and make the game run at 60fps.

You know...

We’re dedicated to pushing GRID 2 to the next level, making it the definitive racing game on this generation of hardware.

 

[Dilly]

.

Very important features then.

 

[KageMaru]

But it impacts in the RAM usage.

Yeah that's true, I didn't consider that. The dev post above also does a good job explaining their decision and I can't really argue against it.

I'll be curious to see how it looks graphically on these consoles, but I still don't think I'll buy without a cockpit view.