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[Totobeni]

http://cdn.chud.com/0/02/0244ee12_larry-david-faint1qqx.gif

How about you ignore all that and make the game run at 60fps...[/QUOTE]

for them it seems that shiny fancy crap >>>>> higher frame rate and cockpit view that makes the experience and driving/gameplay better.

their priorities are messed up.

 

[Jamesways]

By making this educated call, we can use the extra available memory to make the on-track racing a truly mind-blowingly immersive experience.

Nothing says immersion more than chase cam.

 

[Dilly]

I want the Toca days Codemasters back.

 

[jlevel13]

it's a fact that only 5% of Codemasters Racing game players ever used the in-car view

I still feel like this "fact" is made up. I can't believe only 5% of players ever used the cockpit view, especially say in Dirt 3, where hardcore mode forced it and was pretty much the best thing about that uneven release.

Honestly, the graphics in Codemasters racing games have been very good since Dirt 2, especially on PC. I don't feel like they needed to take away features to improve the graphical detail. It's just so misguided and crazy. Nobody ever complains about the detail and graphical effects in their games (except for the piss filter). They look great. People complain about the handling, the bugs and especially 30 FPS on console. Those are the areas they should be working on improving.

 

[Neuromancer]

Nothing says immersion more than chase cam.

"It's like I'm literally hanging in the air 10 feet behind and above the car, steering, accelerating and braking as if by magic! SO REAL!"

 

[Danny Dudekisser]

I wonder if it's going to be like Codemasters good racing games, or if it'll be like that shitty Dirt Showdown... or whatever it was called.

Hopefully the former, obviously... because these guys make the best racing games today, by a fucking mile.

 

[Goldrusher]

I wonder if it's going to be like Codemasters good racing games, or if it'll be like that shitty Dirt Showdown... or whatever it was called.

Hopefully the former, obviously... because these guys make the best racing games today, by a fucking mile.

You do know it's 2012 and not 2006?

 

[Jamesways]

"It's like I'm literally hanging in the air 10 feet behind and above the car, steering, accelerating and braking as if by magic! SO REAL!"

True Race day immersion!

I still feel like this "fact" is made up. I can't believe only 5% of players ever used the cockpit view, especially say in Dirt 3, where hardcore mode forced it and was pretty much the best thing about that uneven release.

I'm with you. Ony 5% of all players of each game since Dirt ever used the cockpit view? B.S. I could see lower stats from people playing multiplayer exclusively, but still, that seems way too low.

What a bummer.

 

[Doug Heffernan]

Isn't most of the Codemasters staff now at Playground Games? (Forza Horizon)

That would explain a lot...

 

[1-D_FTW]

.

Trash blowing across the track seems oddly poetic.

 

[NullPointer]

"It's like I'm literally hanging in the air 10 feet behind and above the car, steering, accelerating and braking as if by magic! SO REAL!"

Shift happens.

Every since NFS Shift came along immersion for me has been defined as a solid cockpit experience. Its great in Shift, Forza, Dirt 3 and many GT5 cars have stellar internal views. Even Driver San Francisco has a cockpit view for chrissakes.

But hey, they've made their design trade-offs and I'm obviously not their target audience any more. Moving on.

 

[RobotRocker]

Fuck, there's a whole load of overreaction going on in this thread. Who are we to argue with the developers of their own game?

You can mock up a cockpit in ten minutes flat by fixing cardboard to your screen, and if you use grey duct tape you can add a roll cage without breaking sweat. Codemasters know this. It's the rest of us who are stupid.

Codies can do better. Maybe even a plastic shell with peeled off labels of dials, cigarette burns and the guy with the stink eye in the corner who wanders in and offers you a bag of weed for a fiver for that true arcade immersion™

Hellios. Hire me, baby.

 

[StuBurns]

No cockpit? I'd rather die...

 

[MagicWithEarvin]

Only 5% of Grid users used the cockpit view, huh? Reading through here and other forums, as well as watching a ton of cockpit videos on YouTube, I'm just not sure.

 

[sflufan]

I'm sorry, but a cockpit view is simply a fundamental, intrinsic feature of a racer. There is simply no justifiable reason for not including one.

You might as well not include a brake or accelerator.

 

[drifter444]

I want a cockpit view dammit.

 

[McLovin]

Awwwww man!! I loved Grid!!!
edit- I used cock-pit view all the time ;_;

 

[Spectral Glider]

Bullshit CG trailer and no cockpit view? Yuck.

 

[Cuban Legend]

I really can't believe that they took the cockpit view out. Their reasoning is even stranger.

Downgraded to $5 Steam Sale. Codemasters are fools, I feel sorry for them.

 

[Dibbz]

Nothing says immersion more than chase cam.

lol

 

[Hero of Legend]

Hope it's Wii U-bound like All-Stars and whatever Dirt game they're bringing. God I hate these NDA's, it's always a guess if Wii U is being supported or not, Gamescom I hope will lift the curtains for more western games. :/

When's that again?

 

[DonMigs85]

for them it seems that shiny fancy crap >>>>> higher frame rate and cockpit view that makes the experience and driving/gameplay better.

their priorities are messed up.

It's pretty much just Polyphony, Turn 10 and Reflections that seem to care about 60FPS and tighter response nowadays.
If I'm not mistaken, Burnout Paradise and Driver San Fran were the last two cross-platform 60FPS console driving game.

 

[Totobeni]

Codemasters GRID2 forum is full of angry people right now.nice work losing many of your fans in this already small genre,CM.

 

[Neuromancer]

Let's just assume for the sake of argument that the 5% statistic is true. Odds are, those 5% are your most hardcore fans. They're the ones who are most likely to get hyped up about the game before its out and hype up other people in the process. They're the ones who are most likely to get the game day one and (assuming the quality is there) spread their positive impressions online and to their friends. They're the ones who are most likely to capture footage and upload it to YouTube. In other words these people are doing your job and basically advertising the game for you. I think it's pretty silly to make these people upset, just so you can (by your own admission, Codemasters) make other parts of the game a little prettier.

It's probably too late to reverse course but I think this was a terrible idea.

 

[NullPointer]

It's pretty much just Polyphony, Turn 10 and Reflections that seem to care about 60FPS and tighter response nowadays.
If I'm not mistaken, Burnout Paradise was the last cross-platform 60FPS console driving game.

Driver: San Francisco?

 

[DonMigs85]

Driver: San Francisco?

Oops, will edit

 

[Cuban Legend]

Driver: San Francisco?

And that was a game with a great chase cam but an even more interesting cockpit view. REPPIN DAT 900 DEGREE ANIMATIONS.

 

[Dilly]

I will laugh if this game doesn't have dynamic weather and or pitstops.

It wouldn't surprise me, they obviously need the memory for trash flying around on the track.

 

[Smash88]

Piss Filter 2.0.

 

[Absoludacrous]

I've never seen a racing developer so intent on fucking up all of their franchises as Codemasters has this generation.

 

[Randy]

http://www.gamesradar.com/grid-2-we...ing-it-racing-games-will-never-be-same-again/

It's true, GRID 2 is real. We've played it. We've crashed over the Armco of the Californian coastline and into the blue sky beyond. And we're here to tell you everything we can because we're ridiculously excited about it. This has the potential to be the best racing game of the generation. Perhaps ever.

 

[Dilly]

Perhaps ever? :lol

 

[brotkasten]

Perhaps ever? :lol

Gaming press hypes up their shitty moneyhatted previews. Wheel nuts at 11.

 

[Grassy]

http://www.gamesradar.com/grid-2-we...ing-it-racing-games-will-never-be-same-again/

Oh hang on a second, if 85% of players use gamepads surely they can save valuable resources by fucking off wheel support completely then...

 

[Mascot]

http://www.gamesradar.com/grid-2-we...ing-it-racing-games-will-never-be-same-again/

If GRID 2 is pitched as purely an arcade racer, then I feel pretty excited by it. Codemasters maybe need to drop any pretences about it being simcade - they made that mistake while marketing GRID and ended up dashing a lot of player's expectations.

Ditching cockpit view is a brave (foolhardy?) decision, but the game might still turn out to be a fuck-load of fun.

 

[sp3000]

The cockpit view was the only thing good about the first game and of course they are taking it out.

What an unbelievably stupid idea

I would rather spend $60 on a game like Project Cars that actually listens to its fanbase. Oh, and it also takes advantage of the strengths of the PC instead of removing features just to cater to the console's lack of RAM

 

[Dilly]

Oh hang on a second, if 85% of players use gamepads surely they can save valuable resources by fucking off wheel support completely then...

They can use that processing power to have dynamic cloth animations on spectators.

 

[MaLDo]

84,3% of players look to the road while playing, so they can eliminate the car model and textures.

78,5% of players skip the replays, so they can eliminate replays.

....

Those excuses about memory and power are easily removed if the game is able to release the textures and the exterior of the car model when loading textures and interior models (and the hood). Could in any case limit change during the race (just choose in the start countdown).

 

[Delusibeta]

for them it seems that shiny fancy crap >>>>> higher frame rate and cockpit view that makes the experience and driving/gameplay better.

their priorities are messed up.

If they want to maximise casual sales, this is precisely how you go about it: better graphix equals more sales, most of the time.

 

[Dead Man]

Why are none of the trees actually green? Fuck you CM.

I can tolerate the absence of in car view if they compensate it with 30+ tracks.

But if they come offering a 6 track game like Dirt, I'll let it rotten in the shelf.

Yeah. I don't use coclpit cams, so that is no big deal to me, but I understand why people are pissed off about it.

I just want this again

That was such a great game.

 

[Salsa]

racing wheel ready

 

[brotkasten]

racing wheel ready

Who says the game has proper wheel support? Looking at the statistics, only a minority of gamers use wheels.

On a more serious note, here's the producer's "fuck you" to all gamers who want the cockpit view in this game.

"First of all, it's important to say that every design decision we make is done with a lot of careful consideration and not taken lightly. We're acutely aware of the love there is for GRID in our community and we want to deliver the best possible experience for everyone.



There seems to be some confusion about where we get our data from to help us make these decisions. While we do use research and focus groups, the most important data source for us is the enormous amount of telemetry data we can obtain from our servers that tells us exactly how and what our players are doing across all our games. So it's not a case of just a sample of people we've spoken to in research, it's a fact that only 5% of Codemasters Racing game players ever used the in-car view.



We certainly don't want to alienate any of our fans we want to deliver truly exciting features that 100% of our players will enjoy. Videogame development is always about trade-offs and in this case, taking the hard decision to lose the in-car views for 5% of our players (and remember we still have bonnet cam and bumper cam, which many people with racing wheels use), is something we felt was more beneficial to everyone. They are expensive to run due to the requirement for high-resolution interior textures which are seen close-up and require a considerable amount of in-game memory (to store) and processing (to render).



What this means in practice is that the benefit to our vehicle models, environment models and the hundreds of other things in the environment sapping memory, is huge. By making this educated call, we can use the extra available memory to make the on-track racing a truly mind-blowingly immersive experience.



For example, we can author and run higher resolution vehicle models with more detailed geometry. We can feature higher resolution external vehicle textures and work further detail into our environment textures. We can dedicate more processing power to our improved physics systems, integral to the GRID 2 experience, and push other systems to the next level, such as particles and real-time lighting. And there are many more benefits.



One final point to make is that we’re at the tail-end of the current console generation. We’re now incredibly familiar with the current hardware and have reached the point that we’re getting EVERYTHING possible from it. We’re dedicated to pushing GRID 2 to the next level, making it the definitive racing game on this generation of hardware. Dropping a lesser-used feature such as interior cam frees up the memory and processing power to push the more prominent systems to the next level is a tough decision but it's one we felt had to be made, for the benefit of the majority of players.



If you’re still not convinced, all I ask is that you wait and see what we've got to show you. We've only scratched the surface of what we've got to show you on GRID 2 - there's lots more to coming in the months to follow and I genuinely think that you'll really enjoy it. Come and see for yourself at Eurogamer Expo.



Executive Producer Clive Moody"

It's just too bad that GT5 and Forza 4 still end up looking better than this instagram'd game.

 

[Jamesways]

People are going to be even more pissed when they realize the car list will have no GT, LMP, or touring cars. Pretty sure it's just going to be drifting cars, muscle, and exotics.
Wonder if Spa was taken out?

 

[Diablohead]

People are going to be even more pissed when they realize the car list will have no GT, LMP, or touring cars. Pretty sure it's just going to be drifting cars, muscle, and exotics.
Wonder if Spa was taken out?

oh man if spa is gone and we only have skylines, lol...

 

[Perkel]

oh man if spa is gone and we only have skylines, lol...

87% of people hate skylines
There won't be any skylines.

But 74% people like monkeys so...

 

[diffusionx]

I don't like cockpit view in most games. It's a cool graphical feature but seeing a tiny sliver of the track from 6 feet away is not immersive to me. I much prefer bonnet cam.

If the guy isn't lying then I can see why they would cut it. Cockpit views for all cars is a lot of work and if only 5% of people are utilizing it....

 

[Perkel]

I don't like cockpit view in most games. It's a cool graphical feature but seeing a tiny sliver of the track from 6 feet away is not immersive to me. I much prefer bonnet cam.

If the guy isn't lying then I can see why they would cut it. Cockpit views for all cars is a lot of work and if only 5% of people are utilizing it....

I can watch it all day

 

[RaceManIak]

In Olympic time... I considere the annoucement of Grid2 a False start.

 

[thelurkinghorror]

I'm one of the 5% (now 6%?) and very sad about the new info on Grid2. What the fuck Codemasters?
You have to build cool games for who pay to play not for the shareholders. And this is a common mistake these days, i'm so sad.

Yesterday i finished again MGS2 and I remember the time when a game designer don't give a fuck and make what he really want to make...

 

[gtmax]

Racing games have become such a convoluted genre. Every other sports game is tailored to people that are fans of that sport and are mostly a simulation - in at least the way they make you feel in playing the game. Baseball, Basketball, Football, Soccer, they all simulate the basis of their games pretty well.

I think a lot of devs are stuck thinking they can deliver the best driving model themselves, not realizing others have nearly perfected the formula. I'd love to have seen this game using the driving model of PGR series - at least the handling in that game was very consistent.

What i miss from racing games is a structured career life that gives you the sense that you've made progress in the game. I sound like a broken record but Total Immersion Racing had a fantastic career mode. Because you raced with different classed cars within the same race, it gave you something to work towards. Mix car racing is a great idea that no one really does.

In that game, TIR, you also had an engineer that would tune your car based on teh track you were driving. So you did laps and after every lap he tuned your brakes, suspension, gearing depending on your times.

And why can't any game have an ultimate achievement after some point? Either some hidden car (doesn't have to be exotic), a hidden track or a cool effect, like TOCA2 had, just for shits and giggles.

These producers need to step away and have a person there that knows what FUN is.

I tried the first Grid and didn't bother after how that demo felt. Not my cup of tea physics wise.