Support NeoGAF

[Caio]

Yea, those images don't do it justice, the video is very impressive.

Yeah, some people really can't even understand what kind of advancement is Ratchet on PS5 : technical differences VS Ratchet PS4 include 4k texel density assets, GI RT support, more draw distances and higher texellation at larger draw distance, improved physics and number of moving objects and static objects, native 4K 30fps & Dynamic 60fps, etc etc etc Some people here are so funny, to say the least.

 

[El Pistolero]

I remember seeing people downplaying this. "Oh but what's so incredible about that". Lol. That's pretty much instant. That's a whole fucking level with huge viewing distances completely loaded in 2~3 seconds. Many times in a row without disrupting gameplay. If that's not nextgen I don't know what is.

Better AA, AF, shadows and FPS count. Such is the view of the unsophisticated!

 

[Whitecrow]

about 6 seconds to both move the RAM for the current game to the SSD and then also load the next game as well. Games not optimized for XSX either, but is using Velocity Architecture

Nothing secret-saucy about saving game states in a fast hard drive.

 

[TonyK]

about 6 seconds to both move the RAM for the current game to the SSD and then also load the next game as well. Games not optimized for XSX either, but is using Velocity Architecture

Multi quick resume is AWESOME!! Will Ps5 have something similar for resume multiple games like XBox?

 

[GymWolf]

Yes they wok fry live dogs
If saw that, id execute the chef.
I know its a culture thing, but live frying a dog, fucking animals

Time to nuke china i guess, we really don't lose anything valuable over there...

 

[Closer]

Time to nuke china i guess, we really don't lose anything valuable over there...

If you can find something that only affects Humans, I'm all in!

 

[THEAP99]

Multi quick resume is AWESOME!! Will Ps5 have something similar for resume multiple games like XBox?

The ps-4 already had that

 

[TonyK]

The ps-4 already had that

No, I have a Ps4Pro. It has quick resume for 1 game, but not for multiple games (like Netflix has or Xbox series X will have)

So my question is if Sony said PS5 will have quick resume for multiple games at same time.

 

[THEAP99]

No, I have a Ps4Pro. It has quick resume for 1 game, but not for multiple games (like Netflix has or Xbox series X will have)

So my question is if Sony said PS5 will have quick resume for multiple games at same time.

They haven't talked anything ui related yet

 

[ShadowWolf712]

You need healthy vision and a 4K screen to see it, but here are some more I made. Zoom as much as you like, and this is a heavily compressed video:

More 4K screenshots I made:

See the extremely detailed shadows from the tail hair

The lighting gives a realistic flavor to a cartoony game

This could pass as a CGI movie

You absolutely do not need a 4K screen to see the difference, tbh.

The textures and models ALONE have visible differences even on a 1080p phone screen.

 

[Grinchy]

It clearly looks incredible. Some people will say it doesn't, and that's ok. Some people aren't observant or they have agendas or they hate platformers or any number of reasons for having a stupid opinion.

 

[ShadowWolf712]

The same expert who got banned on ERA and B3D for spreading FUD and same guy who said R&C doesn't have RT, that expert?

Wait, he said it doesn't have raytracing??

 

[winjer]

 

[Negotiator101]

This guy has literally ripped apart the SSD requirement in one short video, impressive.

 

[Gameplaylover]

So, secret sauce my ass or what?

 

[Holammer]

This guy has literally ripped apart the SSD requirement in one short video, impressive.

It's not just anyone either, that's Jon Burton, founder & coder of Traveller's Tales.

 

[Stooky]

This is a load of Shit.

 

[winjer]

This guy has literally ripped apart the SSD requirement in one short video, impressive.

This is not just some guy. This is Jon Burton, an industry veteran, that has been making games for 30 years.
A lot of them were state of the art in their respective platforms.

 

[Whitecrow]

This guy has literally ripped apart the SSD requirement in one short video, impressive.

He didnt. That's a very clickbaity video.

The title should've been: Ratchet and Clank tricks could've been used in previous generations.
Nobody say it couldnt.

Put a 5400 rpm SATA drive on the ps5 and see what happens to the gameplay.

 

[Riky]

Very interesting.

So he's basically saying Insomniac are using the SSD but what they are using it for could be done with other techniques on older hardware.
Maybe they will get to the point where what they use the SSD for in future will be impossible?

 

[Dream-Knife]

He didnt. That's a very clickbaity video.

The title should've been: Ratchet and Clank tricks could've been used in previous generations.
Nobody say it couldnt.

Put a 5400 rpm SATA drive on the ps5 and see what happens to the gameplay.

Pretty sure everyone in this thread last year was saying that.

 

[kruis]

This guy has literally ripped apart the SSD requirement in one short video, impressive.

No, he didn't. His point is that older hardware can also stream in completely different environments, but completely sidesteps the loss in asset quality. And that asset quality is the whole point. R&C:ARiT could be done on the PS4 but it wouldn't run as smooth, the transitions would be longer and models and environments would be simplified enormously to make it work on a console with half the amount of ram as the PS5 and a slow as molasses HD compared to a blazing fast SSD.

 

[nush]

This is a load of Shit.

One of the most technically proficient programmers out there with a huge body of work to back it up.

In fairness a launch window game isn't going to max out the hardware benefits right out the gate.

 

[Negotiator101]

He didnt. That's a very clickbaity video.

The title should've been: Ratchet and Clank tricks could've been used in previous generations.
Nobody say it couldnt.

Put a 5400 rpm SATA drive on the ps5 and see what happens to the gameplay.

Insomniac said it required an SSD, it obviously doesn't.

 

[Negotiator101]

No, he didn't. His point is that older hardware can also stream in completely different environments, but completely sidesteps the loss in asset quality. And that asset quality is the whole point. R&C:ARiT could be done on the PS4 but it wouldn't run as smooth, the transitions would be longer and models and environments would be simplified enormously to make it work on a console with half the amount of ram as the PS5 and a slow as molasses HD compared to a blazing fast SSD.

He just did, rewatch the video

 

[kruis]

This is not just some guy. This is Jon Burton, an industry veteran, that has been making games for 30 years.
A lot of them were state of the art in their respective platforms.

It's still clickbait.

 

[Whitecrow]

Insomniac said it required an SSD, it obviously doesn't.

You cant make the game behave like that in a SATA drive. End of the story.

If we are going that way, we could make the game for PS3 and make it run at 2 fps.

 

[Negotiator101]

You cant make the game behave like that in a SATA drive. End of the story.

If we are going that way, we could make the game for PS3 and make it run at 2 fps.

Mate, the guy is a programmer, I didn't make the video. Insomniac had us all fooled but this guy has debunked it. You got an issue then take it up with him.

 

[nush]

It's still clickbait.

A youtuber using a clickbait title!

OMG someone call the authorities to stamp this filth out.

 

[Whitecrow]

Mate, the guy is a programmer, I didn't make the video. Insomniac had us all fooled but this guy has debunked it. You got an issue then take it up with him.

I'm a programmer too. I'm also an analytic enough person to not swallow everything youtube throws at me without filtering it.

You are the one here acting like a pure fanboy who is not listening to anything or any other reasoning different than yours.

 

[Dream-Knife]

No, he didn't. His point is that older hardware can also stream in completely different environments, but completely sidesteps the loss in asset quality. And that asset quality is the whole point. R&C:ARiT could be done on the PS4 but it wouldn't run as smooth, the transitions would be longer and models and environments would be simplified enormously to make it work on a console with half the amount of ram as the PS5 and a slow as molasses HD compared to a blazing fast SSD.

His point was those rifts have basic geometry, and the other section was on rails, making it very easy to preload everything.

Essentially it's a pretty version of Mario 64.

 

[Negotiator101]

I'm a programmer too. I'm also an analytic enough person to not swallow everything youtube throws at me without filtering it.

You are the one here acting like a pure fanboy who is not listening to anything or any other reasoning different than yours.

What games you worked on? I listened to that guy who has far better knowledge than you.

 

[Md Ray]

Video disliked and reported for spam/misleading. What a load of bullshit.

 

[Whitecrow]

What games you worked on? I listened to that guy who has far better knowledge than you.

Making games != being smart

 

[Connxtion]

You cant make the game behave like that in a SATA drive. End of the story.

If we are going that way, we could make the game for PS3 and make it run at 2 fps.

This guy knows his shit more than 99% of the folk on this forum.

He also showed a game he worked on doing the exact same thing in the video, in fact better as both instances of the world/locations were running in real-time.

We all knew how this was done, smoke and mirrors. But like he said they will be using the SSD properly, he was just discussing how it’s achievable on older hardware since it was thought and specifically stated by Insomniac that it can’t/wouldn’t.

Again this guy knows his shit, and if he says it can be done, it can be done.

 

[Garani]

Mate, the guy is a programmer, I didn't make the video. Insomniac had us all fooled but this guy has debunked it. You got an issue then take it up with him.

So what? He didn't work on THAT game. Of course asset streaming has been done since ages past. Shit, it used to be done during the Amiga era, especially for the video work.

As other said, asset streaming isn't new. Streaming assets in high quality is a whole different issue.

 

[kruis]

His point was those rifts have basic geometry, and the other section was on rails, making it very easy to preload everything.

Essentially it's a pretty version of Mario 64.

Again, he completely disregards the asset quality in those on rails sections. Yes, you could recreate the same gameplay mechanic on the PS4 but It would be impossible to load the same amount of data in the same amount of time on a PS4 as on a PS5. The PS4 HDD simply can't stream data that fast. You wouldn't be playing a Pixar movie in real time anymore.

 

[Negotiator101]

Making games != being smart

He's got 30 years experience.

 

[Whitecrow]

This guy knows his shit more than 99% of the folk on this forum.

He also showed a game he worked on doing the exact same thing in the video, in fact better as both instances of the world/locations were running in real-time.

We all knew how this was done, smoke and mirrors. But like he said they will be using the SSD properly, he was just discussing how it’s achievable on older hardware since it was thought and specifically stated by Insomniac that it can’t/wouldn’t.

Again this guy knows his shit, and if he says it can be done, it can be done.

Man the IQ in this forum.

Is it possible to do the trick in older hardware?
YES

Does it make sense?
FUKING NO

Who in the world would make this gameplay feature if instead of loading in 2 seconds it loads in 1 minute?

Stop playing semantics. The only platform where this feature can work AS INTENDED is the PS5 with the SSD.
And stop using the authority fallacy to shut off your brain.

 

[Negotiator101]

So what? He didn't work on THAT game. Of course asset streaming has been done since ages past. Shit, it used to be done during the Amiga era, especially for the video work.

As other said, asset streaming isn't new. Streaming assets in high quality is a whole different issue.

I'm listening to the guy who made the video, he seemed highly knowledgeable and intelligent. 30 years experience, I say his history speaks for itself.

 

[Dream-Knife]

Again, he completely disregards the asset quality in those on rails sections. Yes, you could recreate the same gameplay mechanic on the PS4 but It would be impossible to load the same amount of data in the same amount of time on a PS4 as on a PS5. The PS4 HDD simply can't stream data that fast. You wouldn't be playing a Pixar movie in real time anymore.

I agree on the asset quality.

Ratchet isn't Pixar quality though. It's closer than anything has come though. It takes hours to render a single frame of a Pixar movie.

 

[Low Moral Fibre]

I totally believe R&C would be possible on older hardware with some tweaks. I thought it was a fun game but was really disappointed with the rifts as I pictured being able to jump between worlds at will in the middle of levels but the video is spot on in that it is basically only on-rails sections or cutscenes.

The pocket rifts are just warping you to another part of the level so nothing more impressive than Portal.

What I do think is that given more time Insomniac or some team with similar pedigree could make a game where you aren't so limited with the warping. R&C felt like a tech demo or proof of concept but I can't see why someone couldn't use the same principles to make it possible to warp around between different worlds outside of on-rails stuff and something like that would not be possible on older hardware without huge loading screens as the console would never know when to pre-load stuff.

 

[winjer]

You cant make the game behave like that in a SATA drive. End of the story.

If we are going that way, we could make the game for PS3 and make it run at 2 fps.

The point he is making, is that Insomniac said that those rifts and transitions, were only possible on the PS5's SSD.
And this is objectively false. They could do those effects on the Series X, or PC with an SSD.
Sony was desperate to have some thing that showed some technical advantage over the Series X. And the only thing they had, was the SSD.
So the marketing department ran with that narrative.
Maybe some day we will see a game that does something that is only possible on the PS5 SSD, and not on the Series X.
But that game is not Ratchet and Clank a Rift Apart.

And he did make a similar effect on the PS3, with an HDD. But of course, with a lower level of detail. This is a 15 year old console, after all.

 

[Snake29]

No, he didn't. His point is that older hardware can also stream in completely different environments, but completely sidesteps the loss in asset quality. And that asset quality is the whole point. R&C:ARiT could be done on the PS4 but it wouldn't run as smooth, the transitions would be longer and models and environments would be simplified enormously to make it work on a console with half the amount of ram as the PS5 and a slow as molasses HD compared to a blazing fast SSD.

Just look at Miles Morales on PS4 and PS5. Both are the same games, but one has no loading screens if you go from inside a building to the outside of a building.

The point he is making, is that Insomniac said that those rifts and transitions, were only possible on the PS5's SSD.
And this is objectively false. They could do those effects on the Series X, or PC with an SSD.
Sony was desperate to have some thing that showed some technical advantage over the Series X. And the only thing they had, was the SSD.
So the marketing department ran with that narrative.
Maybe some day we will see a game that does something that is only possible on the PS5 SSD, and not on the Series X.
But that game is not Ratchet and Clank a Rift Apart.

And he did make a similar effect on the PS3, with an HDD. But of course, with a lower level of detail. This is a 15 year old console, after all.

Yeah since why would Insomniac even talk about Xbox in their marketing? Would Xbox talk about their competitor if they market something or what?

And this is objectively false. They could do those effects on the Series X, or PC with an SSD.

Insomniac has always said it wasn't possible on previous hardware. Did they said it was not possible on PC or Xbox? Why bring the Xbox into it in the first place with a game developed exclusively for the PS5?

Why does this all sounds like the xbox fans are desperately trying to shit on this lol. Also Insomniac has never claimed Rift Apart would use all the SSD I/O power and that there was no room, since they said there was still enough of room left. So we already knew that and no other game atm is using the full potential, but that doesn't mean you just need to put in a lower spec SSD, because that makes no sense.

I only see this as a new "sEe, tHe xSx sSd iS oN pAr" kinda nonsense...

I'm listening to the guy who made the video, he seemed highly knowledgeable and intelligent. 30 years experience, I say his history speaks for itself.

Troll harder....

 

[cireza]

Seeing who made the video makes this even more brutal because the background and experience of the person. Great watch, thanks.

 

[sircaw]

Very interesting.

So he's basically saying Insomniac are using the SSD but what they are using it for could be done with other techniques on older hardware.
Maybe they will get to the point where what they use the SSD for in future will be impossible?

I am replaying horizon zero dawn again, I wish my ps4 pro had 1 sec loading times.

Trust clickbait video or insomniac games, a company that makes magic happen.

 

[nush]

Video disliked and reported for spam/misleading. What a load of bullshit.

I'm sure your +1 to the 47 dislikes vs 1.2K likes is really going to show him!

 

[Connxtion]

Man the IQ in this forum.

Is it possible to do the trick in older hardware?
YES

Thank you, you just confirmed the whole premise of the video

Now we both agree.

 

[Werewolfgrandma]

I'm a programmer too. I'm also an analytic enough person to not swallow everything youtube throws at me without filtering it.

You are the one here acting like a pure fanboy who is not listening to anything or any other reasoning different than yours.

I've have at least 15 different people here shit on me for suggesting Insomniac could of made this game work on Xbox series because they are talented and it's their talent and not the ps5 that makes the game impressive.

Video disliked and reported for spam/misleading. What a load of bullshit.

The more you post the more I think you just get your rocks off from trolling.

 

[Mithos]

Unless his "lego ps3" game was loading the second gameplay from the HDD (was probably already in ram/vram wasting space that could have been used by the active gameplay view) when pressing change viewport he did not disprove much.