Theres a few interesting choices but why in the world is Heracross there?
There's more iconic gen 2 pokemon then him.
As said in his post: Placeholder for Gen VI pokemon.
Theres a few interesting choices but why in the world is Heracross there?
There's more iconic gen 2 pokemon then him.
Are there many/any characters left that are actually guaranteed beyond a shadow of a doubt?
I know you aren't serious but do people actually want the eShop bag as a playable character?
...Admittedly, that would be actually fucking hilarious.
I think Mach Rider is our second retro rep if we get one. Sakurai did state that Mach Rider was his favorite newcomer for Melee and Mach Rider is the spiritual predecessor to F-zero, so it is kind of important. Also I see great revival potential in Mach Rider that I could see Sakurai ultilizing.Green Mamba said:Glad to see someone other than me sees Mach Rider potential.
Chrom is certainly a possibility (I feel as it will come down to him and Roy for the third Fire Emblem spot), but I think Roy has the upper hand here.Sir Ilpalazzo said:I still can't agree with putting Roy there instead of Chrom. I'm not denying that there is still demand for Roy, but Awakening is a big success and a pretty important game for Nintendo, so I see no reason why Chrom wouldn't be chosen over Roy.
Glad to see you here.IntelliHeath said:Ah! Welcome to NeoGaf. I just looked at your roster first without reading anything and I was wondering why it look familiar. Now I saw your name, so no wonder your roster look familiar.
I would be happy with the roster, but it might be lack of surprises for me.
I'm not sure how many, but I do think we'll see some new faces with unique gameplay mechanics.Red Arremer said:Mach Rider definitely has potential, but Sakurai would likely have to have a vision for a character mechanic. I'm not putting it beyond him to come up with a really cool mechanic for him, but I wouldn't put my money on Mach Rider being the character who brings in new mechanics.
That said, do you think there will be a lot of new characters that will have fresh gameplay mechanics?
Melee and Brawl both brought in characters with new aspects in that regard - the Ice Climbers as pair character, Peach's random item pull, Marth's stronger sword tip, Zelda/Sheik's transformation, Pichu's self-hurting (for better or worse), Lucario's aura, gliding, tether recoveries, PT's fatigue, Wario's in-game timer charging, Olimar as a whole...
I look forward to when everyone said "OMG, 6th Gen Mascot is like guarantee", even if it's revealed to be butt-ugly.Neoriceisgood said:I can't wait for 6th gen Lucario to be revealed and this thread to go nuts over it.
I understand that it never did as well as Lucario, but I thought it was a popular Pokémon.Boss Doggie said:Considering how Zoroark flopped I doubt they'll try another Lucario.
Mainly appearly in Samurai Warriors 3 and Nintendo Land is what made him likely. Sakurai said that if he ges another game that he will probably get into Smash. Now this was said Pre-Melee, but Sakurai is known for sticking to his stance and I feel as these two appearances will be enough to get Takamaru in.Green Mamba said:I have to question why Takamaru is so commonly seen on rosters. It seems almost like the group of Smash fans has collectively convinced itself that he's likely, but I've never actually seen someone request him per se.
At this point, I don't consider anyone a guarantee since any characters could get passed up.Neoriceisgood said:Are there many/any characters left that are actually guaranteed beyond a shadow of a doubt?
I often felt like a lot of the most logical choices made it into Brawl already. Right now the only "shoe ins" aren't as much shoe-ins as much as ... characters that "make sense" ?
I know you aren't serious but do people actually want the eShop bag as a playable character?
Right. Melee added Bowser, Peach, and Zelda, and Brawl rounded out the top tier of Nintendo characters with Wario, Dedede, Pokémon Trainer, and Diddy Kong. Nintendo's all-stars are accounted for, which makes predicting SSB4's roster especially difficult.Are there many/any characters left that are actually guaranteed beyond a shadow of a doubt?
I often felt like a lot of the most logical choices made it into Brawl already. Right now the only "shoe ins" aren't as much shoe-ins as much as ... characters that "make sense" ?
DKC3.
Which one?
SNES.
There are people who don't like the music?
My main issue with Chrom is that I don't see much standing out about him. Sure you could argue his game being a big success, but looking at representation of Smash characters, it's hard to see Sakurai seriously taking into account sales, especially when Chrom doesn't stand out in his game as much as Marth, Ike and Roy did in their own games (Lucina being a major character in FE13 who looks similar to Marth and DLC consisting of past lords). Also Chrom is very similar to Ike in how he would play, which also hurts since Sakurai looks for uniqueness. Not to mention that Roy is far more popular within the Smash community than Chrom.
The only advantage I see Chrom having is if Sakurai feels a Fire Emblem newcomer would go over better than Roy's return, but with Chrom being basically "expected but not wanted", it makes it hard to see that.
Rather than predicting specific characters I think the first trailer might be most telling cause a roster can, more so than characters, have a certain flavor to it's direction.
1. Peach, Bowser, Mewtwo
2. Marth
3. Zelda, Ice Climbers
4. Mr. Game & Watch
5. Dr. Mario, Ganondorf, Young Link, Falco, Pichu, Roy
1. Wario, Diddy Kong, Lucario
2. Wolf, Zero Suit Samus, Lucas, Ike, Olimar, Pit
3. Pokemon Trainer
4. ROB, Snake, Sonic
5. Toon Link
What if Sakurai trolled us with Slippy being a new character
Waluigi being one of the first characters revealed would be hilarious. I can't think of anyone more anti-hype.
Based on how the previous games turned out, I think this game's roster will primarily be a combination of 2 and 3, moreso than any of the previous games' rosters were. We're just about out of ones (I guess Chrom and probably a new Pokemon are the only ones I can really think of) and if there were more than a few fours, I think the novelty would wear off.
But I don't think fives as you describe them are that bad. I don't think they're "playing it safe" so much as they are the kind of character that gets put in to fluff up the roster just because the developers have extra time, like the Melee clones or the cut Brawl characters. Even if they're sort of half-assed, I like having some characters like that in the game, and they don't take resources that would have gone towards fully unique characters anyway.
1. Peach, Bowser, Mewtwo
2. Marth
3. Zelda, Ice Climbers
4. Mr. Game & Watch
5. Dr. Mario, Ganondorf, Young Link, Falco, Pichu, Roy
1. Wario, Diddy Kong, Lucario
2. Wolf, Zero Suit Samus, Lucas, Ike, Olimar, Pit
3. Pokemon Trainer
4. ROB, Snake, Sonic
5. Toon Link
What if Sakurai trolled us with Slippy being a new character
Deep down everybody at some point has wanted this.
When Snakey went to look at Japanese forums, he said he saw a lot of requests for Takamaru. I guess that's kind of anecdotal, though.
I do agree that I'm not sure how they could make Chrom an interesting character while differentiating him from the current Fire Emblem characters, though. I think that if they seriously can't think of a way to make him interesting, they could just cut Ike and transfer his moveset over to Chrom, but who knows. I don't think there's any way either Ike or Roy can directly compete with Chrom, though, and I think the unique character issue works against Roy just as much as it works against Chrom.
You may have noticed that the Nintendo site that you Go to is blacklisted 'round these parts.
You may have noticed that the Nintendo site that you Go to is blacklisted 'round these parts.
Naw. IIRC it was because they were too eager to post rumors that people on NeoGAF were taking as fact, so that block was put in place to get people to double-check what they were posting was actual news and not rumor.Yeah, I forgot that, should I delete the link entirely?
At GDC 2008, Sakurai outlined his four criteria which characters had to meet. Lucas had to meet them. The fact that he did is what got him in. I'm not sure if this applied to characters in 64 and Melee as well, but I highly doubt recentness was enough to warrant Roy's inclusion, else he wouldn't be one of the most popular newcomers in Melee.Sir Ilpalazzo said:I think recency is a big factor in series with rotating casts like Fire Emblem. We know Roy and Lucas got into Melee and Brawl because they were the newest main characters from their series and for pretty much no other reason.
Most any Pokémon could be added and be made into decent fighters. Potential Mario newcomers are also more popular than pretty much any non-Big Three character (Big Three being Mario, Pokémon and Zelda). The thing is, there's a good reason why the roster is being flooded with Mario or Pokémon addition and it's this:Sir Ilpalazzo said:I can't agree that sales don't matter, either. I'm not saying that they determine everything, but they are the reason why Mario and Pokemon have the most character representation or why Marth is the main Fire Emblem character. It's true that some characters are oddball choices, but in general I think sales (which are a big part of popularity too) are a pretty big factor.
If Sakurai truly valued sales as a serious factor, the roster would be flooded with Mario and Pokémon characters. New additions will get in by their own worth, not because a game makes big $$$.NP: How did you go about choosing which characters to include in the final roster? Were there any characters that you could have included, but weren't able to for what-ever reason?
MS: Of course there were some characters we couldn't include, but we've decided that we're just not going to talk about them. [Laughs] As far as choosing which characters, we had to really look at the series that would be represented in the game and create a balance that would make fans of all the series happy. We didn't want to have all Mario characters, all Pokémon characters... We looked at each series and tried to pick the characters that would have the widest appeal to the largest fan base. And of course, we looked at games like Animal Crossing and Nintendogs, where there aren't really any characters that lend themselves to fighting, and we decided not to include characters from those series as fighting characters. One thing that is kind of a challenge is that we haven't had a lot of new characters from Nintendo since Captain Olimar [that could work well in a fighting game]; a lot of games have been Mario titles or new iterations in existing series.
If Chrom and Zoroark/6th gen didn't suffer from varying degree of being "expected, but not wanted", perhaps I would agree. We'll have to see how much Chrom support grows one FE13 comes out worldwide, but I don't think a Pokémon newcomer will get in over Mewtwo this game since the ones we already have and Mewtwo already have a better resume than any other potential addition from that franchise. If a Pokémon newcomer is added, it'll either be the last addition from the franchise or even beat out Lucario, but I think Mewtwo will take priority.Sir Ilpalazzo said:I don't think Roy can beat out Chrom. Roy has a decent amount of fan support, and Awakening shows that he is still kind of relevant, but Chrom has sales and recency on his side. I don't think it means much that Roy has more support from Smash Bros. fans because in that case we shouldn't get any new characters at all before we bring back the cut Melee characters.
I don't think they'll just copy paste what Ike has, give it to Chrom and tweak his stats. If Chrom were to get in, I think he'll work more like a lugified Ike, but different enough to where he plays considerably different.Sir Ilpalazzo said:I do agree that I'm not sure how they could make Chrom an interesting character while differentiating him from the current Fire Emblem characters, though. I think that if they seriously can't think of a way to make him interesting, they could just cut Ike and transfer his moveset over to Chrom, but who knows. I don't think there's any way either Ike or Roy can directly compete with Chrom, though, and I think the unique character issue works against Roy just as much as it works against Chrom.
Technically, we already do...I'd be fine with 6 Pokemon. Heh, it could be a little homage from the games where the max you could carry is 6. And I agree Snakey, Sakurai shouldn't have problems with time constraints this time around, no excuses why everyone at this point cannot be added. Adding characters should be up there in priority, and if he can't come up with a moveset for a certain character give it to the Tekken/Tales guys because they could easily work their magic.
Technically, we already do...
But yeah, six slots for Pokémon would be nice to see. Brawl's roster + Mewtwo and whatever they throw at us would be the ideal situation. I actually look forward to see what the Gen 6 mascot turns out to be.
Why, exactly? Bayonetta's a cult hit with little mainstream recognition. She also seems a bit too "mature" for a game like Smash Bros. in both physical design and attack capability. I'm confident all guest characters will be company mascot-types from franchises selling in the tens of millions: Mega Man, Pac-Man, Slime, someone from Final Fantasy, etc. Bayonetta's far too minor league.i think bayonetta will be 100% in it.
Weren't Marill and Togepi more the Gold/Silver figureheads. Pichu was more the rep for egg Pokémon.
I certainly see where his potential as a newcomer is coming from, but the Smash fanbase talks as if he's almost certain, or a shoe in, to the point that it really does feel like groupthink at this point, an echo chamber.
Why, exactly? Bayonetta's a cult hit with little mainstream recognition. She also seems a bit too "mature" for a game like Smash Bros. in both physical design and attack capability. I'm confident all guest characters will be company mascot-types from franchises selling in the tens of millions: Mega Man, Pac-Man, Slime, someone from Final Fantasy, etc. Bayonetta's far too minor league.
Black-Wind said:I pop in here sometimes when I see the thread come up on my sub-list but it's never really different. It's never what people really want or what's actually likely (cause no one can know what's actually likely with out new info) it's just what they expect based on some pattern. I don't think many people actually want Chrom for example, they just expect him. At the end of the day it's just a more advanced version of brawl's "Mystical Japan likes XYZ" imo.
Hell, last time I was here I had some huge debate with someone because my obsession with Pokemon lead me to believe that there would be a 6th gen revealed and released before Smash 4 (I think I even made a proper bet about it for $200 on here but I forgot who ...). Most people brushed me off as some nut-job because I don't reinforce the outcomes they expect and that guy really hated the idea because it would shake up what people expect for the series in Smash.
i think bayonetta will be 100% in it.
I do think six slots is possible for Pokemon, and that Sakurai will try his best to bring back all the playable Pokemon from Brawl plus Mewtwo if he has to bring in a 6th-generation Pokemon. I don't think there are any Pokemon in Brawl that Sakurai is going to go into Smash 4 with the intention of cutting, and that if any of Brawl's playable Pokemon (plus Mewtwo) don't get in, it will be due to time constraints than anything else.
Hopefully, Sakurai won't have that problem this time due to having a much bigger team and much longer development time.
However, if the the first posterboy for 6th-generation is a Pokemon that could not translate well to a playable fighter or is another Pokemon that is yet another Lucario/Zoroark, I could very well see them just keeping all of Brawl's playable Pokemon, adding back in Mewtwo, and then calling it a day.
What can people do?But what can you do? Without info there can only be speculation and predictions. And the more logical choices can be based on past decisions. It has become stagnant we all know that. After the first trailer character we'll see if it stays the same. I doubt it because thats how it works. And I think it's ok to only expect some characters too. i'm expecting Chrom but I want Lyn. We're going to get FE Awakening here eventually so maybe by actually getting a chance to play it more people will want him in. And for the Japan thing, it would be selfish to thnik we're the only ones that matter so Japan's input is very important. They're the ones making it lol. What I'm basically saying is that looking it from every angle is perfectly fine, even if some views are more predominant.
I vaguely remember this but I know you did make a PKMN prediction along those lines so good stuff. What else you got?![]()
What can people do?
Realize that they don't have all the answers and be content with just discussing what they would like if they really feel the need to keep discussing a game with so lil information so far from release?
And even if you do expect certain characters, there's no reason to treat them as "shoe-ins". As for Japan Sakurai has said it before that Smash is bigger than being something just for Japan so there's no reason to think that what they want and like makes w/e less likely compared to what the rest of the world likes. For example, I saw someone use "But Japan doesn't like Lil Mac/ P-O!!" and a reason why that happening is "less likely". That would make prefect sense if the game was made purely for Japan and we're all expected to mod our consoles and import it. IT's less "don't care about Japan" and more " don't think that Japan is the be-all-end-all and don't take "News from Japanese Forums!" as anything more than what it is".
And ontop of that there's chunks of "information" that gets over looked because it doesn't line up with what people have listed as "what to expect". Like Namco's possible rep ... people just expect Pacman and will jump on you if you suggest something different. But what has Namco said? Their big heads have freely expressed interest in putting everything from Tekken to SC to Gundam to Tales characters in Smash 4 but never Pacman. Why? Cause those are series they love, work on and make them money. People "expect" MM from Capcom ... but we learned from Brawl that both sides were expecting the other party to approach them. Now the only guy at Capcom that we know gave a damn about it is gone and MM is now their red headed step-child.
And look at Snake, that shows that 3rd party picks are far more "personal" than people seem to care to notice. That makes me think that it's far more "likely" that Sakurai's gonna pick one of his bro's characters over some sterile safe bet. I also think he's gonna want to actually shock people with some characters so I personally see Travis or Bayo as characters to look for. Or even a Tales Of character seeing as Sakurai personally asked for the Tales Director and said Director apparently would love to have a tales character in the cast.
Ehh, Pokemon's my main gaming subject and though I can write another essay about Pichu's importance to the series (to counter this notion that he's not the 2nd gen rep) or how I feel Lucario will go down his road for Smash 4 I don't think people want that debate again so I'm just gonna leave.![]()
Man I wonder how the tears would be delicious if Roy and Mewtwo didn't return.
Man I wonder how the tears would be delicious if Roy and Mewtwo didn't return.