• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Nintendo Land Minigames Unveiled (Screens)

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
NSMB is a perfect example of a game that would be measureably worse if it included online. The multiplayer is built around griefing others, which is fun with your friends in a room and FUCKING IRRITATING with randoms. Nintendo would have had no choice but to remove/time down the playa' hatin' to include online and it would not have come close to being an equal trade.

People should start thinking like a developer, not every feature makes sense for your game, and every choice impacts the design.

That's aside even from the technical difficulty of synching 4 clients in a very precise platformer, that runs at 60fps. NSMB has tons of enemies, moving platforms, and coins on screen. All those interactive elements have to be synched between all four players. On four different connections. It's hard enough to get a 1 on 1 fighting game working online, where there's only two moving objects that matter.

I know that the solution some folks have, is to advocate compromising the game design in the name of online play. Some do believe games are completely useless without internet. Therefore, the game must be brought down in order to work online.

At the same time, many folks really don't understand how this stuff works. You still see plenty of complaints about fighting games for instance, with people asking why their favorite shooter is awesome online but so many fighting games suck. They don't understand what's happening under the hood (and even visually) in say, an FPS vs a genre where the action must be locked 1:1 between clients.


Play online with friends? It's not "local with friends or online with strangers, sorry". I only play online with friends. Mainly because it has gotten complicates to get together physically. Not impossible but I'd like online to fall back on. No excuse for the lack of it really. I'll still buy it but I'm not going to pretend that they dropped the ball.

Well, like this. You may believe there's zero excuse for any game to not have live online multiplayer. But sometimes, there's a reason.

Back when NSMB Wii had its Iwata Asks, I seem to recall Miyamoto said that online multiplayer in the game was too technically demanding. The general reaction to this was "he's lying, they're lazy". I didn't think that was the case then, and don't think it's the case now. I'm sure to some that's "defending a corporation". I tend to think it's understanding how the technology works.

FYI, I fully agree that it's frustrating that some games don't have online multiplayer as an option. Unfortunately, the reality is that it's not easy to implement without compromising certain games. The speed of light is a big problem.
 

jaypah

Member
That's aside even from the technical difficulty of synching 4 clients in a very precise platformer, that runs at 60fps. NSMB has tons of enemies, moving platforms, and coins on screen. All those interactive elements have to be synched between all four players. On four different connections. It's hard enough to get a 1 on 1 fighting game working online, where there's only two moving objects that matter.

I know that the solution some folks have, is to advocate compromising the game design in the name of online play. Some do believe games are completely useless without internet. Therefore, the game must be brought down in order to work online.

At the same time, many folks really don't understand how this stuff works. You still see plenty of complaints about fighting games for instance, with people asking why their favorite shooter is awesome online but so many fighting games suck. They don't understand what's happening under the hood (and even visually) in say, an FPS vs a genre where the action must be locked 1:1 between clients.

Oh, it's impossible. Wasn't aware. Nintendo should have just explained it. Then people wouldn't think Nintendo just didn't want to do it because "play together!"
 
This game needs to have some sort of leaderboard system. Even if it's just limited to those on your friends list. There's really no excuse for it not to be included as it would greatly enhance the replay value of those single player score driven games.
 

Bumhead

Banned
This game looks fantastic. Might actually be my most anticipated launch game at this point.

Pleased to see so many games either single player or with single player features. Was a little concerned when we first saw the game that it would be very heavily skewed towards multiplayer, but thankfully it all looks pretty well rounded.

Can see me spending way more time with this game than I thought I would.
 
It being packed in and that it's what a Nintendo console is all about makes it great of next year. New games based on the mini-games start to trickle out and suddenly you have a whole lot of new, interested customers.
 

jaypah

Member
That's aside even from the technical difficulty of synching 4 clients in a very precise platformer, that runs at 60fps. NSMB has tons of enemies, moving platforms, and coins on screen. All those interactive elements have to be synched between all four players. On four different connections. It's hard enough to get a 1 on 1 fighting game working online, where there's only two moving objects that matter.

I know that the solution some folks have, is to advocate compromising the game design in the name of online play. Some do believe games are completely useless without internet. Therefore, the game must be brought down in order to work online.

At the same time, many folks really don't understand how this stuff works. You still see plenty of complaints about fighting games for instance, with people asking why their favorite shooter is awesome online but so many fighting games suck. They don't understand what's happening under the hood (and even visually) in say, an FPS vs a genre where the action must be locked 1:1 between clients.




Well, like this. You may believe there's zero excuse for any game to not have live online multiplayer. But sometimes, there's a reason.

Back when NSMB Wii had its Iwata Asks, I seem to recall Miyamoto said that online multiplayer in the game was too technically demanding. The general reaction to this was "he's lying, they're lazy". I didn't think that was the case then, and don't think it's the case now. I'm sure to some that's "defending a corporation". I tend to think it's understanding how the technology works.

FYI, I fully agree that it's frustrating that some games don't have online multiplayer as an option. Unfortunately, the reality is that it's not easy to implement without compromising certain games. The speed of light is a big problem.

I'd already said that I didn't know it was impossible to have an online platformer before your edit. Thanks for the second explanation though. No sarcasm, I really mean thanks for taking the time to type that out. I'd read about hit prediction and such in FPS games and I guess I never really thought about how that's a limitation when you need to have multiple people synced up for precise platforming. With so many games being online enabled it's not really the type of thing that you stop to think about a lot. But if it really is impossible within their vision then I guess that's that. Sorry, as much as I follow gaming I admittedly don't know much about netcode.
 

D-e-f-

Banned
This game needs to have some sort of leaderboard system. Even if it's just limited to those on your friends list. There's really no excuse for it not to be included as it would greatly enhance the replay value of those single player score driven games.

You'll be pleased to hear then that that's pretty much what's happening with Miiverse in that game. The Game Informer article on NintendoLand mentioned specifically that "Nintendo hopes [chasing after high scores] will breed competition in the Miiverse."
 

D-e-f-

Banned
Seeing all this awesomeness makes me even sadder that many people of the general gaming press seem to still dismiss this game as a silly minigame compilation with no appeal.

I'm now actually really excited to play Nintendoland!
 

Neiteio

Member
Made a quick wallpaper of all the attractions for anyone with 1600x900 displays (first three in first row -- multiplayer only; first three of second row -- single and multi; everything else -- solo):

Z-New-NintendoLand.jpg
 

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I'd already said that I didn't know it was impossible to have an online platformer before your edit. Thanks for the second explanation though. No sarcasm, I really mean thanks for taking the time to type that out. I'd read about hit prediction and such in FPS games and I guess I never really thought about how that's a limitation when you need to have multiple people synced up for precise platforming. With so many games being online enabled it's not really the type of thing that you stop to think about a lot. But if it really is impossible within their vision then I guess that's that. Sorry, as much as I follow gaming I admittedly don't know much about netcode.

It's no problem. I also didn't mean to come off as browbeating at all in clarifying things; it's purely meant as information. Basically, I see the situation like this. Being able to play with friends is good, whether in person or online. Whenever possible (and possible includes feasible - such as within development timetables), online play should be included.

You can absolutely make a platformer that has online play. LittleBigPlanet makes about as much of this as can probably be done currently. The only restriction, I think, is if you want to make a game that adheres to pretty hardcore values for frame rate, collision detection, and responsive controls. Some classic game designs are very difficult to take online without compromising a lot.

So there's basically two ways to handle it. Stop making any game that can't be put online. Or continue to make some games that fall back on local multiplayer in order to maximize the experience.

It comes down to opinions. Some would say (and have said) that every game must be online today. Some don't like that attitude. Others just want as many games as possible to have online and are disappointed when some don't - which is entirely reasonable.

At any rate, all that stuff aside...

I am very glad to hear that there are 'leaderboards', score chasing and score attack, incorporated into Nintendoland. This has been something Nintendo has really dragged their feet on because they were way too conservative about competition models in their games. Between the Miiverse stuff in NSMB U and now this, maybe they're getting over their misplaced fears.
 

Gahiggidy

My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
Is it correct that F-Zero mini-game has yet to be revealed? If so, I hope they designed it kinda like Space Mountain from Disney World, with it all taking indoors in a "pretend" city, with backdrops projected on the walls and ceiling.
 

Neiteio

Member
So the only ones missing is the Yoshi and the Game & Watch ones ?
I'm really eager to see the Game & Watch one. It's called Octopus Dance, so I imagine it involves Miis clad in scuba diving gear retrieving treasure from the tentacles of the Octopus... while dancing??
 

Tathanen

Get Inside Her!
I hate to say it, but Pikmin Adventure makes Pikmin 3 look like a piece of shit. Absolutely IMMACULATE visuals, a ton of really need new ideas, vs P3's "more of the same Pikmin."

I sorta hope the P3 team saw the Pikmin Adventure and used it as inspiration to up their game.
 

Neiteio

Member
I hate to say it, but Pikmin Adventure makes Pikmin 3 look like a piece of shit. Absolutely IMMACULATE visuals, a ton of really need new ideas, vs P3's "more of the same Pikmin."

I sorta hope the P3 team saw the Pikmin Adventure and used it as inspiration to up their game.
Erm, where'd you get that tag?

Also, I agree: I'm a lot more excited by Pikmin Adventure than Pikmin 3. Different types of games, obviously, and it remains to be seen whether the "beat-'em-up with light RPG elements" that is PA will have the staying power of an RTS like P3. But at this point in time, PA just looks a lot more fun to play, and the "Nuts and Bolts" aesthetic really does go a long way toward adding freshness.
 

Mr. F

Banned
Holy wow, yeah Pikmin 3 looks graphically lacklustre compared with Pikmin Adventure. I thought it might be the difference in art styles at first but PA clearly has the advantage graphically.
 

Neiteio

Member
Holy wow, yeah Pikmin 3 looks graphically lacklustre compared with Pikmin Adventure. I thought it might be the difference in art styles at first but PA clearly has the advantage graphically.
Nintendo Land, in general, is a looker. I can't believe I'm saying that about a Mii game but it's true.

Right now I'm most interested in Balloon Trip Breeze, which looks like simple straight-forward fun with great atmosphere (including driving rain, different times of the day, and a superb rendition of the Balloon Fight theme). Challenging yourself to successfully deliver each Mii's package (instead of simply making it to their platform each day) looks like a nice wrinkle in the design.

After Balloon Trip Breeze, I'm most interested in Metroid Blast and Pikmin Adventure. I'm also intrigued by Takamaru's Ninja Castle -- if it's as fast and fluid as it looks, your swipes determining distance and the angle of the pad determining trajectory, it could have quite a bit of depth for what is essentially a shooting gallery. I see you can even intercept incoming projectiles with your throwing stars. The visuals look gorgeous too.
 

Daschysta

Member
It looks like while NL is completely ground up for the Wii-U, perhaps NSMBU and especially Pikmin 3 are still using some upressed wii assets? Because, especially for a Mii game, the graphics are pretty impressive. Can't think that they really would have focused super duper hard on graphics either. Makes me excited for future Ground up Wii-U projects.
 

Mr. F

Banned
I'm also intrigued by Takamaru's Ninja Castle -- if it's as fast and fluid as it looks, your swipes determining distance and the angle of the pad determining trajectory, it could have quite a bit of depth for what is essentially a shooting gallery. I see you can even intercept incoming projectiles with your throwing stars. The visuals look gorgeous too.

I haven't really been keeping up, have there been any recent impressions of Ninja Castle? I remember reading some E3 hands-on previews that suggested the Gamepad easily loses calibration. Curious to see whether it's been fixed or improved.
 

Tathanen

Get Inside Her!
One thing I noticed: the boss of the Pikmin demo dropped Mario-style coins after being defeated. Those didn't appear at any earlier part of the demo.

Could those coins be a game-wide currency? Used to unlock... stuff? Or something?
 

Medalion

Banned
Sounds good

I hope this Nintendo Land thing actually has more than meets the eye to it as well so people end saying they shoulda got the deluxe version instead
 

Neiteio

Member
One thing I noticed: the boss of the Pikmin demo dropped Mario-style coins after being defeated. Those didn't appear at any earlier part of the demo.

Could those coins be a game-wide currency? Used to unlock... stuff? Or something?
I believe Game Informer said something to the effect that you can play pachinko to unlock various decorations in the hub world (I.E. animatronic Ridley, etc).
 
One thing I noticed: the boss of the Pikmin demo dropped Mario-style coins after being defeated. Those didn't appear at any earlier part of the demo.

Could those coins be a game-wide currency? Used to unlock... stuff? Or something?

Yeah, good chance you use them to unlock stuff in NintenoLand, maybe extra attractions(sounded different than the main minigames) I thought I recalled reading somewhere within NintenoLand itself or elsewhere.

Not sure.
 
One thing I noticed: the boss of the Pikmin demo dropped Mario-style coins after being defeated. Those didn't appear at any earlier part of the demo.

Could those coins be a game-wide currency? Used to unlock... stuff? Or something?

Most likely. Or they even could be system wide like the 3DS coin thing.
 

Neiteio

Member
Ah, here we go - from the GI summary thread:

- ride a small train to and from attractions
- spend coins in the hub that you've earned by playing attractions
- winning pachinko games populates the park with Nintendo memorabilia
- this includes Miis in Zelda costumes

Also, I bet Octopus Dance is based off the Shield Pose demo from E3s past.
 

Terrell

Member
No one posted this yet?

7 Minutes of Pikmin Adventure from NWR. 1080p. Bagpipe music. LOOKS AMAZING!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhyqhiHI7yU
Holy shit, BAGPIPES?! Perhaps my memory sucks, but I don't remember that in Pikmin's soundtrack.

Seems like the music is being experimented with as well, not just the visuals. Marimba in the Balloon Trip theme, bagpipes in Pikmin... gotta go back and see the other demos to see what else might be there.
 

Neiteio

Member
Holy shit, BAGPIPES?! Perhaps my memory sucks, but I don't remember that in Pikmin.

Seems like the music is being experimented with as well, not just the visuals. Marimba in the Balloon Trip theme, bagpipes in Pikmin... gotta go back and see the other demos to see what else might be there.
Eh, I remember bagpipes in Pikmin games. But yeah, Nintendo Land has great music. Sounds AND looks good (and plays good too, I hear)!
 
Eh, I remember bagpipes in Pikmin games. But yeah, Nintendo Land has great music. Sounds AND looks good (and plays good too, I hear)!

Metroid Blast's, Balloon Trip's and Pikmin Adventure's music all seems topnotch and memorable and the other attractions' music isn't too shabby itself though I can't recall it freshly like the ones I mentioned.

I was surprised at how good the music is for the games, the only thing unpolished/unattractive about NintendoLand are the characters you play as but that depends on whether you like ot hate Miis, they look decent for what they are.
 

Neiteio

Member
I like the Miis, especially the way they look now. The textured clothes and lighting/shadowing give them a tangible, toy-like look and feel. It's cute.

As for what Nintendo Land is, it's a minigame collection: 12 attractions in all, each themed after a different Nintendo franchise. Three of them are multiplayer only (2-5 players); three of them are single-player AND multiplayer (so 1-5 players); and the remaining six are single-player only.

Many of the games are quite robust: Metroid Blast, for instance, has three modes for one to five players, including a Horde mode against waves of AI, and one of the modes has more than 16 levels. Lots of enemy and terrain types, the ability to morph-ball and grapple, and then there's the aerial gunship you can pilot. In single-player you can play as either Samus or the gunship (confirmed by Bill Trinen); in multiplayer, one person is the gunship and the others are Samuses. Team up, or fight against each other -- lots of ways to play. And that's just Metroid Blast, one of 12 attractions.

It's all connected by a hub world you can flesh out with Nintendo memorabilia. It looks nice! :)
 

Penguin

Member
Ah, here we go - from the GI summary thread:

- ride a small train to and from attractions
- spend coins in the hub that you've earned by playing attractions
- winning pachinko games populates the park with Nintendo memorabilia
- this includes Miis in Zelda costumes

Also, I bet Octopus Dance is based off the Shield Pose demo from E3s past.

Shield pose is in Game & Wario

I feel like Octopus is going to be a rhythm based game of some type.

I wonder if Nintendo would add content and re-release some of these w/ sequels on eShop down the line.
 

jacksrb

Member
Made a quick wallpaper of all the attractions for anyone with 1600x900 displays (first three in first row -- multiplayer only; first three of second row -- single and multi; everything else -- solo):

Very nice! I think it would be a little more clear if you grouped by columns instead of mixing things on the rows.

Nintendo Land is looking awesome and a lot more built out than Wii Sports Resort [which I adore!].
 

Neiteio

Member
Do we know if all the games will be able to be played in single player or will some be multiplayer only?
For 1 player: Yoshi's Fruit Cart, Balloon Trip Breeze, Donkey Kong's Crash Course, Takamaru's Ninja Castle, Captain Falcon's Twister Race, Octopus Dance

For 1 player AND up to 5 players: The Legend of Zelda Battle Quest, Metroid Blast, Pikmin Adventure (in Metroid Blast single-player, you can even choose to play as Samus or the gunship)

For 2-5 players only: Mario Chase, Luigi's Ghost Mansion, Animal Crossing Sweet Day.

SOURCE: Nintendo press release

Very nice! I think it would be a little more clear if you grouped by columns instead of mixing things on the rows.

Nintendo Land is looking awesome and a lot more built out than Wii Sports Resort [which I adore!].
Yeah I know, but it just looked nice to me with the rows. :)
 

backlot

Member
For 1 player: Yoshi's Fruit Cart, Balloon Trip Breeze, Donkey Kong's Crash Course, Takamaru's Ninja Castle, Captain Falcon's Twister Race, Octopus Dance

For 1 player AND up to 5 players: The Legend of Zelda Battle Quest, Metroid Blast, Pikmin Adventure (in Metroid Blast single-player, you can even choose to play as Samus or the gunship)

For 2-5 players only: Mario Chase, Luigi's Ghost Mansion, Animal Crossing Sweet Day.

SOURCE: Nintendo press release

Alright, I'm cool with that. The multiplayer only ones didn't look like the kind of thing I'd want to play by myself anyway. As long as I can do Metroid and Pikmin single player I'm happy. :)
 
Top Bottom