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[Piggus]

Folks who like to tell your these games are "sim lite" like to move the goalposts to fit their superiority narrative - they kind of believe deep down they are real racing drivers. So if you say "it has damage" they'll move the goalpost to "how detailed the damage."

Best to ignore them and get on with enjoying the games.

Haha, I've noticed this a lot. First GT and Forza had inferior driving physics and now that they've made enormous strides to close that gap, the hardcore PC sim people pick something else that PC sims are better at (while ignoring everything that GT/Forza is better at). PC sims have yet to provide even close to the car selection of GT and Forza whereas GT and Forza are less punishing/realistic with regard to damage. So people taking sides are silly since they both have their pros and cons.

EDIT: I'm not sure why people are suddenly disappointed in the car selection for pCARS considering they could have just looked it up already... It's not like any of this was super secret info being kept from the backers. Practically all the info you could want about this game is out there.

 

[OmegaDL50]

Forgive my, maybe half ignorant, question, but as a simulator, do you not drive from cockpit view or hood view, so how would the damage not being 100% there affect you? Also, as a simulator, wouldn't you try to avoid damage and contact at all costs, above winning the race in the first spot?

Again, I am new to the genre, so these questions are genuine.

Well it's more than just avoiding collisions. For example if you shift too late or try to shift without clutch or over rev you could cause the transmission to get damaged.

Over revving could also lead to the engine being blown.

Even silly stuff like taking a turn too hard at high enough speed and braking at a corner causing the brakes to lock up or worse the brakes failing.

It's weird situations like this that are unpredictable but can happen.

 

[CaptainSlow]

Wow. This went from a Day 1 purchase to waiting to get it on sale sometime. No Japanese cars and the only American cars are Fords? Ugh. But hey, thanks for including the Renault Clio!

 

[Gestault]

Even silly stuff like taking a turn too hard at high enough speed and braking at a corner causing the brakes to lock up or worse the brakes failing.

It's weird situations like this that are unpredictable but can happen.

I have to ask, because everything in my experience makes it sound like someone who just doesn't know how cars without anti-lock brakes work: Does this actually happen in real cars? The act of turning quickly causing brakes to lock up?

 

[etta]

Well it's more than just avoiding collisions. For example if you shift too late or try to shift without clutch or over rev you could cause the transmission to get damaged.

Over revving could also lead to the engine being blown.

Even silly stuff like taking a turn too hard at high enough speed and braking at a corner causing the brakes to lock up or worse the brakes failing.

It's weird situations like this that are unpredictable but can happen.

Okay, so internal damage. So is this stuff hard to implement then? It seems it's invisible damage, but obviosuly things would change, handling, control, ...etc.

 

[fresquito]

Haha, I've noticed this a lot. First GT and Forza had inferior driving physics and now that they've made enormous strides to close that gap, the hardcore PC sim people pick something else that PC sims are better at (while ignoring everything that GT/Forza is better at). PC sims have yet to provide even close to the car selection of GT and Forza whereas GT and Forza are less punishing/realistic with regard to damage. So people taking sides are silly since they both have their pros and cons.

You're mixing things here.

I don't believe in the so called superiority of genres, that's such an stupid concept, but GT/Forza lack a lot of elements to be called sims. Their simulation level is really light and ignores so many important aspects of a race. They do fantastic make believe, don't take me wrong.

For some reason, when you say Forza and GT are not sims, some people read they are not good. In fact, some hardcore sims say Project CARS is an arcade just to mean it's an inferior game. It's crazy.

 

[KHlover]

Does Turn10 and Polyphony have a limitless budget? How big is their budget, exactly?

Surely not, but I didn't even imply this in the first place. However we shouldn't forget that these series are 5-10Mil+ sellers, so they are pretty much guaranteed to have a much higher budget than Project Cars. Budget was only part of my point though.

What these series have and Project Cars doesn't is pool of old cars they can reuse for the newer games. Not having to develop every car model from scratch saves a LOT of money and development time while keeping the roster big at the same time.

Project Cars is the first in its series, so they had to create every single car from scratch again. That obviously limits the amount of cars they can feasibly put into the game if all cars should be of the same high quality.

 

[OmegaDL50]

Okay, so internal damage. So is this stuff hard to implement then? It seems it's invisible damage, but obviosuly things would change, handling, control, ...etc.

Stuff like this mainly heavy physics calculations. generally CPU heavy stuff.

Hyper realism sometimes isn't always a consideration of fun. I can see why many games don't factor these things because often times people just want to get into the game drive freely without the worriment of their car condition at all times.

I wouldn't say it's so much it being hard to implement but rather a decision that made by design.

 

[Juanfp]

No ferrari?

Either way, I want to try this game. Being a sim with better physics than Forza and GT sound interesting.

 

[Piggus]

You're mixing things here.

I don't believe in the so called superiority of genres, that's such an stupid concept, but GT/Forza lack a lot of elements to be called sims. Their simulation level is really light and ignores so many important aspects of a race. They do fantastic make believe, don't take me wrong.

For some reason, when you say Forza and GT are not sims, some people read they are not good. In fact, some hardcore sims say Project CARS is an arcade just to mean it's an inferior game. It's crazy.

There's a reason why GT calls itself a driving simulator, not a racing simulator. But to say that either GT or Forza isn't a sim is just crazy and absolutely implies that you think they're inferior, considering they both strive to be sims with realistic driving models. Just because they focus on different aspects of the driving experience doesn't mean they're not sims.

 

[fresquito]

There's a reason why GT calls itself a driving simulator, not a racing simulator. But to say that either GT or Forza isn't a sim is just crazy and absolutely implies that you think they're inferior, considering they both strive to be sims with realistic driving models. Just because they focus on different aspects of the driving experience doesn't mean they're not sims.

They're not sims because they're ignoring a lot of things related to driving. If there's no mechanical damage, there's no way to simulate shifting gears badly. If there's no road temperature, there's no heat that affects tires, and thus affects nbakes. If there's no air pressure simulation, westgate can't be simulated. If there're no mechanical damage, there's no way you can break the suspension of your car by abusing it. If there're no asymetric setups, that affects your driving in ovals, if setups are standard for every car, then you're not simulating the cars too well.

So, there're lots of elements about driving that are not simulated os just lightly simulated. I'm not saying these games are inferior because of that. Mario Kart doesn't simulate jack shit and is a landmark in gaming.

 

[Korezo]

Someone streaming ps4 game on live for playstation. He going through everything.

 

[ShamePain]

Surely not, but I didn't even imply this in the first place. However we shouldn't forget that these series are 5-10Mil+ sellers, so they are pretty much guaranteed to have a much higher budget than Project Cars. Budget was only part of my point though.

What these series have and Project Cars doesn't is pool of old cars they can reuse for the newer games. Not having to develop every car model from scratch saves a LOT of money and development time while keeping the roster big at the same time.

Project Cars is the first in its series, so they had to create every single car from scratch again. That obviously limits the amount of cars they can feasibly put into the game if all cars should be of the same high quality.

Why didn't they use models they've made for Shift1/2, those were good enough, and PCars is not that big of an upgrade visually from Shift 2.

 

[Hoo-doo]

Two fucking Arielm Atoms. Two. Count 'em!

Awe yeeeee

 

[ShamePain]

They're not sims because they're ignoring a lot of things related to driving. If there's no mechanical damage, there's no way to simulate shifting gears badly. If there's no road temperature, there's no heat that affects tires, and thus affects nbakes. If there's no air pressure simulation, westgate can't be simulated. If there're no mechanical damage, there's no way you can break the suspension of your car by abusing it. If there're no asymetric setups, that affects your driving in ovals, if setups are standard for every car, then you're not simulating the cars too well.

So, there're lots of elements about driving that are not simulated os just lightly simulated. I'm not saying these games are inferior because of that. Mario Kart doesn't simulate jack shit and is a landmark in gaming.

Of all those things only air pressure and breaks failing aren't simulated in Forza 5.

 

[funkystudent]

Why didn't they use models they've made for Shift1/2, those were good enough, and PCars is not that big of an upgrade visually from Shift 2.

Because EA own all that work. Not SMS.

 

[Megasoum]

People need to stop comparing pCARS to Forza and GT and instead compare it to the old TOCA games (or even Grid Autosport) and pc sims like Assetto Corsa and rf1/rf2.

Comparing pCARS to GT/Forza makes as much sense as comparing it to Driveclub (hint: It doesn't make sense).

 

[Helznicht]

Haha, I've noticed this a lot. First GT and Forza had inferior driving physics and now that they've made enormous strides to close that gap, the hardcore PC sim people pick something else that PC sims are better at (while ignoring everything that GT/Forza is better at). PC sims have yet to provide even close to the car selection of GT and Forza whereas GT and Forza are less punishing/realistic with regard to damage. So people taking sides are silly since they both have their pros and cons.

EDIT: I'm not sure why people are suddenly disappointed in the car selection for pCARS considering they could have just looked it up already... It's not like any of this was super secret info being kept from the backers. Practically all the info you could want about this game is out there.

I am not a Sims snob. I played my Forzas and loved them. But, I do want a realistic number of cars in my races. I do want blown tires. I do want to run out of gas and I do want pitting. All these thing I wish Forza brought in the next edition, and each time disappointed.

I also am not a racing expert, but I do know what it feels like to drive a performance car fast. I also had a driving wheel with Forza on 360. I never once felt like I was driving a performance car fast. I am now playing Dirt Rally on PC with a wheel and I get so absorbed into it, I come away feeling like I was speeding down a narrow road and braking for my life. I have not played Project Cars, but if it brings what DR has to my PC, I likely wont be playing the next forza unless they re-write the book.

 

[OmegaDL50]

I have to ask, because everything in my experience makes it sound like someone who just doesn't know how cars without anti-lock brakes work: Does this actually happen in real cars? The act of turning quickly causing brakes to lock up?

Sorry I missed your question. I am not a race car driver, my only experience in driving in real life is with my crappy Nissan Versa. However from my experience with some Racing Sims, I understand that ABS and TCS are naturally disabled.

In regards to real life racing, I know that the Japanese Super GT don't have ABS enabled, Neither in the Le Mans GT1, I do know Formula One racing outlawed ABS in the '90s and Formula 1 cars go in excess of 180Mph, so braking those tight corners and the rapid increase and decrease in speeds they have can definitely take a toll on the brakes.

I'm not well versed in more modern systems and do not know which racing series if any allow ABS outside of maybe GT3

 

[sueil]

I also am not a racing expert, but I do know what it feels like to drive a performance car fast. I also had a driving wheel with Forza on 360. I never once felt like I was driving a performance car fast. I am now playing Dirt Rally on PC with a wheel and I get so absorbed into it, I come away feeling like I was speeding down a narrow road and braking for my life. I have not played Project Cars, but if it brings what DR has to my PC, I likely wont be playing the next forza unless they re-write the book.

You will love PCars if you love that feeling. Playing with all assists off is really fun.

 

[KHlover]

Why didn't they use models they've made for Shift1/2, those were good enough, and PCars is not that big of an upgrade visually from Shift 2.

Because those assets aren't theirs to use. They don't own the right to them.

 

[ShamePain]

Because those assets aren't theirs to use. They don't own the right to them.

Seems like a ripoff having to model the same damn tracks and cars all over again.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Seems like a ripoff having to model the same damn tracks and cars all over again.

 

[saladine1]

I would've loved to see more Japanese race cars, especially classic stuff like:

While those in the know realize that this game is about authentic motorsport/raceday atmosphere and thrill of the race itself with track count being the focus, it seems a lot of other people were expecting a massive car count similar to GT/Forza, while others still were expecting customization and an upgrades system ala SHIFT 2.

SMS should probably create a video detailing and describing how this game is different to the others and what their focus is. A sort of dispelling the confusion as it were..

 

[Mugatu]

I don't care about the limited number of cars but the limited diversity is a dealbreaker for me - while i don't necessarily want to start out in economy cars like in GT I do want regular cars, not just racers.

 

[cutmeamango]

Good selection with sufficient overlap for races although I find the distribution too supercar oriented.

Raceroom continues winning.

 

[I Want Your Cat]

Damn, no Viper. I love that car.

Its missing a lot of makes. Idk ima really have to think about this.

 

[Metfanant]

I don't care about the limited number of cars but the limited diversity is a dealbreaker for me - while i don't necessarily want to start out in economy cars like in GT I do want regular cars, not just racers.

This game isn't focused on regular cars..the whole idea of the game is about being a RACECAR driver...

 

[2SeeKU]

I've got the BETA on PC and it has a few cars not on that list, strange it's not in the retail version (Edit, the models are still WIP, makes sense now!):

Here's an article stating the game would contain 11 Ford cars:
http://www.wmdportal.com/projectnews/eleven-fords-to-be-included-in-project-cars/

1966 Mustang 2+2 fastback (foundation trade dress for 1966 Shelby GT350)
1967 Ford MK IV
1972 Escort RS1600
1980 Capri (Group 5 – Team Zakspeed)
1988 Sierra RS500 Cosworth (Group A)
1997 Mustang Cobra (SCCA Trans-Am)
2012 Fusion NASCAR Stock Car
2012 Focus ST
2012 Focus ST (BTCC)
2013 Falcon FG (Australian V8 Supercar Car of the Future)
2013 Ford Shelby GT500


tldr; They've got tons of cars coming guys. Probably DLC though :-(

 

[Mugatu]

This game isn't focused on regular cars..the whole idea of the game is about being a RACECAR driver...

I understand and I know the game isn't exactly aimed at me but people do race in regular cars and I do think more diversity would have been better as there are some "regular" cars.

I think cutmeamango said it better when he said it's too supercar oriented.

 

[GoonerTRON]

Did Turn 10 buy Japanese car rights? This is missing alot of big names.

 

[shandy706]

They're not sims because they're ignoring a lot of things related to driving. If there's no mechanical damage, there's no way to simulate shifting gears badly. If there's no road temperature, there's no heat that affects tires, and thus affects nbakes. If there's no air pressure simulation, westgate can't be simulated. If there're no mechanical damage, there's no way you can break the suspension of your car by abusing it. If there're no asymetric setups, that affects your driving in ovals, if setups are standard for every car, then you're not simulating the cars too well.

Forza has or simulates every single one of those.

Even broken suspension and shot transmissions/engines.

I assume you not knowing is simply ignorance with having not played it or not knowing much about the series. The list of things being simulated in F5 is incredibly detailed.

 

[golem]

No qualifying, stupidly short career races, no pit stops, no weather, no TOD, need I go on?

a 2 second AAA tick sheet check to assess the games worth, then quite frankly, it's their loss.

Whut? Lol

 

[MGR]

Car list is fine. If I could manage 3-4 play sessions a week and try a new car every time it would take me 4-5 months to try them all.

 

[Zeth]

No [my favorite car]? Yeah, no. Bargain bin it is. Also, Driveclub something something.

Y'all are crazy. Assetto Corsa was the best sim ever with like 12 cars - I don't see car count being one of this game's problems.

 

[sant]

What a garbage list

 

[Storm Raider]

Project A Few Cars

Underrated post.

No Chevy or Dodge?

 

[nillapuddin]

Project A Few Cars

goat post status

no corvette, no buy

 

[BinaryBear07]

Ouch, this list leaves a lot to be desired.

 

[x24hrs2livex]

This went from a Ill grab it on sale, to a definite no buy. No Skyline, Ferrari or Lamborghini is a deal breaker. Still wish the developers all the success in the world.

 

[TheAdmiester]

Underrated post.

No Chevy or Dodge?

goat post status

no corvette, no buy

More like overrated shit post. 74 cars is a HUGE amount for a full-on sim game.

 

[RootCause]

Don't know much of racers, but is that a good quantity of cars?
I still need a racer for my ps4. I almost got Driveclub when it was $20, but I talked myself out of buying it.
I feel like I need a wheel to enjoy these, and they're kinda expensive.

 

[endlessflood]

Ouch, this list leaves a lot to be desired.

I think it's a pretty damn good list. It would be nice to get a few extra examples from some other series maybe (e.g. DTM, Super GT, Australian V8 Supercars, and some more recent European touring cars).

The missing cars at the top of my list though would be the Lister Storm, Oreca Viper, and at least one of the Corvette race cars (C5.R, C6.R, C7.R, etc.). All pretty iconic (IMHO).

 

[kyser73]

Ford Sierra RS500 Cosworth Gr.A

OOO, Group A Cossie! WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

Great list. I'm also looking forward to trying out the Ginettas.

The lack of Japanese cars is a bonus IMO - there's a whole world of great sports cars that don't come from Japan.

 

[Megasoum]

Don't know much of racers, but is that a good quantity of cars?
I still need a racer for my ps4. I almost got Driveclub when it was $20, but I talked myself out of buying it.
I feel like I need a wheel to enjoy these, and they're kinda expensive.

For a racing/motorsport simulator (which pCARS is)? It's a great list.

For a pokemon style game (à la Forza/Gran Turismo) it's a very short list.




I wish people would start comparing pCARS to similar games (the old TOCA series, Grid Autosport, Assetto Corsa, etc) instead of comparing it to GT/Forza which doesn't really have much in common with it except for the fact that you are racing cars. Apple and oranges.

 

[cutmeamango]

For a racing/motorsport simulator (which pCARS is)? It's a great list.

For a pokemon style game (à la Forza/Gran Turismo) it's a very short list.

I wish people would start comparing pCARS to similar games (the old TOCA series, Grid Autosport, Assetto Corsa, etc) instead of comparing it to GT/Forza which doesn't really have much in common with it except for the fact that you are racing cars. Apple and oranges.

Huh, all of those games barely simulate motorsports. They pit all cars without any flag system or proper championship.
They mostly have only 3/4 cars of the same class too.
Don't even know what Assetto Corsa has in common with TOCA and GRID except "racing cars".

 

[TheAdmiester]

Huh, all of those games barely simulate motorsports. They pit all cars without any flag system or proper championship.
They mostly have only 3/4 cars of the same class too.
Don't even know what Assetto Corsa has in common with TOCA and GRID except "racing cars".

Games that focus on motorsport/league racing as opposed to car ownership games that allow for customisation and single races for money.

 

[Megasoum]

Games that focus on motorsport/league racing as opposed to car ownership games that allow for customisation and single races for money.

Yup

 

[cutmeamango]

Games that focus on motorsport/league racing as opposed to car ownership games that allow for customisation and single races for money.

Oh career "evolution" structure and XP instead of money. Although pCars everything is unlocked from the start right?

 

[TheAdmiester]

Oh career "evolution" structure and XP instead of money. Although pCars everything is unlocked from the start right?

I think so, it's definitely the case in free play at least. In career mode I assume stuff is locked by progression (ie. "You haven't finished your GT4 races so you can't do GT3", but I've never played career so don't quote me on that.