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[Muppet of a Man]

Putin's Russia is so close to the Soviet Union (less the satellite states) in practice, that it is not even joke status anymore...it is just sad and pathetic and dangerous all rolled up into one.

 

[ЯAW]

This.


I don't understand how starving your own people is a good move.

There is still domestic products, nobody is going to starve. Prices will go up if Putin doesn't write some emergency law that will keep the prices at sane level.

Putin's Russia is so close to the Soviet Union (less the satellite states) in practice, that it is not even joke status anymore...it is just sad and pathetic and dangerous all rolled up into one.

Seriously, and things were looking good just few years back with Medvedev.

 

[Baraka in the White House]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

I see.

 

[Sharpeye]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

It would be everybody else's common sense against your lack of one. The seps shot down the plane, more than enough evidence points to them. Russia is alot more careless than you think.

 

[Zeus Molecules]

You sanction a country when it has no other partners. What did the US expect when Russia has all its former USSR republics and China to trade with?

The US expected correctly that they would be able to move in and replace Russia as a major energy provider to Western Europe. Also don't emphasize the Russia/China trade as being a net positive for Russia. As soon as China saw Russia was in a bad place trade wise they finally agreed to sign a energy trade deal that had been stalling for decades that was altered to be heavily in favor of China. The net loser has been Russia throughout this whole war.

Sanctioning Food to me is a desperate move. Russia along with Japan was the only G8 net importer of Food which meant Food cost more there usually and was always more price sensitive to fluctuations in the Food market. Add to that the fact Russia has a history of civil unrest based around a lack of Food and I have to again question Putin's logic in makibg this decision.

 

[neogaffer1]

Ever since Putin's gang seized like 90% of the media, the Russian population is under constant mind-rape.
Like such..

(they have taken it down when it led to an outrage, back up)
(edit: check out the source too, some random-ass blog, rofl)

Bear in mind that this is the English version of RT. The Russian propaganda directed at Russians on the other hand...

$10 says that footage of a State Dept. person talking about people visiting their grandmothers is about immigrants crossing the US border and has nothing to do with Ukraine.

 

[Veritigo_X]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

Curious to hear your theory on the matter then.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

Curious to hear your theory on the matter then.

Don't encourage his wild nonsensical theories. That's probably what he wants. To get into an argument.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Putin's Russia is so close to the Soviet Union (less the satellite states) in practice, that it is not even joke status anymore...it is just sad and pathetic and dangerous all rolled up into one.

Its like an eternal curse of a nation

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

Your arguing a straw man. Pro-Russian rebels not Russia it self. though russia provided the arms.

 

[Liha]

This is bad for Austria...

 

[neogaffer1]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

There's been recordings of Pro-Russian separatists talking about how they shot down a plane they thought was a military plane, then found out that it was civilian. There are other ones of these same separatists telling each other to take stuff from the crash site (like the black box) and hide it from the international investigators.

 

[Chumly]

I'm glad Putin took the next step to sanction his own country further instead of the EU or US having to do it. While it could hurt the US and EU it's just going to make Russians more miserable. Just look at the tourism fiasco.

 

[Fox318]

Like all dictators he has to fight a strong opposition party.

 

[WorriedCitizen]

Just a logical step on his mission to bring back the Soviet Union and cold war times.

 

[ICKE]

This is really bad news for many businesses, the worst fear Finland had was that Russia would target commercial plane routes with sanctions. Would have basically doomed Finnair.

Especially Poland is hurting from these sanctions, I feel really sorry for farmers. All them apples being wasted ;_;.

 

[backflip10019]

Putin is turning more and more into Kim Jong Un with every passing day. This is a terrible idea.

 

[epmode]

Don't encourage his wild nonsensical theories. That's probably what he wants. To get into an argument.

Clearly. I was happy to see so many ignoring such obvious bait but he'll probably get this thread off-topic eventually.

 

[The Albatross]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

Using your "common sense," I think we could only deduce that the surface to air missile became self-aware and launched itself at the plane, because, really, who could possibly gain by shooting down a commercial airliner other than the Robot Apocalypse?

 

[jay]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

My theory is this plot was enacted by the same US agents who took down the trade center.

 

[gutter_trash]

so Russians will eat more boring food.

they lose

 

[Veritigo_X]

Don't encourage his wild nonsensical theories. That's probably what he wants. To get into an argument.

You're right, I probably shouldn't. I just hate how people who dismiss all evidence pointing to pro-Russian separatists never come out and say what they think. It's always 'The West is wrong, there isn't enough evidence'.

 

[Sibylus]

And yeah, colour me disgusted at all the half-admiration the American right has for Putin. What the hell.

 

[tfur]

My theory is this plot was enacted by the same US agents who took down the trade center.

When all else fails, it's cia bro.

C... I... A...

also, squibs...

 

[Phantast2k]

$10 says that footage of a State Dept. person talking about people visiting their grandmothers is about immigrants crossing the US border and has nothing to do with Ukraine.

No, thanks. I'd rather play the lottery.

Apparently the Russian of vice minister of econ. development was fired for criticizing that the budged holes were plugged with money from pension funds:

Ina Ruck ‏@InaRuck 31 Min.

Wow! RU feuert stv.Wirtschaftsminister. Hatte kritisiert, dass Moskau Haushaltsloch m privaten Rentenbeiträgen stopft http://www.vedomosti.ru/politics/ne...olil-zamministra-ekonomiki-raskritikovavshego …

/edit
English source: A Russian Bureaucrat's Lonely Rebellion - Bloomberg View

 

[Sibylus]

This is really bad news for many businesses, the worst fear Finland had was that Russia would target commercial plane routes with sanctions. Would have basically doomed Finnair.

Especially Poland is hurting from these sanctions, I feel really sorry for farmers. All them apples being wasted ;_;.

This is when you make applesauce and an applesauce marketing blitz.

 

[gkryhewy]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

This is 9/11-truther-grade idiocy. The separatists thought they were shooting down a Ukrainian cargo plane, as they had in prior days. No one had anything to gain by shooting down a passenger plane.

 

[BronsonLee]

When all else fails, it's cia bro.

C... I... A...

also, squibs...

THIS IS A CIA OP - Kelsey Grammer

 

[Fox318]

Just a logical step on his mission to bring back the Soviet Union and cold war times.

Except this time they have China as a huge trade partner.

Sanctions won't hurt Russia so long as they can go to China for lost sales.

After Stalin was out as the head of state Mao didn't exactly get along with the Russians on everything and there were a few border confrontations.

Today its different as China sees this as a trade opportunity with the loss of sales in Europe.

Europe could have delt with Putin years ago but they got hooked on Russian gas.

 

[Darklord]

And yet the majority of Russia loves this man. It's like the soviet union all over again.

 

[Fox318]

And yet the majority of Russia loves this man. It's like the soviet union all over again.

Cult of personality

 

[Sectorseven]

Except this time they have China as a huge trade partner.

Sanctions won't hurt Russia so long as they can go to China for lost sales.

After Stalin was out as the head of state Mao didn't exactly get along with the Russians on everything and there were a few border confrontations.

Today its different as China sees themself a trade opportunity with the loss of sales in Europe.

Europe could have delt with Putin years ago but they got hooked on Russian gas.

I don't know, doesn't China have issues feeding its own people, let alone exporting? Not to mention their quality control (or lack thereof).

 

[Forgotten_Taco]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

Wait...what? You sound like a conspiracy nut, not a paragon of common sense. There's no evidence anywhere that this was anything but Pro-Russian separatists.

 

[jufonuk]

And yet the majority of Russia loves this man. It's like the soviet union all over again.

this scares me , I mean how far could he go before anyone says, no enough is enough.

it seems anything he wants to implement, his people automatically love.

 

[Zeus Molecules]

I don't know, doesn't China have issues feeding its own people, let alone exporting? Not to mention their quality control (or lack thereof).

China had food, its just usually not up to western health standards. This was a "cut your nose to spite your face" move.

 

[wildfire]

Like all dictators he has to fight a strong opposition party.

Send them to the gulag!

 

[rpmurphy]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

You do realize by that basis, the motivating factor can exist in reverse, right? That the pro-Russian separarists shooting it down and making it look like the other side did it? What you are suggesting has little to no weight on this matter in light of other evidence.

 

[jmdajr]

Um

seems


not wise??????

 

[Mortimer Brewster]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

That's some Oliver Stone level conspiracy theory kookiness you are pushing there.

 

[jmdajr]

Except this time they have China as a huge trade partner.

Sanctions won't hurt Russia so long as they can go to China for lost sales.

After Stalin was out as the head of state Mao didn't exactly get along with the Russians on everything and there were a few border confrontations.

Today its different as China sees themself a trade opportunity with the loss of sales in Europe.

Europe could have delt with Putin years ago but they got hooked on Russian gas.

I didn't know that was a thing.

 

[Piano]

Perfect.

 

[Rebel Leader]

When all else fails, it's cia bro.

C... I... A...

also, squibs...

NSA

 

[Midnight Phoenix]

Yours or mine. Because my common sense tells me the Russians would have nothing to gain from such an attack, whereas the US would have everything to gain by making such an attack look like the responsibility of Russia.

You are correct. Russia not shot it down. But it was done by pro-russian separatists, whom Russia supplies weapon. They give them weapon and specialists, after what they shut down wrong plane. There is hacked mail of one of Russian government dude (Shlegel). All results, about Crimea referendum and LNR and DNR, was set two weeks prior to it. If someone interested, there it is. Sry but it is on Russian http://ntv.livejournal.com/361111.html . Someone can say this is fake. But there is two copy of passports, one of copy is diplomatic passport. I don't know how hard is to photoshop it, But I can't find any evidence that it is. All names is hidden, because in other way it will be shutdown by LJ as interference in the private life.

 

[Archer]

/thread

 

[Drensch]

How long has geeky dad worked in the ministry of information?

 

[PhoenixDark]

But guys, Putin is a master tactician who has completely outmaneuvered the west! This move will destroy the US and European economies.

 

[ValeYard]

These recent developments leave me completely baffled. On the one hand, there are these anachronistic tactics, on the other, completely ineffective policies.

To try and understand this stuff better I'm reading "Fragile Empire" by Ben Judah. The first few chapters are all about Putin's beginnings in East Germany and then in St. Petersburg.

 

[speculawyer]

And yet the majority of Russia loves this man. It's like the soviet union all over again.

Putin has managed to play the victim card.

Oh, the west is always persecuting us poor Russians. And those evil westerners are supporting Nazis to take over in Ukraine.

Does it make sense? No. Is he able to sell it? Apparently. Are Russians stupid? Well, look at how many Americans think Obama is a Kenyan Muslim. And if you don't have an independent press and you can't read the international press . . . well, you can get suckered.

 

[speculawyer]

Except this time they have China as a huge trade partner.

Sanctions won't hurt Russia so long as they can go to China for lost sales.

After Stalin was out as the head of state Mao didn't exactly get along with the Russians on everything and there were a few border confrontations.

Today its different as China sees themself a trade opportunity with the loss of sales in Europe.

Europe could have delt with Putin years ago but they got hooked on Russian gas.

China does what is in China's interest. They are not going to do anything to help Russia because Russia is their commie friend. They'll buy natural gas and other raw materials from Russia but only because that is in China's best interest. They like to work with parties that are sanctioned against because it allows them to get cheap prices.

And China still has some territorial disputes with Russia.

 

[FStop7]

Funny how this report reads, "...pro-Russian separatists shot down Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 in Ukraine. ..."

Wasn't aware there was yet a determination (outside of the US government's spin) on the matter.

really