This how I always viewed it based on all the similiarites between the two. It's a shame we never got a definite answer on that as well as many other things about Zanarkand. X-2 is one of my favorite games but they really dropped the ball on Shuyin and Zanarkand. I feel we could've (and should've) gotten more about Spira's history (Ex. Zanarkand/Bevelle War, Summoners, etc.) via spheres and whatnot but it is what is I guess.
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So who/what exactly is Tidus? [Spoilers]
- Thread starter Lights and Waves
- Start date
This how I always viewed it based on all the similiarites between the two. It's a shame we never got a definite answer on that as well as many other things about Zanarkand. X-2 is one of my favorite games but they really dropped the ball on Shuyin and Zanarkand. I feel we could've (and should've) gotten more about Spira's history (Ex. Zanarkand/Bevelle War, Summoners, etc.) via spheres and whatnot but it is what is I guess.
Still ten times better than FFXII
Auron was also able to "Ride Sin and go to Zanarkand". It's a psychical location anyone can enter, yes.
The fayths on Mt. Gagazet keep summoning it forever until they die. It's actually quite simple when you think about it, just explained like dogshit in the actual game.
When the HD remaster was released they released an audio drama and novel (2.5) set after X-2.
Tidus kicks a biltzball that was actually a bomb in the novel and gets his head blown off (or something). In the audio drama, we find out Auron has a kid no one knew about, Lulu became the mayor of Besaid (the only good, logical thing that happened), Yuna breaks up with Tidus, and Sin somehow comes back.
Ugh. Ugggggggh.
AuthenticM
Member
This is really the only thing in the game that might serve as an argument for Dream Zanarkand existing in the present. But I'm not sure it's enough. I wish it had been clearer.
Are those Ultimania guides even reliable? Like, who said that Dream Zanarkand was in present-day Spira? Unless it's the writer of the game, I'm not sure we can swallow that without question. It's hard for me to take it seriously when the Ultimania guide for VIII said that Ultimecia was not an alternate universe Rinoa, when many elements of the actual game point towards them being the same person.
I don't think Tidus was meant to be a perfect recreation of Shuyin, but that Shuyin was more of a basic template for Tidus. The Fayth needed to engineer Tidus perfectly to have the exact history and personality to truly defeat Sin.
What little we know about Shuyin suggests he was far more aggressive than Tidus. After all, his desire for revenge toward the entire planet at what happened to Lenne is what causes the events of FFX-2.
Clearly, Tidus has been given Shuyin's appearance, voice, and fighting style, as well as some aspects of his history (Shuyin appears to have been a blitz ball player, though it's never openly stated). But his personality remains far more innocent, optimistic, and naive.
What little we know about Shuyin suggests he was far more aggressive than Tidus. After all, his desire for revenge toward the entire planet at what happened to Lenne is what causes the events of FFX-2.
Clearly, Tidus has been given Shuyin's appearance, voice, and fighting style, as well as some aspects of his history (Shuyin appears to have been a blitz ball player, though it's never openly stated). But his personality remains far more innocent, optimistic, and naive.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
Please tell me this is actual canon. It would make me love FFX all that much more if it is.
Yeah but the fayth also state that the Shuyin we meet in game, isn't the Shuyin that lived a 1000 years ago in Zanarkand.
Fayth: Shuyin? Just a shadow. It may look like him, but the real Shuyin died long ago. Even after a thousand years, his hate and misery linger on. His feelings grew so strong, they began to act on their own... Eventually, they became a shadowa shade that wants only to vanish, but cannot.
He's an unsent that's basically been driven mad by bitterness, anger, regret, etc. I'm sure Shuyin and Tidus aren't 100% like but pre-death Shuyin probably does at least share some personality traits with Tidus.
This is actually the most accepted theory and my own headcanon. The theory says that all the inhabitants of Dream Zanarkand are based on real people that lived there, or more like "based on the memories" of the people that lived there. So the Dream Zanarkand people do not look exactly like their originals.
sixteen-bit
Member
I came into this world as a
UpDownLeftRight
Banned
I've never really been able to make up my mind. My initial interpretation was that he's an approximation of Shuyin, built out of poorly remembered details. By this leaves the question of what is Jecht? What's his correlation to Shuyin to be Tidus' father?
In the end the best solution I can try to come up with is Tidus is an approximated summon of Shuyin and that Jecht is either an anomaly brought on by poorly remembering Shuyin or that he was summoned by Yu Yevon with a pre determined goal of making him into Sin, hence pulling into the timeline as and when he did.
As for Zanarkand, it's often mentioned that the Fayth continued to dream, but it never directly states they're all focused on summoning Tidus, so I assumed dream Zanarkand was being summoned collectively. How any of it continues into FFX2 is beyond me, I've not replayed it recently enough to remember why Shuyin is being summoned or how, along with any other summons. The Fayth didn't stop dreaming for some reason it seems but that leaves Tidus'disappearance at the end of FFX confusing.
In the end the best solution I can try to come up with is Tidus is an approximated summon of Shuyin and that Jecht is either an anomaly brought on by poorly remembering Shuyin or that he was summoned by Yu Yevon with a pre determined goal of making him into Sin, hence pulling into the timeline as and when he did.
As for Zanarkand, it's often mentioned that the Fayth continued to dream, but it never directly states they're all focused on summoning Tidus, so I assumed dream Zanarkand was being summoned collectively. How any of it continues into FFX2 is beyond me, I've not replayed it recently enough to remember why Shuyin is being summoned or how, along with any other summons. The Fayth didn't stop dreaming for some reason it seems but that leaves Tidus'disappearance at the end of FFX confusing.
AuthenticM
Member
I came into this world as a
LOL
Don't forget the "Why you~~ Just because your boobs are so big doesn't mean you know everything!!" line.
FF X-3 will be worth it for this alone.
The question is, what the hell are the gifs on the left in the OP? I assume they are from the remaster and they made a redesign because Tidus and Yuna looked too distinct (for FF standards) so they pasted Cloud's face and hair over Tidus and turned Yuna into a horrid abomination?
Seriously, who's responsible for these unnecessary disastrous changes? What a fucking disgrace, jesus christ.
Seriously, who's responsible for these unnecessary disastrous changes? What a fucking disgrace, jesus christ.
UpDownLeftRight
Banned
AuthenticM
Member
Lights and Waves
Member
Lights and Waves
Member
I think Jecht is just a dream Zanarkand inhabitant that figured out who to break the cycle and made his way to Spira to set things in motion.
targetpractice
Member
Tidus is clearly supposed to be the "dream" version of Shuyin, and I don't think he necessarily has to be an idealized form of Shuyin either. Remember that in FFX lore, unsent dead souls come to envy, resent, and hate the living. Given the manner in which Shuyin died, and the fact that he's spent 1000 years as an unsent by the time the events of X-2 happen, it's not surprising that his personality would seem totally different from Tidus's.
See, this is something that I've never fully understood. At the end of FFX, Yuna sends all of the aeons, and the Fayth with them. This is why, during FFX-2, Bahamut's Fayth only speaks to Yuna in the Farplane, whereas they spoke in several other locations during FFX, before he was sent. So, given that they are already in the Farplane, how is it that they are able to summon Tidus back anyway?
See, this is something that I've never fully understood. At the end of FFX, Yuna sends all of the aeons, and the Fayth with them. This is why, during FFX-2, Bahamut's Fayth only speaks to Yuna in the Farplane, whereas they spoke in several other locations during FFX, before he was sent. So, given that they are already in the Farplane, how is it that they are able to summon Tidus back anyway?
Lights and Waves
Member
InsaneTiger
Member
He is great.
UpDownLeftRight
Banned
???
Second pic makes Tidus look like Cloud after using one of the Seinfeld low-flow shower heads.
Lights and Waves
Member
The second photo is Shuyin, not Tidus. At least your confusion validates Yuna's mistaking of the two.
Death Penalty
Member
I'm more inclined to think Shuyin's resemblance to Tidus was the incredibly sloppy writing and hideous plot contrivance that plagues the entire sequel than any indication Tidus is a representation of Shuyin. Beyond that, yeah. Dude's just an extremely specialized Aeon.
mattiewheels
And then the LORD David Bowie saith to his Son, Jonny Depp: 'Go, and spread my image amongst the cosmos. For every living thing is in anguish and only the LIGHT shall give them reprieve.'
What's happening with these two clips?
Dark_castle
Junior Member
You don't want to know.
Can't wait for him to handle the FFVIIR plot changes!
Lights and Waves
Member
Yuna acquires a sphere that has the memories of a summoner from Zanarkand trapped inside of it. She dreams that she and Tidus are captured and executed by Bevelle's guards.
She later learns of Lenne, a summoner, and Shuyin, her lover. Lenne was drafted into the Machina War between Bevelle and Zanarkand. Shuyin knew Lenne would die, so he snuck into Bevelle to steal Vegnagun, the strongest machina created. (Lulu references this machina while the group rides the shoopuf in FFX).
Lenne chased after him and convinced him to abandon the machina, as she's accepted her fate. The Bevelle guards catch them though, and kill them both.
mushrambio
Member
Thank you
Blood Diamonds
Banned
mushrambio
Member
I came into this world as a
This made my day
Death Penalty
Member
No need to lose your head over it.
Poltergust
Member
Why do people think that Dream Zanarkand is within Sin? Sin attacked Dream Zanarkand. So Sin attacked within itself?
Unless it can make mini-clones of itself and deploy them inside its body that doesn't make any sense.
It's far more likely that Dream Zanarkand simply existed within the world of Spira but was guarded by Sin to prevent any outsiders from discovering it.
Unless it can make mini-clones of itself and deploy them inside its body that doesn't make any sense.
It's far more likely that Dream Zanarkand simply existed within the world of Spira but was guarded by Sin to prevent any outsiders from discovering it.
Lights and Waves
Member
Except that it doesn't. Could you please stay on topic?
Best to just treat X2 as a spinoff rather than a sequel, enjoy the gameplay and ignore the awful story/characters