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Sony announces Q2 results

Parmenides

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May 9, 2006
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Sony Corporation announced its consolidated results for the second quarter ended September 30,2009. Operating revenue was $18,458 million. An operating loss of $362 million was recorded. Sony Corp. posted a net loss of $292 million.


Q2 Worldwide Unit Sales

Code:
Hardware          PSP        PS2       PS3      Wii      360


FY 2007           2.5        3.2       1.3      3.9      1.8

FY 2008           3.2        2.5       2.4      4.9      2.2

FY 2009           3.0        1.9       3.2      3.5      2.1




Software          PSP        PS2        PS3


FY 2007           12.6       38.0       10.4

FY 2008           11.8       23.2       21.2

FY 2009           12.9       11.1       23.9






(Unit: million)

PS3 LTD Sales
Code:
PS3 Worldwide Unit Sales



Price          Hardware   Software 

€/$ 499-599     5.5       28.4

€/$ 399         18.3      161.3

€/$ 299         3.2       23.9

LTD             27.0      213.6

(Unit: million)


Business development

Code:
Q3FY2006  PS3 introduced ( 20GB: RRP 49,980 Yen/ 60 GB: Open Price )


Q3FY2006  PS3 introduced (20GB: SRP 499 U.S. Dollars/ 60GB: SRP 599 U.S. Dollars)


Q4FY2006  PS3 introduced (Europe) (60GB: SRP 599 Euro)


Q3FY2007  New Price PS3 (40 GB:RRP 39,980 Yen/ 399 U.S. Dollars/ 399 Euro )


Q2FY2009  PS3 Slim introduced (120 GB:RRP 29,980 Yen/299 U.S. Dollars/299 Euro )



http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/IR/financial/fr/09q2_sony.pdf
 

user_nat

THE WORDS! They'll drift away without the _!
Dec 19, 2008
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The Slim was reported to sell 1 mil in 3 weeks or so. So 3.2m for the Quarter seems reasonable.

edit: Holy crap at the game division losses. Makes you wonder if the drop was worth it for them.
 

soco

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Oct 3, 2006
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ah ok. you're listing just the numbers for that quarter. however, what's the point of comparing the Q2 fiscal year results for all the companies, because don't all of the companies have very different fiscal years?
 

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
Jun 8, 2004
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Don't see what's off about those numbers.

This is for July, August, September.

Price cut hit in the middle of the quarter, Slim hit in the last month. These numbers are shipments to retailers too, so would include a little bit of shipments to be sold in Oct.

soco said:
ah ok. you're listing just the numbers for that quarter. however, what's the point of comparing the Q2 fiscal year results for all the companies, because don't all of the companies have very different fiscal years?

They are, I'm sure, comparing the Jul/Aug/Sept period. I mean microsoft hasn't had its Q2 yet so they can't be comparing fiscal quarters. They're comparing performance in Sony's Q2.
 

NeoUltima

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Jul 31, 2007
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xbhaskarx said:
What's the difference between operating loss and net loss?
Operating as in a result of their normal business. Net includes stuff that they are not in the business for, such as selling old land or buildings.
 

expy

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Dec 9, 2008
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xbhaskarx said:
The game division (Network and Product Services) lost $654 million for the quarter.

Wow those are pretty heavy losses for the game division... How many more quarters like this one can Sony take?
Pretty sure they're looking at the broader scope of things. Pushing Blu-Ray was a big plus from the PS3, it benefits many other divisions, besides, looks like they're bouncing back pretty well.
 

EXGN

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Dec 26, 2007
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gofreak said:
Don't see what's off about those numbers.

This is for July, August, September.

Price cut hit in the middle of the quarter, Slim hit in the last month. These numbers are shipments to retailers too, so would include a little bit of shipments to be sold in Oct.

It's the wonky wording, they say they sold 3.2 million PS3s at $299, which kinda makes it look like they are saying they sold 3.2 million slims.
 

expy

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Dec 9, 2008
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EXGN said:
It's the wonky wording, they say they sold 3.2 million PS3s at $299, which kinda makes it look like they are saying they sold 3.2 million slims.
Not really, since all other SKUs were also brought down to $299 as well.
 

Firewire

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Apr 14, 2007
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EXGN said:
It's the wonky wording, they say they sold 3.2 million PS3s at $299, which kinda makes it look like they are saying they sold 3.2 million slims.
Other PS3's sold at $299.
 

user_nat

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Dec 19, 2008
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expy said:
Pretty sure they're looking at the broader scope of things. Pushing Blu-Ray was a big plus from the PS3, it benefits many other divisions, besides, looks like they're bouncing back pretty well.
Losing 300m is hardly bouncing back well.

Although without the game division they would have made money overall as a company this quarter.
 

laserbeam

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Mar 23, 2007
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Losses make sense. We know the Slim is still taking a sizeable loss on each unit so increased sales mean increased money lost by Sony.
 

Zombie James

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Dec 28, 2005
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At 27 million the PS3's cleanly passed both the GC and Xbox (~22 million each). It's about 5 million away from passing the N64. And that about does it for my rare contribution to sales-age.
 

FrankT

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Nothing seems too out of order here.

Nirolak said:
The game division (Network and Product Services) lost $654 million for the quarter.

Can definitely say I called that. Approaching 5 billion in losses soonish for the division this generation. Hopefully they are close to even on manufacturing/shipping costs for the slim at this point.

laserbeam said:
Losses make sense. We know the Slim is still taking a sizeable loss on each unit so increased sales mean increased money lost by Sony.

Do we know it's sizable? The only thing I have heard was still taking a loss or at least I thought. Any analyst chime in on what they thought the loss was at this point or did Sony actually say like they did in May with the fat?

user_nat said:
The Slim was reported to sell 1 mil in 3 weeks or so. So 3.2m for the Quarter seems reasonable.

Aye, although I'm sure there is some holiday stock in here as well. For October my Best Buy has had a stack of slims like I have never seen in my life. End of the quarter shipments I'm sure.
 

Zombie James

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Dec 28, 2005
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Jtyettis said:
Nothing seems too out of order here.



Can definitely say I called that. Approaching 5 billion in losses soonish for the division this generation. Hopefully they are close to even on manufacturing/shipping costs for the slim at this point.

They should be in better shape once the fat models are cleared out and they don't have the manufacture them anymore, yes?
 

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
Jun 8, 2004
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FWIW they attribute the loss to falling Vaio sales and specifically in the game business to falling PS2 hardware and software sales, and appreciation of the yen.
 

FrankT

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_leech_ said:
They should be in better shape once the fat models are cleared out and they don't have the manufacture them anymore, yes?

I'm sure they stopped manufacturing them for a good while now. Question is how much is left out there. I wouldn't think too much at this point. I see a few here and there from place to place.
 

Opiate

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Dec 4, 2007
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Oof. Better than expected on all fronts, actually: their losses were less than expected, and I'd assume those are rosy shipment numbers.

Still, this puts the PS3 generation's total losses at ~5 billion dollars. It is now by a wide margin the biggest money loser in video game history.
 

SlipperySlope

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Mar 11, 2009
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Opiate said:
Oof. Better than expected on all fronts, actually: their losses were less than expected, and I'd assume those are rosy shipment numbers.

Still, this puts the PS3 generation's total losses at ~5 billion dollars. It is now by a wide margin the biggest money loser in video game history.

What were the expected losses?
 

C4Lukins

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gofreak said:
FWIW they attribute the loss to falling Vaio sales and specifically in the game business to falling PS2 hardware and software sales, and appreciation of the yen.

That is a funny way for them to put it, because I doubt they are losing any money when it concerns PS2 hardware and software sales. In reality the PS2 is just no longer making up for the losses they are having with their other platforms.
 

Opiate

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C4Lukins said:
That is a funny way for them to put it, because I doubt they are losing any money when it concerns PS2 hardware and software sales. In reality the PS2 is just no longer making up for the losses they are having with their other platforms.

Correct. It's not "funny," it's called massaging the numbers.
 

FrankT

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SlipperySlope said:
What were the expected losses?

Good question. I said before the cut they would be rather large and I was thinking $500 million. This is a good tick above that to be sure. I'm not sure I saw any general gaming division estimates myself.

C4Lukins said:
That is a funny way for them to put it, because I doubt they are losing any money when it concerns PS2 hardware and software sales. In reality the PS2 is just no longer making up for the losses they are having with their other platforms.

Aye
 

Opiate

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Jtyettis said:
Good question. I said before the cut they would be rather large and I was thinking $500 million. This is a good tick above that to be sure. I'm not sure I saw any general gaming division estimates myself.

Those don't exist, they effectively never do outside very specific circumstances. However, it is significantly better than the expected aggregate for Sony corp (which was a net loss of 644 million) and I'd assume we all agree that those shipment numbers are quite good. Has the PS3 or 360 ever gotten that high outside holidays? I don't think either has.
 

Azelover

Titanic was called the Ship of Dreams, and it was. It really was.
Dec 3, 2004
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After what I've witnessed in the Nintendo thread? I expect fairness and consistency with appropriate sentiment over these losses. The other companies at least posted a profit in these times and I've never seen so much doom and gloom. We shouldn't be unbalanced about it. Posting from a PS3
 

AniHawk

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Jun 7, 2004
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Maybe these losses will finally wake Sony up and get them to start making non-games again.
 

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
Jun 8, 2004
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C4Lukins said:
That is a funny way for them to put it, because I doubt they are losing any money when it concerns PS2 hardware and software sales. In reality the PS2 is just no longer making up for the losses they are having with their other platforms.

Well more accurately they put down the deterioration in the loss to these things. So that is fair for them to say - if PS2 sales are falling and no longer helping to offset losses elsewhere, they can finger that as a reason for why profitability has disimproved.

On hardware losses, the last estimate Sony gave I think was that they were losing 10% on hardware. Given the time that was said I guess that was a post-Slim estimate (even though we didn't know it at the time).
 

Opiate

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Azelover said:
After what I've witnessed in the Nintendo thread? I expect fairness and consistency with appropriate sentiment over these losses. The other companies at least posted a profit in these times and I've never seen so much doom and gloom. We shouldn't be unbalanced about it. Posting from a PS3

You are absolutely correct that, on an absolute scale, Nintendo is still embarrasing Sony. it really is one of the most incredible drummings a formerly dominant competitor has ever gotten: there's been a nearly 20 billion dollar swing in Nintendo's favor in the last 3 years. In 3 years!

But it's not just about the absolute results, it's about the relative ones. Sony performed better than expected, and down YoY. That's a mixed bag. Nintendo was down drastically YoY and was below expectations. That is bad on all counts, relatively speaking.
 

FrankT

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gofreak said:
Well more accurately they put down the deterioration in the loss to these things. So that is fair for them to say - if PS2 sales are falling and no longer helping to offset losses elsewhere, they can finger that as a reason for why profitability has disimproved.

On hardware losses, the last estimate Sony gave I think was that they were losing 10% on hardware. Given the time that was said I guess that was a post-Slim estimate (even though we didn't know it at the time).

They said specifically in May about 10% on each $399 SKU. Again, I have seen no real measure of this for the slim to date or I simply missed it.
 

AniHawk

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Nirolak said:
Well, they did announce these titles at TGS for the motion controller:

Eccentric Slider (temporary name)
Sing and Draw (temporary name)
Champions of Time (temporary name)
Motion Party (temporary name)
The Shoot (temporary name)
Tower (temporary name)

Does Champions of Time involve time travel in some way?
 

gofreak

GAF's Bob Woodward
Jun 8, 2004
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Jtyettis said:
They said specifically in May about 10% on each $399 SKU. Again, I have seen no real measure of this for the slim to date or I simply missed it.

Sorry you're right, that was on $399 of course. The only other indicator they gave (more recently) was that hardware cost had been reduced by 70% since launch, but we're missing a piece of info for that to be useful (i.e. the original cost).

They're losing money on hardware, that's for sure, Hirai confirmed as much after the slim launch. However I doubt the margin of loss is significantly higher on the slim than on the fat. I think it's unlikely they'd have greenlit Slim if it didn't keep losses at the same point or lower than before.