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Sony confirms Crash Bandicoot rights still with Activision

SDCowboy

SDCowboy

Member
Empty said:
it's weird how people think sony are unable to work with activision.

even though they've been a huge partner for both destiny and the last call of duty, and sony have done tons of third party deals this generation

i mean obviously naughty dog aren't developing a new crash, but there's nothing that requires sony re-buying the ip for them to partner with activision to have sanzaru make a classic style ps4 crash bandicoot game for fans to enjoy.
Click to expand...

Seems like a lot of people possibly either forget or don't know that Sony never owned Crash in the first place.
 
I

InsaneTiger

Member
Tingle said:
So why would outcome 1 mean a toy to life game, despite that not making sense to Activision as a company? There are multiple possibilities to what a Crash game would be, it doesn't have to be a toy based game.

I think a Crash game would most likely be a rerelease of some sort, but who knows?
Click to expand...

I didn't say that it would be a toy game in my last post did I?

I said there will either be a new game or not, no matter the genre.
 
T

Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!

Member
Empty said:
it's weird how people think sony are unable to work with activision.

even though they've been a huge partner for both destiny and the last call of duty, and sony have done tons of third party deals this generation

i mean obviously naughty dog aren't developing a new crash, but there's nothing that requires sony re-buying the ip for them to partner with activision to have sanzaru make a classic style ps4 crash bandicoot game for fans to enjoy.
Click to expand...

They'd have to put on some cash to make it exclusive.

And also to persuade them to make a Crash game if they weren't planning on doing it already.
 
V

Voost Kain

Banned
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku! said:
It's so weird to me that of all the studios that have closed since 1996 (including several Sony Studios), that the dudes who made Bubsy 3D are still around.
Click to expand...

Quality aside Bubsy 3D was an innovative game that got hurt because it came out after two better titles, Crash and Mario 64..

Bubsy was an ambitous project, an open platformer with exploration and (arguably) better water control than Mario 64. It looked like a Beta and they decided to use tank controls for some reason.

I wonder what it would have looked like if it was fully finished?

Anyway quality aside, that kind of work got them a spot to continue making games.
 
S

SNURB

Member
Napalm_Frank said:
Dudes

Duuuudes

I just remembered that Sony Bend developed Bubsy 3D.

We got our developer right here, folks.
Click to expand...

Fun fact: The founders of Bend admitted that Crash Bandicoot killed any credibility that was left in Bubsy 3D.

So in a way, Crash killed Bubsy.
 
W

wrestleman

Member
Playsage said:
I guess they made those mobile kart games but I don't remember them being popular
Click to expand...

The first Crash Kart game on iOS was the top selling game app for several years in a row.

ALSO

Since people STILL apparently don't understand this:

Sony had a publishing contract for Crash 1, 2, Warped, Team Racing, and Bash.

They have no usage rights for them. And while I can't say for SURE, this contract is presumably the reason that when they distribute the games AS IS, the copyright text is the copyright text that is already listed on the games, with Universal Interactive Studios, as the contract would most likely not be altered thereafter.

There were rumors (which were alluded to in an official capacity somewhere, unless I'm remembering totally wrong) that Activision was the reason it couldn't be put out on Vita in NA regions.

Anybody who has REALLY played the first Crash game can look at the Uncharted 4 segments and tell you CONFIDENTLY that it's not the same code, and it's only partially the same art. The physics are different, the crates act differently, it's just NOT Crash 1. It's a convincing approximation but it's NOT emulated, and it's NOT ported, which would IMMEDIATELY disqualify them from saying "Hey, we made this one, it's ours" even if they DID have that level of usage rights, which they DO. NOT. HAVE.

If you need any more evidence, Naughty Dog used exclusively art from Crash 1-TR in their Art book. Art that they own and created (and some by Charles Zembillas and Joe Pearson, who are ALSO credited). They still had to credit Activision for their ownership of Crash Bandicoot.

They are using the Crash Bandicoot LOGO. Nate SAYS the WORDS "Crash Bandicoot".
Regardless of the game content, the logo and name are Activision's IP regardless.

Another example of Activision's full ownership: The
Uncharted 4 segment
uses Crash Bandicoot 1 music. This is ACTUALLY the BEST example of how Activision owns the first several games, now that I think of it: Josh Mancell, the composer of the music for Crash 1 through Team Racing, has been trying to work with a label to release the Crash Bandicoot music on CD and digitally -- he has been unable to because Activision has not been working with him. Sony has told him that they do not own the music or content from the games, as well.

If all the content in the first few games was owned by Sony just because they had the publishing and distribution contract, he wouldn't have to jump through all the hoops to deal with Activision to release music HE WROTE. If it was Sony-owned, they'd have been released by now.

No matter who 'made the content' or whether it's new or not, it's ACTIVISION'S PROPERTY under the current trademarks.

The fact they
are not listed under the Uncharted 4 credits as owning it
is VERY FUCKING SUSPECT when they are listed in the fucking art book, and 10 months ago, Naughty Dog members said
that the fucking segment was IMPOSSIBLE (VERBATIM, mind you), for the very reason that they "didn't own it". The segment is IN THERE NOW. What does that imply to you? What else could people POSSIBLY ascertain from that wording and the resulting segment BEING in the game?
 
F

funkystudent

Member
Chobel said:
WTF is going in here?
Click to expand...

sand-bury-your-head-in-the-sand.jpg
 
C

CalamityPixel

Member
Well, Sony never owned the rights to Crash.

Can't imagine Activision giving them away now unless they wanted good PR, but then again that PR makes it seem like they were holding the franchise "hostage" and would most likely paint them in a negative light.

I really don't understand all these threads about Sony/Naughty Dog getting the rights to Crash, any dev has any good of a chance getting the rights as Sony/ND do.
 
G

get2sammyb

Member
Edson Farley said:
Whwhwhwh WHAT?!

If they greenlit it it IS OK.

If they used the code for their PS classics, which DO NOT have activisions logo on them that would also be OK.
Click to expand...

Even if Activision did greenlight it,
you don't think Naughty Dog would give them a special thanks for allowing them to use a property that they don't own
? What made them change their mind -
Straley said it was impossible a year ago
?
 
V

Vena

Member
TedHub said:
I mean, sure, but it's something curious, regardless.
Click to expand...

Does Sony own distribution/game rights on the old Crash games? They can probably do a lot with that without having to acknowledge the current IP owner since the originals are from before that time.
 
W

wrestleman

Member
Vena said:
Doesn't really answer my question definitively. It's supposition and Matt highlights doubt on this whole thing of "having to" (as in forced to) credit Acti. There must be holes here.
Click to expand...

I don't really see how? They own publishing/distribution rights but have no usage rights. Activision owns the games themselves, other than source code, and I gave the example of them holding a vice grip on the music rights as decent evidence of them owning them. If Sony had full use of the games they published, there would be no hold up on Mancell releasing the soundtrack albums. Mancell has been pretty public about the fact that Sony has told him to ask Activision, and Activision has been pretty distant and not willing to reply.

Unless people think it's some arbitrary thing where Activision owns the MUSIC from the first few games but not the rest of the game's properties...
 
N

Nostremitus

Member
Primeau31 said:
yeah, we're definitely still spoiler tagging this. a lot of people were going in completely blind and haven't seen the opening scene of the game yet.



sorry mate :(
Click to expand...
I don't even own a PS4 and I've known about that for a week. It's not a secret... It's not even relevant to the story... Calling that a spoiler is a stretch... A big one. That's like saying that talking about which cars will be in Need For Speed or which guns will be in the next CoD are somehow spoilers as well.

funkystudent said:
You Crash returns to Sony people are the 2010s version of shenmue 3 weirdos of the 2000s.


Don't let things like facts get in the way though!
Click to expand...
So what you're saying is that Crash will begin active development soon just like Shenmue 3?
 
G

get2sammyb

Member
Vena said:
Doesn't really answer my question definitively. It's supposition and Matt highlights doubt on this whole thing of "having to" (as in forced to) credit Acti. There must be holes here.
Click to expand...

Also doesn't explain why
Straley was of the opinion that putting Crash in Uncharted 4 was impossible
last year. What changed?
 
J

Jigorath

Banned
Sony doesn't need to buy the rights back to make a new game.

They can just co-produce a title with Activision. Would be much cheaper on their part anyways.
 
W

wrestleman

Member
get2sammyb said:
Also doesn't explain why
Straley was of the opinion that putting Crash in Uncharted 4 was impossible
last year. What changed?
Click to expand...

I'm asking this question as well. He said it was impossible. Verbatim. Exact quote. He said it was impossible BECAUSE they didn't own it. Yet here we are. What is different now?
 
G

get2sammyb

Member
Jigorath said:
Sony doesn't need to buy the rights back to make a new game.

They can just co-produce a title with Activision. Would be much cheaper on their part anyways.
Click to expand...

Would they want to play a big part in reviving the brand only for Activision to put a rubbish developer on a sequel and make it multiformat?
 
S

Sodding_Gamer

Member
wrestleman said:
The first Crash Kart game on iOS was the top selling game app for several years in a row.

ALSO

Since people STILL apparently don't understand this:

Sony had a publishing contract for Crash 1, 2, Warped, Team Racing, and Bash.

They have no usage rights for them. And while I can't say for SURE, this contract is presumably the reason that when they distribute the games AS IS, the copyright text is the copyright text that is already listed on the games, with Universal Interactive Studios, as the contract would most likely not be altered thereafter.

There were rumors (which were alluded to in an official capacity somewhere, unless I'm remembering totally wrong) that Activision was the reason it couldn't be put out on Vita in NA regions.

Anybody who has REALLY played the first Crash game can look at the Uncharted 4 segments and tell you CONFIDENTLY that it's not the same code, and it's only partially the same art. The physics are different, the crates act differently, it's just NOT Crash 1. It's a convincing approximation but it's NOT emulated, and it's NOT ported, which would IMMEDIATELY disqualify them from saying "Hey, we made this one, it's ours" even if they DID have that level of usage rights, which they DO. NOT. HAVE.

If you need any more evidence, Naughty Dog used exclusively art from Crash 1-TR in their Art book. Art that they own and created (and some by Charles Zembillas and Joe Pearson, who are ALSO credited). They still had to credit Activision for their ownership of Crash Bandicoot.

They are using the Crash Bandicoot LOGO. Nate SAYS the WORDS "Crash Bandicoot".
Regardless of the game content, the logo and name are Activision's IP regardless.

Another example of Activision's full ownership: The
Uncharted 4 segment
uses Crash Bandicoot 1 music. This is ACTUALLY the BEST example of how Activision owns the first several games, now that I think of it: Josh Mancell, the composer of the music for Crash 1 through Team Racing, has been trying to work with a label to release the Crash Bandicoot music on CD and digitally -- he has been unable to because Activision has not been working with him. Sony has told him that they do not own the music or content from the games, as well.

If all the content in the first few games was owned by Sony just because they had the publishing and distribution contract, he wouldn't have to jump through all the hoops to deal with Activision to release music HE WROTE. If it was Sony-owned, they'd have been released by now.

No matter who 'made the content' or whether it's new or not, it's ACTIVISION'S PROPERTY under the current trademarks.

The fact they
are not listed under the Uncharted 4 credits as owning it
is VERY FUCKING SUSPECT when they are listed in the fucking art book, and 10 months ago, Naughty Dog members said
that the fucking segment was IMPOSSIBLE (VERBATIM, mind you), for the very reason that they "didn't own it". The segment is IN THERE NOW. What does that imply to you? What else could people POSSIBLY ascertain from that wording and the resulting segment BEING in the game?
Click to expand...

Well said. Something is definitely happening
 
V

vulva

Member
The weird sudden thirst for Crash probably lead to Activision raising the cost to acquire the IP. All the enthusiasm for a new Crash inadvertently killed any chance of Sony doing it. Instead you'll get some shovelware rushed release to capitalize on this sudden interest.
 
G

get2sammyb

Member
The thing is: I can see the arguments for and against - both make sense. And that's the problem here: things don't quite add up. There surely has to be more to all of the rumours and speculation and weirdness. Surely!

vulva said:
The weird sudden thirst for Crash probably lead to Activision raising the cost to acquire the IP. All the enthusiasm for a new Crash inadvertently killed any chance of Sony doing it. Instead you'll get some shovelware rushed release to capitalize on this sudden interest.
Click to expand...

Or... Activision realised they could cash in while the price is at a record high and Sony was willing to meet their ransom.

I dunno. Like, maybe?
 
S

Spaghetti

Member
Papacheeks said:
Sony is actually funding the game a decent amount. The kickstarter was a smart business move to gauge if it was a viable investment since Shenmue 2 sold like dog shit. That Kickatarter money along with Sony's help make the game a more lucrative deal for all involved publishing wise.
Click to expand...
Hi. No.

It has been reiterated dozens of times since last E3 that Shenmue III is not being funded by Sony. Sony are publishing and marketing the PS4 version. Their investment is a "marketing investment" (Source: Gameblog), and Cedric Biscay has stated Shibuya Productions is the main non-Kickstarter investor (Source: Twitter).

Sony are involved in the same way they are with other independent games, where they support the developers and help offset costs that would otherwise defer the budget from actual development. It isn't even in the same stratosphere of "Sony is actually funding the game a decent amount".
 
V

vulva

Member
get2sammyb said:
The thing is: I can see the arguments for and against - both make sense. And that's the problem here: things don't quite add up. There surely has to be more to all of the rumours and speculation and weirdness. Surely!



Or... Activision realised they could cash in while the price is at a record high and Sony was willing to meet their ransom.

I dunno. Like, maybe?
Click to expand...
I prefer my cynicism and negativity.
 
I

innervision961

Member
Lets all just come out and say what we really want, Naughty Dog's amazing talent to produce a handcrafted/handpainted adventure platformer. Just imagine how amazing that would be, the guys who cut their teeth on these types of games and left for the amazing experiences of Uncharted and TLOU only to return to the genre and blow us all away.
 
J

Jobbs

Banned
I played the original games back when I was a kid and I never understood why anyone gives a fuck about them. I've always thought they're kind of terrible.

But if there are people out there who want a new one then fine by me
 
W

wrestleman

Member
innervision961 said:
Lets all just come out and say what we really want, Naughty Dog's amazing talent to produce a handcrafted/handpainted adventure platformer. Just imagine how amazing that would be, the guys who cut their teeth on these types of games and left for the amazing experiences of Uncharted and TLOU only to return to the genre and blow us all away.
Click to expand...

I really don't get this sentiment that Naughty Dog couldn't make a wonderfully polished and great looking platformer with depth and replay. I don't get the idea that it's a 'waste' of their energy or 'talent'.

They make good games, and while they clearly enjoy these big cinematic experiences, what stops them from making big cool setpieces and having good writing and story inside the Crash Bandicoot universe? Something can be quirky and funny and still be big and well thought out and well written.

Well, I "get" where people come from on it, I guess, I just disagree.

Jobbs said:
I played the original games back when I was a kid and I never understood why anyone gives a fuck about them. I've always thought they're kind of terrible.

But if there are people out there who want a new one then fine by me
Click to expand...

I disagree, but this is the kind of Crash 'dislike' that I don't mind. They weren't for you, but you have no problem with the people who DID enjoy them wanting more. If more people were like you in this regard, it would be wonderful.
 
mysteriousmage09

mysteriousmage09

Member
Shawn Layden will come out on stage wearing a Crash Bandicoot costume and Bobby Kotick will come out jumping around like a maniac while wearing a Ripper Roo costume. The contract for the IP rights will be signed on stage, a bunch of hologram nitro boxes will explode, everything goes dark.

Sony Interactive Entertainment presents.

Crowd goes ape shit.
 
S

SNURB

Member
vulva said:
The weird sudden thirst for Crash probably lead to Activision raising the cost to acquire the IP. All the enthusiasm for a new Crash inadvertently killed any chance of Sony doing it. Instead you'll get some shovelware rushed release to capitalize on this sudden interest.
Click to expand...

Why would it kill any chance of Sony doing it if they're the ones doing all the sudden teasing? Not one hint came from Activision's side. Sony knows what the fans want.
 
Papacheeks

Papacheeks

Banned
Spaghetti said:
Hi. No.

It has been reiterated dozens of times since last E3 that Shenmue III is not being funded by Sony. Sony are publishing and marketing the PS4 version. Their investment is a "marketing investment" (Source: Gameblog), and Cedric Biscay has stated Shibuya Productions is the main non-Kickstarter investor (Source: Twitter).

Sony are involved in the same way they are with other independent games, where they support the developers and help offset costs that would otherwise defer the budget from actual development. It isn't even in the same stratosphere of "Sony is actually funding the game a decent amount".
Click to expand...

That's pretty much what I meant dude?

Sorry to have to go back from another thread and post links that Sony is supporting the game.

"Sony and Shibuya Productions have been wonderful partners because they believe in Shenmue and want to see the best for the fans and the game," Suzuki said in an update on the project's Kickstarter campaign. "Their investment in (and support of) Shenmue have helped to realize a sequel that will stand proud with its predecessors. While it is not business practice to discuss the specific details of such arrangements, I can say that with their assistance on the production and marketing end, and in Sony's case with some publishing support as well, Ys Net is able to use more of the money we collect through Kickstarter purely for Shenmue 3's development. It is also important to note that your funds are going strictly to Ys Net for development of Shenmue 3 — Sony and Shibuya Productions are not seeing a cent of your Kickstarter dollars."
Click to expand...

Polygon

"We said the only way this is going to happen is if the fans speak up, and we thought Kickstarter was the perfect place to do this."

"Sony and Playstation is very much a partner in this game and it's going to be run through third party production, and we're going to help YS Net get the game done," Corsi continued. "And we're going to be partners on it the whole way."

While many seemed concerned over this omission, it appears that Sony's role is not as hands-on as people are assuming.
Click to expand...

The escapist

It goes on to talk about what you showed which was the marketing, advertising, promotion. But it sounds like there are others involved as well, and that they could be using Sony's Third party relation production house to facilitate it with Sega.

So I say funding, and you automatically think funding development? There are different ways to back/fund projects. Microsoft does it too.

Also what is with the shitty response with Hi.No? It's like you didn't read the end of my comment where I say it's a lucrative deal for all involved "Publishing wise" Which basically is what Sony, Sega are among others are doing. Sega has probably put some development money to the project, but that I have no clue on just guesses.
 
W

wrestleman

Member
Xamtheking said:
What if activision bought sony
Click to expand...

What if Activision bought Sony and Sony bought Activision at the same time and the deals were kept too secret and they both went through and now there's an infinite time and space loop in California that's slowly eating the planet?
 
S

Sponge

Banned
wrestleman said:
What if Activision bought Sony and Sony bought Activision at the same time and the deals were kept too secret and they both went through and now there's an infinite time and space loop in California that's slowly eating the planet?
Click to expand...

And then Disney comes in and outbids Sony for Crash so they can hold him ransom for Spider-Man film rights.
 
C

CREMSteve

Member
If Sony's E3 stage goes dark, and the "A Naughty Dog Game" text appears, followed by a brief moment of silence before the Crash theme started playing... shit, I'd pretty much die of happiness right then and there.
 
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