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[Rubedo]

Makoto still caring about Sayaka is super weird to me. Like, the chick tried to kill you and everyone around you. That she regretted her acts while she was being killed in revenge doesn't redeem her at all.

Maybe he just decided she wouldn't have done it if it weren't for Monokuma's manipulation and forgave her based on that.

Y'know I always wondered how Makoto actually felt about discovering these people were murderers. Like did he really care at all about having to call Mondo out? Did he feel sympathy toward him due to the conditions of what happened or just view him as a killer?

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Like did he really care at all about having to call Mondo out? Did he feel sympathy toward him due to the conditions of what happened or just view him as a killer?

I think the game itself states that it's all about him ensuring everyone's survival, while fighting Monokuma in the process. He never blames anyone who killed another in that game; he always blamed Monokuma.

 

[Matt Attack]

Makoto still caring about Sayaka is super weird to me. Like, the chick tried to kill you and everyone around you. That she regretted her acts while she was being killed in revenge doesn't redeem her at all.

I'd imagine he doesn't entirely blame her for what happened, but rather Junko for pushing her to that point. Maybe he feels similarly about the Remnants of Despair, which is why he goes so far to save a group of mass murderers? Not sure though.

 

[Schadenfreude]

Then should everyone in DR2 also hate everyone who tried to kill the others? Should the DR1 characters hate Hina for what she tried to do? Each one of them were in dire circumstances and were pushed to their psychological limits. I think it's far more realistic for them to look back on what happened after the fact and grieve/forgive the departed instead of keeping some irrational grudge.

I really think they should. Those guys forgave everyone too easily. Something like this is a cop out:

I think the game itself states that it's all about him ensuring everyone's survival, while fighting Monokuma in the process. He never blames anyone who killed another in that game; he always blamed Monokuma.

What happened to personal responsibility? Monokuma may have put the gun in their hands but they were the ones who pulled the trigger way too easily.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

What happened to personal responsibility? Monokuma may have put the gun in their hands but they were the ones who pulled the trigger way too easily.

I'm kind of with you; I guess I'm speaking mainly from the perspective of the "Ultimate Hope." No one had to kill anyone else, and that's what it comes down to.

Still, they were in exacerbating circumstances, so it's not so black and white.

 

[Matt Attack]

What happened to personal responsibility? Monokuma may have put the gun in their hands but they were the ones who pulled the trigger way too easily.

Whether it makes sense or not, that's just who Makoto is. He's pretty extraordinary in his capacity for forgiveness, for better or for worse.

 

[Moonlight]

Kind of why he even tried to give the UDs a second chance at all, heh.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Whether it makes sense or not, that's just who Makoto is. He's pretty extraordinary in his capacity for forgiveness, for better or for worse.

Well, it's not just Makoto. Hajime isn't the type to shun the murderers, either.

 

[Xpike]

I still kinda don't get how Junko managed to destroy the world. In DR1 I assumed Junko and Mukuro were just part of a really large "Ultimate Despair" terrorist cell and they were the Hope's Peak agents, but having a Japanese fashion designer teenager orchestrate the end of the world is kinda stretching it...

 

[Rubedo]

What happened to personal responsibility? Monokuma may have put the gun in their hands but they were the ones who pulled the trigger way too easily.

This is a problem I had with the DR2 motives in Chapters 3 and 4. In the previous game, it is as you say. Monokuma puts the gun in their hand but it's ultimately their choice. In those two chapters, they were basically forced. Mikan had to be reverted to her evil self to kill someone and it wasn't really her fault she got a disease that did that. In the fourth, they literally had to kill or die.

Kind of why he even tried to give the UDs a second chance at all, heh.

Yeah. He believes in the best of people.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

In the fourth, they literally had to kill or die..

I also preferred how the mastermind went about things in DR1 because of that, but it also makes for a different, more forceful dynamic in DR2 after the more passive one of DR1, and it also matches Junko's change of motivations. In DR1, she just wants to maximize everyone's despair, while in DR2 it's more about her wanting everyone to die asap so she can resuscitate herself.

 

[Rubedo]

I also preferred how the mastermind went about things in DR1 because of that, but it also makes for a different, more forceful dynamic in DR2 after the more passive one of DR1, and it also matches Junko's change of motivations. In DR1, she just wants to maximize everyone's despair, while in DR2 it's more about her wanting everyone to die asap so she can resuscitate herself.

That's true. I didn't think about that. Also explains why she made the second murder so unfair. It was specifically designed to make Fuyuhiko kill someone. It didn't serve as a motive for anyone else.

 

[A Link to the Past]

This is a problem I had with the DR2 motives in Chapters 3 and 4. In the previous game, it is as you say. Monokuma puts the gun in their hand but it's ultimately their choice. In those two chapters, they were basically forced. Mikan had to be reverted to her evil self to kill someone and it wasn't really her fault she got a disease that did that. In the fourth, they literally had to kill or die.



Yeah. He believes in the best of people.

With fairness, this killing game wasn't operating with the same logic. It didn't matter who lived or died, Junko* was just trying to cause so much turmoil that the gang would have to interfere.

 

[Tuulenpoika]

Booyah, got the platinum. Finally I can let that Monomi minigame alone. It felt so out of place in the game. I mean it worked and controlled well and all that, but still, the first game didn't have anything like that, and from that aspect it was better for it. Also, especially if the game has a secret trophy about collecting every item in the minigame, how about having a concrete item list?

Overall, I can't help but feel a little disappointed after reading everywhere about how the sequel would be better than the first one in almost every aspect. For me, it was pretty much the opposite. Not a bad game by any means, still straight out 5/5, but definitely inferior to the first one. I wish I didn't care about all those little flaws, but since the overall game is otherwise so great, even the tiniest of faults stand out in comparison.

Maybe I should play the last case once more to end with a definite positive note.

 

[MSMrRound]

Maybe I should play the last case once more to end with a definite positive note.

Chapter 5 for me likewise. Still my favourite chapter across both games.

 

[Suzushiiro]

Thinking on it more, what makes me kind of angry about the ending is that there's no logical reason why someone would design the Neo World Program to work the way it does.

I mean, at first it kind of makes sense- the characters are basically themselves minus their memories after entering high school moved (rather than copied) into the system, and upon graduation they're meant to overwrite their old fucked up personas in the real world. The characters who die have their data deleted, and their real bodies can't function without having something written back to their brains by the system. Junko plans on exploiting this by writing herself over the brains of the dead characters instead.

But then the shutdown thing comes up. Now they say that if the whole program just shuts down outright the living characters will wake up and be just as they were before they were hooked into the Neo World Program, forgetting everything that transpired inside... but the characters who died stay dead.

This doesn't make any sense- if the reason why the dead characters couldn't wake up is because they needed the data the Neo World Program was supposed to return, then that should apply to the living characters and mean that they can't wake up after the shutdown either. If the only consequence of the shutdown is that they all revert to their pre-Neo World Program states rather than (mentally, at least) becoming who they were after graduation, that should apply to the characters who died in there too and they should have woken up after the shutdown just like everyone else.

Beyond that- why the fuck would you make a VR program of any kind that had the potential for real-world consequences if anything went wrong inside the VR world, unless your whole intent was for it to be a deathtrap (such as in Sword Art Online)? I mean, I get that the Junko-virus wasn't something they expected, but there still could have been bugs, accidental deaths, etc.

It just feels like the whole reason why the tech works the way it does is because that's how it has to work to make the game sufficiently tragic. I get that the writers wanted to have their cake and eat it too in that they wanted the "it was all virtual realty" twist but didn't want to invalidate all of the deaths that happened in the process, it just feels like they could have gone about it better.

 

[Sorian]

The program was meant to work on extremely dangerous individuals. I doubt they cared if there were casualties

 

[Deleted member 13876]

The program was meant to work on extremely dangerous individuals. I doubt they cared if there were casualties

Makoto made it known on multiple occasions that he had grave concerns about the Program.

 

[Sorian]

Makoto made it known on multiple occasions that he had grave concerns about the Program.

Makoto was not the one who developed the program nor was he anyone that had any real say on the matter.

 

[Deleted member 13876]

Makoto was not the one who developed the program nor was he anyone that had any real say on the matter.

I know. I'm not arguing against you, rather backing up your point. The higher ups knew it was dangerous, but didn't care and had entirely different designs for the Remnants. Makoto tried to use the tech on them on his own turns and hoped for the best possible outcome despite his reservations.

 

[SolarKnight]

It's not as if the program was specifically designed to fuck up whoever died in it, it's just that there's not much it can do when said person is practically brain dead.

There never was supposed to be any possibility for danger until Monokuma hijacked it. That's why the teacher is meant to be omniscient, to watch over and protect them if something could happen.

 

[dakkumauji]

Mikan's despair voice in the dub is pretty good.

 

[PK Gaming]

Thinking on it more, what makes me kind of angry about the ending is that there's no logical reason why someone would design the Neo World Program to work the way it does.

I mean, at first it kind of makes sense- the characters are basically themselves minus their memories after entering high school moved (rather than copied) into the system, and upon graduation they're meant to overwrite their old fucked up personas in the real world. The characters who die have their data deleted, and their real bodies can't function without having something written back to their brains by the system. Junko plans on exploiting this by writing herself over the brains of the dead characters instead.

But then the shutdown thing comes up. Now they say that if the whole program just shuts down outright the living characters will wake up and be just as they were before they were hooked into the Neo World Program, forgetting everything that transpired inside... but the characters who died stay dead.

This doesn't make any sense- if the reason why the dead characters couldn't wake up is because they needed the data the Neo World Program was supposed to return, then that should apply to the living characters and mean that they can't wake up after the shutdown either. If the only consequence of the shutdown is that they all revert to their pre-Neo World Program states rather than (mentally, at least) becoming who they were after graduation, that should apply to the characters who died in there too and they should have woken up after the shutdown just like everyone else.

Beyond that- why the fuck would you make a VR program of any kind that had the potential for real-world consequences if anything went wrong inside the VR world, unless your whole intent was for it to be a deathtrap (such as in Sword Art Online)? I mean, I get that the Junko-virus wasn't something they expected, but there still could have been bugs, accidental deaths, etc.

It just feels like the whole reason why the tech works the way it does is because that's how it has to work to make the game sufficiently tragic. I get that the writers wanted to have their cake and eat it too in that they wanted the "it was all virtual realty" twist but didn't want to invalidate all of the deaths that happened in the process, it just feels like they could have gone about it better.

Actually, the reason why they can't wake up is because they experienced the sensation of death. That shock effectively left them brain dead; with or without their memories, they'd still be comatose.

HINATA HAJIME: You said earlier that whether it’s really true or not, if you experience it as real then it becomes “reality” ...

NAEGI MAKOTO: Once something’s been destroyed, you can’t bring it back ... whether it’s reality or a program.
NAEGI MAKOTO: It’s impossible for them to return...

One could reason that the reason why Hajime and co remembered what transpired was due to that fact. Even though they lost their memories, the experience of being trapped on that island never really left them. Junko somehow reviving them despite that circumstance is a bit of a stretch, I agree, but not completely unreasonable.

 

[Rubedo]

Today I met someone who legitimately wanted an American DR2 live action movie. Like with Kristen Bell as Mahiru and Chloe Grace Moretz as Hiyoko.

I...just can't even begin to imagine...

 

[Labrys]

I will never understand people casting american actors for Japanese characters. Jeez.

 

[ScraftyDevil]

Today I met someone who legitimately wanted an American DR2 live action movie. Like with Kristen Bell as Mahiru and Chloe Grace Moretz as Hiyoko.

I...just can't even begin to imagine...

Who would even play Gundam? Bruce Campbell?!

...Actually I'm totally okay with that.

 

[Otaku Coder]

With regards to Sayaka: It's worth noting that, when that murder went down, Monokuma hadn't yet introduced the Class Trial system nor specified that getting away with a murder meant killing everyone else.

 

[Zonic]

Today I met someone who legitimately wanted an American DR2 live action movie. Like with Kristen Bell as Mahiru and Chloe Grace Moretz as Hiyoko.

I...just can't even begin to imagine...

I can't help but wonder if it was less about the actual movie & more about seeing those two together, considering the relationship Hiyoko had with Mahiru.

Otherwise, man, I don't know. I feel like a movie COULD work, but I think the main problem is that it'd just feel rushed because in 90-120 minutes, you'd have to deal with introducing everyone, give them personalities, do all the investigations, have the trials, have actual character development, then deal with the whole twist ending.

Sure, we had the anime only be about 13 episodes, but averaging about 20-ish minutes each, that's still over 4 hours. You'd have to cover the entire game in half that, maybe even less.

How long is that stage play suppose to run? I guess I'll wait & see how that turns out. But I kind of feel better when Japan makes movies based on franchises from their own country & the same goes for the US.

 

[ScraftyDevil]

If they did make a movie, they'd realistically have to either divide it into multiple parts a la Kill Bill or just significantly cut down on the number of cases in the game. Mind you, I don't know how they'd do that without butchering the character development, but unless they pull a Scott Pilgrim and give each case like 20 minutes or so, there's no way they're fitting the entire game into one movie.

 

[Rubedo]

I can't help but wonder if it was less about the actual movie & more about seeing those two together, considering the relationship Hiyoko had with Mahiru.

Otherwise, man, I don't know. I feel like a movie COULD work, but I think the main problem is that it'd just feel rushed because in 90-120 minutes, you'd have to deal with introducing everyone, give them personalities, do all the investigations, have the trials, have actual character development, then deal with the whole twist ending.

Sure, we had the anime only be about 13 episodes, but averaging about 20-ish minutes each, that's still over 4 hours. You'd have to cover the entire game in half that, maybe even less.

How long is that stage play suppose to run? I guess I'll wait & see how that turns out. But I kind of feel better when Japan makes movies based on franchises from their own country & the same goes for the US.

Right. If a 13 episode anime series couldn't do it, a movie can't. And being American live action would make a lot of the visual stuff on DR2 either dumb looking or impossible.

The idea very well could have just been based on that casting choice though.

 

[Zonic]

Yeah, it would have to be a two-parter, because there's NO way they'd fit everything into one movie, especially if they want people to care about the characters before they get killed.

Only problem with a two-parter is if ya try to promote it via trailer, commercials, etc. you'd have to be careful without spoiling who died in the previous film.

Right. If a 13 episode anime series couldn't do it, a movie can't. And being American live action would make a lot of the visual stuff on DR2 either dumb looking or impossible.

The idea very well could have just been based on that casting choice though.

Oh god, I can't imagine how much the character design would suffer. Again, that stage play seems to be staying true to the game & is cool to see how they'd look in the real world. But sometimes, the US kind of screws up how characters look....*remembers Dragonball Evolution*

I still should check out the anime one of these days, despite the complaints.

 

[ScraftyDevil]

Yeah, it would have to be a two-parter, because there's NO way they'd fit everything into one movie, especially if they want people to care about the characters before they get killed.

Only problem with a two-parter is if ya try to promote it via trailer, commercials, etc. you'd have to be careful without spoiling who died in the previous film.

I suppose they could just do what Nymphomaniac did and release it as a two-parter but release both parts on the same day. That way they could advertise the whole package rather than each movie individually, and people wouldn't have to wait a year or more just to see what happens to the rest of the cast.

 

[dakkumauji]

It's fair to say an American movie for this game sounds like a bad idea so they should just hurry up and the anime already.

 

[Zonic]

Speaking of the anime, what's the chance there'll be one for DR2? Or did the reception of DR1's adaptation make it so that's not happening?

 

[dakkumauji]

Speaking of the anime, what's the chance there'll be one for DR2? Or did the reception of DR1's adaptation make it so that's not happening?

I honestly thought we would have gotten at least an announcement for SDR2 anime by now. I mean there was a merchandise push for SDR2 (four scaled figures and mini figures for the whole cast) like what DR1 got.

Maybe DR1's not chart topping sales pushed SDR2's anime plans on hold and we might see that again like some time later like Devil Survivor 2 Break Record (though reversed, lol).

One thing to note is that most of the staff for the first anime is now the staff for the Assassination Classroom adaptation that's starting in the winter so maybe we'll have to wait for that to be done first.

Still waiting for the first anime to be released in the west too... *grumble grumble*

 

[Zonic]

Didn't Funimation license the series? I mean, they didn't dub it (& there's no DVD/BD release), but still, they have the rights to it.

 

[Phamit]

Oh god, after this Remants of Despair reveal by Makoto I was like..

I could totally understand why the Future Fondation wanted to see people rather death then alive

 

[Steel]

Makoto still caring about Sayaka is super weird to me. Like, the chick tried to kill you and everyone around you. That she regretted her acts while she was being killed in revenge doesn't redeem her at all.

Supposedly the Future Foundation restored his memories. They could've been a couple in their high school years, at the very least they were friends.

 

[dakkumauji]

Didn't Funimation license the series? I mean, they didn't dub it (& there's no DVD/BD release), but still, they have the rights to it.

They only have the streaming rights and never mentioned if they have the home release rights.

It wouldn't be the first time if Funi streamed something but didn't release it for whatever reason. Of course it could still be early for them to announce it or whatever.

Truth be told, I have hope that NISA ends up licensing it cause their releases are one of the best for bonus stuff even if they don't usually dub it.

 

[jello44]

Girls reactions to getting the vibrator

 

[Feep]

Beat it

Goddamn my character is awesome

 

[Rubedo]

Girls reactions to getting the vibrator

Ibuki and Chiaki won at reactions. The thing about being a kid's toy is still weird. And then there's the ball gag...

 

[Zonic]

"Yup, thanks."

/ded

Where's the rest of the female reactions (Mahiru, Peko, & Mikan)?

 

[FluxWaveZ]

Girls reactions to getting the vibrator

Akane and Sonia have the same face.

 

[DaBoss]

What gifts give unique dialogue in DR1 and DR2?

Akane and Sonia have the same face.

lol

 

[Xpike]

Girls reactions to getting the vibrator

I think Ibuki's is supposed to be generic...but it fits extremely well.

 

[Tinfoilhatsron]

That anime end though, lol.

 

[dakkumauji]

Here's another chunk of the cast's response.

Teruteru is as you would expect it~

I'll imagine this is Gundham's response.

 

[ScraftyDevil]

Here's another chunk of the cast's response.

Teruteru is as you would expect it~

I'll imagine this is Gundham's response.

Daily reminder that Gundam is best girl.

 

[Rubedo]

Here's another chunk of the cast's response.

Teruteru is as you would expect it~

I'll imagine this is Gundham's response.

Peko and Gundham's are great too. I expected Mikan to say that ever since I discovered the ball gag is one of her favorites.