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[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Thread #2) - One Thumb Up

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J2 Cool

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One thing I was really curious to see before the film, was how the darkside would get on its feet again after Jedi. For some reason, I naturally wanted that piece of the puzzle filled in. But it made a lot of sense for telling a simpler story, and an ongoing battle of good vs evil, that they would skip to the classic conflict. It also puts the film too much the parallel of Revenge of the Sith to show evil's rise. Although I imagine it to be revealed in pieces over the rest of the trilogy, certainly as Luke comes into the story.

About the Rey controversy of being too powerful too easily, it was but a small gripe of mine after the film before I read anything, but I enjoyed her performance so much as well. I think if anything it sets up a fear for the rest of the films, in regards to escalation for the series after she's already defeated her adversary. You can have Kylo become a master sith in the next film, but dramatically its a concern to properly impose the threat of your villain. Other than that I wanted Fin to be more capable at something but Rey fills most roles he may have been good at. But within the framework of the film I think it's a very overstated issue.

Star wars fans are finicky by nature with the details, but it seems the argument is manifesting in a really strange way at this point.
 
Jul 2, 2011
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It's been casually mentioned Williams is attached to all three films, but I don't think anything's been finalized.

I think they'll have JW on the mainline films as long as he's healthy and willing to score them. Obviously with his age, you have to have contingencies, just in case.

I'm kinda more interested in seeing how they handle scoring the Anthologies. They're not going to have Williams (or Giacchino or really anyone) scoring a different SW movie every single year.
 

MisterHero

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I love the movie dearly, but what 'arc'?

The only character with s discernible arc is Fin.
-Kylo tells us that he is conflicted by the light, but we never actually see jack shit
The Anakin/Vader visions would've been awesome. We don't even need to know if it's really him or Snoke manipulating Ben
 

16BitNova

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There's no way Rey is a Kenobi. Both the OT and PT are Skywalker stories. Star Wars is a Skywalker story. Kenobis are nobody.

I posted way early this morning. Here's my speculation.

Going along with the Darth Plagueis is Snoke theory. Rumors from before about Anakin's birth was that Plagueis actually did figure out how to manipulate the force (or midicholorians, whatever) to create life, and therefore he created Anakin (which is why his midicholorian count was off the charts) essentially being his "Father".

What if Snoke is Plaguies, and saw Anakin as a failed attempt, so he tried again with Rey. Creating her. Sure it still leaves it open to who her mother may be. But, this could also explain her connection to Luke/Skywalker's since essentially she is like Anakin's sister.

Edit: Even if Snoke isn't Plaguies, maybe he learned the power of creating life and created Rey. And he was the one who left Rey on Jakku. Would explain why he left her to that asshole merchant guy. Bad guy connections.

Too far fetched?
 

DiipuSurotu

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one of the things that i think is a carryover of the prequels is talking about the light side of the force. or maybe it's a continuation of the video games.

i had assumed that the dark side just meant the bad side. in rotj there's talk about good in vader, but in tfa, there's talk about how how there's still light in ben. why did this happen.

I partly agree, but at least what I like is that they never "light side", it's "dark side" vs simply "the light".
 

diaspora

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I posted way early this morning. Here's my speculation.

Going along with the Darth Plagueis is Snoke theory. Rumors from before about Anakin's birth was that Plagueis actually did figure out how to manipulate the force (or midicholorians, whatever) to create life, and therefore he created Anakin (which is why his midicholorian count was off the charts) essentially being his "Father".

What if Snoke is Plaguies, and saw Anakin as a failed attempt, so he tried again with Rey. Creating her. Sure it still leaves it open to who her mother may be. But, this could also explain her connection to Luke/Skywalker's since essentially she is like Anakin's sister.

Too far fetched?

More complicated than this series is capable of being.
 

TheXbox

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Aug 26, 2012
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Because his work on TFA is rather subpar?
While I grant you it's probably the weakest score of the saga (maybe a toss up between this and Clones), you don't just tell John Williams to fuck off because one soundtrack wasn't quite as seminal as you'd hoped it would be. There's still a lot of great music here.
 

Toa TAK

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Because his work on TFA is rather subpar?

For what it's worth, even though that's the case, if he's still confirmed to go do the rest of the trilogy I'm glad in the sense that I hope that he'll be able to amp it up a bit for whatever Rian Johnson does with him.

That said, Rey's Theme doesn't match up to Across the Stars.
 

blackdevil

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It's not the best SW score but I don't believe anyone else out there would have done a better job.


who did the score for the second trailer? when the star wars theme starts?

was it in the movie? i dont remember but i dont think so . It sounded so powerful and made that trailer even better.
 

Fliesen

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Feb 18, 2014
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For him, maybe.

But still pretty good I think.

yeah, multiple viewings make it easier to identify the mix of the different themes / motives.

The way they cleverly use the various stages of Rey's theme across the movie is pretty fantastic. Up until the Falcon flight where it starts with pieces from the OT and once she leaves hyperspace, it's Rey's theme all the way, because it's become Rey's story.
 
Nov 17, 2005
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Except it works well for both audiences. Again this is going to be A LOT of people's first SW movie. It works well in that regard too. I've had many people who saw this movie who have never seen one before love this movie.

I mean of course you would hope they go back and watch the others after this.

Dude, there is a difference between making Aliens (which I saw before Alien) and making TFA before someone sees ANH.

In one, the new director took characters and themes from the first film and forged a completely new story that was great on its own and didn't rely on the overall structure of the previous film to work.

The other is an incredibly safe retelling of the original film, right down to the trench run to destroy a Death Star.

I love both Alien and Aliens for different reasons and watching one doesn't immediately make me think of all the things I had seen before.
 

Ether_Snake

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Prometheus is proof they didn't and still don't need Snoke to be stupid CG. They can just enhance him a bit if needed if they need to do something specific.

 

TAJ

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
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Is it weird I'm half expecting Phasma to join the good team in VIII?

I get the impression that she wasn't raised by the First Order her whole life. If so that would make her one of the only troopers capable of making a credible face turn. (Sorry, Finn.)

I hope she's dead, though.
 

Effect

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Jun 15, 2007
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Except it's really not a remake of the original at all. Callbacks sure. But this movie is it's own beast and stands on it's own.

I enjoyed the film ultimately in the end but it does not stand on it's own. Not completely. There is an assumption that you have some knowledge going into this film feel. The lack of exposition and explanation for things shows that. It's built to stand on nostalgia in a lot of places as well. That's not to say it can't be enjoyed or that's even a bad thing but there are number of things you just have to accept and go with. Far to many that if this wasn't a Star Wars film, and had the unfairly I feel accepted belief by man is that everything about the prequels were bad and this has to be good, it would be called out on it and hit negatively for it. It being a Star Wars films saves it from that criticism. It's not a work of art. Not at all. Not even close. I agree it doesn't have to be to be very enjoyable. I don't care that it isn't and didn't care about that when it came to the OT or the PT however I don't think people should get it twisted and think there are no flaws in this film.
 

Real Hero

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I feel bad for saying but they should get rid of Williams, not a single new memorable theme in the entire film. Fuck, he did amazing work for the prequels if he's not capable of that anymore have him leave along with Ford. Love the man but this film deserved a better score.
 

MartyStu

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Seems to me that Rey is lukes daughter and Luke put her in hiding on Jakku after he saw what happened to Kylo and he destroyed his order.

I just hope that we find out just how many children Luke was training.

Would be cool if at some point in the movies if he or Rey gather up all the barely trained apprentices.
 
Jul 30, 2008
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It's not the best SW score but I don't believe anyone else out there would have done a better job.
It isn't that it's not the best. It's one of the worst. I think plenty MIGHT have done a better job. But we'll never know.

I feel bad for saying but they should get rid of Williams, not a single new memorable theme in the entire film. Fuck, he did amazing work for the prequels if he's not capable of that anymore have him leave along with Ford. Love the man but this film deserved a better score.
Rey's theme is amazing. Surprisingly, probably one of the best in the Star Wars movies.
 

sploatee

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Sep 18, 2013
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I've now seen it twice and am going to dump my thoughts in this here post so I can get on with my life.

I thought it was tremendous fun.

Kylo Ren was a fascinating character - the best in the film. The lightsaber fight worked and I appreciated it being the focus rather than the assault on Starkiller Base.

The section with the Rathtars (?) was possibly the weakest part of the film. It just didn't sit right with me; the creatures were a little too obviously CGI and the space pirates seemed to be from a different film. It did make me chuckle though.

The closing meeting with Luke wasn't bad, but didn't feel very Star Wars.

BB8 was marvellous and I'd happily watch a whole film of BB8 and R2D2 just bumbling about.

I didn't have any problems with Rey's "trench run" moment and I didn't have any problems with R2 waking up (although I did think it was something to do with Luke putting
his hand on R2), I was too busy cute-ing out over BB8 having the little piece of the puzzle.

I didn't feel let down by Phasma - I found Finn's comeuppance scene really funny.

Maz Kanata worked. Snoke not so much, although the character is interesting (Plagueis?).

The shot of the Falcon looping on Jakku (the one in the first trailer) might be the best moment of JJ's career (in the films I've seen) - in fact, that set-piece and the one immediately preceding it (Poe and Finn escape) were fantastically well-done; exciting, charming and kinetic.

The Tokudana action sequence was marvellous - the tracking shot of Poe being a fighter ace and the Resistance flying in over the waves were 'stupid grin' moments for me, as was Finn facing down the Stormtrooper with the spinny electric thing.

I think JJ's done a fantastic job overall, though. It doesn't have the heft of Empire, but it doesn't try to. It aims at being a rollercoaster swashbuckler and it nails it, while leaving enough plot points unexplained to whet the appetite for the sequel.

So if I was going to make the qualitative quantative I'd probably say its an 8/10 for me and a huge relief. I just hope Disney don't overdo it by making too many films and it'll take quite a stretch for me to be convinced that Colin Trevorrow is the best person for Episode 9.

Oh bugger - one last thing. On first viewing I felt a little let down by the score (apart from the well-placed callbacks and Rey's theme on meeting Luke) but on a second viewing I noticed the very subtle nods to previous motifs. I would've liked a few more distinct themes, but it seemed like a calculated decision to avoid such themes to draw attention to the callback moments. Seems to have been a good one, judging by the response to Rey grabbing the lightsaber.

So. Yay! Probably not gonna see it a third time though. I feel like I've drained everything from it!
 

diaspora

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I feel bad for saying but they should get rid of Williams, not a single new memorable theme in the entire film. Fuck, he did amazing work for the prequels if he's not capable of that anymore have him leave along with Ford. Love the man but this film deserved a better score.

The music during the Anakin/Obi Wan duel was really good.
 
May 30, 2013
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It isn't that it's not the best. It's one of the worst. I think plenty MIGHT have done a better job. But we'll never know.

To be fair to Williams, this movie's pace is so far off-the-charts compared to the OT, I don't even know if there was enough time to put in a meaningful score, without it being intrerupted by banter or a scene change
 

Ether_Snake

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It makes much more sense of Rey's parents to have been killed by Kylo.
 
Jul 30, 2008
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To be fair to Williams, this movie's pace is so far off-the-charts compared to the OT, I don't even know if there was enough time to put in a meaninful score, without it being interpreted by banter or a scene change
I could be completely wrong, but I feel like he tried to keep too much of the same feeling with his new pieces in TFA. Rey's theme was a great step in a new direction, purely in terms of instrumentation. I wish we had more like it.

I have faith in Williams. This might've just been a bad fluke overall. He might've just feel too constrained by the past to break free with something new and amazing? Who knows....rambling now.
 
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Someone's post on that R2D2 explanation regarding the novel:



Why in fuck did they cut all this crucial shit from the novel? I don't get it. This is like the 3rd or 4th really needed piece of information that should have been in the movie...

Well they really botched that one in the movie.
 

Real Hero

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also for , C3PO had the funniest moment in the movie interrupting the reunion. That was straight out of empire strikes back.
 
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