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Super Mario Galaxy Appreciation Thread

Tab0203

Member
EGM: Speaking about those powerup suits for Mario.... Sure, they're cute, but we feel like Mario's more fun to control without them.

...

EGM: The Red Star flying suit is totally fun, but why not allow users to play with it in a real level?

...

EGM: Galaxy is a huge success in Europe and America, but it's not selling as quickly in Japan. Why?

...

EGM: Are there aspects of Galaxy that you designed specifically with the Western audience in mind?

...

EGM: Galaxy's ending seems surprisingly apocalyptic and crazy; it's more in line with anime like Evangelion and Akira than the Mario fare we're used to. What's exactly going on during that nonsense?
Who conducted the interview? Horrible questions.




Articles/interviews worth reading:

Interview with Super Mario Galaxy composers Koji Kondo and Mahito Yokota
http://www.music4games.net/Features_Display.aspx?id=186

Super Mario Galaxy Audio Journal
http://www.music4games.net/Features_Display.aspx?id=187

Understanding The Fun of Super Mario Galaxy
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/3522/understanding_the_fun_of_super_.php
Another part of easy fun is exploration and variety. Some of the gameplay variety in Mario Galaxy includes:

-Flying with the bee suit
-Shooting fireballs with the fire suit
-Creating frozen platforms and ice skating with the ice suit
-Becoming a ghost who can turn invisible and float with the ghost suit
-Jumping very high with the spring suit
-Riding a manta ray on the water in a race
-Riding a turtle shell underwater in many situations, including races
-Balancing on a ball as you navigate through a level
-Flying with the red star suit
-Numerous tricks of gravity that vary across several levels

Just the moment-to-moment interactions involved with these things are fun, without even considering how they are used in the context of hard-fun-goals.

...

Camera

I used to think that moving the camera around while you are in the middle of platforming was part of the game in Mario 64. I was good at this, and I considered it one of the skills the game was all about. Mario Galaxy removes this "skill" almost entirely because it has an amazingly good camera system. Almost all the time, the camera is pretty much where you want it to be. This is a similar concept to the wall jump mentioned above, in that the game is much better off creating difficulty in other places than wall jump execution or camera fiddling.

Mario Galaxy's camera is actually an amazing accomplishment. I saw a GDC lecture one year about camera systems in games from the guy who did the camera for Metroid Prime. That game also has excellent camera handling (and the best mini-map ever). You might say, "But it's a first-person shooter! There is nothing to the camera."

What you don't realize is that Metroid Prime has over 20 camera modes. When you're in an open area, it's a regular first-person camera. When Samus rolls into a ball, it's third person. Some ball-rolling areas have a side-view camera and basically turn the game into 2D gameplay. Going through a tunnel has a special camera, and some boss fights have another camera.

A Mario-style third person platform game has even more demanding camera needs than Metroid Prime. In 1996, I would have not even been able to imagine a camera for a 3D Mario game that was basically in the right place almost all the time.

When you consider that Mario Galaxy presents far more challenges to camera design than any other 3D platform game ever, it's that much more impressive that it succeeds. No matter which way gravity is going or which kind of crazy thing you're jumping around on, the camera seems to know where it should be. This is undoubtedly the result of endless hours of hand-tweaking of camera paths and some very smart logic to boot.

Opinion: What Super Mario Galaxy's Rosalina Shows Us About Storytelling
http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=18472
It is worth pausing here to reemphasize that Super Mario Galaxy – a Mario game, for chrissake! – tackles the drama of human tragedy.
 

ziran

Member
Tab0203 said:
Who conducted the interview? Horrible questions.




Articles/interviews worth reading:

Interview with Super Mario Galaxy composers Koji Kondo and Mahito Yokota
http://www.music4games.net/Features_Display.aspx?id=186

Super Mario Galaxy Audio Journal
http://www.music4games.net/Features_Display.aspx?id=187

Opinion: What Super Mario Galaxy's Rosalina Shows Us About Storytelling
http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=18472

Understanding The Fun of Super Mario Galaxy
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/3522/understanding_the_fun_of_super_.php
Some retard with extra special learning difficulties?

You're right, the questions were so dumbass it's untrue!

But, thanks for the extra articles/interviews, they're really good! I'll add them.
 
ziran said:
Some retard with extra special learning difficulties?

You're right, the questions were so dumbass it's untrue!

The truth is, 1up/EGM is always like that with not only Nintendo games but all Japanese games. Their bias against them is sickening and completely unprofessional. They see their abstractness and wackiness as a bad thing off the bat almost like it's something we have to put up with instead of enjoy.

But of course that's evident when Galaxy scores only an A and GTA and A+ easily.
 

Tab0203

Member
nincompoop said:
... other than the camera approaching Mario 64 levels of incompetence.
Read the 'camera' quote above and stop posting in Galaxy threads.

There are 2 or 3 spots in the game where even I thought "let me rotate the camera!". 2 or 3 OUT OF 200-300 (I have no idea, let's count) planets, objects and whatnot.
What the fuck is wrong with you? Are you a Nintendo-, PS3-, xbox360- or SMS-fanboy? (Ignore the question)
 

Tab0203

Member
Edag Plata said:
...

But of course that's evident when Galaxy scores only an A and GTA and A+ easily.
That was Parish's/Toastyfrog's fault. My guess is he was confused and thought he works for EDGE (pre Halo3)

edit
His complaints were true (a few repeating planets and musical tracks IIRC) but laughable considering they had to come up with 120 "missions". Compare that to the flaws in other 10/10 games...

Mario Galaxy is a 1up/EGM 11 or 12. A+++
 

Flakster99

Member
sp0rsk said:
I had my fiancee get this game the other day and we played together till pretty late in the night (I was on 2p duty). It was interesting because it had been a while since I had seen the game and it blew me away all over again.

It really has the best visuals of any game this gen, in my opinion. The music is still amazing. It still has that impact, it was really awesome. Kinda funny this thread showed up when it did.

I found the 2 player mode was a really easy way of getting my fiancee into the game. She kinda has a Mario phobia so at first she wasn't having much fun, but by the time we were done she was having a great time.

Just brilliant design all around.

Word for word, this is also my response. Mario's stash is quite intimidating with the ladies. ;)

Brilliant design, attention to detail, orgasmic music.
 

itsinmyveins

Gets to pilot the crappy patrol labors
Just sat down and got myself another star (now I've got 86!). Haven't played the game in a long time, and man -- the music and the visuals are really stunning.
 

andthebeatgoeson

Junior Member
ziran said:
No. From your posts here I don't think you're ever a bad person! ;)

But, eventually, one day, do yourself a favour if you have even the slightest inclination this game could be great, and finish it with at least 120 stars. I think you'll love it!

And if you don't enjoy it, remember GAF exists for you to bitch about it, so it's win, win!
Apparently, Nintendo is doing me a favor by not releasing any good games over the next 6 months, so I should be straight.
 
Tab0203 said:
Read the 'camera' quote above and stop posting in Galaxy threads.

There are 2 or 3 spots in the game where even I thought "let me rotate the camera!". 2 or 3 OUT OF 200-300 (I have no idea, let's count) planets, objects and whatnot.
What the fuck is wrong with you? Are you a Nintendo-, PS3-, xbox360- or SMS-fanboy? (Ignore the question)
Well excuse me if I like actually being in control of what's on the screen instead of having to run around at akward angles! They pretty much nailed the camera system with SMS, too bad people like you had to complain because you were too lazy to move the camera every once in a while. No matter how much the 'camera' quote tries to justify it, there's no way to design a "smart" camera system that accounts for every possible situation in a 3D game (unless it has a completely fixed path a la Crash Bandicoot), so fully manual camera controls are necessary for me to get the best experience out of the game. Besides, that was one out of only 2 real complaints I had about an otherwise fantastic game, so why don't you take the stick out of your ass and calm down mmmkay?
 
Farore said:
The lack of love for Melty Molten music disturbs me...
The great thing about Melty Molten is that it fits the level so well!

And if there isn't enough love for this track, it's because there are so many great songs on the soundtrack that you can't list them all at once. :)

My fav is still Buoy Base though. :)
 

Tab0203

Member
nincompoop said:
Well excuse me if I like actually being in control of what's on the screen instead of having to run around at akward angles! They pretty much nailed the camera system with SMS, too bad people like you had to complain because you were too lazy to move the camera every once in a while. No matter how much the 'camera' quote tries to justify it, there's no way to design a "smart" camera system that accounts for every possible situation in a 3D game (unless it has a completely fixed path a la Crash Bandicoot), so fully manual camera controls are necessary for me to get the best experience out of the game. Besides, that was one out of only 2 real complaints I had about an otherwise fantastic game, so why don't you take the stick out of your ass and calm down mmmkay?
e81m3m.gif



I never played Sunshine and you can control the camera in Galaxy "every once in a while". :p
 
Yeah, once every *extremely long* while. Plus you can't adjust the camera height at all.

Mario Sunshine's camera = perfection (as long as you're not behind a ferris wheel, lol). I think I'm gonna play me some right now!
 
I've only collected about 30 stars and I think it's the best Mario game ever but for some reason I never feel like playing it. I pick it up on occasion collect about 5 stars think to myself 'that's great' and then don't play it for another two months. Odd.
 

DrLazy

Member
The game was great. The spherical designs were awesome. The graphics, sound, gameplay, length and everything else were all outstanding. But it wasn't perftect...

The Bad:

The intro. Long, silly and unskippable. A good videogame story interweaves itself into the game, not forcing the player to stop and watch. The begining was so long and boring, I couldn't get some of my friends to sit through it to the point where they actually played the awesome game. The game should have just started where Mario was catching bunnies.

Dizziness - I didn't have a major problem, but it bothered more than one of my friends.

Camera - This one is clearly debatable. I think the camera works great, but I did like the full control of sunshine's better.

The multiplayer - Again this one is debatable, but for me and my friends the little cursor did nothing. It's not even close to comparable to old school multiplayer of Mario Bros 3. I just wish something similar was possible in 3D Mario. If not alternating play, maybe something similar to the old Sonic\Tales system where the camera would just follow Mario with a second player controlling Luigi. I guess this is really nitpicky.
 

Tab0203

Member
nincompoop said:
Yeah, once every *extremely long* while. Plus you can't adjust the camera height at all.

Mario Sunshine's camera = perfection (as long as you're not behind a ferris wheel, lol). I think I'm gonna play me some right now!
You don't get it. Are there spherical objects in Sunshine? Can you walk up/left/right side down? Any 2D sections midway through a 3D level? The same gravity engine?

The camera shows you where to go/not to go, the next planet/object, pull stars, enemies, black holes, 2D etc. Half the jumps in my videos wouldn't be as fun to watch or simply impossible with Sunshines camera system.
Most people would probably throw up and adjust the camera all the time. Not just every once in a while.

You think they never tested Sunshines camera during development? You don't need a second analog stick for full camera control. Pointer + double click C or A+B + bounding box a la MP3/MoH2. Or grab the screen/camera similar to Boom Blox or the weather channel globe.
 
Tab0203 said:
The camera shows you where to go/not to go, the next planet, pull stars, enemies, black holes etc. Half the jumps in my videos wouldn't be as fun to watch or simply impossible with Sunshines camera system.
The jumps in your videos only represent a small part of the game. Almost every level has instances where you have to inspect open areas to figure out what you have to do next, or collect 5 pieces of star poop or whatever, and these areas are begging for full camera control. I didn't have much of a problem with the camera outside of these areas, but there's no reason that they couldn't have given us the option to fiddle with the camera when we wanted, and just snapped the camera back to the default view after we recentered it or something.
You think they never tested Sunshines camera during development?
I doubt it, considering how many people complained about having to move the camera in Sunshine.

By the way, I wasn't implying that they could have just lifted the camera from Sunshine and had it work just as well in Galaxy, just that the camera in Galaxy would have been better if they gave you more control over it and that Sunshine was an example of how having full camera control could work well in these types of games.
 

stuminus3

Member
nincompoop said:
Almost every level has instances where you have to inspect open areas to figure out what you have to do next, or collect 5 pieces of star poop or whatever, and these areas are begging for full camera control.
There isn't one single point in the whole game where you need anything like that. Not one.
 

PantherLotus

Professional Schmuck
I've somehow wandered into an angst-ridden discussion on the merit's of one of the finest games ever made and its camera system. Not that it's not a worthy discussion, but it seems a bit nit-picky to me.

If anything, I'd be bitching that we can't buy extra levels on WiiWare yet. I'm sure there'd be a market for user-created Galaxies. You'd have to buy the Galaxy Level Creator Kit, of course (1000 points). You could share them and send them into Nintendo's very own contest channel, much better (and more relevant) than the dumbass mii contest channel.

Actually, Nintendo should do this for every single one of their games:

1. Sell Game (peripheral for extra moneh, duh)
2. Sell Level Editor (for extra moneh, duh)
3. Provide Custom-Level-Submission Channel
4. ???
5. Profit.
 

Tab0203

Member
nincompoop said:
... I didn't have much of a problem with the camera outside of these areas, but there's no reason that they couldn't have given us the option to fiddle with the camera when we wanted, and just snapped the camera back to the default view after we recentered it or something.
Ahh, much better without hyperbole. And "snap the camera back to default view" is a good idea.


PantherLotus said:
I've somehow wandered into an angst-ridden discussion on the merit's of one of the finest games ever made and its camera system. Not that it's not a worthy discussion, but it seems a bit nit-picky to me.

If anything, I'd be bitching that we can't buy extra levels on WiiWare yet.
I couldn't agree more.
 

PantherLotus

Professional Schmuck
Tab0203 said:
I couldn't agree more.

To be clear, I acknowledge that there are moments when the camera was frustrating in SMG, but only in the same way that Angelina Jolie's nipples are uneven and Scarlett Johannsen sometimes has morning breath. I mean, really.
 
stuminus3 said:
There isn't one single point in the whole game where you need anything like that. Not one.
Umm... yeah there were. In almost every single galaxy. Granted, they weren't large open areas, but they still had to be explored in a non-linear fashion, which is something the camera wasn't suited for.

The worst offenders were Honeyhive galaxy (especially during the purple coin mission) and pretty much any underwater level (Beach Bowl is the first one to come to mind).
 

chuckddd

Fear of a GAF Planet
My favorite part of the Melty Molten levels was having Mario jump in the lava and go "OOOH OOOOH ACK ACK ACK ACK!!!" And, of course, trying to control his pants on fire jump without laughing so hard that I dropped the controllers.

I ordered the original soundtrack from Play-Asia and have had the CD in my truck ever since. I'm definitely replaying this game in it's entirety the next time I have a gaming lull.
 
just went back to this earlier tonight after a few hours of re4 wii


man, fuck luigi's purple coins. i'm only glad the developers had the foresight to put in like 50% more than you actually need-- i wouldn't have been able to finish it otherwise

not that i don't have skills, but i'm less likely to dedicate my time to memorizing a game these days than when i was in 6th grade
 
Pseudo_Sam said:
Que? Good Egg Galaxy was one of my favorites, and it's the very first one. Considering how quickly Battlerock is reached too, I'd say the game has a very even distribution of awesome.

Good Egg had a few, erm, good moments, sure. But the levels were chunked and segmented to an insane degree. There were so many launch stars in Good Egg that it almost felt like I wasn't playing a game. You start on one sphere, collect 5 star pieces, or stomp an enemy or something, and then the launch star appears to take you to the next sphere. Very very passive player dynamic.

Battlerock got a bit better, but it was still rife with those automatic movement tracks that just...removed any sort of meaningful human interaction.

My favorite parts in Galaxy were the 2D gravity levels, no doubt. The consistent, direct interaction/control was wonderful, and it felt like I was playing a Mario game.

But in other areas, when I'm just basically looking for the next launch star/automated track...meh.

What was amazing about SMB3 wasn't the fact that there were bite-sized chunks of levels. It was that there was no wasted space in those chunks of levels. Apart from the rare moving platform (1-4), you were never a passive observer in SMB3.
 

Tab0203

Member
Number 7 was a bit rushed, but this one turned out pretty good. 2 hours of playing/filming and 4 hours of editing/finding the right tracks.

What a game.

Super Mario Galaxy - Jump Compilation 8
press watch in high quality

Music:
Battle for the Grand Star
King Bone
Peach's Castle is Stolen
Megaleg
Ice Mountain
Lava Road
Egg Planet

jsk0p2.png


otndbm.png


f3i4n8.png
 

soldat7

Member
Wow what a game. I played for about an hour the other night.

Sucks that I have to tuck it away now until Christmas. :(
 

TomServo

Junior Member
Nabs said:
put it back in and was wowed again. the bedroom has some really nice levels in it

I'm still playing through for the first time, at around 80 stars in the garden. The game is a freaking masterpiece, everything is just so intuitive.

It's taking me a long time, I know, but I ruined Mario64 by forcing myself through that game quickly, and forcing myself to get all the coins. I still get pissed when I hear the words "Tick Tock Clock".
 

Ranger X

Member
I love love this game. Best Wii game hands down.

I just don't understand the amount of praise the camera gets though. I mean, it's well done but there's a catch. What's hard when you program a camera is how it will react to obejcts and walls. In Mario Galaxy the camera is always "around" some bunch of objects, around planets. It's like the game was designed to make it easy for the camera. I don't see what's exceptional about the camera itself, the design of the game is all mighty more impressive.
 

y2dvd

Member
PantherLotus said:
If anything, I'd be bitching that we can't buy extra levels on WiiWare yet. I'm sure there'd be a market for user-created Galaxies. You'd have to buy the Galaxy Level Creator Kit, of course (1000 points). You could share them and send them into Nintendo's very own contest channel, much better (and more relevant) than the dumbass mii contest channel.

Hint Nintendo!
 

PedroRVD

Member
the art in this game is so fantastic, that EVERY picture you have shown here DESERVES to be a poster.

I cant think of any game else that has made me think that.

Game of all the generations. Past, Present...and Future.
 

birdchili

Member
Ranger X said:
It's like the game was designed to make it easy for the camera.
it absolutely was, and it works (well... mostly). this kind of thing is a long-standing game design technique, of course.

naturally, not all games are going to be able to be set up this way, and i still think that the d-pad is generally inferior to a second analog for camera stuff, which hurts lots of existing game designs.

i need to play some more of this... it'll mellow out my current anger at zack and wiki:)
 

NeonZ

Member
The intro. Long, silly and unskippable. A good videogame story interweaves itself into the game, not forcing the player to stop and watch. The begining was so long and boring, I couldn't get some of my friends to sit through it to the point where they actually played the awesome game. The game should have just started where Mario was catching bunnies.

What? I thought that when people complained about the intro, they were talking about the long and pointless bunny catching section.
 
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