• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Traditional handhelds in permanent decline says Rob Fahey from Gamesindustry.biz

Loonz

Member
perryfarrell said:
Totally agree with the article. Nintendo & Sony's handheld business is in the process of being murdered by the mobile phone market.

One point that I haven't seen made yet, is that Nintendo and Sony aren't just competing with mobile phones in terms of features (iPhone wins), game pricing (iPhone wins), customer base (iPhone wins), they're also competing for developers.

If you have a team of talented people with the goal of crankin out a third-party game on a mobile platform, what are you going to choose? A traditional, closed, mostly cartridge-based, game market for a mobile console on life support, with fees and slow approval processes? Or the new, open, digital download, mobile phone game market that is vibrant and can only get bigger? Many third parties will obviously choose the second option.

I agree, specially with the bolded part. I have (and love) a 3DS, but I can't see it competing in the future with platforms that hold everyone's interest, from the general public to the developer side of things. Can gaming handhelds remain competitive when plenty of people have, apparently, advanced to other platforms and interests?.

Someone said before (I don't know whether it was in this thread or another one, sorry) that next gen portable consoles could have a better shot at the market by creating synergy with smartphones, by being cheap smartphone-friendly devices, and having eshops with cheap content equivalent to those of android or iOS. Well, I think that kind of device may have future. Perhaps.
 

hsukardi

Member
Those of you thinking that price of games on iOS are going to stay this low for the long term future are in for a big booyah
 

Mikor

Member
hsukardi said:
Those of you thinking that price of games on iOS are going to stay this low for the long term future are in for a big booyah

I think not. Just look earlier in the thread, where people made the argument that people are playing iOS and Android games solely based on price. This isn't an issue of supply and demand - the prices will only go down. If I had some pretty graphs to show you to illustrate my point, I would, but alas.

The smartphone/multifunction portable device owners who use those devices as their exclusive game platforms will not pay much more than what their games are priced at now, and the trends support this argument.

If you are talking in terms of multiple years, the major players in the dedicated markets will react and adapt accordingly before a high-price mobile app/game trend sets in.
 
Why do these articles keep being written anyway? If they say it enough it will become true? Seems like market manipulation to me.

Are there any good cell phone games that are not ports of successful one or that don't reuse assets? If handheld devices die off like some people hope, you are kidding yourself if you expect the price to stay as they are. You will also lose out on the potential to sell or buy used since cell phone games are all digital.
 

M3d10n

Member
hsukardi said:
Those of you thinking that price of games on iOS are going to stay this low for the long term future are in for a big booyah
Yes, they're all going to be free with micropayments. That's where investor money is going right now.
 
Let's see how it all plays out before making definitive statements.

I can definitely see it happening though. Very easily. Methinks that's part of the reason Nintendo dropped $80 off of the 3DS price. Floundering in the purely handheld space is one thing, but now cell phones are fighting for that same gaming dollar, and they are being very aggressive about it.
 

rpmurphy

Member
orioto said:
With the market evolving so much and the war between apple and consoles so intensive, i wonder...
I know that Apple won't ever release a new iphone with buttons, but but but, could they release a "gamer" sku of the iphone ala xperia ? That would probably sell gigatons and wouldn't hurt the casual customers.
They should, but it would come at a cost of fragmenting their market. When Monster Hunter is like this on the iPhone, that's a sign that touchscreen-only gaming cannot be the future of portable gaming.
 

Famassu

Member
hsukardi said:
Those of you thinking that price of games on iOS are going to stay this low for the long term future are in for a big booyah
Most smartphone gamers don't pay for their games (especially on Android devices) or wait for those 0.99-1.99$ sales. As the prices go up, the number of people who buy those games diminishes drastically. While 5-10$ games might get more common and more people might actually start paying for them, I don't see the next step (15-20$) - which would probably be required to get some bigger budget non-downport exclusive games to smartphones - becoming too much more common or that popular with smartphone gamers. I mean, 10$-15 is the limit for a lot of people for much bigger (& better) downloadable PS360 games (some don't even like to pay much more than that for retail games), what makes you think smartphone owners would pay those kind of prices?
 

Princess Skittles

Prince's's 'Skittle's
DeliciousDoc said:
Why do these articles keep being written anyway? If they say it enough it will become true?
Pretty much.

DeliciousDoc said:
Are there any good cell phone games that are not ports of successful one or that don't reuse assets?
Of course there are. Are there any with the depth/scope of really great DS/PSP games? Not so much.
 

Tobor

Member
lunchwithyuzo said:
Not for a $10-20 pricepoint. Which is sort of the point.

iOS advocates shouldn't want the platform killing dedicated gaming handhelds. iOS benefits directly from cheaper ports from these machines (like FF3 or CivRev), which as ground up iOS projects just wouldn't have happened due to the finances involved.
How can this be treated as such a certainty when no one has tried?

A $20 original game from a traditional developer isn't out of the question. Somebody will crack that nut.
 

commish

Jason Kidd murdered my dog in cold blood!
M3d10n said:
I don't know about TWEWY, but there is an interview with the GTA Chinatow Wars devs which state that the iOS port revenue wasn't enough to fund an iOS-exclusive game with the same budget as the original.

Moreover, the "casual" iOS public is shunning away from paid games altogether. It's all F2P now.

But that's a bit misleading. For one, the game was already old and was already released on other platforms. Anyone who played it before probably isn't going to buy it again. Second, if you make an iOS game from scratch, you wouldn't need the same budget as a PSP/DS game from scratch. And F2P is just another example of how devs can monetize their games in ways that they can't with a PSP/DS. That's why companies like Zynga are worth more than traditional game companies already.

The winds are shifting, friends, whether you want them to or not. Say what you will, it's undeniable that iOS develop is increasing while dedicated handheld sales and development are decreasing.
 

diffusionx

Gold Member
Tobor said:
How can this be treated as such a certainty when no one has tried?

A $20 original game from a traditional developer isn't out of the question. Somebody will crack that nut.

They kind of did try. When the iPad came out, a lot of games were in the $10-$15 range. Now, they are priced at about the same level as iPhone. I just don't think anybody is going to pay $20 for an iOS game. As Nintendo has pointed out, people just don't see games on the platform as being worth that much.

commish said:
Second, if you make an iOS game from scratch, you wouldn't need the same budget as a PSP/DS game from scratch.

You wouldn't? I think a Chinatown Wars on iOS from scratch would probably cost the same if not more as the DS version to make. iOS hardware is a fair bit nicer than the DS.
 
Tobor said:
How can this be treated as such a certainty when no one has tried?

A $20 original game from a traditional developer isn't out of the question. Somebody will crack that nut.
I thought that's what Chaos Rings was? And while a sure success, it didn't even begin to approach the sales or revenue of more content rich DS and PSP games from SE.
 

Famassu

Member
commish said:
Second, if you make an iOS game from scratch, you wouldn't need the same budget as a PSP/DS game from scratch.
If the iOS games want to be comparable to (the best) PSP & DS games in how much content they have and how good they sound & look, they will have to have similar budgets. And that's the point, with the pricepoints that iPhone games are sold, they can't afford that, thus leading to inferior games with crappy controls.

And F2P is just another example of how devs can monetize their games in ways that they can't with a PSP/DS.
Yeah, and those games are crap like FarmVille and Angry Birds. You won't be seeing F2P Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker 2. Ever. You just don't make games like that with F2P budgets.
 
See, I just don't see there being too many "deep" games coming to mobile phones or the like. I think most will be casual, so the handhelds will still be quite relevant for some nice, lengthy games.
 

Lothars

Member
commish said:
The winds are shifting, friends, whether you want them to or not. Say what you will, it's undeniable that iOS develop is increasing while dedicated handheld sales and development are decreasing.
The winds may be shifting but will it be permanent? Nope dedicated Handheld will always be around and have games made for them, Mobile Gaming is here to stay but the games that will be made for it are gonna be more bit size experiences, they will be smaller games because I don't believe bigger budgets are sustainable in the mobile game market.

Famassu said:
If the iOS games wants to be comparable to PSP & DS games in how much content they have and how good they sound & look, they will have to have similar budgets. And that's the point, with the pricepoints that iPhone games are sold, they can't afford that, thus leading to inferior games with crappy controls.


Yeah, and those games are crap like FarmVille and Angry Birds. You won't be seeing F2P Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker 2. Ever. You just don't make games like that with F2P budgets.
Absolutely, the prices of what Iphone games go for is what will keep the games smaller and less deep because if users are only willing to buy games for .99 or f2p, I know that handheld gaming is not going anywhere anytime soon.
 

Ulairi

Banned
Tobor said:
How can this be treated as such a certainty when no one has tried?

A $20 original game from a traditional developer isn't out of the question. Somebody will crack that nut.

They haven't yet. iOS gaming is a race to the bottom and we're not going to see a game like Dragon Quest IX released on iOS before the PSP Vita or 3DS. We may see them ported to iOS after the developer has made its money and is just looking for additional revenue streams but we won't see it day and date or iOS first.
 

Aaron

Member
Lothars said:
The winds may be shifting but will it be permanent? Nope dedicated Handheld will always be around and have games made for them, Mobile Gaming is here to stay but the games that will be made for it are gonna be more bit size experiences, they will be smaller games because I don't believe bigger budgets are sustainable in the mobile game market.
People need to stop repeating the lie that all ios games are shallow $1 experiences lacking content. There are a number of ports of full handheld games, even some downloadable games like Guardian of Light. There are few dedicated robust experiences, but just like console exclusives there doesn't have to be. If people can play the same Puzzle Quest 2 on their phone that's on the DS, do they need a DS? Well yeah if they still want the Nintendo stuff, but people who don't feel the need for exclusives might find dedicated handhelds redundant.

The ios market is still very much in flux. Once things settle in a year or so there will be a market for higher priced games, and that will draw in larger developers and bigger projects.
 

Mikor

Member
commish said:
But that's a bit misleading. For one, the game was already old and was already released on other platforms. Anyone who played it before probably isn't going to buy it again. Second, if you make an iOS game from scratch, you wouldn't need the same budget as a PSP/DS game from scratch. And F2P is just another example of how devs can monetize their games in ways that they can't with a PSP/DS. That's why companies like Zynga are worth more than traditional game companies already.

The winds are shifting, friends, whether you want them to or not. Say what you will, it's undeniable that iOS develop is increasing while dedicated handheld sales and development are decreasing.

I'm not sure anyone is really equating the decline of dedicated handheld development to the absolute downfall of the dedicated handheld market. It is merely destined to become like many other niche markets. We may not have weekly releases, and far less developers, but what is released will be of the quality and content expected of a release targeted towards enthusiast gamers.

This is, in no way, a bad thing.
 

Tobor

Member
lunchwithyuzo said:
I thought that's what Chaos Rings was? And while a sure success, it didn't even begin to approach the sales or revenue of more content rich DS and PSP games from SE.
Chaos Rings was a good start, but it was more like dipping their feet in the pool.
 

Ulairi

Banned
Aaron said:
People need to stop repeating the lie that all ios games are shallow $1 experiences lacking content. There are a number of ports of full handheld games, even some downloadable games like Guardian of Light. There are few dedicated robust experiences, but just like console exclusives there doesn't have to be. If people can play the same Puzzle Quest 2 on their phone that's on the DS, do they need a DS? Well yeah if they still want the Nintendo stuff, but people who don't feel the need for exclusives might find dedicated handhelds redundant.

The ios market is still very much in flux. Once things settle in a year or so there will be a market for higher priced games, and that will draw in larger developers and bigger projects.

It's not a lie. It's factual. Pointing out that iOS is getting ports of year old games developed on the DS or PSP isn't a good argument for the robustness of iOS gaming. And, games like Guardian of Light is only good when you have the criteria that it must be an iOS game first. iOS gaming is designed for people that view gaming on a handheld or portable device as something disposable and without much value. If you just want to waste a few minutes here and there. If that is your view that's fine but it's not mine.
 
Zapdos1121 said:
See, I just don't see there being too many "deep" games coming to mobile phones or the like. I think most will be casual

Brb, have to beat my high score on the latest Cave shmup on iOs ($10). Games don't come much more hardcore than that.

Of course most games on the iOs are simple, casual experiences. That's because it's so ridiculously easy to develop for (and because there's somewhat of an expectation that the games are cheap).
 

Lothars

Member
Aaron said:
People need to stop repeating the lie that all ios games are shallow $1 experiences lacking content. There are a number of ports of full handheld games, even some downloadable games like Guardian of Light. There are few dedicated robust experiences, but just like console exclusives there doesn't have to be. If people can play the same Puzzle Quest 2 on their phone that's on the DS, do they need a DS? Well yeah if they still want the Nintendo stuff, but people who don't feel the need for exclusives might find dedicated handhelds redundant.

The ios market is still very much in flux. Once things settle in a year or so there will be a market for higher priced games, and that will draw in larger developers and bigger projects.

Ok not all ios games are shallow but I've played pretty much every major ios game and their are some standouts but the absolutely majority are not worth playing at all.

Also do you think the games that are full game experiences such as Civ Rev, Puzzle Quest 2 or really any of the ports would have been made without the first version being on dedicated handhelds? I doubt they would have been.

Ulairi said:
It's not a lie. It's factual. Pointing out that iOS is getting ports of year old games developed on the DS or PSP isn't a good argument for the robustness of iOS gaming. And, games like Guardian of Light is only good when you have the criteria that it must be an iOS game first. iOS gaming is designed for people that view gaming on a handheld or portable device as something disposable and without much value. If you just want to waste a few minutes here and there. If that is your view that's fine but it's not mine.
That's exactly it.
 
commish said:
The winds are shifting, friends, whether you want them to or not. Say what you will, it's undeniable that iOS develop is increasing while dedicated handheld sales and development are decreasing.

The same was true of the Wii at one point. Now OS is the hot place to try for a cash grab. Trash games killed the Wii market even though there were plenty of worthwhile games in the lineup as well. It'll be interesting to see how it shakes out when the trash is $1-$5 instead of $20-$50.
 

Vinci

Danish
Out of curiosity, could someone post the number of DS systems and iOS devices in the wild, so to speak, and how much revenue each brings from software/apps on their individual userbases?

If we have such information, of course... Don't kill yourselves trying to get it or anything.
 

Rubicon

Neo Member
Aaron said:
People need to stop repeating the lie that all ios games are shallow $1 experiences lacking content. There are a number of ports of full handheld games, even some downloadable games like Guardian of Light. There are few dedicated robust experiences, but just like console exclusives there doesn't have to be. If people can play the same Puzzle Quest 2 on their phone that's on the DS, do they need a DS? Well yeah if they still want the Nintendo stuff, but people who don't feel the need for exclusives might find dedicated handhelds redundant.

The ios market is still very much in flux. Once things settle in a year or so there will be a market for higher priced games, and that will draw in larger developers and bigger projects.
Total agreement. Guys that think the AppStore is full of one dollar rubbish clearly don't look long enough, because there's plenty of one dollar excellence also.

The DS is such a pita to develop on, whereas you can write an iPhone game on your PC if you really want to. (Yes, you have to go via a mac in the end, but that's what we do - go via a mac in the end). Almost all of my working day is spent using dev studio 2008 writing iOS and Android games. Having written some commercial DS stuff in the past, it's like night and day - way more productive.

I can speak from experience too. Check out my Great Little War Game (A free lite version is available). I wouldn't dare be arrogant enough to say this is better than Advance Wars, but what I will do is compare content. There's a similar number of levels, similar number of units, similar things to do, etc., and ours is in 3D. In short it's a reasonable comparison from a pure developer resource/content creation angle. It's already made us a small profit and it retails for 3 bucks, which makes it perfectly viable as a business proposition also.

There are plenty of other top notch games on the AppStore that only cost a few bucks too - stacks of them in fact. When I look at the price of a DS game in a shop now, it makes me cringe tbh. I'm never spending that much on one game ever again.
 

Ulairi

Banned
Vinci said:
Out of curiosity, could someone post the number of DS systems and iOS devices in the wild, so to speak, and how much revenue each brings from software/apps on their individual userbases?

If we have such information, of course... Don't kill yourselves trying to get it or anything.

It's really not there. We don't have enough data to say very much. All we have is a narrative that simplistic games journalists like to write to because they then don't actually have to think critically and express any knowledge. You also have a lot of western journalists that never took handheld gaming seriously. They just didn't. So for them, iOS portable gaming is all they know and because they were not that interested in the PSP and DS and never experienced the vast catalog of brilliant games they just continue to ignorant. If I'm a writer that neer played much on the DS or PSP but I do own an iPhone and because I don't view handheld gaming as something of value, the iOS device is fantastic. But, if you ever spent any real time playing the great PSP and DS games then you cannot make the mental gymnastics needed to believe the stuff being written like the linked article above.
 
SonicX_Zero said:
Agreed, the sample size and experience speaks for itself that dedicated handhelds are indeed dying.

I disagree. While the paradigm *is* shifting, it's not the death of the entire handheld industry. It's new competition. And that's not a bad thing. It's forcing Nintendo to steps its game up.

But there will always be a market for portable gaming with more "meat" than cutting rope, throwing birds and ports of ten year old games.

The only difference is Nintendo and Sony might not be able to get away with such a rigid pricing structure. Selling Pilotwings for 40 bucks isn't a good look.
 

Ulairi

Banned
Rubicon said:
Total agreement. Guys that think the AppStore is full of one dollar rubbish clearly don't look long enough, because there's plenty of one dollar excellence also.

The DS is such a pita to develop on, whereas you can write an iPhone game on your PC if you really want to. (Yes, you have to go via a mac in the end, but that's what we do - go via a mac in the end). Almost all of my working day is spent using dev studio 2008 writing iOS and Android games. Having written some commercial DS stuff in the past, it's like night and day - way more productive.

I can speak from experience too. Check out my Great Little War Game (A free lite version is available). I wouldn't dare be arrogant enough to say this is better than Advance Wars, but what I will do is compare content. There's a similar number of levels, similar number of units, similar things to do, etc., and ours is in 3D. In short it's a reasonable comparison from a pure developer resource/content creation angle. It's already made us a small profit and it retails for 3 bucks, which makes it perfectly viable as a business proposition also.

There are plenty of other top notch games on the AppStore that only cost a few bucks too - stacks of them in fact. When I look at the price of a DS game in a shop now, it makes me cringe tbh. I'm never spending that much on one game ever again.

I know Advanced Wars. Advanced Wars is a friend of mine, your name is no Advanced Wars.
 
Rubicon said:
Total agreement. Guys that think the AppStore is full of one dollar rubbish clearly don't look long enough, because there's plenty of one dollar excellence also.

The DS is such a pita to develop on, whereas you can write an iPhone game on your PC if you really want to. (Yes, you have to go via a mac in the end, but that's what we do - go via a mac in the end). Almost all of my working day is spent using dev studio 2008 writing iOS and Android games. Having written some commercial DS stuff in the past, it's like night and day - way more productive.

I can speak from experience too. Check out my Great Little War Game (A free lite version is available). I wouldn't dare be arrogant enough to say this is better than Advance Wars, but what I will do is compare content. There's a similar number of levels, similar number of units, similar things to do, etc., and ours is in 3D. In short it's a reasonable comparison from a pure developer resource/content creation angle. It's already made us a small profit and it retails for 3 bucks, which makes it perfectly viable as a business proposition also.

There are plenty of other top notch games on the AppStore that only cost a few bucks too - stacks of them in fact. When I look at the price of a DS game in a shop now, it makes me cringe tbh. I'm never spending that much on one game ever again.

Are you speaking exclusively from a handheld perspective?
 

Tobor

Member
Vinci said:
Out of curiosity, could someone post the number of DS systems and iOS devices in the wild, so to speak, and how much revenue each brings from software/apps on their individual userbases?

If we have such information, of course... Don't kill yourselves trying to get it or anything.
I cant speak to DS numbers, but there have been over 200 million iOS devices sold since 2007.
 

clashfan

Member
Nintendo should make a android phone like the droid. Instead of slide out keyboard it would have d-pad and face buttons. I would buy this.
 

Aaron

Member
Lothars said:
Ok not all ios games are shallow but I've played pretty much every major ios game and their are some standouts but the absolutely majority are not worth playing at all.

Also do you think the games that are full game experiences such as Civ Rev, Puzzle Quest 2 or really any of the ports would have been made without the first version being on dedicated handhelds? I doubt they would have been.
Because that's how the handheld market was when those games were released. Wii had the same problem, and still does if you go solely by games released in the US. The ios market can support larger experiences, and does have a few like Aralon and Rimelands, the market/developer perception is it can only be dollar apps/waggle fests.

That can change, but it depends on Apple. People are basically stupid. They'll buy what's put in front of them. Games that are on the featured page, especially those under the 20meg download limit, sell like crazy. That download limit doesn't need to be there. Apple can also divide the marketplace for higher quality games, the way there's a separation on xbox live for indie/xbla/games on demand.

I should add I don't think dedicated handhelds are going anywhere. I'm not even convinced their market is shrinking. It's the overall mobile gaming market that's expanding.
Market perception isn't locked in stone. It can be changed. There are plenty of ios apps that cost way more than $1, and they have no problem selling because they fill a particular need. Millions of people own ipads alone, and millions more have iphones/ipods. Not all of them want to play Farmville.
 

Ulairi

Banned
Mammoth Jones said:
I disagree. While the paradigm *is* shifting, it's not the death of the entire handheld industry. It's new competition. And that's not a bad thing. It's forcing Nintendo to steps its game up.

But there will always be a market for portable gaming with more "meat" than cutting rope, throwing birds and ports of ten year old games.

The only difference is Nintendo and Sony might not be able to get away with such a rigid pricing structure. Selling Pilotwings for 40 bucks isn't a good look.

You're exactly write. I would think more journalists would be writing that the traditional retail paradigm must change for traditional handheld gaming. Pilot Wings is a fantastic game for $10 but its value goes down at $35. That was a big mistake that Nintendo made with the 3DS. The eshop should have been available at launch and with games like Pilot Wings
 

Vinci

Danish
Tobor said:
I cant speak to DS numbers, but there have been over 200 million iOS devices sold since 2007.

And how much revenue has been generated via app purchases?

EDIT: I'm trying to determine how much revenue is being generated by the iOS market and how much has been generated in the DS market. If the revenue produced by the iOS market is smaller than the DS market's, or just comparable, then I don't see any reason to fully abandon dedicated portable machines. At least it wouldn't be for handheld developers.
 
So I wanted to do images for the US market like I did for the Japanese market. However, thanks to less NPD data showing up, I've got a lot more DS/PSP gaps in the last year. So what I did was assume any of the missing months was 20% down from the previous year. This does make the last year potentially quite inaccurate. But it shows that even on the low part of the cycle, the hardware market is still about where it was when DS Lite came out.

The early parts are definitely too small: I don't have GBC info, and I'm sure it wasn't selling nothing during GBA's early days.

Monthly, starting from GBA launch:
20110802usportablesmonthly.png


Rolling yearly, starting from a year after GBA launch:
20110802usportablesrollingyear.png
 
Famassu said:
Most smartphone gamers don't pay for their games (especially on Android devices) or wait for those 0.99-1.99$ sales. As the prices go up, the number of people who buy those games diminishes drastically. While 5-10$ games might get more common and more people might actually start paying for them, I don't see the next step (15-20$) - which would probably be required to get some bigger budget non-downport exclusive games to smartphones - becoming too much more common or that popular with smartphone gamers. I mean, 10$-15 is the limit for a lot of people for much bigger (& better) downloadable PS360 games (some don't even like to pay much more than that for retail games), what makes you think smartphone owners would pay those kind of prices?

This is probably correct, which worries me. iDevice/Android gaming is popular due to the convergence of convenience, tech, and price point. Upset that balance, and I can totally see the landscape changing. I just made this post in the iPhone/iPad thread in response to the newly released FREE Battlehearts, Bumpy Road, and Sword and Sorcery content:

Cromulent_Word said:
I personally think that there's too much focus in the iOS market on heartlessly milking cash out of consumers, rather than respecting them and generating good will through mutual support like you see (indie) dev's doing on Steam, and to an extent on XBLA & PSN. The rad dudes at Simogo have been pumping out HUGE free updates for Bumpy Road because they want their supporters to continue to support. It's good business via being cool, rather than good business via business-first approaches. Anywho, i could blabber on about this, but in the end i think theres real business/financial reasons for studios like Capy/Superbrothers to look out for supporters first.

Sure, there was a chance #Sworcery could have charted a bit higher... but the only way to do that was to give the middle finger to the same people that supported us from day one.

I'm so torn on this subject. As a consumer, I totally respect the service of free updates in order to garner strong relationships. However, this is an age old debate (which is the same with XBL and PSN DLC). I recently sent message to the Battlehearts guys that I would've gladly handed over a dollar for the additional two character classes and balancing done with the most recent update. I can't think of too many Battleheart fans that would not. Had the update come during the game's most hyped period, I believe that the cash-for-content follow-through would'v been much higher.

If developers give me a complete game and I pay for it, I'm fine. Every bit of additional content really is icing on the cake and deserves monetary compensation. It's a trickier situation with something like, say, Ultimate Marvel vs Capcom 3 because who knows if specific characters were purposely withheld just to milk the audience into a second purchase.

Games like Sword and Sworcery, Bumpy Road, and Battlehearts appear to be complete and confined experiences that are already priced at damn near give-away values. Therefore, I always feel guilty whenever these devs choose to give away content - especially when they don't need to.

As for more selfish considerations, there's an understanding and agreement between consumer and producer that with monetary exchange comes expectation. When developers charge for content, our dollars say that we want more, and our monies fund that development. When devs give away stuff for free, you can only say thank you and take what you can get, when you can get it.

These dirt-cheap, but increasingly richer experiences, have to be subsidized somehow. Hypothetically, isn't the alternative twenty dollar point of entry on iDevice/Android gaming, or even worse, even crazier FREEMIUM models where we're headed? I fear that if content is continually given away for free, and/or repeatedly dropped to 1 or 2 bucks, not only is the expectation that quality games should COMPETE to be as gutter cheap as possible, it removes our (the consumer) obligation to support quality product when it hits the appstore instead of waiting for the discounts.

I'm just worried that this ecosystem - as much as I love it - will be short lived if consumers are continually spoiled by higher quality games being forced into lower price ranges while the EXPECTATION of FREE continues. There's a heated debate in this other GAF thread about the legitimacy of 40.00 games on traditional handheld gaming platforms.
Currently, iDevice/Android gaming has hit this incredible sweet spot with impulse buy pricing. Higher tier HD titles usually fall under ten bucks with the rare Japanese exceptions going for just under 15. iPhone retina versions are usually about 50% less. When holiday sales hit, hot games plummet briefly to giveaway dollar deals.

My biggest fear is that gamers will begin to condition themselves to wait for holiday sales. The cost of entry is already so darn cheap on so many good games (COMPANIONS is only 6.99 and it's such full game!), that I worry that this behavior pattern of free for the sake of fostering goodwill, as well as indistinguishable pricing between crap 99 cent games and GREAT games, will not only kill incentive for developers, but bring the whole house of cards falling in.


What do Devs think, or am i worrying about nothing?
 

magash

Member
Vinci said:
And how much revenue has been generated via app purchases?

EDIT: I'm trying to determine how much revenue is being generated by the iOS market and how much has been generated in the DS market. If the revenue produced by the iOS market is smaller than the DS market's, or just comparable, then I don't see any reason to fully abandon dedicated portable machines. At least it wouldn't be for handheld developers.

The revenue generated by the IOS market is laughably and pathetically smaller than that of the DS. I remember during the unveiling of the Ipad2 Steve Jobs pointed that they have been able to pay out $2 billion to devs in like 3+ years
 
Mikor said:
I'm not sure anyone is really equating the decline of dedicated handheld development to the absolute downfall of the dedicated handheld market. It is merely destined to become like many other niche markets. We may not have weekly releases, and far less developers, but what is released will be of the quality and content expected of a release targeted towards enthusiast gamers.

This is, in no way, a bad thing.
This, exactly.

If the market becomes only iOS/Android, which it won't, I'm bailing out.
 
Top Bottom