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[SupremeHoodie]

You are quite confused about 1440p support. PS5 renders games at 1440p as well, but it upscales it to output at 4k. So if a developer wants to develop a game around 1440p, there's no problem at all.
You just can't select 1440p from the settings screen to output at that resolution.

That’s garbage.

 

[ethomaz]

Halo, Hellblade, Everwild, Fable, Gears, Forza, Fallout, Elder Scrolls, Doom, Wolfenstein, etc.

Xbox fans can play 'our exclusives' too. What's your point?

Both consoles are solid af, and I say that as a PC player who will likely snag a Series X down the road, but has no interest in one at launch.

You mean Xbox can play the promise of exclusives... because none of these exclusives happened yet.

 

[teezzy]

Coolwhhip S0ULZB0URNE

Where they stand in development currently is irrelevant as far as I'm concerned. The games are coming. As for Bethesda and Id, you don't drop $7.5 billion to not have those titles exclusive to your ecosystem.

An ecosystem (and controller) which I prefer overall.

SkankHunt420 My gaming time is limited, and I already have too much to play. I snag a console for local multiplayer of fighting and sports games to play in the living room with friends. GamePass and hopefully local Halo multiplayer is the gravy on top. I already have some XB1 pads, and I'm happy that Series X will support them. Also BC.

 

[Redlight]

Best place to play multiplatform games they said.

Plays best on they said.

The lesson is to shut your trap until you're actually delivering. Let the results speak for themselves.

It's launch. You may have gone a little early yourself.

 

[bitbydeath]

Everything is to the metal now, Vulkan and DirectX 12 has essentially evaporated that console superiority narrative. Like for like console and PC hardware end up performing nigh identically when evenly matched.

Nah. PC API’s aren’t hardware specific. They’re broad and that’s how they have to remain in order to support so many variants.

 

[Redlight]

It's not the need to be out in front, it's the fact that with a little bit of time it will be. This has me worried for you people because you're partially winning a few battles with some release titles and siking yourselves up prematurely believing that this is going to be the normal state of affairs.

You have all the information and forewarning in the world for why this is happening, you know it's temporary, I know it's temporary, every here knows it's temporary, but just to dig that knife into us a bit you're claiming some kind of victory which will inevitably fall flat and embarrass all of you.

Worst part is you'll be all confused and act like you didn't see it coming. I'll make sure to remind you, constantly.

DC, sadly it just doesn't work like that.

sircaw and his band of usual suspects will be up in everyone's face every single time that a game doesn't show a massive difference. Then, if the situation changes to Xbox being consistently better, they will pivot to 'Sony first-party', 'faster loading', 'Tempest' or some other marketing catch-phrase. If they get desperate enough the fact that the console is bigger will become it's defining feature. We've seen it before, it's a pattern.

There will never be a realisation or admission of anything MS positive from these guys. It's like a religion with them.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

But last gens best looking games were on the Pro just like thus far this gens best looking games are on the PS5

That's not true, there are several third party titles which rival or exceed Sony's efforts. That mostly comes down to time invested and artistic talent, not the hardware. Regardless of capability incredibly talented people can produce beautiful things.

 

[brownfedora]

We heard these same things from Microsoft about immature tools at the launch of XBONE. It all turned out to be BS.

It will be the same this time around.

 

[ethomaz]

DC, sadly it just doesn't work like that.

sircaw and his band of usual suspects will be up in everyone's face every single time that a game doesn't show a massive difference. Then, if the situation changes to Xbox being consistently better, they will pivot to 'Sony first-party', 'faster loading', 'Tempest' or some other marketing catch-phrase. If they get desperate enough the fact that the console is bigger will become it's defining feature. We've seen it before, it's a pattern.

There will never be a realisation or admission of anything MS positive from these guys. It's like a religion with them.

Blame random posters on forum.
Not the actual party behind the console lol

 

[onQ123]

So PS5 is holding a better frame rate all while having more smoke effects coming from the guns?

 

[M_A_C]

It's just tools, also your pixel fill rates are limited by your texel rates because guess what, everything has textures. You could have double the pixel rate but if you can't fill the texture data you have nothing to render, so that's a completely irrelevant point.

This is the same issue the PS4 Pro faced, it had higher pixel fill rates than the One X, but its texel capability was starkly less.

This is actually Tim Heidecker joking with us right?

 

[Shmunter]

So PS5 is holding a better frame rate all while having more smoke effects coming from the guns?

Xbox has more smoke effects coming from it's internal fan. This round is a draw.

 

[Cato]

They waitied until RDNA 2 was feature complete to build their system, Sony did not. There's going to be a disparity in development tools, not only in terms of general availability but also experience with them.

That is nonsense. Direct X 12 is a mature but also very rich abstraction/api.
They would not need to wait for any specific type of hardware to become available before they could work on the dev tools and sdk.
No, any specifics about rdna2 would be hidden beneath DX12 and never be surfaced to the application or the development tools.

But all software is not equal. DX12 is a VERY rich API which provides abstractions for very vastly different hardwares and drivers.
To provide a unified API where you as a dev do not have to worry about specifics about a particular devide or what quirks it has.
This is very nice because you as a developer can focus on other things.
But it comes at a cost. The richer and more layers of abstraction an API provides, the thicker it becomes and the more overhead it consumes, i.e. it gets slower and slower as the API becomes richer and richer.

Maybe that is the issue. DX12 is great since you have the same api both for pc and for xbox which saves development time.
But it is a much thicker and less efficient api than something that only needs to target a very limited set of hardware.
You don;t believe me? Look at a very thin abstraction like Vulkan and how it performs against a very thick abstraction like DX12.
Why is Vulcan so much faster than DX12 on the limited small set of devices that support Vulcan?

Anyway. SDK and tools operate on the API level. The API is exactly the same regardless if you add a new device beneath it.
There is absolutely zero reason why tools would have to wait because one out of many low level device drivers are not yet ready.

TL;DR
DX12 is a great and very powerful standard API. However what makes it standard is also what makes it slow compared to an API dedicated to only a specific small set of hw. Less abstractions to traverse means less overhead.

 

[Aceofspades]

I think Im witnessing a mini meltdown from DynamiteCop!

OT: BASED CERNY

 

[DynamiteCop!]

That is nonsense. Direct X 12 is a mature but also very rich abstraction/api.
They would not need to wait for any specific type of hardware to become available before they could work on the dev tools and sdk.
No, any specifics about rdna2 would be hidden beneath DX12 and never be surfaced to the application or the development tools.

But all software is not equal. DX12 is a VERY rich API which provides abstractions for very vastly different hardwares and drivers.
To provide a unified API where you as a dev do not have to worry about specifics about a particular devide or what quirks it has.
This is very nice because you as a developer can focus on other things.
But it comes at a cost. The richer and more layers of abstraction an API provides, the thicker it becomes and the more overhead it consumes, i.e. it gets slower and slower as the API becomes richer and richer.

Maybe that is the issue. DX12 is great since you have the same api both for pc and for xbox which saves development time.
But it is a much thicker and less efficient api than something that only needs to target a very limited set of hardware.
You don;t believe me? Look at a very thin abstraction like Vulkan and how it performs against a very thick abstraction like DX12.
Why is Vulcan so much faster than DX12 on the limited small set of devices that support Vulcan?

Anyway. SDK and tools operate on the API level. The API is exactly the same regardless if you add a new device beneath it.
There is absolutely zero reason why tools would have to wait because one out of many low level device drivers are not yet ready.

TL;DR
DX12 is a great and very powerful standard API. However what makes it standard is also what makes it slow compared to an API dedicated to only a specific small set of hw. Less abstractions to traverse means less overhead.

This is sensible but this conflates this to some kind of rendering issue when the reality is the modes where there is a perceived problem (120 FPS and low resolution) configuration around the CPU would be the limiting factor.

 

[GHG]

It's launch. You may have gone a little early yourself.

I'm the one who is "early" when people were not hesitating to puff their chests out chat shit before the release of the consoles?

Also, yes it is launch, for both platforms. This notion that only one platform will improve over time as the developers get to grips with the systems is farcical.

 

[Aceofspades]

So those "surprising" results are the reason DF halted their face offs?

Lol

 

[GHG]

So those "surprising" results are the reason DF halted their face offs?

Lol

It has to be said, they have been awfully slow in getting these head to head comparisons out.

I'll give them the benefit of the doubt for now though, they will have a lot of work/content to get through at the moment.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

Maybe DF is holding out for patches, they are probably shocked by the results. Perhaps DF is afraid to light more fires in the console war, even if they aren’t intentionally trying to do that, but a byproduct of comparisons.

 

[Boglin]

I think Im witnessing a mini meltdown from DynamiteCop!

No. You're witnessing overflowing, unadulterated confidence that has no foundation. It's quite the sight to behold and I truly hope he isn't just one of the most masterful trolls that have ever graced this forum because it's interesting to read. He earned his tag based on his unwavering stubbornness and based off his responses to those who doubted his conclusions in his Series S thread, I think he very well may be the Dunning-Kruger effect incarnate.

 

[Bittermich]

The versions tested were 1.004.000 on PS5 and 1.0.3.0 on Xbox Series X|S

Seems fair.

 

[onQ123]

So those "surprising" results are the reason DF halted their face offs?

Lol

They shook we are about to hear the words Caveats , Curious , In The Here & Now , Peculiar , Strange & so on all through these videos.

 

[Aceofspades]

It's launch. You may have gone a little early yourself.

PS4 performed better than Xbox One since day 1

Its been said that these new consoles have never been closer in power , this statement still holds true today and will hold true 10 years from now. But the green camp kept refusing to accept this fact and kept beating their chests yelling 12TF!

Looking at those comparisons now, and looking at the overall feature set provided by these consoles. PS5 is easily the better system, and at $399 provides a tremendous value.

Sony outsmarted MS yet again.

 

[NeonGhost]

So PS5 is holding a better frame rate all while having more smoke effects coming from the guns?

You can actually see the smoke effects are glitched on the Xbox and are happening off center from the barrel of the gun they are still there

 

[sinnergy]

Screen tearing is way lower than AC with PS5 having a very little less than Xbox.
Framerate a bit better on PS5.
That is the 120fps mode.

60fps mode is nearly identical.
No tearing.
60fps 99.9% of time.

That is probably the best multiplatform perform in both until now... I’m really impressed.

Sounds good ! Might buy now for series . 60 frames .

didn’t like 120 Hz, looked like soap opera in Dirt 5, a bit like the Hobbit movies at 45 frames

 

[sinnergy]

You can actually see the smoke effects are glitched on the Xbox and are happening off center from the barrel of the gun they are still there

These consoles are coming in hot in these COVID times , both have their share of bugs unfortunately.

 

[Hawking Radiation]

So now xbox fans not only have to wait on games, they also have to wait on tools.

Dead

 

[sircaw]

It's not the need to be out in front, it's the fact that with a little bit of time it will be. This has me worried for you people because you're partially winning a few battles with some release titles and siking yourselves up prematurely believing that this is going to be the normal state of affairs.

You have all the information and forewarning in the world for why this is happening, you know it's temporary, I know it's temporary, every here knows it's temporary, but just to dig that knife into us a bit you're claiming some kind of victory which will inevitably fall flat and embarrass all of you.

Worst part is you'll be all confused and act like you didn't see it coming. I'll make sure to remind you, constantly.

The problem is this is something you could have avoided but people like you doubled down, its no point crying foul when your the person that instigated all of this.

The savage beating your taking is your fault, no one else's. you can stand there and act all innocent and use vagueness as a form of your defense and cute little sayings like "you guys just wait and see" but this is what we told you and your fellow xbox fanatics months ago.

What your trying to do is what we said to you months ago, you fucked up m8.

You have done this to yourself, you don't get to play the victim card i am afraid.

No matter the outcome over the next few months, years this whole generation, people like you need to have a closer look at your self and say, "Woops i fucked up" Learn from your mistakes, learn from your bullshit please.

Everyone here knows the crap you pulled, you might be brave being here but that means nothing if your not learning.

You created mess like this, no me, not the sony fans, you constant bullshit about how great Microsoft is/was.

This is a colossal fuck up of your own making, don't try and pass the buck,

 

[Truespeed]

They can't control themselves, when faced with the overwhelming reality of what's actually taking place they instead choose to ignore it, act like it's somehow this more powerful hardware being weaker, and then act like a pack of wild animals without thinking of the future consequences.

This behavior and these threads will come back to haunt them.

 

[Riky]

Only small drops on both, good news. VRR on Xbox sorts that out so once again due to that feature the Xbox will have the best playing version with no tearing. Microsoft obviously knew VRR would be a killer feature from day one.

 

[jose4gg]

Only small drops on both, good news. VRR on Xbox sorts that out so once again due to that feature the Xbox will have the best playing version with no tearing. Microsoft obviously knew VRR would be a killer feature from day one.

Yes, I agree with you, for 0.00009% of gamers, the Series X is the better version.

 

[sircaw]

DC, sadly it just doesn't work like that.

sircaw and his band of usual suspects will be up in everyone's face every single time that a game doesn't show a massive difference. Then, if the situation changes to Xbox being consistently better, they will pivot to 'Sony first-party', 'faster loading', 'Tempest' or some other marketing catch-phrase. If they get desperate enough the fact that the console is bigger will become it's defining feature. We've seen it before, it's a pattern.

There will never be a realisation or admission of anything MS positive from these guys. It's like a religion with them.

no, that's not correct, the reason people like me exist is that people like you started this shit.

You and your fud force of xbox people poked the bear for months with your constant belittlement of the ps5, this is your own fault, the chickens have come home to roost and its you that started all this.

Want to look at what the problem is and where all this shit started, Want to know the reason while your feeling awful atm and dealing with all this crap , go and look in the mirror sunshine, you will see the reason staring right back at you

You need to learn from this, you and the others, funsocks nad kagey k all of you, don't constantly insult ps5 people and then try to degrade their hardware for months and months then play the victim at the end.

No one is falling for your shit anymore.

I don't care if ps5 wins or loses but i care people get justice for the weak lame shit people like you pulled.

Remember, you asked for this.

 

[Hawking Radiation]

Someone get Phil to pick one. I have more lying around the shed but I can't give them all away.

 

[Armorian]

I see plenty of tools trying to get Xbox to stand up ITT

 

[Tajaz2426]

Hopefully we can now concentrate on games, instead of console warring over which box is better.

From the outside looking in as a PC gamer it seems that people made fun of Sony and their console and now that can be put to rest. The XBox is going to win some and the PS5 is going to win some.

This is great for gamers, as competition makes Microsoft and Sony work harder on their product and give gamers what they want.

 

[sircaw]

Hopefully we can now concentrate on games, instead of console warring over which box is better.

From the outside looking in as a PC gamer it seems that people made fun of Sony and their console and now that can be put to rest. The XBox is going to win some and the PS5 is going to win some.

This is great for gamers, as competition makes Microsoft and Sony work harder on their product and give gamers what they want.

this is a post i can agree with, and i think this is a post most people probably want to become true, but the truth is will these people learn.

time will tell but i have my doubts, unfortunately.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

The problem is this is something you could have avoided but people like you doubled down, its no point crying foul when your the person that instigated all of this.

The savage beating your taking is your fault, no one else's. you can stand there and act all innocent and use vagueness as a form of your defense and cute little sayings like "you guys just wait and see" but this is what we told you and your fellow xbox fanatics months ago.

What your trying to do is what we said to you months ago, you fucked up m8.

You have done this to yourself, you don't get to play the victim card i am afraid.

No matter the outcome over the next few months, years this whole generation, people like you need to have a closer look at your self and say, "Woops i fucked up" Learn from your mistakes, learn from your bullshit please.

Everyone here knows the crap you pulled, you might be brave being here but that means nothing if your not learning.

You created mess like this, no me, not the sony fans, you constant bullshit about how great Microsoft is/was.

This is a colossal fuck up of your own making, don't try and pass the buck,

I'm not avoiding anything because I not only haven't backed down from anything originally asserted, and not a single solitary person should either. This merely introduces a minor speed bump to an eventuality that doesn't land in your favor. You people think you're getting one over on people like me, you think you're winning. I'm afraid to inform you, but you are in fact not.

You're prematurely celebrating minor victories with no foresight of what's to come, you're getting brazen and overtly cocky over tiny battles surrounding launch games and not looking at the bigger picture. You're ignoring the months of reported information of devkits not yet being in circulation while the PS5's were actually leaking from developers, you're ignoring the reported information of developers using PC's with targeted spec's to start configuring their games for Series X. You're ignoring discussion of people in the know surrounding current development tools that are not quite up to snuff.

You like the others are living in the moment, ignoring anything you possibly can to capture and live in this moment, and that's fine but it's also an amatuer mistake.

 

[Evilms]

 

[Hawking Radiation]

We simply don't have the whole picture with Sony. Need that die shot! I think overall the Series X has the edge, just not to what people think it is, but an edge none the less. Granted, lots of talk about how PS5 manages its cache, which has many benefits across the entire pipeline. That is something not so easily translated into sexy marketing. Smartshift probably putting in work too.

Want to point something out Matt Hargett said on Twitter about DMC PS5 versus Series X comparison vids:
"I mentioned one aspect of the system design choices being different. Imagine when people have more time to really optimize their code/data and hit these caches more often"

Both are so very close to each other and we may see them continue to trade blows in the future. As of right now, my takeaway is Series X may have slightly more computational power, but Sony implementation could be more efficient.

Ive said this for the longest time. Efficiency vs Brute power.
The numbers look more impressive when are higher but the numbers don't tell the whole story.
It's akin to having an American muscle V8 go against a tuned 6cylinder import.
Sure the V8 has more cylinders and more outright power but how much power actually gets down to the road.
Silly analogy but this is what I gleamed from developer comments and some reputable insiders over the last year leading up to launch.

 

[Malcolm9]

I'm not avoiding anything because I not only haven't backed down from anything originally asserted, and not a single solitary person should either. This merely introduces a minor speed bump to an eventuality that doesn't land in your favor. You people think you're getting one over on people like me, you think you're winning. I'm afraid to inform you, but you are in fact not.

You're prematurely celebrating minor victories with no foresight of what's to come, you're getting brazen and overtly cocky over tiny battles surrounding launch games and not looking at the bigger picture. You're ignoring the months of reported information of devkits not yet being in circulation while the PS5's were actually leaking from developers, you're ignoring the reported information of developers using PC's with targeted spec's to start configuring their games for Series X. You're ignoring discussion of people in the know surrounding current development tools that are not quite up to snuff.

You like the others are living in the moment, ignoring anything you possibly can to capture and live in this moment, and that's fine but it's also an amatuer mistake.

Blah blah blah something something.....

 

[alucard0712_rus]

We need to know if it's a result of one PS5 SKU and 2 XBOX SKU's.
It's probably take more time to optimize game for 2 consoles instead of one. Or optimization is worse.

 

[sinnergy]

Won’t ever game in 120 Hz looks like a soap opera tested it and was disgusting .. good for me because 60 frames in this game is fine !

anyone else feel the soap opera effect at 120 Hz?

 

[sircaw]

I'm not avoiding anything because I not only haven't backed down from anything originally asserted, and not a single solitary person should either. This merely introduces a minor speed bump to an eventuality that doesn't land in your favor. You people think you're getting one over on people like me, you think you're winning. I'm afraid to inform you, but you are in fact not.

You're prematurely celebrating minor victories with no foresight of what's to come, you're getting brazen and overtly cocky over tiny battles surrounding launch games and not looking at the bigger picture. You're ignoring the months of reported information of devkits not yet being in circulation while the PS5's were actually leaking from developers, you're ignoring the reported information of developers using PC's with targeted spec's to start configuring their games for Series X. You're ignoring discussion of people in the know surrounding current development tools that are not quite up to snuff.

You like the others are living in the moment, ignoring anything you possibly can to capture and live in this moment, and that's fine but it's also an amatuer mistake.

You never fucking listen, you will never learn.

Are you failing to grasp the reality of this situation, this is not about winning or losing, this is not about Microsoft or sony, this is about you and people like you. Crazy mad Microsoft Zealots that have done there best to spread fud, downplay and belittle Sony games for months.

You are a shrewd operator, smarter than your basic zealot but at your core your still a fucking troll,


Everyone here on this forum knows it, I don't want to be here wasting my time listening or responding to your shit, but i have seen it for months on end, and so has everyone else.

The fact is the only reason i am here now is to combat people like you, whose soul purpose was/is to ruin everyone else's fun on this forum.

You and your gang don't get to try and come out smelling of roses, no sir, forget it.

You reap what you sow, now deal with this all.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

A year from now when PS5 ports still competes with Xbox Series X ports what will be the excuse then? Still waiting on better tools? Devs being biased towards PS5? More laziness?

 

[SegaSnatcher]

Won’t ever game in 120 Hz looks like a soap opera tested it and was disgusting .. good for me because 60 frames in this game is fine !

anyone else feel the soap opera effect at 120 Hz?

That doesn't even make any sense. Soap Opera effect is when you either take a 24FPS movie and interpolate the frames to output 60fps or when a movie is shot at a higher native fps than 24fps, i.e 48fps or 60fps, since a big part of what makes a film look like film is the motion that is caused by filming at 24fps There is no such thing as a Soap Opera effect in games. In fact 60fps was pretty much the standard Framerate in games early on. Going to 120Hz does not make video games look unnatural, the higher the better as long as its relatively stable and or you can make use of VRR.

 

[DynamiteCop!]

You never fucking listen, you will never learn.

Are you failing to grasp the reality of this situation, this is not about winning or losing, this is not about Microsoft or sony, this is about you and people like you. Crazy mad Microsoft Zealots that have done there best to spread fud, downplay and belittle Sony games for months.

You are a shrewd operator, smarter than your basic zealot but at your core your still a fucking troll,


Everyone here on this forum knows it, I don't want to be here wasting my time listening or responding to your shit, but i have seen it for months on end, and so has everyone else.

The fact is the only reason i am here now is to combat people like you, whose soul purpose was/is to ruin everyone else's fun on this forum.

You and your gang don't get to try and come out smelling of roses, no sir, forget it.

You reap what you sow, now deal with this all.

That's a really neat story, but you're still going to end up on the back side of all of this. I'd start coming to terms with it now.

 

[sircaw]

That's a really neat story, but you're still going to end up on the back side of all of this. I'd start coming to terms with it now.

See that people, exactly what i said. You can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

 

[Vick]

You're prematurely celebrating minor victories with no foresight of what's to come

What's to come is this made on a console ten times more powerful.

That also won't have to run on a Series S.

 

[Tajaz2426]

That's a really neat story, but you're still going to end up on the back side of all of this. I'd start coming to terms with it now.

Brother there isn’t a backside to this. I don’t know the full story and what has transpired, but in the Speculation thread, there were all kinds of people making fun of the PS5 and the people that like it.

It can be put to rest now, as it doesn’t matter who winds and loses, they are pretty close to parity. You keep going on and on about how things will change, but you’re failing to realize that it doesn’t matter.

Both boxes will win and lose some, just say you messed up if you were part of the gang that was doing the trolling me maybe talk about games instead of a plastic box. Microsoft and Sony do not care for any of us, they only want money out of our pockets. There isn’t a company in the world that cares about their customers.

There is no need trying to protect your side as there isn’t any sides. We are the purchasers and the closer the games are, the more we stand to gain. They will work harder to make us happy as that is how they get paid.

That’s all I’m going to say on the matter. I don’t like having to read through a bunch of trolls posts just to try and find people that are decent to talk to.

 

[Md Ray]

Parity? The hardware isn't in parity, this doesn't make any sense. This is a growing pain issue with software which will be eradicated and then all of this will flip on its head.

It's inevitable.

The hardware (GPU) is kind of in parity if you look past TFLOPS.

What about 22% faster rasterization, pixel fillrate, 22% higher cache bandwidth on PS5? Why do Xbox fans ignore this?