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[Cizeta-Moroder]

Who's saying these men are entitled to attention?
The premise is that these men are invisible to college educated men as potential mates.
No one is crying for these guys; we're looking at the data objectively.
It's like you've barged in the thread with very strange non sequiturs about entitlement, women changing their sexual orientations to meet these realties, and other strange topics.
It's just wacky honestly.

Not in the general tone of the thread, but in a few posts that implication seems to be present:

This really gets under my skin. It is okay for women to have standards regarding height, income, and education, but if a man even mentions a woman's weight, all hell breaks lose.

the harsh truth is they need to change what they're looking for then, or change themselves to make themselves more attractive to the suitable partners out there.

Sorry, I don't mean to derail or to call you out specifically.

 

[entremet]

I hope this helps clarify my point:

I get your point, the issue is also the concentrations in different locations--urban versus rural and so on.

You're looking at it as closed system.

 

[Neverwas]

I've worked in the tech industry for almost 20 years, and have helped start 3 different departments within my company, define policy, etc etc etc... but god forbid I tell my date I don't have a degree.

 

[efyu_lemonardo]

I get your point, the issue is also the concentrations in different locations--urban versus rural and so on.

You're looking at it as closed system.

If it's not a closed system and the men aren't having trouble finding a partner that means they are marrying from outside the system, which is something that should be measurable.

All I'm trying to say is there has to be some kind of tradeoff for men in this scenario and it would be interesting to figure out what that tradeoff is.

 

[efyu_lemonardo]

People who put so much emphasis in a piece of paper when it comes to dating are silly. Not everyone who doesn't have a degree is a deadbeat moron.

While I agree with the second sentence, it's important to note that the people putting so much emphasis on a piece of paper in this scenario aren't just the women but also the places of employment.

 

[entremet]

If it's not a closed system and the men aren't having trouble finding a partner that means they are marrying from outside the system, which is something that should be measurable.

All I'm trying to say is there has to be some kind of tradeoff for men in this scenario and it would be interesting to figure out what that tradeoff is.

I got you.

I don't know, doesn't seem the author researched it.

Maybe it's not lucrative to research since these are ignored by the mainstream media. College educated women are amongst the most marketed demographics.

 

[saucyrobot]

In any case, whatever group it is that lacks the preferred/sought trait, is not entitled to attention.

Educated women are plenty attractive as they are. To say that they owe the world even more, is madness.

Stop arguing with yourself. Or, preferably, be honest and simply say what it is you're thinking. I'm pretty sure it boils down to "men aren't entitled to attention, but women are".

Unsurprisingly, it's this sort of mentality that accounts for why some of these women are single in the first place. If you feel entitled to dismiss large portions of the opposite sex as potential partners based on some predetermined criteria, you may find that even people in your preferred demographic are reluctant to engage with you. It turns out that large numbers of people aren't interested in approaching personal relationships as if they were business transactions judged purely on their underlying economic value.

 

[Sober]

The problem is when people assume that college education is some magic key to a higher intelligence.

You can coast through high school, but not to your bachelor's. In retrospect the bachelor's is nothing but that's probably because you already have one, or better.

As stated earlier, unless you are dropping your Bachelor's (or higher) for something you're passionate about it and it's ultimately worthwhile in some respect, a high school diploma is nothing to either of those accomplishments. Because the former two imply a standard of intellectualism or drive and subsequent, tangible results.

 

[RedSwirl]

A combination of this and the fact that men are typically left under-equipped to handle college. In the US boys are typically somewhere around a year and a half behind girls in their grade levels in literacy, The time that they traditionally need in order to exert all of their pent up energy during recess (physically) and lunch (socially) is slowly being taken, and the reading they actually do they find incredibly uninteresting, making it much harder to convince them to read, meaning they never develop the same literacy skills as girls, creating an education gap.

Starting from a young age we're making it difficult for boys to learn while making it easier for girls to learn and not catering to their actual educational needs, leading to high gender disparities in college enrollment.

We've accidentally been engineering this situation for years.

I can believe this.

Throughout most of school in my experience (the 90's and early 00's) most of the girls seemed to be better students than the boys, read more, and wrote more legibly. I think some of us here know the term "write like a girl" and how it's often used as a positive jibe. I think my graduating class in college might have actually been 75 percent female.

And I didn't even begin to find books I was even slightly interested in reading until after college. To be honest I still don't read a whole lot today.

I get your point, the issue is also the concentrations in different locations--urban versus rural and so on.

You're looking at it as closed system.

This is kind of what I meant when I said "all over the world." I remember reading an older story hinting at something similar happening in urban China, where the most highly-educated women couldn't find suitable partners, even using the "D-grade to A-grade" scale.

 

[RedSwirl]

You can coast through high school, but not to your bachelor's. In retrospect the bachelor's is nothing but that's probably because you already have one, or better.

I don't know man. In retrospect, getting my BA wasn't extremely difficult. It could be just that I focused on a major that I actually enjoyed working in...

Spoiler

and can't find a job in today.

 

[Sober]

I don't know man. In retrospect, getting my BA wasn't extremely difficult. It could be just that I focused on a major that I actually enjoyed working in...

Spoiler

and can't find a job in today.

That's the point though, you either study in a program you're really passionate in, or you pick something and you grind it out and work towards the end.

The end result is you're probably going to pick up a nuanced and specific appreciation of what you were studying. And that translates into other things I suppose people (or specifically here, college/university-educated women) who desire to marry into the same socio-economic status care about. Not looks, but being able to hold a conversation about more intellectual subjects. You don't have to be a polisci major to talk about politics but you're more likely to be able to participate or willing learn in order to participate over people who only care about sports/local issues/celebrity gossip.

 

[Fuzzery]

In any case, whatever group it is that lacks the preferred/sought trait, is not entitled to attention.




Educated women are plenty attractive as they are. To say that they owe the world even more, is madness.

These two are contradictory statements

 

[Shy Fingers]

I get this sort of mentality though. If I take anecdotes from my life, there seems to be a huge difference from my high school crowd and those who went to college. Using it as a litmus test for those who you would wish to seek out to be around.

It's kind of like GPA and applying for a job, while that number doesn't have anything to do if you can do your job, just a quick way to weed out a lot of people who might be that way.

 

[CornBurrito]

I've worked in the tech industry for almost 20 years, and have helped start 3 different departments within my company, define policy, etc etc etc... but god forbid I tell my date I don't have a degree.

Sorry, but most people aren't likely to gamble. Having to sift through every person without a degree just to find the one exceptional case (like you) is too much time/effort.

 

[Robdraggoo]

slight counter point.
My wife has a college degree, I dont. we work in the exact same field in the exact same position, yet I make a little more than she does, also despite the fact that she has worked there a little longer than I have. But I guess thats a different matter all together.
However whne we first got together about 14 years ago she didnt have that education. So I guess its really amounts to when you met, and how well you are at keeping her around. I chose humor, because its all I got. And I aint very funny.

 

[Desi]

Very interesting topic with a lot of interesting responses. Some are easily noticeable just from the dating sector: OkCupid or living next to a University that is predominantly female (or gay male)

 

[RedSwirl]

That's the point though, you either study in a program you're really passionate in, or you pick something and you grind it out and work towards the end.

The end result is you're probably going to pick up a nuanced and specific appreciation of what you were studying. And that translates into other things I suppose people (or specifically here, college/university-educated women) who desire to marry into the same socio-economic status care about. Not looks, but being able to hold a conversation about more intellectual subjects. You don't have to be a polisci major to talk about politics but you're more likely to be able to participate or willing learn in order to participate over people who only care about sports/local issues/celebrity gossip.

I guess that puts my major in a weird position. Focusing in journalism forced me to maintain a constant drip-feed of world events and a bunch of other subjects, but I graduated around the same time the job market in that field was devastated. I'm getting into a whole other off-topic subject though.

 

[Bleepey]

Isn't this what MRAs say about women being hypergamous?

 

[AyaisMUsikWhore]

People who put so much emphasis in a piece of paper when it comes to dating are silly. Not everyone who doesn't have a degree is a deadbeat moron.

Your second part is true but it's an intellectual thing. Some women want to know that their partner is educated beyond street smarts and just as accomplished as them for that safety financially stable net. It's not like women are straight out opposed to not dating anyone without one. It's just more attractive

 

[gutter_trash]

degree classisim LOL

I have been working in my field for over 15 years without a degree, I started working in this industry early enough that it did require higher education. Today though it does. For my case it doesn't matter because my experience trumps educations

so, if a girl wants to go out with a jobless guy with a degree, go ahead, go into dept with that philosophy major slash barista

 

[Bleepey]

I forgot to add isn't this basically the same shit as said in the black (female) blogosphere about there not being enough good black men? I always thought dating was backwards for men, when younger women get to be much pickier and men work harder to get attention from women. When women get older and men are more established, women may want the more established guy whilst the older guy may wanna bang the hot 20yr olds he missed out on but they can now date.

 

[LegendofJoe]

I forgot to add isn't this basically the same shit as said in the black (female) blogosphere about there not being enough good black men? I always thought dating was backwards for men, when younger women get to be much pickier and men work harder to get attention from women. When women get older and men are more established, women may want the more established guy whilst the older guy may wanna bang the hot 20yr olds he missed out on but they can now date.

Nice observation, intuitively I think there's a lot of truth to this.

 

[Guy LeDouche]

My wife is a MD/MPH and I have my BA in English, so weirder things are possible.

We met on OKC.

 

[Random Painted HIghway]

My wife is a college professor who went to a top,program in her field and has a great job, all of her female cohort in grad school that were single have had a really difficult time finding mates. If they didn't lock someone in during undergrad, they were pretty much screwed, and not for lack of trying. Pretty sad really.

 

[tearsintherain]

Time to import some single men!!

But seriously a lot of women are pickier too, my sister is single now for a while and in her late 30s and super picky about dating. No online dating, only through friends, and she's rejected so many on the first date that nobody even suggests anyone anymore. Nothing wrong with that though, she seems pretty happy (no kids) and leads a good life and has a lot of people who love her and she does a lot of charity stuff.

I'd bet more and more women are finding the bachelor life to their liking, should make for interesting stuff in another two or three generations. Maybe a backlash and a pro-marriage movement, or maybe serial casual relationships lasting a few years throughout your life becomes more normal.

 

[RedSwirl]

I forgot to add isn't this basically the same shit as said in the black (female) blogosphere about there not being enough good black men? I always thought dating was backwards for men, when younger women get to be much pickier and men work harder to get attention from women. When women get older and men are more established, women may want the more established guy whilst the older guy may wanna bang the hot 20yr olds he missed out on but they can now date.

The problem is the same for black women but doubly bad. I think the ratio is like 80-something employed black men for every college-educated black woman. Mass incarceration is a main differentiating factor here.

 

[tauroxd]

Sorry, but most people aren't likely to gamble. Having to sift through every person without a degree just to find the one exceptional case (like you) is too much time/effort.

Yeah, that's the sad thing, that they thing is probably a waste of time... And I don't blame them, really.

 

[Azulsky]

I would be more concerned with the potential significant other having a job in todays climate. You can print diplomas on inkjet but that has nothing to do with a getting a paycheck.

Plus saying you have a degree is pretty diluted these days.

 

[efyu_lemonardo]

Sorry, but most people aren't likely to gamble. Having to sift through every person without a degree just to find the one exceptional case (like you) is too much time/effort.

Once an educated woman realizes her chances of finding a similarly educated man aren't as great as she'd like, the rational thing to do is broaden her search criteria. We all do this all the time, and it's a big reason why a lot of people end up discovering that a happy and successful relationship isn't so easy to predict based on a handful of dry stats.