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[Poor GRIMES]

That's a bit much and I respectfully disagree. I will say that articles like this calling the whole mix up institutional racism, when it really appeared to be an honest mistake, is one of the things that causes people to downplay actual institutional racism. If you look for deeper meaning and a conspiracy where there is none will make certain people dismiss your argument in the future. It doesn't really help anybody.

I think that article's claims are very messy, yes. Trying to equate a singular, innocuous mistake to something that might be a product of institutional racism is a bit much. I agreed with her claims that, yeah, PoCs not being as celebrated with their promotions in their careers in comparison to their White counterparts is similar to the media's reaction to the entire incident. Absolutely, there's relevant inklings of evidence that suggest that the media linking Moonlight's win to the La La Land mixup detracts from allowing the Moonlight crew from getting their well-deserved spotlight, however, I don't think it's quite right to throw accusations towards people that were obviously confused whilst everything was unfolding on live TV.

 

[Knightmarre]

Hope the author didn't strain his arm with all the reaching in the article.

 

[Staccat0]

Maybe. You're right, we really don't know, and I'm not sure what I'd do in that situation.

Personally I appreciated the producer's tactic of immediately shutting down the LLL speeches and making it clear that Moonlight won over the other guy's approach of making sure he gets to have his say before revealing what happening on his own time. We don't know exactly what was going on in his head, but I do think it's very clear from his facial expressions before speaking and from his immediate "Oh yeah, and we lost" reaction after being cut off that he definitely knew what happened before taking the microphone.

It was definitely the wrong move and bad look regardless of his rationale. I just can see how I might do something similarly rude or stupid in such an insane situation.

 

[mid83]

People sure love to look for conspiracies. Any attempt to try to paint this as anything other than an unintentional mistake is gross in my opinion, especially the attempt to somehow tie this to racism.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Uh. Ok.

I'm confused at what the author thinks should have happened after the mistake was made. They obviously didn't have a set protocol and it makes sense to be apologetic to the mistaken winner. I imagine kimmel had producers either freaking out in his ear, or he had no guidance. But I guess Kimmel should have told them to shut up and ripped the oscar from their hands?

This is something out of nothing.

It was academy history, for sure. Like, a fuck up like that happening is something that's going to eclipse the winner. Even if it was the Titanic, the fuck up would've eclipsed the winner through and through.

Like...yeah Moonlight was robbed, so was La La land, so was anything else that happened that night.. 20 years from now, the biggest thing remembered from this is going to be that it was the only* time that there's been an envelope fuck up this massive.

*Until it happens in the future in which case there will be so many fuck ups the oscars loses its power.

 

[ClayKavalier]

It was academy history, for sure. Like, a fuck up like that happening is something that's going to eclipse the winner. Even if it was the Titanic, the fuck up would've eclipsed the winner through and through.

Like...yeah Moonlight was robbed, so was La La land, so was anything else that happened that night.. 20 years from now, the biggest thing remembered from this is going to be that it was the only* time that there's been an envelope fuck up this massive.

*Until it happens in the future in which case there will be so many fuck ups the oscars loses its power.

This really happened at the worst possible moment. If the screwup had happened for any other award no one beyond the people already interested in the Oscars would be talking about Best Picture regardless of who won.

 

[Tagg9]

I completely disagree with this. If the reverse had happened, and Moonlight had mistakenly been named the winner, then the events would have unfolded the exact same way.

Certainly Kimmel was not being malicious when he said to the La La Land producers, ”I think you should just keep it anyway." He felt bad that anyone should have to lose in such a public way. But notice that what Kimmel didn't say is, ”Let's get Moonlight up here right now and let them have their moment." His empathy, like that of many others, went towards the people who looked most like him on stage.

Kimmel is a comedian, and he wasn't sure what to do. The La La Land producer had already spoken about getting the Moonlight crew on stage, and there was nothing more to be done at this time. If Kimmel were to say what this article's author suggested, it would be seen as incredibly insensitive to the La La Land crew who just had a prize taken away from them. The Moonlight crew was moments away from having their moment in the limelight.

And to claim that Kimmel was motivated by skin color? Seriously fuck the author of this article, that's a terrible thing to accuse someone of, especially when there is absolutely zero evidence to support it.

Despite the overall sloppiness of what occurred, I feel like it was handled as well as can be expected (well, apart from the "lol we lost btw!" guy).

 

[UnemployedVillain]

It was academy history, for sure. Like, a fuck up like that happening is something that's going to eclipse the winner. Even if it was the Titanic, the fuck up would've eclipsed the winner through and through.

Like...yeah Moonlight was robbed, so was La La land, so was anything else that happened that night.. 20 years from now, the biggest thing remembered from this is going to be that it was the only* time that there's been an envelope fuck up this massive.

*Until it happens in the future in which case there will be so many fuck ups the oscars loses its power.

I disagree. No one is going to remember the fuckup without remembering what movies were involved in it. If anything the fuckup made the win more memorable than the typical announcement, but that's just me

 

[Poor GRIMES]

I disagree. No one is going to remember the fuckup without remembering what movies were involved in it. If anything the fuckup made the win more memorable than the typical announcement, but that's just me

Exactly.

This mistake absolutely elevated Moonlight's profile. A quick glance at its box office gross in its initial run will tell any person with good sense that if the win was given without the error, then it would just join the list of films that were awarded Best Picture with absolutely no cultural mindshare, like The Artist, for example.

 

[WrenchNinja]

Kimmel should be getting more shit for making so many stupid jokes about Mahershala Ali's name

 

[milanbaros]

I just can't imagine the commentary if it had been the other way round.

 

[FortuneFaded]

Kimmel should be getting more shit for making so many stupid jokes about Mahershala Ali's name

He was on his show the following night so he clearly wasn't that insulted himself.

 

[Enzom21]

It's articles like this that convert liberals into conservatives.

Does it convert non-racists into racists as well?
I mean, all of that "entitlement" would make someone racist, right?

 

[soundscream]

He was on his show the following night so he clearly wasn't that insulted himself.

He was also on months ago explaining his full name, its not a big deal

Also his name is a Hebrew name from the old testament, not a Muslim name like I've seen some here imply.

 

[Spikematic]

The sheer level of reaching in that article is utterly absurd. I hope Jimmy brings this up in one of his monologues and mocks it relentlessly because it sure deserves it.

 

[not psycho]

I disagree with the article, because it would have been more awkward in reverse. "Actually the winner is La La Land, I am so so sorry La La Land that you didn't get your full moment, Moonlight you're still here? Get off the stage now!"

It is true that Moonlight didn't get the moment they were supposed to for winning Best Picture. It wasn't "robbed", it was an accident, but it still stings. I felt, and feel, worse for them than for La La Land. Very unfortunate.

 

[Angel_DvA]

Nothing was robbed, this accident probably get the movie a bigger exposure that he would have get otherwise, Moonlight winning best picture award got me to take a look at the synopsis at least.

 

[Trojita]

It's articles like this that convert liberals into conservatives.

If that's all it takes for someone to side with a party whose agenda is; racist, discriminates against LGBT, demonstrably bad for anyone but the super rich, lies constantly, wants to control a woman's body, and is for small government until they are in power, then you might not have been shit to begin with.

The basis of the article is dumb. I disagree with posters supporting the unsubstantiated narrative given by the article, but it is one article, at cosmo of all places.

 

[Trojita]

Edit: Double Post by accident.

 

[Vyer]

People sure love to look for conspiracies. Any attempt to try to paint this as anything other than an unintentional mistake is gross in my opinion, especially the attempt to somehow tie this to racism.

The article isn't talking anything about conspiracies

 

[greatestjediever]

Joking about Mahershala's name was Kimmel's wackest moment.

I felt his joke about a random stranger from the tour bus' name was more insulting.

Yulree is not a real name? I have friend's that know her too, as she's a resident in the OC.

 

[Clockwork]

Bullshit.

This is being viewed through the lens of someone who has the benefit of hindsight. Obviously it is very easy to pick out flaws after the fact.

Things are very different in the moment they are happening and shit hits the fan.

As far as the Kimmel thing I think he was just trying to show some empathy. Do you not think it was just as embarrassing for the La La Land folks?

 

[Blader]

Accusing Jimmy Kimmel, who was visibly befuddled on stage trying to manage this mess, of racial micro aggressions seems like a ridiculous stretch to me. But, as a white man myself, maybe I'm just not sensitive to picking up on those things.

 

[Lights and Waves]

The silver lining on this cloud is that Moonlight is gonna get one of the biggest Oscar bumps in history I bet.

Not a lotta people saw it, but the madness of that moment is gonna have a lot of curious eyes going to Moonlight. They will sadly perplexed I think, but money is good.

Most theatres have dropped it already and the movie is out on Blu-ray. La La Land is still playing in IMAX and Dolby Digital though, I think it's going to get a big boost.

 

[nahlakhai]

No one bringing up the fact that Jimmy made fun of the Asian girl's name during that cringey tourist stunt?

Spoiler

/s

I saw this article posted by someone on FB on Monday and it contributes a little bit to everything that has transpired in this country in the past 20 months. Time to lighten up.

 

[travisbickle]

Bullshit.

This is being viewed through the lens of someone who has the benefit of hindsight. Obviously it is very easy to pick out flaws after the fact.

The internet seems to be a breeding ground for this.

 

[Randam]

This would have been the same, when it would have been the other way around.

Beatty would have acted the same, Kimmel would have said the same thing.

 

[Ethranes]

Attributing mistakes to institutionalised racism is a good way to get clicks these days, the whole article, and yes I did read it, is total bullshit.

 

[MisterR]

Yeah it was pretty gross how people was rushing to say how brave and full of grace the La La Land people were.

Bullshit. Winning an Oscar is a lifelong dream for people in the film industry. Thinking you've won one and then having it taken away has to be an extremely shitty feeling and they handled it with class and grace.

 

[MarkMclovin]

Didn't everyone that saw it live and all over the news the next day, recognise it?

 

[chromatic9]

The way Warren Beaty was hogging the mic long after the mistake was a bit strange to me. I would've tried to put the spotlight on the real winners straight away and try to make best of it, like re-announce it instead of more bungling along.

 

[gutter_trash]

The Lala Land producers took too much space and tried to Alpha his way over Beatty and Kimmel.

He had no business trying to overstay his welcome by snatching the card out of Beatty's hand, holding onto the Oscar demanding to be the one to pass it off.

The Producer should have relinquished the Oscar and hand it back.

Get off the stage

 

[kmfdmpig]

Bullshit. Winning an Oscar is a lifelong dream for people in the film industry. Thinking you've won one and then having it taken away has to be an extremely shitty feeling and they handled it with class and grace.

Yes, particularly when that awkward shift from elation to dejection is broadcast around the world.

The situation was not what it should have been for the cast/crew of Moonlight, but would have been much worse for the cast/crew of LLL.

 

[Count Dookkake]

Pretty good example of recreational outrage.

 

[Vyer]

That verbiage alone implies a deliberate, malicious act. Someone doesn't get "robbed" accidentally. People aren't incidentally robbed, they are deliberately robbed. I recognize that that is not really the tone or point of the article itself, but if you're going to use a provocative eye-catching headline then expect to be kind of raked over the coals for it.

No, that's what people are injecting into it to disagree with it. They were 'robbed' of their moment. Not because of some grand conspiracy of the evil accounting firm. But that doesn't change the fact that they were robbed of it. And the response afterward from everyone (but Horowitz) didn't do much to try and salvage it. That doesn't mean that was malicious either, but the article is positing that the majority's natural reactions to the minority can often not make those types of considerations.


If we can recognize that that's not the 'tone or point' of the article we shouldn't need a bunch of disclaimers or semantics lessons to actually discuss the tone and point of the article.


It's the same kind of shit that happens in most race conversations. Instead of actually discussing the topic or the nuances of it like history, subconscious reactions or culture, etc, people just boil it down to 'I/HE/SHE is NOT a racist!!!!' and round and round it goes.

 

[wildfire]

When I heard about this mistake I was wondering why people were overreacting to a mistake. Now I see this article and find out they didn't clarify their mistake until after the La La Land team started their acceptance speech.


Before I didn't think Beatty was at fault for being confused about the situation but this took way too long to get resolved. It never should've gotten that far in the first place.

As for the article it feels like an over reach to point out that the mistake of giving the wrong card is a strong enough indicator of

The carelessness and haphazardness ... of how institutional racism continues to work, even after people of color have overcome a significant barrier.

It took too long to correct the issue but you can't make any strong inferences by the length of time to correct the issue as somethng born out of the way institutional racism works.


OTOH their comment about Kimmel's reaction is on point.

Who the fuck says

”I think you guys should keep it anyway."

Kimmel has always been a douche and his statement reveals a lack of consideration that the Moonlight team are the actual winners. When mistakes like this are made the reaction has always been a variation of "our bad it wasn't you but you did great work and are still deserving of some recognition but this is their reward."

Kimmel could only empathize with the La La Land team but not the Moonlight team and that's a clearer sign of racism at play here, subconsciously or consciously.

 

[The Salt Life]

Eh, it's really not that deep. It's actually kind of funny that somehow a snub still appeared to happen.




If an article like this can "turn" someone from a liberal to a conservative they probably weren't a liberal to begin with.

I think what he means is, it's a loss of another vote

 

[Despera]

Actually, this fuck up will result in more attention to Moonlight.

And on top of that, after enough time passes the fuck up will be mostly forgotten while the film will forever be remembered as the best picture of 2016.

I understand the issues this article is trying to highlight, but I also see some considerable positive aspects to it as well.

 

[Lights and Waves]

Kimmel has always been a douche and his statement reveals a lack of consideration that the Moonlight team are the actual winners. When mistakes like this are made the reaction has always been a variation of "our bad it wasn't you but you did great work and are still deserving of some recognition but this is their reward."

Kimmel could only empathize with the La La Land team but not the Moonlight team and that's a clearer sign of racism at play here, subconsciously or consciously.

I think you're reaching here. Kimmel was nervous and made a joke. "I think you guys should keep it anyway." I've heard that a million times before.

 

[PdotMichael]

Kimmel has always been a douche and his statement reveals a lack of consideration that the Moonlight team are the actual winners. When mistakes like this are made the reaction has always been a variation of "our bad it wasn't you but you did great work and are still deserving of some recognition but this is their reward."

Kimmel could only empathize with the La La Land team but not the Moonlight team and that's a clearer sign of racism at play here, subconsciously or consciously.

You need more to call someone racist than that.

But this is the internet and GAF after all...

 

[Despera]

I think you're reaching here. Kimmel was nervous and made a joke. "I think you guys should keep it anyway." I've heard that a million times before.

Also this. People need to stop jumping to conclusions.

 

[wildfire]

You need more to call someone racist than that.

But this is the internet and GAF after all...

I don't. You do. We can agree to have our own perspectives.

I think you're reaching here. Kimmel was nervous and made a joke. "I think you guys should keep it anyway." I've heard that a million times before.

Yeah right. This is not the common reaction at all. The common reaction is "whoops our bad but you guys are also awesome."

 

[BocoDragon]

The tone of this article is pretty heavy handy to me. It's just dripping with sanctimonious politicism.

But the finer point is true... they were robbed of their moment. The Oscar going to the whitest movie ever before being "snatached away" by a very black movie looks about as awful, semiotically, as it could be.

 

[SeanC]

I think the public is going to remember the moment at this year's Awards and how the Best Picture went far more and recognize Moonlight far more than if some 80 year old just said "And the winner is..."

It's Oscar history now, like a streaking naked man behind David Niven or Littlefeather accepting on behalf of Brando. Nobody remembers 95% of the show or even who wins what, they're going to remember this and this moment in time and why Moonlight winning says a lot.

 

[John Kowalski]

I do agree with the sentiment that the general outcome of the Oscars has not been that Moonlight won, and how significant that is as far as race in the Oscars is concerned, but mostly about the mistake. That said gaf and the eight o'clock news is where I hear Oscar stuff.

 

[Killing_Joke]

Do people really think this would have been handled any differently if it was just another "white" movie instead of Moonlight? In fact i would argure this incident made Moonlights win bigger. I can only imagine the outrage if this situation was reversed. lol

 

[Polari]

It's obviously a shame it worked out that way but I'm guessing the Moonlight folks are too stoked to have won Best Picture to focus on it that much.

 

[Korey]

I think you're reaching here. Kimmel was nervous and made a joke. "I think you guys should keep it anyway." I've heard that a million times before.

The problem is that Kimmel didnt acknowledge the Moonlight people even once. He spent the whole time joking/talking to the LLL people and Beatty.

Watch the clip again. The bald producer and Beatty had to cut him off twice because they wanted to give Moonlight their time to talk.

This doesn't mean that Kimmel is racist, but it might be an example of institutionalized racism in action.

 

[Polari]

Kimmel has always been a douche and his statement reveals a lack of consideration that the Moonlight team are the actual winners. When mistakes like this are made the reaction has always been a variation of "our bad it wasn't you but you did great work and are still deserving of some recognition but this is their reward."

Kimmel could only empathize with the La La Land team but not the Moonlight team and that's a clearer sign of racism at play here, subconsciously or consciously.

Kimmel was caught short, made a lame joke offering the La La Land folks some consolation on what was obviously pretty disappointing and embarrassing for them. There's nothing remotely racist about it. That's fucking ridiculous reaching.

 

[SpideySenses]

I feel like Jordan Horowitz did such a fantastic job in that moment that it kind of moved the goal posts for what is expected for the other people there, that was an embarrassing high pressure situation and realistically everyone did fine.