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Battle Garegga Rev.2016 announced by Famitsu, "M2 ShotTriggers" release
- Thread starter @MUWANdo
- Start date
ThePeoplesBureau
Member
This may not be a particularly popular opinion, but I actually welcome this line of thinking. It shows they have an understanding that trying to market this kind of game to the masses is fruitless. Better to position it as a premium product to customers who were always going to buy it regardless, and heck if you net in customers beyond the dedicated fanbase for this sort of niche product, then it's a bonus. Ignoring this logic has burned publishers in the past, to the detriment of the potential for them to financially support future releases. I think Cave were caught out this way during the 360 era, and external factors aside, sales of their shmup titles never exactly set the world alight. I want to see M2 go from strength to strength, and if that means I have to pay a premium to do so, I will.
It's not really that hard... The rank system is complicated, but you can ignore a lot of it nuances and just stick to the basics: ignore excess power ups, suicide right before the next million points, don't drop the medal chain and start again many times and for the love of YGW do not raise the auto fire frequency
CAVE and pretty much everyone else rode the "niche release for a niche audience at a high price" thing into the ground; their sales were low precisely because they weren't able to attract anyone outside their diehard fans (aside from Deathsmiles which was a complete fluke).
M2's raison d'etre is different: their products are explicit repackagings of "retro" games which carry different expectations, and they're not really trying to "break" these games to the mainstream.
M2's raison d'etre is different: their products are explicit repackagings of "retro" games which carry different expectations, and they're not really trying to "break" these games to the mainstream.
ThePeoplesBureau
Member
They did give the option of both standard and limited editions for most of their 360 line-up. If M2 are only pitching BG as a singular premium edition offering, this differs to Cave's approach.
I agree, but any publisher worth their salt will always try to market their product for the most possible sales under whatever expectations have been set.
Regardless, hopefully the reputation of BG and M2 will see some enhanced interest from the gaming press, especially outside of Japan. Shmups in general get a bum deal when it comes to widespread coverage (famously bad Deathsmiles gameshark review, I'm looking at you) but this is often due to a complete lack of understanding on the part of the reviewer who rarely bothers to expand on anything other than 'you can complete this game in 15 minutes.' I know we're not even at the stage where we even have confirmation of a release outside of Japan as yet, but one can still dream for a future where shmups are respected for their technical prowess for those willing to dig a little deeper.
sixteen-bit
Member
Sega publised the last TF game. I wonder if they own it.
Would coalesce with all the existing Sega DLC already out for DBCS.
I just really hope they can make enough money from this to keep the series going.
StarCreator
Member
I recall the Saturn port itself has remastered music. Are we still getting that soundtrack as well?
The premium edition is up for pre-order on a few JP websites: 9500 yen gets you a download code, a soundtrack CD, a booklet, a flyer, some clear files, a 20th anniversary book with interviews, planning documents, etc and a replica medal. http://i.imgur.com/v4H18s3.jpg
http://www.yodobashi.com/ec/product/100000001003243791/index.html
http://kuraris.ocnk.net/product/2599
The retail description also mentions some of the extra features, including a Super Easy mode and customisation options (do they go beyond dip switches?).
Sega doesn't own the IP, one of the old Technosoft guys does. He re-releases OSTs from the old games every so often.
http://www.yodobashi.com/ec/product/100000001003243791/index.html
http://kuraris.ocnk.net/product/2599
The retail description also mentions some of the extra features, including a Super Easy mode and customisation options (do they go beyond dip switches?).
Sega doesn't own the IP, one of the old Technosoft guys does. He re-releases OSTs from the old games every so often.
SmiteOfHand
Member
Download code is disappointing, but I suppose that is the reality of where we are. I'm just gonna import. Will be a drag waiting for the code to get here before I can play but ah well.
sixteen-bit
Member
Shame about no disc release for the game 
ExitPlanetDust
Member
Download code is unfortunate. Well, at least I won't need to wait for shipping. I will pick up a JP PSN card code when it hits the store.
adversesolutions
Member
Pre-ordered this mutha.
Edit: and I don't even like Garegga.
Edit: and I don't even like Garegga.
StarCreator
Member
Any idea if an import friendly store will be carrying this (or if the stores linked to will export)?
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
9500 yen for a fuckin' download? I mean... wow. Don't give me all that other junk if I can't get the game in a proper format. That is stupid.
PepsimanVsJoe
Member
All of that and yet there isn't a disc for the actual game.
I guess they can't justify the cost of pressing blu-rays.
I guess they can't justify the cost of pressing blu-rays.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
Dunno if Calladuty did it, but this sort of thing has definitely been done before... the difference is, though, that in other cases, there was still some way to get the game on a disc.
SmiteOfHand
Member
It stings here a bit more than a big triple-A title like CoD because long term digital rights are still up in the air. You are almost certainly going to be able to buy and play CoD decades from now. Niche titles like this can easily vanish and with no second hand market?
But on the other hand I understand costs and risks and all so I understand why M2 would go this way.
Maybe down the road we will get it all on disc with a ShotTriggers collection.
But on the other hand I understand costs and risks and all so I understand why M2 would go this way.
Maybe down the road we will get it all on disc with a ShotTriggers collection.
hikarutilmitt
Member
Don't care it's a digital code (I actually rather like it, wish more pubs would offer LEs this way!), it will be mine. It's pricey, but I would have bought the Insanity DVD years ago and that was JUST the book and superplays. This gives me the soundtrack, superplays, booklet, the game and a replica medal that's actually really neat.
I mean, it's still cheaper than a Saturn copy and I can use one of my PS4 sticks on it!
I mean, it's still cheaper than a Saturn copy and I can use one of my PS4 sticks on it!
SOME-MIST
Member
I'm hoping that's what the handful of cave staff (who went to m2 in 2014) are working on.
wishful thinking.
No, it wasn't a fluke. It was Moe. And ever since then, C.A.V.E. has been finding ways to pack underage breasts into their games to get more sales.
Just look at their next PC game. Dodonpachi Resurrection.
Muchi Muchi Pink
Member
Finally some Raizing/8ing love.
cave released a lot more games before, that fits your description. And if you wanna survive in japan, that's your last straw.
Sure, but it didn't work: Deathsmiles did good business, all their other games went back to selling what they usually did, including Deathsmiles 2. Waifus don't guarantee success in and of themselves.
SmiteOfHand
Member
Augemitbutter
Member
no game disc is disappointing. i wish we could tell them what we want but they're problably not listening.
the androgyne
Member
3700Y for just the game huh. They're pushing their luck. Not quite Dariusburst levels of pushing their luck, but close!
What. That's a great price. The idea that shmups aren't worth 40 bucks is poisonous.
the androgyne
Member
I meant in terms of their chances for proving much to publishers at that price. I just hope the price is right such that they can continue doing more.
Me personally... it's still a little high. It's not just that it's a shooter, it's also 20 years old and relatively speaking, comparable games can be had for cheaper. I'm keen to see what 3d classics style "Grantanoff" features they add, or even what of the Saturn options it retains, before making a decision.
Don't mind me, still salty i haven't bought Darius; don't want the Vita version (too small) and no sales on the digital only PS4 release
Me personally... it's still a little high. It's not just that it's a shooter, it's also 20 years old and relatively speaking, comparable games can be had for cheaper. I'm keen to see what 3d classics style "Grantanoff" features they add, or even what of the Saturn options it retains, before making a decision.
Don't mind me, still salty i haven't bought Darius; don't want the Vita version (too small) and no sales on the digital only PS4 release
the androgyne
Member
Not from the same era no, i was referencing stuff like Resogun, Raiden IV, Soldner X2, Sine Mora, things the average punter would think are more impressive for less at a cursory glance.
But if you're talking emulation, then most emulated games (not just shooters) are cheaper too, so people would expect that kind of price. If you compare to Sega 3d classics which are kind of ported... they're still really cheap, even for the arcade ones.
I realise there's other factors like M2 publishing being different to Sega publishing, and the game being more obscure etc at play though.
But if you're talking emulation, then most emulated games (not just shooters) are cheaper too, so people would expect that kind of price. If you compare to Sega 3d classics which are kind of ported... they're still really cheap, even for the arcade ones.
I realise there's other factors like M2 publishing being different to Sega publishing, and the game being more obscure etc at play though.
My issue isn't with the fact that it's a shmup, the lack of a physical option makes it not worth the $40. I was ready to go for the premium but digital only is a deal breaker on that. I'll wait for a discount.
drangleic tourism
Member
So the code could only be redeemed on a JPN account? Or could we add it to a NA account if we imported the physical LE?
ThePeoplesBureau
Member
You will only be able redeem the code on a Japanese PSN account.
StarCreator
Member
I love physical releases as much as the next guy, but if something is digital only then it's digital only. These days there isn't a huge difference between physical and digital anyway; everything phones home and requires installation to the hard drive anyway. As much as I want a physical release, I also understand that not buying something I want leads to the wrong message to the publisher that says I don't want it at all, and that runs counter to wanting M2 to do more in the future.
drangleic tourism
Member
This is really the only reason I would have preferred a disc.
I wonder if playasia or another western friendly site will get the LE.
Yeah it isn't ideal and definitely frustrating for collectors. Considering how great M2's Sega Ages releases were, I feel this has to be because they can't afford a low blu-ray print run.
sixteen-bit
Member
I meant in terms of their chances for proving much to publishers at that price. I just hope the price is right such that they can continue doing more.
Me personally... it's still a little high. It's not just that it's a shooter, it's also 20 years old and relatively speaking, comparable games can be had for cheaper. I'm keen to see what 3d classics style "Grantanoff" features they add, or even what of the Saturn options it retains, before making a decision.
Don't mind me, still salty i haven't bought Darius; don't want the Vita version (too small) and no sales on the digital only PS4 release
It's been as low as $25 on PSN
hikarutilmitt
Member
So... we get it ported or we don't get it ported. Either we get it digitally or not at all. This is likely an artifact of M2 self-publishing but this sentiment of "I want thing. Now I can have thing but not how I want thing, so now thing is bad and I don't want it" is silly, to me.
I have the opposite problem where I'd rather have packages like this for LEs because most games I will buy digitally.
Yeah it isn't ideal and definitely frustrating for collectors. Considering how great M2's Sega Ages releases were, I feel this has to be because they can't afford a low blu-ray print run.
It's unfortunate, but if they can give me what I want, I can't really justify paying out for it. There might be a good reason for it, but honestly the existence of an LE that has no game with it makes that a bit hard to swallow.
I'm not willing to pay $40 for the game digitally. I'm not protesting it's existence, I'm just not happy with the release, not willing to pay a premium for a release that isn't worth it to me.
Also ironic how you say it's silly to you then go on to talk about how it's your preferred release and complain about how you don't like the way LEs are normally sold. Buying games digitally for any price even remotely close to what a game would retail for is silly to me but that doesn't mean I can't understand that other people have different preferences than I do.
I'd be willing to buy the LE to get the game physically and even pay a premium on top of that. Since that's not an option I'll wait for the digital price to drop to something I feel is worth it and buy it later. Not real difficult concept to understand.
StarCreator
Member
I guess my real question to you is why the game being a digital download makes it any less a game than a game being encoded on a plastic disc that will probably become unreadable in 10-20 years anyway. You're approaching this as if it's the Persona 4 Social Link Expansion (which literally did not include the game in any form) but it seems to me there's an unusually high premium being attached to physical media when there is no real effective difference at this point.
PepsimanVsJoe
Member
I'm on the fence because I don't know if I like Garegga that much.
In the eyes of most it's a classic, best in the genre and all that, but the optimal way to play it just never clicked with me.
Watching Kamui - and the other top-players - destroy it is always fun though.
In the eyes of most it's a classic, best in the genre and all that, but the optimal way to play it just never clicked with me.
Watching Kamui - and the other top-players - destroy it is always fun though.
I haven't had any discs become unreadable and I have plenty of PlayStation and Saturn games that would be around the 20 year mark.
Discs generally last a lot longer than online services and HDDs both of which I've seen bite the dust. I don't want the game attached to an online account and hardware.
I don't see the value in dropping $40 on a digital download, particularly when the company putting it out is capable of putting out an expensive LE set. If you do, good for you buy the game full price and enjoy it, I'll wait for it to get cheaper. It's not like they're going to run out of digital copies anyway so there's no rush.
wild wild rice
Member
Do we know if these M2 ShotTriggers are coming to NA? I need all of them.
the androgyne
Member
US PSN? I only have EU & JP at the moment and haven't seen it drop there.
sixteen-bit
Member
I think it's been as low as 20.99€ with a Plus sub.
And to correct myself from earlier, on NA PSN it was $19.99 during the flash sale in July.
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Cool writeup on Garegga's musical influences i found the other day. Relevant cuz the disc in the premium release is a soundtrack, lol.
http://fetchquests.tumblr.com/post/49842230887/detroit-garegga
StarCreator
Member
PSN launched on the PS3 and still operates just fine on the PS3 today. The PSP is the only hardware for which a direct connection for PSN has been shut down for, but even then, there are still plenty of options for installing games from PSN onto a PSP. So no, PSN has not "bitten the dust".
I'm also not sure you're aware of how a PS4 works but in most cases the game is tying to your online account and using the HDD in some way regardless of whether you inserted a disc or started a download. In the end it's the same bits and bytes.
Sure, you could store the discs away and they'll probably last a few decades until the glues holding the layers together finally separate, but if you're actually using them as games, they're likely not going to last nearly as long. I've had PlayStation games literally shatter in my hands. I've yet to lose any game I've downloaded for any platform in such a fashion.