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[Dubz]

Focusing on Kinect was a fool's errand. The people who cared about it before have already tired of it, and the people who are actually going to be buying an Xbone want nothing to do with it.

This post pretty much nails it for me.

 

[Justified]

There were plenty of rumors that they were going to do that, but the cable companies weren't interested. They tend to balk at anything that replaces their hardware with someone else's, and they loathe anything that makes it easier to buy or rent content through anyone but themselves.

Yea didnt Comcast come out with their own "X1" box?


*edit*

Yea they did, so much for MS trying to "own the living room" with cable companies in the way

 

[KorrZ]

In my experience with the XBONE so far, the Kinect is the only way to navigate around the UI. Trying to do so with a controller is clunk and frustrating, and the voice commands work really well actually.

I do agree that it has no gaming value at this point though.

 

[ItIsOkBro]

In my experience with the XBONE so far, the Kinect is the only way to navigate around the UI. Trying to do so with a controller is clunk and frustrating, and the voice commands work really well actually.

I do agree that it has no gaming value at this point though.

There's a technical term for this, I forget what it is. When someone doesn't put effort into something because it's easier using something else.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Is the gap all that's important? Is it not possible to be considered a success if the gap is massive?

If it barely outsells the 360 while turning a profit, shareholders might not scrap the entire program, sure. Be considered a success? Not after the billions they poured into Xbox in the 2000s. The One is supposed to be the "long game" reward for the entire home console venture. Being outsold 2:1 by Sony - the company they joined the console market to limit market expansion of in the first place - is unacceptable 15 years down the road.

Any loss in total unit sales or XBL membership would be catastrophic. The division would be sold off before the end of the generation.

 

[E92 M3]

I really don't want to see the Xbox brand go down -- have so much invested in the ecosystem. Selfish reasons, but I'd be pretty mad if everything just fell apart. Microsoft just needs to make some changes quickly and efficiently.

 

[imae]

If they took out the Kinect, and lowered the price accordingly, It would be a more appealing purchase for me personally. When I think about purchasing the Xbone I feel, almost subconsciously, like I'm paying money for something(Kinect) that I don't really want. I can't be the only one.

It still needs (exclusive) games that I want to play before I'll purchase it anyway though.

 

[SwiftDeath]

I kind of get that, but that phone is still $500-700 without a 2 year contract that basically means it's almost double that. XBL/PS+ is just ~$50 for a full year of service, so there are differences. But there are a LOT of stupid features we eat up and not complain, features that sometimes seem like the only thing added to that years revision still most buy it. I am saying most because I don't do that and many don't do that, yet many of those people complain about paying $100 more for an 5 year minumum investment.

Those added features ARE NOT what costs the $100 extra, the kinect IS adding that cost.

There is no argument wherein which the kinect is not adding SIGNIFICANT cost to the XB1. It objectively is.

Hell most of those gimmicky cellphone features that you are talking about are software solutions that add ZERO cost to the phone. Siri, Samsungs crazy eye following tech, and so on.

People buy the latest phone because they want the newest and best tech. If anything that habit would indicate they value performance which is not a boon to the XB1's current price/performance ratio.

Still why is it acceptable there, but here in gaming we basically rage over it, don;t even try it and write it off, like you did, as a gimmick. I am not saying this will be the most revolutionary peripheral yet, but even at one point the joystick on the N64 controller was a gimmick that most games passed over at the beginning, it later revolutionized gaming. Sure sure MS is never going to be Nintendo, but at least give the chance.

The joystick on the N64 was immediately used in the MAJORITY OF GAMES on the GAMING CONSOLE. It immediately validated it's existence to anyone and everyone who used the product. If you asked a consumer who used the N64 how would you feel if Nintendo offered a controller without a joystick they would look at you like your crazy because the N64 WOULDN'T WORK without the joysitck whereas the XB1 would work fine without the kinect.

I have the X1 and love Kinect. It is no gimmick to me, it is a legit way to work the UI and improve it. Setting up the X1 and getting to use it was part of the most fun thing i did with the console and the thing that mostly screamed to me " wow this feels new!". I love my PS4, but it still feels like PC/2 or PS3.9

It's great that you feel that way but does it not seem sad to you that "the most fun you had" on a new gaming console was using the kinect to work the UI and not actually playing a new game?

Clearly the general public does not value the kinect as you do in the least bit. That's all that matters.

It is not the only way, only that the "manual" way take too long or is in another alternate way. You are complaining that Kinect, without you having to press anything at all, recognizes you and log you in. It is similar to what you ask, which I see no problem in having or adding later( and it WILL be added), but it is better. He is how my day goes: I come home from work, go into my apt, Xbox On, do stuff, stand in front, logs in, do stuff, Xbox do..., do stuff, xbox ... All this before even sitting down and turning on the controller. Are you really trying to tell this is horrible or way worse sitting down and waiting for it. Sure it saves me minutes, maybe just seconds, but It feels great, it feels new, it feels like the future to me. I just can;t see why you and other see it as bad and then only offer wha tI see as dumb arguments against it. One extra button press, give the choice to make it more cumbersome.

KEEP THE KINECT FUNCTIONALITY. I never ever said to remove kinect functionality, that's dumb. What consumer wants less options? Just add the abilty to auto-login by setting it to one account. Why should they not allow this?

You can set it to either kinect login for you or auto-login like every other console.

It's again GREAT THAT YOU LOVE THE KINECT but the general masses clearly do not value a kinect at $100 more than the PS4.

 

[jimmypop]

In my days, they used to be called games.

Yeah, referring to games as "experiences" is where I stop reading the PR. I have experiences playing games. I don't play "experiences".

Will MS be offering the XB1 in different "colorways"? I hope they can wrap my "experiences" up in "social" as well.

 

[DrunkDan]

So were they saying that Kinect was a reason to purchase a One over a PS4 originally?

 

[LanielLayDewis]

Firstly, overbiased isn't a word. Second, I bought an Xbox One with my hard earned money, and have therefore earned the right to voice an opinion on the product that I purchased. I don't see the value of the peripheral. If hearing someone saying that incites that kind of response from you, then you need to deal with those emotions on your own time. Don't attack me for doing what many reasonable people have done with their Xbox One -- not use the Kinect.

The levels of menus you are forced to navigate on Xbox One that Kinect saves you from doing are services that are immediately achievable on the PS4 with one button. Many people, including the console reviewers from various publications, have cited that it appears as though the non-Kinect method has been made complicated for the sole purpose of forcing the use of Kinect. This is a software issue that can be easily addressed, yelling that someone is biased because they would prefer an easier method for accessing services without Kinect does more to demonstrate your bias than anything.

I am not attacking you, just stating that your complaint about having to press TWO extra button as the end all is stupid, even more when you compain that it should be easier to get the Xbox to record that having to go through a lot of menus. " I have to press two extra buttons? Nah Kinect sucks!" Is not a valid excuse to anyone to condemn a piece of hardware. Laziness is not a meter or an excuse for your bias/hate, even more when you spent that hard earned money on something you knew you wanted and you knew how it would work.

This is a discussion forum I am only discussing what I see as your invalid excuses to bash the peripheral, it does not affect me that you pay $500 of hard earned money on a console that you were going to knowingly partially use. Why not get the PS4 or wait for a price drop or SKU? Either you love DR3 as much as I do, or any other launch game, or you bought the X1 to experience the Kinect and it's other features. You most likely had a PS3/360/Wii/Pc already so why spend the money to bash it?Why havent you sold the Kinect through Ebay then? You seem to hate it so much. MS never lied about that, not even the almost 100% responsiveness of the Kinect. You should at least give it a try. I was skeptical, I tried it, I loved it. It can be better or it could be a lot worse, but for what they intended it works perfectly for me.

Also you do know that the Kinect is the method intended to control the UI, this is why using the controller can sometimes be more cumbersome, though not impossible and not as bad as they describe. I don't know if you remember when joysticks came in and the d-pad sort of was out. Did you not struggle, as I still do sometimes, trying to control the menu/character/game with the d-pad only to find out that it was used for another type of input. That "small" change made a lot of thing different a "hard" at first but we adapted. I see it as the EXACT same thing with kinect, hopefully it can stick. The PSeye also does this or parts of it.

And sorry for making up a word, but English is not my first language and you understood what I had to say, so you don't have to be a condecending smartass .

 

[semiconscious]

Focusing on Kinect was a fool's errand. The people who cared about it before have already tired of it, and the people who are actually going to be buying an Xbone want nothing to do with it.

said it before: if they'd really wanted kinect to be an integral part of the xbone, they never should've released the 1.0 version. because this is the direct result of doing so...

 

[Nafai1123]

So were they saying that Kinect was a reason to purchase a One over a PS4 originally?

Polygon's 24hr unboxing livestreams.

Never forget.

OT, they need to drastically overhaul the UI so they can feasibly remove Kinect. My guess is that's what they are trying to accomplish by the end of the year.

 

[FairXchange]

Also you do know that the Kinect is the method intended to control the UI, this is why using the controller can sometimes be more cumbersome, though not impossible and not as bad as they describe.

Who are 'they'? I described the menu navigation as cumbersome without Kinect, and that is a problem! Why do I need to talk to my device, this alienates people that rather use another form of input to control their technology. Why alienate an established userbase by forcing voice controls, it makes zero sense. It's almost like if Steam made it harder to use keyboard and mouse on their client, and tried to sell an expensive microphone to people, and asked them learn strange voice inputs like "Steam, Show Me .. ".

And sorry for making up a word, but English is not my first language and you understood what I had to say, so you don't have to be a condecending smartass .

English not being your first language is fine, throwing an accusation of bias at me (whilst not using a real word) is the problem. Your entire argument is that if you don't like Kinect, you're biased. I find that questionable, and you should probably work on a new angle.

 

[LanielLayDewis]

Those added features ARE NOT what costs the $100 extra, the kinect IS adding that cost.

There is no argument wherein which the kinect is not adding SIGNIFICANT cost to the XB1. It objectively is.

Hell most of those gimmicky cellphone features that you are talking about are software solutions that add ZERO cost to the phone. Siri, Samsungs crazy eye following tech, and so on.

People buy the latest phone because they want the newest and best tech. If anything that habit would indicate they value performance which is not a boon to the XB1's current price/performance ratio.

I am not arguing that the Kinect doe snot add significant cost, but that is is the same type of feature. You can argue that none of those features cost $100 dollar to make, yet those phones are still $500 to 700 a pop each year. Add to that the data plans. They buy it because they want that tech, but do they actually get it. IMO adding a better kinect after8 years is a lot more admisible than adding a stupid thumb print or better screen and more cost just one year removed. We are comparing a one years investment at $500 to a 5 year minimum investment for $500 too.

So what is the better value here? Hell people paid $100 for stupid guitar Hero controller for just that game

The joystick on the N64 was immediately used in the MAJORITY OF GAMES on the GAMING CONSOLE. It immediately validated it's existence to anyone and everyone who used the product. If you asked a consumer who used the N64 how would you feel if Nintendo offered a controller without a joystick they would look at you like your crazy because the N64 WOULDN'T WORK without the joysitck whereas the XB1 would work fine without the kinect.

And the Kinect was immediately ued with the X1 to set it up, run and control the OS, open games, record and eery other feature that made it "new" to me. It immediately validated it's existence, it just ahsn;t done so for gaming. IMO I blame lack of innovation from developers, but as for the Kinect for it's original use for the X1. Just as you say about the jostick I can say about the kinect, though I know it is just my opinion here. As far as the OS experience goes I can't imagine going back to the X360 or using the X1 Os without the Kinect so for me it has value

It's great that you feel that way but does it not seem sad to you that "the most fun you had" on a new gaming console was using the kinect to work the UI and not actually playing a new game?

Clearly the general public does not value the kinect as you do in the least bit. That's all that matters.

You missunderstand me, I mean the most fun with the console as in OS and features. I love the PS4 for what it will do, but the OS is nothing to write home about. The home button is nice, but was done by Nintendo before, but the console experience seems dissapointing for the PS4. For me it works because it made me say hmm it is faster, but that's it. I could just as well bought as new PS3 redesign with a OS redesign and it would feel the same. This is what I mean by most fun. Opening, setting up and playing around with the X1 OS with the Kinect has been the most fun out of all the console experience.

Games are another story, but still MS was better. DR3 is my most played launch game, followed by KI and then AC4 for PS4. I liked Killzone but hate it with a vengenace later on when it got really cheap. First time I've wanted to hurl the controller in a long long time. Knack was ok, but felt too long and I lost interest. Ryse was an amazing showpiece for the hardware, but shallow, though it was short so it was ok. ( IMO Knack should have been as long as Ryse and Ryse longer)

Still the games are not here. They will start gettin here with Titansfall/MGSV: GrounZeroes/ Infamous. That is when it truly starts.

KEEP THE KINECT FUNCTIONALITY. I never ever said to remove kinect functionality, that's dumb. What consumer wants less options? Just add the abilty to auto-login by setting it to one account. Why should they not allow this?

You can set it to either kinect login for you or auto-login like every other console.

It's again GREAT THAT YOU LOVE THE KINECT but the general masses clearly do not value a kinect at $100 more than the PS4.

This they will DEFINETLY add in a future update like they always do. YOu can complain about the experience now, but Ms has always done an awesome job at listening for stuff to improve in their eventual updates. This being one of them, and if they don't want to undermine the Kinect? Well mix it. It could let you have a default account and you tell it how to access it, for example automatically, kinect recognize, just a confirm after setting the default the xbox1 asks if this is the desired profile, you just say yes) Solved.

General masses do not value a $100 Kinect I get that, but that does not mean it is doomed, or it failed, or it won't catch on. Even Sony has done this with the eye. So hopefully, at least for OS sake, the can improve it.

Kinect for games, well that is another story all together I'd love to discuss or explore since I think it is viable too.

 

[CadetMahoney]

Microsoft have really screwed themselves into a corner here. The casuals that they hoped to attract do not give a shit and the gaming crowd are being driven towards the cheaper and more powerful PS4. Personally, I have warmed up to the idea of using it, but the writing is on the wall. It is a dead in the water forced add-on that is proving to be nothing more than an albatross. Nobody wants it, developers don't want to use it and it makes the system too expensive. Just calling a spade a spade.

It's only a matter of time before 3rd party devs can totally ignore bone and PS4/PC gamers no longer need to suffer lowered quality games for parity.

 

[LanielLayDewis]

Who are 'they'? I described the menu navigation as cumbersome without Kinect, and that is a problem! Why do I need to talk to my device, this alienates people that rather use another form of input to control their technology. Why alienate an established userbase by forcing voice controls, it makes zero sense. It's almost like if Steam made it harder to use keyboard and mouse on their client, and tried to sell an expensive microphone to people, and asked them learn strange voice inputs like "Steam, Show Me .. ". .

The original "they" is MS and their vision and now "they" are the consumer, me, the player, xbox user that is loving the new Kinect experience and they are the ones that are not enjoying it because they have the wrong expectations from it. It's is similar IMO to complaining about not having keys in a touchphone. Why so afraid of change? Really why?

I get that using a controller is cumbersome with the OS, but that is only because it was designed to be used with the Kinect. I'm sure MS will make updates to accomodate your complaints eventually, but they don't seem valid to me when you jumped into a console that we knew since day one that is was going to use voice commands, all the time. You said you spent your hard earned money on this WHY?!?!?!? Y ou seem to hate it or at least the whole of the experience!! You still have time to sell it on ebay and get a PS4.

I'm sorry, are you shy and afraid of speaking in public? even when alone. Have we gotten so disconnected to this world that to speak to something to make it work is seen as bad and more cumbersome than exerting actual physical force? The future is here and we want analog input? Don't you have friends you speak too, even online? Is it so bad that you can speak to your console and it understand you almost 100% of the time? I guess if it was a choice, but you know it was not and still you spent your hard earned $$$$$$ on an X1 when the PS4 is cheaper and "better" like many say.

Alienate an establioshed userbase? What userbase? The X1 is new and we all knew what it was going to be with Kinect and all. It is to late in the game to complain about it it is not my fault you didn't know what you were getting into.

Are you truly comparing it to Steam and Valve....really? First of all their usual platform is the PC. The PC uses a keyboard and mouse. If Steam made their own Pc with their own input method they could make it what they want...oh wait THEY DID. They are making their own "console" and controller and most likely people will say it sucks until they use it. So no that argument it specifically invalid with Valve/Steam since they are trying this. They can still fail though.

English not being your first language is fine, throwing an accusation of bias at me (whilst not using a real word) is the problem. Your entire argument is that if you don't like Kinect, you're biased. I find that questionable, and you should probably work on a new angle.

Come on man...this is what I am talking about. Stop acting all wounded by being condescending to me. I understand what bias means and IMO if you have an X1 but have not used the Kinec tby choice while at the same time bashing it you must have a certain degree of bias against it or MS. I get that perfectly. Also Bias is not a english language word only, you do know that right? It translates and it is used in other languages. The fact that you think not is what makes what you accuse me of condescending...

If you acually made sense of what I had to say, you would understand my poin. And that is that I don't get why you think a stupid excuse (extra button press? then complaint about record being too hard?) is reason enough to justify your hate/bias/disagreement/dislike or whatever word you feel fits to your relationship with Kinect. Still you ignore my arguments agains your point by being condescending so yeah. Try it, understand it and then hate it, and if you think it sucks then cool it's your opinion, but if not you clearly have a bias.

 

[Village]

Meanwhile on PS4

I might be actually be dying laughing HALP.

 

[SwiftDeath]

I am not arguing that the Kinect doe snot add significant cost, but that is is the same type of feature. You can argue that none of those features cost $100 dollar to make, yet those phones are still $500 to 700 a pop each year. Add to that the data plans. They buy it because they want that tech, but do they actually get it. IMO adding a better kinect after8 years is a lot more admisible than adding a stupid thumb print or better screen and more cost just one year removed. We are comparing a one years investment at $500 to a 5 year minimum investment for $500 too.

So what is the better value here? Hell people paid $100 for stupid guitar Hero controller for just that game

Video Game Consoles are not and will never be as practical or multi-use capable as cell phones.

You could go months without using your consoles and still have a high quality of life. Living a couple of months without a cell phone would be hell to most people.

Trying to validate the existence of kinect as anything but a ultimately unnecessary gimmick based on the fact that people buy new phones year in year out is entirely flawed logic. They are in no way comparable.

The plastic instruments craze [guitar hero and the like] was a billion dollar craze that validated its existence in the willingness of people to buy PERIPHERALS to play the games. By that argument, kinect should be a PERIPHERAL and justify its existence JUST LIKE the "stupid guitar hero controllers" had to.

And the Kinect was immediately ued with the X1 to set it up, run and control the OS, open games, record and eery other feature that made it "new" to me. It immediately validated it's existence, it just ahsn;t done so for gaming. IMO I blame lack of innovation from developers, but as for the Kinect for it's original use for the X1.

Kinect validated it's existence to YOU. I cannot repeat this enough apparently but your love and affection for the kinect is great but it is clearly not how the GENERAL MARKET feels about the kinect as sales show. If kinect was truly appealing the price difference would not be leading to such sales disparity between the XB1 and PS4.

Just as you say about the jostick I can say about the kinect, though I know it is just my opinion here. As far as the OS experience goes I can't imagine going back to the X360 or using the X1 Os without the Kinect so for me it has value

NO you cannot not. Not objectively and hell not even subjectively man.

People use the XB1 without the kinect. That alone objectively proves it is in no way anything like the addition of a joystick in a controller when the majority of games rely/depend on that input interface.

If you remove the kinect, the OS isn't as user-friendly to you as it was before. Great but you still have 98% of the functionality and 99.9% of games function exactly the same way.

It is incredibly disingenuous to compare what the kinect brings to the table with what the addition of the joystick to a controller brought to the table.

You missunderstand me, I mean the most fun with the console as in OS and features. I love the PS4 for what it will do, but the OS is nothing to write home about. The home button is nice, but was done by Nintendo before, but the console experience seems dissapointing for the PS4. For me it works because it made me say hmm it is faster, but that's it. I could just as well bought as new PS3 redesign with a OS redesign and it would feel the same. This is what I mean by most fun. Opening, setting up and playing around with the X1 OS with the Kinect has been the most fun out of all the console experience.

That's great. Market doesn't care about kinect and the market [as it should] decides the fate for any product. Your personal subjective opinion on the kinect doesn't validate it's existence as a mandatory pack-in for every consumer

Games are another story, but still MS was better. DR3 is my most played launch game, followed by KI and then AC4 for PS4. I liked Killzone but hate it with a vengenace later on when it got really cheap. First time I've wanted to hurl the controller in a long long time. Knack was ok, but felt too long and I lost interest. Ryse was an amazing showpiece for the hardware, but shallow, though it was short so it was ok. ( IMO Knack should have been as long as Ryse and Ryse longer)

Still the games are not here. They will start gettin here with Titansfall/MGSV: GrounZeroes/ Infamous. That is when it truly starts.

And how did kinect add to your gaming experience on your $500 gaming console that plays videogames?

This they will DEFINETLY add in a future update like they always do. YOu can complain about the experience now, but Ms has always done an awesome job at listening for stuff to improve in their eventual updates. This being one of them, and if they don't want to undermine the Kinect? Well mix it. It could let you have a default account and you tell it how to access it, for example automatically, kinect recognize, just a confirm after setting the default the xbox1 asks if this is the desired profile, you just say yes) Solved.

No idea what you mean by mix it? But yes they will add Automatic login in the future I'm sure. But it is a valid complaint of the system just like I have valid complaints for the PS4. In no way is it wrong for a consumer of your new product to complain about the lack of a feature that already exists on your previous iteration of the product.

As it stands right now the auto-login snafu feels like either a large oversight [certainly possible] or a specific move to add value to the kinect.

General masses do not value a $100 Kinect I get that, but that does not mean it is doomed, or it failed, or it won't catch on. Even Sony has done this with the eye. So hopefully, at least for OS sake, the can improve it.

Uh yes it does. The Sony camera is going to at best have an attach rate of 20 - 30%. In no way shape or form will it get any substantial 3rd party support that is meaningful.

Kinect for games, well that is another story all together I'd love to discuss or explore since I think it is viable too.

Kinect has been in existence for FOUR YEARS and has yet to deliver a compelling game use for it. Kinect 1.0 had an install base north of 21+ million and still failed to deliver a compelling use for it.

When can we accept that the kinect is not a worthwhile device for gaming? Please tell me exactly how long we have to wait until yet again we can accept it is not going to add a worthwhile use case to gaming? 1 year? 2 years? 100 years?

Why must the kinect be a mandatory pack-in if there is no game use for it? Why can't MS deliver the OS support for it if that's its only purpose?

There is no logical reason why the kinect must be a mandatory pack-in. It is a peripheral and should be sold as one.

 

[EBE]

Don't you have to say 'Xbox turn off'? Xbox off won't work.

XBOX OFF doesn't work, only XBOX TURN OFF.

XBOX TURN ON doesn't work either, only XBOX ON.

oddly specific.

I"m sure it's already been pointed out but you don't even know the syntax, as "simple" as it is. "XBOX OFF" doesn't work, it's "XBOX TURN OFF".

See what we mean by "oddly specific syntax"?

haha. yeah, youre all absolutely right. i know it doesnt help my case, but i was just trying to point out how few key voice commands are necessary to effectively navigate the xbox and get things done. the bit in article about needing to look for and read commands from the command list as if there are so many you couldnt ever memorize them all is simply not that factual. you can learn them in all of five minutes, really. (lol, though i apparently didnt)

 

[Mooreberg]

There is going to have a be a SKU without Kinect at some point. The games that people are going to buy the system for (Titanfall, Halo, etc) don't need unless the developers go far out of their way to shoehorn it in.

I don't know what Microsoft saw going on with the Wii/DS software market from 2008 to 2011 that led to believe appealing to an evaporated audience was the way forward. Sony seems to have gotten the message.

 

[SwiftDeath]

haha. yeah, youre all absolutely right. i know it doesnt help my case, but i was just trying to point out how few key voice commands are necessary to effectively navigate the xbox and get things done. the bit in article about needing to look for and read commands from the command list as if there are so many you couldnt ever memorize them all is simply not that factual. you can learn them in all of five minutes, really. (lol, though i apparently didnt)

I think you can see why to the average reader here you're not making a very strong case for it?

 

[dcx4610]

There would still be some backlash at a $349 Xbox One without Kinect due to its lack of power but would likely be a much tighter race sales race.

I don't need a camera to play a game. Sure, Kinect has the potential to do a lot of cool things but as of right now, it's only use for the most part are voice commands (which are spotty at best). That's not a good enough reason to bump the system price $100 more than the competition. Microsoft had lofty goals on what they could with Kinect but as of now they aren't panning out and it's unnecessarily hurting their business.

The bad thing is while the Kinect is technically optional, the system was built with the camera in mind. It's like a Wii U with the gamepad. Both should be peripherals but instead systems were built around them.

 

[EBE]

I think you can see why to the average reader here you're not making a very strong case for it?

i just goofed up in my original post. it was late at night, i had class in the morning, couldnt be bothered to edit.

i still contend that the voice commands are simple enough to pick up on rather quickly.

 

[3rdamention]

Microsoft simply including Kinect in the Xbox One package for $500 wasn't the sole screw up. They messed this up in so many ways.



First, they included Kinect in a package that was less powerful than their competitor and that costed $100 more than their competitor.

They had no compelling games or software to be used with Kinect. On the 360, Kinect had a reputation as a gaming device. It was the thing you played Kinect Sports and Kinectimals with. At launch, there were ZERO games that made you want to use the Kinect with. The Kinect, at launch, was more of a controller for TV, Voice, and Gestures.

Which brings me to TV. Kinect works great with your digital television provider, as long as you live in the United States. Outside of the US, people are only able to use Kinect for voice and gestures, and a Kinect Game Demo or two. Plus, there is no goal as for when TV is coming to other markets. Which takes us to voice and gestures.

Voice and hand gestures are cool and all, but they aren't for everyone. The amount of time they work consistently varies for everyone. As Ben detailed in his Polygon article, and as many on these forums have detailed, it works for him 80% of the time and much less than that for his wife and kids. He even mentioned that sometimes it is just easier to use a remote. Plus, for some commands, you have to have patience to learn them. If you want to play a movie or a specific album, you have to use the full name of them. Its not rocket science, but you have to be patient to "learn how" to communicate more effectively with Kinect and Xbox One via voice. That doesn't even touch on the fact that some markets cannot even use Voice controls yet because it doesn't recognize their languages. Some people aren't going to have the patience to use the voice and hand gestures, or wait for them to be added to their markets, and now, the PlayStation 4 has been throwing out some voice gestures in games, so the feature isn't even that unique anymore.


In closing, I dont really know what the end game is for Kinect. It doesn't have compelling software, it doesn't work for TV in all the markets, the voice and hand gestures aren't consistent and are frustrating for some, and it drives up the price of the Xbox One. Is the Kinect a voice controller, a gesture controller, a game controller, a microphone? Well its all of those, but just hasn't proven to be a master at any of them, not at this point. And Microsoft may be running out of time to prove exactly what it is, and what it can be. If they keep sliding further behind the PS4 in North America, they may no longer even need to prove its worth if they have to cut it from the package to gain traction.

 

[SwiftDeath]

i just goofed up in my original post. it was late at night, i had class in the morning, couldnt be bothered to edit.

i still contend that the voice commands are simple enough to pick up on rather quickly.

And yet you made a factual error in the most basic of commands for the XB1.

Clearly it is not oddly specific at all...

 

[EBE]

And yet you made a factual error in the most basic of commands for the XB1.

Clearly it is not oddly specific at all...

its not though! 'oddly specific' would be having to speak in weird computer jargon like youre sifting through heavy computer code just to get youtube open. "xbox go to.."xbox snap game DVR.." its not oddly specific. its just specific.

 

[Vigilant Gambit]

PS4 outsold Xbone worldwide despite Xbone having a head start in most of the territories they both launched in. Despite significant supply shortages that have persisted for months after Xbones became widely available towards the end of December.

This will continue to be the case unless they're able to price Xbone competitively to the PS4. The general messaging is: PS4 is both cheaper and more powerful than Xbone. Xbone comes with a cool camera, but you're forced to buy it even if you don't want it.

I want an Xbone eventually, but I will not buy one while I lack the choice of a Kinect-free product.

 

[Jut]

the mandatory Kinect idea made no sense from the day they announced it.

there are no games being made.

even if games were made motion gaming is dead.

voice recognition is mediocore at bbest.

this begs the question: why burden the Xbox with this peripheral?

the only real reason i see worth it is the marketing data, etc the camera collects when it was to be always on. they have to be coming up with a way to go kinectless now. admit the horrible, out of touch decision and get rid of kinect.

ms has touble making excusives as is. last gen most of them were terrible motion games. they can't do both.

 

[SwiftDeath]

its not though! 'oddly specific' would be having to speak in weird computer jargon like youre sifting through heavy computer code just to get youtube open. "xbox go to.."xbox snap game DVR.." its not oddly specific. its just specific.

Xbox On -> Xbox Turn Off

Xbox Off doesn't work. Not oddly specific at all

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

The original "they" is MS and their vision and now "they" are the consumer, me, the player, xbox user that is loving the new Kinect experience and they are the ones that are not enjoying it because they have the wrong expectations from it. It's is similar IMO to complaining about not having keys in a touchphone. Why so afraid of change? Really why?

I get that using a controller is cumbersome with the OS, but that is only because it was designed to be used with the Kinect. I'm sure MS will make updates to accomodate your complaints eventually, but they don't seem valid to me when you jumped into a console that we knew since day one that is was going to use voice commands, all the time. You said you spent your hard earned money on this WHY?!?!?!? Y ou seem to hate it or at least the whole of the experience!! You still have time to sell it on ebay and get a PS4.

I'm sorry, are you shy and afraid of speaking in public? even when alone. Have we gotten so disconnected to this world that to speak to something to make it work is seen as bad and more cumbersome than exerting actual physical force? The future is here and we want analog input? Don't you have friends you speak too, even online? Is it so bad that you can speak to your console and it understand you almost 100% of the time? I guess if it was a choice, but you know it was not and still you spent your hard earned $$$$$$ on an X1 when the PS4 is cheaper and "better" like many say.

Alienate an establioshed userbase? What userbase? The X1 is new and we all knew what it was going to be with Kinect and all. It is to late in the game to complain about it it is not my fault you didn't know what you were getting into.

Are you truly comparing it to Steam and Valve....really? First of all their usual platform is the PC. The PC uses a keyboard and mouse. If Steam made their own Pc with their own input method they could make it what they want...oh wait THEY DID. They are making their own "console" and controller and most likely people will say it sucks until they use it. So no that argument it specifically invalid with Valve/Steam since they are trying this. They can still fail though.




Come on man...this is what I am talking about. Stop acting all wounded by being condescending to me. I understand what bias means and IMO if you have an X1 but have not used the Kinec tby choice while at the same time bashing it you must have a certain degree of bias against it or MS. I get that perfectly. Also Bias is not a english language word only, you do know that right? It translates and it is used in other languages. The fact that you think not is what makes what you accuse me of condescending...

If you acually made sense of what I had to say, you would understand my poin. And that is that I don't get why you think a stupid excuse (extra button press? then complaint about record being too hard?) is reason enough to justify your hate/bias/disagreement/dislike or whatever word you feel fits to your relationship with Kinect. Still you ignore my arguments agains your point by being condescending so yeah. Try it, understand it and then hate it, and if you think it sucks then cool it's your opinion, but if not you clearly have a bias.

Having a good cvoice UI is not mutually exclusive with having a good controller UI. They can, and should, complement one another. MS is one of the the largest software companies in the world, the idea that they can't design a UI that simultaneously is good for Kinect and for controller users is insulting. Especially since the 360, their own product, already does so.

Steambox is a terrible example to hang your hat on, because they are all going to bomb.

 

[Ape]

Reading all this and I remember that at one point the Xbox would STOP WORKING if you unplugged the Kinect. How insane.

 

[SwiftDeath]

Having a good cvoice UI is not mutually exclusive with having a good controller UI. They can, and should, complement one another. MS is one of the the largest software companies in the world, the idea that they can't design a UI that simultaneously is good for Kinect and for controller users is insulting. Especially since the 360, their own product, already does so.

Quite frankly I don't understand why with voice controls the UI would matter at all. I mean if the XB1 had a terrific UI designed first and foremost for controller use how would that negatively affect voice control?

You use voice controls to jump between Apps and the like. Any UI would be fine for that.

 

[EBE]

Xbox On -> Xbox Turn Off

Xbox Off doesn't work. Not oddly specific at all

i dont know. odd is unexpected or unusual. if the command were Xbox Turn On would Xbox Turn Off seem so odd? the command just seems so obvious and not at all difficult to understand.

off all the really good points ive seen you argue on this thread i feel this is the one thats on the shakiest ground. i dont know what more to say, man.

 

[see5harp]

In my experience with the XBONE so far, the Kinect is the only way to navigate around the UI. Trying to do so with a controller is clunk and frustrating, and the voice commands work really well actually.

I do agree that it has no gaming value at this point though.

This plus xbox record that along with power on off when watching netflix. Not needing a controller for those tasks is awesome but I do think a lower price point is needed. They can always enable a guide button sequence for the record functions.

 

[RubenCordeiro]

In my days, they used to be called games.

I laughed, so true.

 

[Justified]

I cant create threads so I'll post this in the closest related thread:

But even Forbes is calling for MS to sell of the XBox division

http://www.forbes.com/sites/adamhar...d-give-xbox-one-to-nintendo/?partner=yahootix

Microsoft has a new CEO. And a new Chairman. The new CEO says the company needs to focus on core markets. And analysts are making the same cry.

Amidst this organizational change, XBox continues its long history of losing money – as much as $2 billion per year.

While calling XBox One a failure may be premature, Microsoft investors have plenty to worry about.

When businesses fall into profit-killing price wars the big winner is the one who figures out how to exit first.

Microsoft could also probably keep a piece of the business (in Nintendo stock) that it could sell at a future date if the “suicide” console business ever turns into something profitable.

Sometimes smart leadership is knowing when to “cut and run.”

 

[SwiftDeath]

i dont know. odd is unexpected or unusual. if the command were Xbox Turn On would Xbox Turn Off seem so odd? the command just seems so obvious and not at all difficult to understand.

off all the really good points ive seen you argue on this thread i feel this is the one thats on the shakiest ground. i dont know what more to say, man.

I will certainly concede that whether or not kinect commands are "oddly specific" is entirely subjective and far less obvious to understand how the average consumer would view them then many of the other things being argued here but the simple notion that a user cannot say "Xbox Go to Ryse" and instead must say "Xbox Go to Ryse: Son of Rome" when the PS4 understands "AC" instead of "Assassin's Creed IV" Black Flag" among a slew of other possible names that PS4 understands for that game seems oddly specific to me.

 

[Zerin]

i dont know. odd is unexpected or unusual. if the command were Xbox Turn On would Xbox Turn Off seem so odd? the command just seems so obvious and not at all difficult to understand.

off all the really good points ive seen you argue on this thread i feel this is the one thats on the shakiest ground. i dont know what more to say, man.

Xbox Off can be misheard and do things like pause. Xbox On is likely more forgiving/easier for the Kinect processor that is on its own listening for the command to turn on.

 

[see5harp]

I cant create threads so I'll post this in the closest related thread:

But even Forbes are call for MS to sell of the XBox division

http://www.forbes.com/sites/adamhar...d-give-xbox-one-to-nintendo/?partner=yahootix

"Forbes"

 

[EBE]

I will certainly concede that whether or not kinect commands are "oddly specific" is entirely subjective and far less obvious to understand how the average consumer would view them then many of the other things being argued here but the simple notion that a user cannot say "Xbox Go to Ryse" and instead must say "Xbox Go to Ryse: Son of Rome" when the PS4 understands "AC" instead of "Assassin's Creed IV" Black Flag" among a slew of other possible names that PS4 understands for that game seems oddly specific to me.

oh does it? ive never seen PS4 commands. well then yeah its a bit weird. but thats hardly a limitation of the technology. im sure the kinect could be patched to work in a similar fashion. but once you get two or three COD games on there then youre going to need whatever subtitle theyre using anyway.

 

[SwiftDeath]

oh does it? ive never seen PS4 commands. well then yeah its a bit weird. but thats hardly a limitation of the technology. im sure the kinect could be patched to work in a similar fashion. but once you get two or three COD games on there then youre going to need whatever subtitle theyre using anyway.

Right thus it's oddly specific because it should be perfectly capable of the same thing

 

[schwabdizzle]

I cant create threads so I'll post this in the closest related thread:

But even Forbes is calling for MS to sell of the XBox division

http://www.forbes.com/sites/adamhar...d-give-xbox-one-to-nintendo/?partner=yahootix

Does Nintendo want Xbox?

 

[AyaisMUsikWhore]

Reading this thread made me love how simple the PS4 UI is. There really isn't anything to figure out. It's literally plug and play. It may not be extremely flashy like Metro but inserting a game and pressing play, recording while in game, going back to the home screen and double clicking to get back to what you were doing is far easier than having to say different specific commands to do one thing. Forget if it doesn't get what your saying either. Forget about unplugging it because a controller can't do it. Microsoft needs to revamp this

 

[SeventhSon]

I really don't want to see the Xbox brand go down -- have so much invested in the ecosystem.

I've seen this word used in different contexts lately, what do you mean by it? What does it mean to you?

 

[FairXchange]

Having a good cvoice UI is not mutually exclusive with having a good controller UI. They can, and should, complement one another. MS is one of the the largest software companies in the world, the idea that they can't design a UI that simultaneously is good for Kinect and for controller users is insulting. Especially since the 360, their own product, already does so.

Steambox is a terrible example to hang your hat on, because they are all going to bomb.

You said it better than I could, and there's nothing else I can add. This is the crux of the issue, the Xbox One should not be a "No Kinect? No Service" platform. If it were, I would have not bought it all together. I've had a blast playing Titanfall this past week, my Xbox One has value to me. So with that being said, MS should be focusing on addressing its customers that want to play on their hardware without the Kinect.

 

[Neuromancer]

I cant create threads so I'll post this in the closest related thread:

But even Forbes is calling for MS to sell of the XBox division

http://www.forbes.com/sites/adamhar...d-give-xbox-one-to-nintendo/?partner=yahootix

Forbes Contributor, basically anyone can write a blog for Forbes nowadays.

 

[w00zey]

In my experience with the XBONE so far, the Kinect is the only way to navigate around the UI. Trying to do so with a controller is clunk and frustrating, and the voice commands work really well actually.

I do agree that it has no gaming value at this point though.

Man I feel the exact opposite. Too each their own.

 

[Justified]

Does Nintendo want Xbox?

My guess is they would like the 3rd party support and infrastructure it would bring.

But I dont believe its on their radar. That notion of MS selling it to Nintendo is just people assuming XBox Division is done, and now they need to "cut and run"

 

[mattp]

what gets me about the kinect is how microsoft seems to have got it into so many peoples' heads that kinect = voice controls
they could have stuck a mic on the front of the console and had the same exact thing for 100 dollars less

i think it's pretty clear the new kinect, regardless of how cool the video tech is, is useless for realtime gaming or anything that requires precision. or honestly, anything that requires precision at all