Oh, did they? I didn't know that. Well I suppose she could die the same way Rose and Donna "died".
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Doctor Who Series 8 |OT| We've fucking time-travelled, yes?
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Oh, did they? I didn't know that. Well I suppose she could die the same way Rose and Donna "died".
DiipuSurotu
Banned
I hope so. The Impossible Girl arc wasn't perfect, but that catchphrase in itself was pretty cool.
Maybe I misread aHebrewMenagerie, but I got the impression he was joking.
Yup, I was just an idiot and didn't realize it was an impression.
WHAT!? How could you say that!?
*screams, throwing self on floor*
It's awful, completely awful! *sobs*
Android18a
Member
I liked Flatline a lot, but I wish the chap had taken the sticker off his baseball cap. That bugged me XD
That may have been true last season, but the character redemption this season has been pretty substantial.
). Current Clara feels so vastly different (better) to me that I can't even think of S7 Clara and S8 Clara as the same person to be honest. This is one time where I don't mind such a big shift though, I wanted her to be a decent character and that's what I'm getting.
TheCowboyPoet
Member
Clara was awesome from day 1, but yeah, she's definitely come into her own... which is good, I figured the worst was coming for her once her "mystery" was solved at the end of Name of the Doctor.
Haven't you been around any yoofs? Not taking the sticker off is a thing, don't you know.
paradox121
Member
As people always say, the problem with S7 Clara was she wasn't a character she was a mystery. She was a walking question mark. You get the sense this was partly on purpose so that Moffat could just tell everyone to write her as a generic companion while he concentrated on writing the 50th. The thing that saved her and even made weirdos like me appreciate her was thanks to Jenna who just totally sells the part no matter how basic the stuff she's given is. And that goes twofold this year where she's actually been given meaty stuff to play and a fantastic actor to bounce off (which in no way is meant to discredit Smith).
Naturally that's now led to accusations that the show's too much focused on her. Which annoys me to no end. It'd be nice for Capaldi to get some more stuff but I get the feeling Moffat's playing the long multiple season game with him.
acheron_xl
Member
Yeah I think Moffat is clearly thinking long term when it comes to Capaldi. There's no way that they're spending an entire season thawing out the Doctor's personality if he's not in the part for some amount of time.
Neil Gaiman, what an awesome guy.
Exterminieren
Banned
If it's a straight choice between a good script written by a bloke and a good script written by a woman, I'd take the script written by a woman at this point. Only having one in a decade is laughable, despite Moffat's apparent best efforts.
JonathanEx
Member
While I get the sentiment of that - I think if you look at it numerically, does it not seem off that in 10 years that every almost single available writer that can write a good script has been male so far? And if there's bigger industry reasons of number of writers and a smaller pool, maybe not knowing as many or they've not had chances before, why not do what you can to boost the chances of people who can write good scripts having them actually used?
Or something. I think someone could be a lot more eloquent on this.
Hot Coldman
Banned
Women generally write more nuanced portrayals of women than men do, so yeah, it kind of does matter. It doesn't just have to be "good", it really helps to offer something other episodes aren't as well, and hiring writers from different demographics is an easy way to try and make that happen.
infiniteloop
Member
nope
Hot Coldman
Banned
Oh, and the need for people to chime in with "I can't be the only one who doesn't give a fuck" whenever the issue of wider representation in art/media/workplaces/whatever comes up? It needs to die. Talk about utter irrelevance to the conversation at hand...
I seem to remember a writer being mentioned that she's working on a s9 script?
Either way, I hope they get one or two scripts from female writers next series.
Anyone who for some reason doesn't care about the social aspect should look at it this way: we are missing potentially amazing scripts written by women because they're underrepresented. Which they are, as far as writing for the show goes, for a variety of reasons.
And it's not like the show is bursting at the seams with amazing male writers either... so any sort of internal initiatives to incentive this sort of thing is more than welcome. Even if you only care about the quality of the writing: having more sources is always better. Moffat seems to agree according to Gaiman:
And it's not like the show is bursting at the seams with amazing male writers either... so any sort of internal initiatives to incentive this sort of thing is more than welcome. Even if you only care about the quality of the writing: having more sources is always better. Moffat seems to agree according to Gaiman:
Anyway, the same way no one needs to get their panties in a twist when the subject of representation comes up, there's no need to be dismissive either.
APZonerunner
Member
It's here where Moffat's insistence on only hiring in experienced folk so he doesn't have to rewrite much hurts a touch, really, because the experienced people are incredibly busy and have their own money-spinning projects on the go. Evolution of the Daleks was messy, but at least in dragging in Raynor (who prior to S3/4 was script editor on Moffat & RTD's Series 1 & 2 scripts in particular, and continued to script edit for Moffat in S3/4) he got a female voice on the show, and in her second outing she really significantly improved. I actually would've liked to have seen her do one more, to be honest, see if the improvement continued.
yeah, it's annoying as fuck
Bobby Roberts
Banned
It's not only annoying, it's bullshit. Obviously you care because the instant someone broached the subject you were there to tell people how minimal a concern it is.
"I don't care if it's a man or a woman."
Well, the fact you're up in here protesting the idea that more women should be writing tells me you do.
"I don't care if it's a man or a woman."
Well, the fact you're up in here protesting the idea that more women should be writing tells me you do.
The Elite
BOSS
The lack of female writers on Doctor Who is notable. There is no denying that.
I'm not sure who they could bring in but I'm not really familiar with a lot of British TV Writers outside of the big names. I'm sure there is enough quality talent out there to at least get a couple for the next season.
I tend to be in the hire the best person for the job boat but the Male:Female writer ratio on Who is notable. There is no reason for it to be like that. Bring in more women writers. Diversity is good.
I'm not sure who they could bring in but I'm not really familiar with a lot of British TV Writers outside of the big names. I'm sure there is enough quality talent out there to at least get a couple for the next season.
I tend to be in the hire the best person for the job boat but the Male:Female writer ratio on Who is notable. There is no reason for it to be like that. Bring in more women writers. Diversity is good.
Sorry for the double post.... but...
From 2014 Hugo awards (one of the most important sci-fi and fantasy awards for writers) nominees we have of special mention in the most popular categories :
And WAY MORE
So they MIGHT be losing a few good scripts if they only hire male writers =P
From 2014 Hugo awards (one of the most important sci-fi and fantasy awards for writers) nominees we have of special mention in the most popular categories :
And WAY MORE
So they MIGHT be losing a few good scripts if they only hire male writers =P
Exterminieren
Banned
No one should have doubt that there are significant women writers who should be made a priority. Go after Sally Wainwright, Jane Goldman, Amanda Coe, Debbie Moon... there are plenty of possibilities. Hell, just plunder Torchwood for a start- Cath Tregenna made some excellent contributions, and I'd bet she could do some great things with the mothership.
I don't doubt Moffat's trying. Hell, Amanda Coe had a script in active development for series 5. Still, more has to be done, because the lack of diversity is only going to hurt the show in the long run.
Just as an aside, though- the Writers Guild of Great Britain would probably have issues with Doctor Who poaching all of its writing talent from the States.
I don't doubt Moffat's trying. Hell, Amanda Coe had a script in active development for series 5. Still, more has to be done, because the lack of diversity is only going to hurt the show in the long run.
Just as an aside, though- the Writers Guild of Great Britain would probably have issues with Doctor Who poaching all of its writing talent from the States.
APZonerunner
Member
Another part of the problem is the women writing for British TV in general; all of the people posted above are American, and on the whole the show tends to use British writers as it's easier to liaise with, easier to get them to Cardiff, and stuff. Plus American writers are generally more expensive, plus the BBC has a charter-written taxpayer-funded duty to employ a majority of British in all aspects of a show.
Then you should really care that something is causing good scripts to not make it to screen, because there's no damn way the only good scripts are written by men.
Honestly I only care that they get the best writers possible, the gender is irrelevant. If next year Moffat got all female writers besides himself that would be just fine with me as long as they were good writers and wrote good scripts.
Umm, how exactly am I protesting the idea of more women writing for Doctor Who? Your post makes no sense. I just want the best writers they can find, no matter the gender. As I said before if Moffat gets all female writers for next year I would be just fine with that as long as they were good writers and write good scripts.
So true. Some previous years of Who I wouldn't mind if some scripts/episodes would of been replaced with another script/writer, though this year it seems like Moffat brought together a really amazing writing team. So far there hasn't been a single episode I would of preferred to see replaced with a completely different writer/script like I have many previous years, hopefully the last 3 episodes of the season are just as good as the first 9.
Assuming most of the writers this year have a good idea for a new script for next year I hope most of them come back next year (especially Jamie Mathieson and Gareth Roberts), along with maybe getting some fresh blood (male or female).
Bobby Roberts
Banned
It makes perfect sense.
If you really didn't care, you wouldn't have piped up to tell people how little you care. The fact you only spoke up once someone broached the subject says you care, even if the actual words are trying to express the opposite sentiment.
It's a subtle form of protestation, and aimed less at the idea that there should be more women, and more at the idea that someone's even bringing up the subject. The way you phrased your statement (am I the only one) definitely suggests (also subtly) that people are somehow concerned with something they shouldn't be concerned with.
Which is bullshit.
I'm sorry but it really doesn't make sense.
This is a message board. I'm free to post my options on this message board. My opinion is that as that as long as we get good scripts for Doctor Who I don't care what the gender of the writers are. I'm would be just as happy with an all female writing staff (well minus Moffat since as long as he's showrunner he's going to write a few episodes each year of course) as I am with an all male staff as long as they produce good scripts. I just want good episodes of Doctor Who. I honestly feel the same way about all shows (and all jobs in general actually), the most important thing is getting the best person for the job.
Maybe my post was poorly worded, but I still don't understand how you seem to think I'm protesting female writers. My opinion is really not that hard to understand, I can't figure out why you're having difficulties with it. You're just assigning a motive to my post and opinion that frankly doesn't exist.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Sure it does. I just pointed out what I was doing in response to what you were doing.
it's pretty straight-up.
I don't care about the writers gender at all. On an unrelated note, I believe there should be more women in the industry. To me, this is two separate topics
Bobby Roberts
Banned
They're not.
If you believe there should be more women in the industry - you care about the writers' gender. It's the same topic.
You're welcome to that opinion, but its not one I hold as well. I want shows to have the best writers, I don't care what gender.
I also want a more even representation of women to be in the industry, but hiring 1-5 new writers entirely on the basis that they are women will not achieve this, because you could be hiring women who are worse writers simply for the sake of hiring women.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
It's not a matter of opinion. If you want there to be more female writers - you care about gender.
You can't say you don't care while mentioning how you care.
You care.
It's okay to say so.
This is neither a thing that is happening, or a thing anyone is advocating for.
Nobody in this thread has said "Boy, I hope they get someone with a pair of ovaries up in the writers room, and fast, qualifications be damned."
In fact, someone went so far as to c+p a list of highly qualified female writers, after someone quoted Neil Gaiman on how Moffat's been trying his damndest to get quality female writers.
Your usage of absolutes when discussing an opinion worries me.
Regardless, this is derailing the thread, so I'm going to talk about how much the new Doctor is growing on me. Really enjoyed every episode since Danny was introduced, Clara's personality being way more fleshed out this season makes for much more interesting viewing.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
We're not discussing a matter of opinion, though.
StopMakingSense
Member
The last two episodes were some of the best episodes of the whole show.
Really great. This has probably been the strongest season of new Who so far, hopefully the final 3 episodes are just as good.
Every episode has been a varying level of good. Not one weak one, two or three classics (including Listen).
The Doctor Who fan in me cares because I think having some female writers might improve the female characters. I don't doubt men can write good ones, but most of them since season 5 have either been a little on the Mary Sue side or sassy older women. I want good scripts, and a more diverse industry wouldn't hurt. Win win.
Significantly better. Watch Flatline and Mummy. They're some of the best episodes the show has to offer.
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