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[Ninja Scooter]

Honestly, it's a hell of a lot better around here than what it was like when the Wii specs finally came out. Sane even.


Oh Johnny Nighttrain....why have thou foresaken me??!?!?!?

I'm not so sure. Keep in mind that there is a poster a page or so back who decided that the Wii U CPU is fine because he watched Mass Effect 3 video on YouTube.

 

[cRIPticon]

So, I'm trying to understand this:

WiiU CPU is slower/worse than PS3/360 ones (by how much?)
WiiU GPU is faster/better than PS3/360 ones (by how much?)
WiiU Ram is 4x the size of the ones on PS3/360 but ~43% slower so that means WiiU ram's is still preferable over the PS3/360 ones but it's not as big a gap as we originally thought.

So overall, the WiiU is just about 1.5x the power of the 360 as we originally thought when the specs were first going around?

Did I get it right?

Who cares what the specs are so long as the games are great? Am I doing it right?

 

[lherre]

He's a lead designer at DICE, a company owned by EA, meaning he no doubt has super-detailed specs of the console and can make a better educated guess than any of us.

Yep, besides there are GDC or other events where "developers" can "talk" about everything, it is not that you talk with people only in your studio ... Like any other job ... so I'm sure a lot of developers know wii u and its performance/specs. Maybe not detailed but they have a good idea about it.

 

[Palette Swap]

Someone should let Nirolak know that he's helping to spread harmful misinformation about the Wii U with that DICE dev update.

He wouldn't do something so dishonorable and offensive if he knew.

 

[cRIPticon]

PR reasons? Who knows. But it's likely he has access to a very detailed spec sheet being from a major studio/pub.

Unless he doesn't? And I am sure that being from a large publisher there are rules in place regarding employees making statements about any of the platforms publicly.

 

[Pharros]

PR reasons? Who knows. But it's likely he has access to a very detailed spec sheet being from a major studio/pub.

Could very well be true. I just haven't been following the dev comments too closely, the massive amount of back and forth is just nuts. We know the CPU is sub par to what anyone expected but overall it comes down to publishers in my opinion. I do hope however that more devs do comment so a more clear picture can be established overall.

 

[KageZero]

That's exactly what I said... Isn't it? Is my use of English that bad?

As above.

But remains unconfirmed, and has nothing to do with WiiU being or not being powerful enough for BF4. It could be shit and still run a version of it, just about, it could be better than Dennis' PC and still not get BF4 for other reasons. These other reasons can be the only reasons DICE dev is not already working, or attempting to work, on BF4 WiiU since he's only going by hearsay rather than personal experience about its specs. Only having the latter could even begin to imply BF4 is not coming to WiiU due to its power level. And the latter isn't at all implied by his words.

Or i have comprehension problems... Sorry then, i didn't understand you well. You are right about that, but still it's not a good sign if he know nothing about it since hes a lead designer but then again maybe other people are working on the wiiu version if it is in development.

 

[lherre]

Unless he doesn't? And I am sure that being from a large publisher there are rules in place regarding employees making statements about any of the platforms publicly.

If i'm not mistaken this twitter is personal (not connected with ea or dice) so it's basically his opinion.

 

[Plinko]

Every launch port looks worse than the HD Twin version. You can "lazy dev" one or two away, but all of them?

Sonic Racing actually is the only one that doesn't, I believe.

Edit: Skylanders Giants as well.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Sonic Racing actually is the only one that doesn't, I believe.

Edit: Skylanders Giants as well.

Wasn't Tekken supposed to be on par? Not sure, but I thought it was referred to as solid.

Mind you, I agree with your point daycru.

 

[beril]

Every launch port looks worse than the HD Twin version. You can "lazy dev" one or two away, but all of them?

Aren't most of them only worse than one of the twins?

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

Man it's getting "Karl Rove on election night" levels of sad for some posters in here. Denial and spin are not good looks.

Pretty much. Give it up, guys.

 

[KageZero]

Sonic Racing actually is the only one that doesn't, I believe.

Edit: Skylanders Giants as well.

Neither do blops,ac3 or mass effect. There are some framerates drops but its almost the same on other versions. Wiiu versions generally have better framerate then ps3 version and little under the x360 in most cases the overall experience is the same(besides the shadoow problem in blops2).

 

[Nirolak]

Unless he doesn't? And I am sure that being from a large publisher there are rules in place regarding employees making statements about any of the platforms publicly.

I've seen EA employees on twitter say things like the iPad defeats the purpose of the Wii U, the Vita is uninteresting because it will get quickly outdated, and that it'd be great if social games go into oblivion (note that EA makes social games).

So... I'll say that EA doesn't really have any policies as long as you're not breaking NDA.

Also, if Gustav Halling doesn't know the performance of the Wii U, then DICE doesn't have the console and that says a lot about their intended support.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Aren't most of them only worse than one of the twins?

Perhaps. But that's still a rather dubious distinction to make.

 

[Plinko]

Wasn't Tekken supposed to be on par? Not sure, but I thought it was referred to as solid.

Mind you, I agree with your point daycru.

It was but in the other thread they were doing some analysis and it appears to drop resolution with more than two characters on the screen.

 

[S1kkZ]

It was but in the other thread they were doing some analysis and it appears to drop resolution with more than two characters on the screen.

all versions do that.

 

[Barbacoatl]

That's weird, my CPU is very fast, but metro is still horribly slow.

 

[KageMaru]

George Lucas made Star Wars 1. Doesn't mean Indy aliens were a good idea.

Seriously, if they haven't touched the system in 6 months (~2 dev kits) why is what they say relevant?

I'm not saying it's not true, I'm legitimately asking.

The thing is the hardware within the dev kits likely haven't changed in any meaningful way in the last 6 months, so I'm not sure if that really matters. The APIs were probably optimized for the hardware at this point in development. This isn't some unique architecture like the Cell where developers are unfamiliar with it. It's an older PPC core coupled with what looks to be some ARM processors and a DSP (I'm assuming for sound).

There are more reasons to believe this guy than there is not to believe him is all I'm saying.

I was looking at benchmarks of the 6490m gpu . I was also looking at things like the liano a4-3300 reviews and other similar systems. where they used metro 2033 on the pc as a benchmark.

It seems to me they just do not want to port it since it can run on a pc with similar specs just fine.

Sorry but this doesn't make any sense to me.

There I bolded the part.
I didn't move the goal post, you keep putting it where I never put it in the 1rst place.
The Conduit is a tech accomplishment for Wii too but I don't see anyone praising that anywhere.

I'm confused, were you or were you not saying the tech in the game was impressive?

for me it's not so much that good tech compliments good art, it's the other way around: shitty tech destroys good art. When I'm looking at an aliased, shimmering, low-res mess I cannot for the life of me appreciate the art.

Well shit tech will destroy anything, I agree there. However my line of thinking was you can have a great looking game using ok tech with great art but the same is hardly true with great tech with ok art.

Well, honestly, if you make a statement like that, these reactions are what's to be expected really. Go to an apple forum and have some supposed tech-guru claim the new *whatever* is crap in a rather harsh statement and see what happens. The same would go for MS or Sony fans in the same situation. No need to pull the "lol, Nintendo(fans)" card, it only discredits your opinion.

I think you misunderstood me. I have nothing against fans of Nintendo. I consider myself one of them even though I don't care for many of their games these days. I still respect and love the company.

However it's one thing to favor a company and their games and it's entirely different to be a blind raging fanboy where all logic is lost. These are the types of people I question and I do it for the warriors of any system.

I understand the same will happen with MS and Sony fanboys, but as long as both systems offer a similar and decent leap in performance, I would imagine the majority of the fanbase would be more civil than what we see here.

Further more, i think people have every right to search for the right context in which this statement was given. No need to act as developers are never wrong, can't be biased or can't have other factors play their hand. This is not "just" an opinion. The fact that he uses the term "horrible" instead of "too slow" or "outdated", shows he is not being purely factual or technical, but a bit emotional. The statement seems to leave no room for interpretation, and yet is also seems rather subjective in the way it is made. Like saying "you suck". No question about what that means, but does said person really "suck"? I remember a statement about Wii not being able to run the start screen of Resident Evil 5. Were we supposed to take that statement "as is" as well? In both cases they go about it in a dismissive way, not interested in really figuring it out, not worth of another look. One might see that as a sign of arrogance and prejudice. The developers track record is of no concern in that case.

I completely agree that context is key and I never think it's wrong to search for it. What many don't seem to understand is the context of his comments are related to the game he is developing. For Metro, the CPU is horrible. That can mean many things, but to figure out what it is exactly, we would have to know more about the Wii-U's CPU and what it's strengths and weaknesses are. We have a good idea that the chip sucks with floating point performance, lagging behind the CPUs in the PS360. We know there are fewer threads in the CPU than what's found in the PS360. So it's not outside the realm of possibility that one of the few known weaknesses is what he's directly referring to.

Based on the footage we have, Metro looks to be running a decent amount of similations from AI to destructable/interactive environments. So it wouldn't surprise me if the game did put a good load on the CPU.

To me, this statement is of no more value than the statements made by Shin'n, a dev team that made Jet Rocket as a Wiiware title, outperforming 95% of actual retail Wii games.

IMO both have the same amount of value. Their games are just designed differently and have different demands. Some games are CPU bound while others are GPU bound for example. Assuming Shin'n is developing a Wii-U exclusive, it wouldn't surprise me if they ran into less issues with the CPU since they are designing their game around the hardware. Multi-platform developers don't have this luxury, instead they need to do their best to find a middle ground with the design and do what they could to make the hardware cope with the demands of their game.

oh i remember when every lazy ass developpers crying like a bunch of wuss about 6 yrs ago saying "baaaaaaaw developping on ps3 is really hard"

i guess its just the begining with nintendo.

The PS3 was really hard, there was no question about it. Seriously "lazy devs" should be a bannable term on every gaming forum, especially those like GAF that have developers as members.

Chances are he didn't even touch it if you read the tweets. Considering how each gen we get excuses saying how the AI and physics will improve and how that's barely the case every time I wouldn't put to much behind it.

Yeah, the more I see you post, the less I can take you serious.

Physics and AI have improved this gen, especially on the physics part. AI is harder to measure as that tends to be more of a design issue than a computation issue, though more power does help with AI as well.

I never claimed he didn't know his stuff. The guys from Shin'n know their stuff too. But somehow because you are blunt, borderline rude, your opinion should be more credible? Factor 5 knew their stuff too, spit out GCN games up there with the best of the Xbox, yet many xbox devs spoke about the GCN in the same manner as this guy about WiiU. So, some perspective can't hurt. The guy basically glanced at the WiiU hardware and dubs it horrible.

I don't understand how he was rude in any way. For his needs, the CPU is horrible and slow, or horribly slow, however way it's worded.

Using Factor 5 is a poor example since they never made a xbox exclusive so who's to say they wouldn't share these other dev's opinions if they had the chance to make exclusives on both systems. Like you said, some perspective can't hurt. =p

Somehow he'd have us believe the WiiU launch ports which are suffering, took as much or more development time than the original games on the 360 instead of the other way around.

I'm not sure how you got this from his comment.

In fairness, there was at least one or two posters in there harping on and on about 600Gflops in the GPU - which would be on the 3x end of that scale. I don't know how seriously people were taking them...but it came up a lot.

I don't think anyone was ever speculating much beyond that though, not least 6x.

I remember plenty of people assuming that next gen down ports would be relatively easy. Doesn't seem to be the case now.h

So all we have are heresay and rumors based on old dev kits and quick ports?

Cool

What is your opinion based on everything? Honest quesiton.

Wasn't Xbox 360 CPU bottlenecked anyway? It had to use one thread for the OS and Sound processing each. This basically takes 30% away from any given game.

How does that compare to the WiiU which is not bottlenecked and has more access to CPU power during gameplay? I think on paper it will look weaker, but given that the WiiU is extremely balanced, it should outperform Xbox360's CPU.

No. The OS uses 1.2-1.5% of a thread on core 1 and core 2 (the three cores are labeled as cores 0, 1, and 2).

Sound processing is different for every game where it can take up a thread or an entire core.

Every CPU, or hardware component, is bottlenecked in some ways. There is no such thing as a system without any bottlenecks. While the CPU may outperform the Xenon in some ways (my guess is general purpose code and as Durante mentioned before, branchy code), it underperforms in other ways such as lower floating point performance or lacking the same number of threads. So it should outperform the 360's CPU in some ways while lagging behind in others.

Is the CPU slower than 360/PS3?

Slower in some respects but faster in others.

 

[wrowa]

Perhaps. But that's still a rather dubious distinction to make.

Why so? All tools are perfectly tailored to the strengths and weaknesses of the Xbox 360 and the PS3 while the Wii U was merely added as an afterthought to the development tools (and it's unlikely that most developers/publishers will ever care enough about the plattform to put enough work into perfectly optimized Wii U tools). Taking this into account, I think it's some kind of achievement that the Wii U versions of some games at least are superior to one of the "HD twins" versions.

Of course, this is not a position a new piece of hardware should be in and I'm as disappointed as everyone else that Nintendo apparently didn't even manage to create a "perfect current gen" console, but once you've accepted this it's reassuring to know that even without much optimization developers are able to get games running on day 1 that aren't completely inferior to what is being achieved on the competitor's consoles after years of work.

While 3rd party support will suck as usual (but let's be honest here it would have sucked either way), I'm confident that at least exclusive games will be able reaching levels that are at least as good as the best PS360 have to offer.

 

[Corky]

That's weird, my CPU is very fast, but metro is still horribly slow.

It's a very demanding game with some quite taxing effects and settings.

 

[airmangataosenai]

What the fuck is going on with Nintendo fans holding up that Zelda demo as some sort of technical achievement? It's one hyper-stylized low polygon humanoid character fighting a stylized cartoony low polygon spider monster in a small room in a non-interactive cutscene. There are literally dozens of actual games released for consoles that have done this and better over the past 3 years on both systems. The demo is mainly about showing off the lighting but even that isn't anything to write home about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arHNcSMXaBk

 

[Discomurf]

The Wii U version of Darksiders 2 looks arguably better than the 360 version.

Colors look less washed out, has sharper textures and draw distance:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nha4XiXnSg&feature=youtu.be&hd=1

 

[cloudyy]

Not only will the Wiiu be cheaper than the PS4/720 but it's also going to have a 6-12 months head-start and is the successor of the most sold console this generation and microsoft and sony lost shit-ton of money this gen and indies seem to really like nintendo's new policy regards them.

If I were sony or microsoft I'd be really worried.

 

[Fabrik]

Well, no. But that also doesn't indicate that you must completely neglect one aspect of a design in favor of focusing entirely on another. All I'm saying is that you argued that "good enough" was the logical choice. I suggested that "a little bit better than that" doesn't seem like some unreasonable endeavor that pits them right in the thick of the tech arms race.

Look at the price of PS3 and XBOX360 after 6 years on the market.

 

[Dictator93]

"We didn't feel like learning a new console"

Is there any chance where we could round up the avatars and connect them with quotes? it would be interesting

 

[Osiris]

Not only will the Wiiu be cheaper than the PS4/720 but it's also going to have a 6-12 months head-start and is the successor of the most sold console this generation and microsoft and sony lost shit-ton of money this gen and indies seem to really like nintendo's new policy regards them.

If I were sony or microsoft I'd be really worried.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Look at the price of PS3 and XBOX360 after 6 years on the market.

One version of the Xbox 360 can be had for $200. I'm not sure if I understand your point.

 

[Fabrik]

One version of the Xbox 360 can be had for $200. I'm not sure if I understand your point.

4GB harddrive and no Kinect or Tablet controller, of course it's going to be cheaper.
Wii U selling at a loss tell us something.

 

[Bidermaier]

I dont understand the people complaining that the Wii U is not a XBOX 3 or a +600$ PC.
We knew since sumo told eurogamer that the gpu is better but the cpu similar or worse than this gen.
People who couldnt care less about multiplatforms ports to the Wii U now they raise their hands because some early ports made with beta kits are not better than the 360 lead platform versions.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

4GB harddrive and no Kinect or Tablet controller, of course it's going to be cheaper.
Wii U selling at a loss tell us something.

I still don't quite understand just what point it is that you think you're making?

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

What the fuck is going on with Nintendo fans holding up that Zelda demo as some sort of technical achievement? It's one hyper-stylized low polygon humanoid character fighting a stylized cartoony low polygon spider monster in a small room in a non-interactive cutscene. There are literally dozens of actual games released for consoles that have done this and better over the past 3 years on both systems. The demo is mainly about showing off the lighting but even that isn't anything to write home about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arHNcSMXaBk

The bird/zelda tech demos were out tech demoed by 360/ps3 tech demos. It was just exciting seeing Nintendo "Step into" this generation. The Wii U should've been released in 2011, tbh.

I'm more worried about the 3rd party reception. For all this "3rd parties embrace Nintendo again" talk there's an absolute lack of any third party titles announced past launch. Not even ports, and especially not same-day ports.

PS3 and 360 have TONS of indie/XBL-focused games launching this year or season in the pipeline, announced. Wii U has a few but way too few and far between to be taken seriously.

I know it's a new console and all, but that's some disturbing trend, when the Wii, 360, and PS3 didnt seem nearly as dry (shovelware or not)

 

[S1kkZ]

The Wii U version of Darksiders 2 looks arguably better than the 360 version.

Colors look less washed out, has sharper textures and draw distance:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nha4XiXnSg&feature=youtu.be&hd=1

lets ignore the missing foliage and awful loading times.

 

[Fabrik]

I still don't quite understand just what point it is that you think you're making?

Simple. Increasing the power on the console would have made the price go above the 299$ bar.

 

[TheExodu5]

What the fuck is going on with Nintendo fans holding up that Zelda demo as some sort of technical achievement? It's one hyper-stylized low polygon humanoid character fighting a stylized cartoony low polygon spider monster in a small room in a non-interactive cutscene. There are literally dozens of actual games released for consoles that have done this and better over the past 3 years on both systems. The demo is mainly about showing off the lighting but even that isn't anything to write home about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arHNcSMXaBk

You're nuts. The lighting is better than any current gen non-PC game, save perhaps The Last of Us (though it has different strengths). And low poly? How, exactly? There's no indication from the videos we have seen that it's low poly whatsoever.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Simple. Increasing the power on the console would have made the price go above the 299$ bar.

That's possible. Or perhaps there was a better way to design it? Or perhaps they could have taken a bigger loss? Or perhaps they needed more time to sell the concept of the GamePad so that -- like with what the Wiimotes did for the Wii -- the audience would not be so inclined to question the value proposition of the console itself and instead be convinced at how cool the new interface option is?

Personally, though, if they did everything they could and were sold that it had to have this certain vision, I personally don't know if I think that upping the price just a bit more to allow for better tech would have been disastrous. If there was even one title that demonstrated a step up from current technology coupled with a more concrete proof of concept than just Nintendo Land, I think this thing could have sold at $350 and $400.

 

[jmls1121]

You're nuts. The lighting is better than any current gen non-PC game, save perhaps The Last of Us (though it has different strengths). And low poly? How, exactly? There's no indication from the videos we have seen that it's low poly whatsoever.

This.

There is so much ignorance in this thread, its astounding. Console launch GAF is worst GAF.

 

[Durante]

I really don't know what's supposed to be so incredibly impressive about the lighting in that demo. Yes. It has a lot of dynamic light sources. That's what deferred rendering does.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

You're nuts. The lighting is better than any current gen non-PC game, save perhaps The Last of Us (though it has different strengths). And low poly? How, exactly? There's no indication from the videos we have seen that it's low poly whatsoever.

Could you link us to some direct feed screenshots and video?

I remember the Zelda demo was notoriously bad. and the Bird demo also had low poly environs. Outside the high res textures the Zelda demo was nothing special or good.

 

[TheExodu5]

Could you link us to some direct feed screenshots and video?

I remember the Zelda demo was notoriously bad. and the Bird demo also had low poly environs. Outside the high res textures the Zelda demo was nothing special or good.

First time I've seen a direct feed shot. IQ does suck...that's a shame. And I'll cede the low poly point.

I still maintain the lighting is gorgeous.

I really don't know what's supposed to be so incredibly impressive about the lighting in that demo. Yes. It has a lot of dynamic light sources. That's what deferred rendering does.

I'm not sure how to quantify it exactly, but I'll do my best. Everything comes together better than anything I've seen. There are a lot of light sources, self shadowing seems stylistic yet very natural, the light reflection on all the different surfaces is spot on, the way the different colored lights interact with one another is also very natural.

Maybe I'll refrain until seeing direct feed video before commenting further. Off screen captures could be coloring my vision.

 

[Akkad]

Not only will the Wiiu be cheaper than the PS4/720 but it's also going to have a 6-12 months head-start and is the successor of the most sold console this generation and microsoft and sony lost shit-ton of money this gen and indies seem to really like nintendo's new policy regards them.

If I were sony or microsoft I'd be really worried.

Is this some kind of meme? lol?

 

[i-Lo]

Not only will the Wiiu be cheaper than the PS4/720 but it's also going to have a 6-12 months head-start and is the successor of the most sold console this generation and microsoft and sony lost shit-ton of money this gen and indies seem to really like nintendo's new policy regards them.

If I were sony or microsoft I'd be really worried.

Nintendo wishes all the Wii owners were this devoted. It'd definitely mean the end of MS and Sony and the reign of benevolent Nintendo. Clearly some people don't have the best interest of Nintendo at heart.

Remember, PS4/XB3 may have the graphical advantage but Wii U has art and gameplay advantage. And gameplay>>>graphics.

Don't lend your ears to inept development studios that are either presumptuous about the Wii U's balanced tech which is impetus for their dismissal (Nintendo should send people who helped develop the system to open the eyes of devs like these to utilize the system to its fullest potential and show everyone just how much more powerful it is compared to the 7 year old heat boxes from Sony and MS) or are lazy to port games properly.

 

[Sentenza]

Am I missing something about the Zelda demo used as a proof/argument?
Because even ignoring the fact that it isn't exactly impressive, as far as I can remember it was confirmed as running on a PC.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

Nintendo wishes all the Wii owners were this devoted. It'd definitely mean the end of MS and Sony and the reign of benevolent Nintendo. Clearly some people don't have the best interest of Nintendo at heart.

Remember, PS4/XB3 may have the graphical advantage but Wii U has art and gameplay advantage. And gameplay>>>graphics.

Don't lend your ears to inept development studios that are either presumptuous about the Wii U's balanced tech which is impetus for their dismissal (Nintendo should send people who helped develop the system to open the eyes of devs like these to utilize the system to its fullest potential and show everyone just how much more powerful it is compared to the 7 year old heat boxes from Sony and MS) or are lazy to port games properly.

and dont forget that none of these ports and none of these developers know how to use the eDRAM or the DSP found in the Wii U. The upgraded cpu is completely different from anything they ever used before because they all skipped the Wii and the R700 GPU is like nothing they ever seen before. completely new architecture dude. Completely. New. The Ram is 4x more than 360 and PS3 so even if you were to add in that its 50% slower its still 2x new and the ram is new architecture too. Devs just have to learn to program!

 

[Pharros]

Am I missing something about the Zelda demo used as a proof/argument?
Because even ignoring the fact that it isn't exactly impressive, as far as I can remember it was confirmed as running on a PC.

Pretty sure that is incorrect. Would be silly to run technical demos for a console on a PC. An early dev unit yes, but clearly not a PC.

 

[velvet_nitemare]

Pretty sure that is incorrect. Would be silly to run technical demos for a console on a PC. An early dev unit yes, but clearly not a PC.

I'm no techie, but i'm pretty sure tons of game tech demoes have been run on PC's at trade shows in the past.

 

[beril]

Pretty sure that is incorrect. Would be silly to run technical demos for a console on a PC. An early dev unit yes, but clearly not a PC.

Almost as silly as showing pre rendered target renders.

But no I don't think there has been any mention of the zelda demo running on PC. The E3 videos show the console next to the tv, and the gamepad tethered to the console.

 

[Pharros]

I'm no techie, but i'm pretty sure tons of game tech demoes have been run on PC's at trade shows in the past.

Oh that is very true, Watch_Dogs for example. However, Nintendo has not been known to do this for their first party titles far as I know. Most common for multiplat third party titles.

 

[Dabanton]

Not only will the Wiiu be cheaper than the PS4/720 but it's also going to have a 6-12 months head-start and is the successor of the most sold console this generation and microsoft and sony lost shit-ton of money this gen and indies seem to really like nintendo's new policy regards them.

If I were sony or microsoft I'd be really worried.

Haha your concern trolling is hilarious.

 

[delta25]

Am I missing something about the Zelda demo used as a proof/argument?
Because even ignoring the fact that it isn't exactly impressive, as far as I can remember it was confirmed as running on a PC.

maybe not impressive to you but to anyone outside the realm of high end PC gaming, the Zelda tech demo was incredible looking.